Re: To Upgrade or not to Upgrade, that is the Question

Christopher Chaltain Sun, 13 Oct 2019 08:28:34 -0700

Well, it doesn't really matter whether all iPhones are created equal ornot. They all carry the Apple logo, and you'll never find anythinganywhere from Apple that says only some iPhone 11's are supported andothers are not. This may make it more difficult for Apple to track downthe root cause, but the burden is still on Apple to ensure theirsoftware works on all supported devices.


On 10/13/19 10:09 AM, richr...@gmail.com wrote:

In a way, what you seem to be implying is that Apple does not have total 
control over its products. If that is true, that is a rather disconcerting 
state of things. I've lost sound a number of times, and I can't imagine how 
this bug slipped by Apple, and if Apple indeed does not control their products 
i.e. two iPhone 11s are not the same, that is truly unfortunate!

-----Original Message-----
From: viphone@googlegroups.com <viphone@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of M. Taylor
Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2019 7:51 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: To Upgrade or not to Upgrade, that is the Question

Hello Carolyn, et al:

You know, I've been puzzling over this ever since I updated my 8 Plus to the 
latest version of iOS and purchasing an iPhone 11; both having never lost 
VoiceOver as the result of any activity.  With the rare exception of some 
VoiceOver display bleed-through errors, described in previous posts, I never 
use any of my Apple devices without VoiceOver and yet, try as I may, I cannot 
reproduce the loss-of-VoiceOver glitch with or without earphones, of any type, 
attached.

Did you know that not all iPhones are created equal?  There are several 
different models referred to by the same device name.  Also, in the United 
States at least, the type of carrier used can, in fact, have an impact on 
device performance.  For example, several years ago there was a VoiceOver 
display driver bug that only affected certain iPhones sold by certain 
manufacturers.  Moreover, if memory serves, iPhones older than the 7 series 
would have 1 of 2 different modems installed, based on certain factors.  My 
point, regardless of the name used, not all iPhones are identical, in terms of 
hardware.

Again, at present, this is just a guess as Apple never admits to hardly 
anything until it has been resolved but I suspect that those having this 
problem, or the reverse, those like me, who are not having this problem, can 
attribute it to the device type that is being used.

For example, and again, this is just a guess so don't take issue, I make it a 
practice to pay full price for SIM-free models of any Apple device, only.  The 
SIM-free model is one that is generally sold outside of the US but can, upon 
request, be purchased inside the US, as well.

I was told, by an Apple employee, that all iPhone 11 series phones are now 
SIM-free unless the purchaser elects not to pay full price for the phone, up 
front.  I do not know how true this is as I am certain that when one purchases 
a device directly from a carrier, the device is most certainly not SIM-free.

While I am certain that Apple will resolve this loss-of-VoiceOver issue, the 
fact that it even exists suggests to me that they did not or could not 
anticipate this problem on their in-house models, said models most likely being 
the purist of the pure where software and hardware installs are concerned.

Mark

-----Original Message-----
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2019 6:08 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: To Upgrade or not to Upgrade, that is the Question

Yesterday, I lost speech, even Bluetooth did not get it for me - phone would 
not ring, only vibrate. We did reboot, turned off then back on. Finally, I 
called Apple Accessibility. We worked and worked again, finally turned off, 
back on, got it. She asked if she could screen share, did, checked About for my 
model information, said she would submit my second complaint with regard to 
VoiceOver. I told her I was out of the house, had the problem for hours, 
couldn't even get Siri. I wish I knew a work around, just to keep it from 
happening again.

I do like Call Silencer, but would give it up to stabilize VoiceOver.

Best regards,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
dani pagador
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 9:54 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Upgrade or not to Upgrade, that is the Question

For as much as I complained about VO dropping out after phone/FaceTime calls, 
I'm really glad I did the upgrade to the IOS13. I got a call that went to 
voicemail this morning that was a SSA scam that said my number would be 
suspended due to fraudulent activity, that I would be arrested, and to kindly 
press 1 (I'm not kidding) for more information. I was able to use the voicemail 
recording and the info VO provided to give an accurate account of the call to 
the FTC when I filed my complaint with them after the call came in.

Yay, Apple.

Do the upgrade. Just have a pair of wired earbuds handy to get VO back if it 
kicks out after a call. I hung up just a few minutes ago from a call (without 
being plugged in), and lost speech but still had sound--I could hear the clicks 
as I swiped right and left. I grabbed my wired earbuds, plugged in, and VO was 
back.

HTH,
Dani

On 10/10/19, M. Taylor <mk...@ucla.edu> wrote:

Hello Angie and Everyone,

You know, I must say that while I was planning on waiting for a later
version of iOS 13.x to be released, before updating my 8 Plus, I am
definitely glad that I went ahead and took the proverbial plunge.
This is to say that I have gained much more than I lost.

Now keep in mind that I have yet to experience any loss of VoiceOver
under any circumstances.  Also, while I do read some email messages
via iPhone, I read most of my emails on either my Windows PC or my Mac
so cannot speak to any problems with the native iOS Mail app.

I absolutely love the new system-wide hap tic VoiceOver feedback
feature.  I think the latest versions of Maps is incredible,
especially the new E.T.A feature.  However, what I like most about iOS
13.x and by the same token, iPad OS 13 is the fact that now, as it was
many, many moons ago, all of my ripped DVD videos play perfectly on
all of my Apple devices.  This was certainly not the case in iOS 12
and earlier.  I am glad that Apple relinquished its death grip on the
types of videos it would and would not allow to be played on Apple
devices, in the hope of getting customers to purchase / rent videos from the 
iTunes Store.

Oh, one more thing, while I am a heavy user of Braille using the
original Focus 40 Blue, as yet, I have not attempted to read any
lengthy pieces on my Braille display so cannot speak to any issues regarding 
Braille displays.

I can tell you, however, that while I adore the new dark mode on my
iPad Pro, I have elected not to engage this new feature on my 8 Plus.  Why?
Well, the display seems to be too dark for my taste on the smaller
display and I find it easier to toggle Invert Display on and off, as
needed with the Home button.

On the iPhone 11, however, given that there is no longer a Home
button, I do engage Dark mode, using the side button to Toggle
VoiceOver on and off, as needed.  As yet, I have not experienced a
loss of VoiceOver before, during, or after calls, of any kind.

I am of the opinion that iOS 12 with Watch OS 5 work much better,
together, than iOS 13 with Watch OS 6, especially where Bluetooth
audio switching is concerned; at least, this has been my experience so far.

Still, all of my "must-have" apps work as expected and I have yet to
encounter any show-stoppers in iOS 13.x, so far.

So, if you have not yet updated to iOS 13.x yet, wait a little longer
before doing so but if you're ready to jump in and begin sending
Apple, along with third-party developers, bug reports as you encounter
them, go ahead and make the leap as we can use all of the proverbial
voices we can get in order to get the attention of all of the
developers to resolve various iOS 13.x issues.

Mark

-----Original Message-----
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of Angie Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2019 3:36 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Upgrade or not to Upgrade, that is the Question

The only thing stopping me from upgrading is the losing sound when
ending a call thing; would hate that to happen when out alone.
Otherwise I’m looking forward to getting my hands on iOS 13

All the best
Angie

On 9 Oct 2019, at 18:58, Louise Johnson <herclou...@shaw.ca> wrote:

Hi I also am waiting to update. Yes there are ones of you who are
doing it and sharing the bugs with Apple and I thank you for that. I
just not a person who wants any problems only a few years in and just
want tech to work all the time. Louise and princess Kiara

-----Original Message-----
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of Joshua Hendrickson
Sent: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 8:00 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Upgrade or not to Upgrade, that is the Question

My Iphone 8 is running 12.41 and I'm not upgrading until some of
these major bugs are getting fixed.  I only had one reminder about
the update yesterday.  I also found remind me later and just for
referrence, don't enter in your passcode if you're prompted for it.
My iPhone 8 is working just fine, and I see no need to update at this
time.  I'm so glad I got on this list so I can be warned about things
like major bugs and so on.  Granted, I don't really use my phone to
check email, but I really don't like the thought of voiceover
shutting down after a phone call.  Until that is fixed for sure, I'm
not upgrading.  I'd recommend not to update just yet.  A lot of my
friends are also waiting to update as well.

On 10/9/19, Susie Stageberg <sstagebe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Good morning all.

My iPhone 7S came up and offered me the upgrade last night. I tapped
on "later" and then "disagree", I hopes this would make it leave me
alone for a while. From reading all the posts on this list (and
elsewhere) about people having a hard time with this upgrade, it
occurred to me that it might be a good idea to hold off until they
get some of this stuff fixed. I am running along very nicely with
12.2 and I'm one of those who does not need the latest and greatest
just because it's the latest and greatest.

Is this an ostrich move? Am I deluded in thinking that by delaying I
will get a better product when I do upgrade? And how long do I play
the ostrich?

Susie

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." -Eleanor
Roosevelt

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