Le 09-06-13 à 11:50, Mike Schrag a écrit :
I knew that the WO runtime has been improved over year, and Apple
uses
many WO in their web applications notheless internal or external.
What
I concerned about the future of WO is, will Apple promote WO to
public? Go to http://developer.apple.com/referencelibrary/ check how
many WO documents were produced after 2007. Only 4. The latest one
even doesn't finished yet. The example code come with Xcode are a bit
outdated and problematic. I still remember how stupid I were last
year
when I came to WWDC WebObjects Lab. However, even Pascal Robert can't
get the Apple examples compiled on my system. I'm not sure if Apple
has fixed that, but the environment is unfriendly to new learner.
I agree that the WO new user experience is pretty lousy.
And this is why we do WOWODC East. And people should not forget that
training is also available from other places.
However, I'm not sure why we should look at the WO community any
differently than, say, the Rails community. In almost every other
community, it's the people in the community who are producing
content for everyone else. If you think the intro to WO material
sucks, then help produce some new content and examples. That's how
any community stays vibrant -- by having members that involve
themselves in making it compelling. This is why mDimension, Chuck/
GVC, Anjo, Quinton, Henrique, Lachlan, and all the other people do
what they do. I think we all recognize that WO is powerful and
contributing keeps it fresh and moving forward.
I think part of the problem is that people expect enterprise support
from Apple because of the NeXT days when WO was $50 000. Rails and
others started as free right from their beginning, so the community
didn't expect enterprise support.
Would I like more podcasts on wocommunity.org? YES. Would I like more
profiles? YES. And this is why we do the surveys and I presented the
stats for wocommunity.org at WOWODC West (I will add those stats to
the wiki before the end of June).
Incidentally, when I work on Cocoa, I'm just as likely to find
answers on cocoadev or the mailing lists as I am to find it in
Apple's prepared material. From my perspective, who cares if Apple
produces content or promotes WO? Is WO great? Does it solve
problems for you better than the alternative? It does for me, too,
and I'll continue to use it as long as it's more compelling than the
alternatives.
Besides the lack of documentation, another point is how much effort
made by Apple goes directly into the community. Of course WOLips will
be benefit if WO runtime has improvements, but did Apple ever sponsor
WOLips just like what they did to clang? Or any WO-related thing
Apple
want to make it as industry standard just like block in C, OpenCL,
llvm?
Actualy Apple DOES sponsor WOLips. The standalone Entity Modeler and
EOModelDoc were sponsored by iTunes (as I've mentioned previously on
the list), and quite a few other enhancements over the past several
months that I've worked on have also been funded by Apple. Apple is
also actively working on Maven features and support (if you're into
that sort of thing :) ). Additionally, the work to modify Project
Wonder to support future versions of WO was in part funded by Apple.
I mean, if they improve WO just only becasue they have a lot of WO
web
apps (think about what Adobe will do if they are accessible to carbon
frameworks--make a 64bit version without a totally rewrite) and are
going to use WO only for Apple's own applications without promoting
to
public, it's not a good thing to developers outside Apple.
The template parser (along with quite a few other enhancements) in
WO 5.4.3 came directly from the Apple Online Store. In fact, Drew
Davidson from AOS gave a great presentation on it at WOWODC this
year. You are mistaken if you think that Apple's internal
development doesn't feed the WebObjects community.
Even Apple's current wo apps were not good testimonials for WO.
Based on what? That's a big statement.
(1) I often got a seesion timeout when I download iPhone SDK or
something right after I login into developer program page.
The iPhone Developer page isn't WO. It's .action URLs, which i
BELIEVE is Struts. The downloader app might be WO.
(2) The session management is a mess in iTunesConnect.
Honestly ... Never seen those problems with it, but maybe that's
just me. I definitely won't give iTC an Apple Design Award, though :)
(3) When I click into an article in page 3 of devforum and jump back,
it goes to page 1.
The dev forums aren't WO -- It's Jive, a commercial JSP-based forum
product.
(4) Short-lived session (since I type English very slow, RADAR often
kicks me out.)
Log a radar :) Sorry .. I couldn't resist.
(5) Apple Online Store made some bad assumption on the name of
customer and rewrite the bad data to apple acount. No way to change.
One of my friend got his name displayed on AppStore as "股公司
liu" for a
long time. The first part is not even part of his name!
What I said is, Apple's current wo apps are not good web apps
comaring
to other web apps I've used.
Since it's not an excellent web app (no matter what cause that), it
will not be a good testimonial of WO.
To each his own, I suppose. I actually think AOS is a pretty nice
app -- certainly as good (and slicker in several ways) than it's
equivalently-sized competitors (Amazon, Dell, etc). Concierge is
very slick. MobileMe is about as modern as you can get. One-to-One
is also cool. iTunes is one of the biggest apps on the web and works
pretty darn well.
Regardless, I think WO is actually thriving (as much as our little
part of the world thrives :) ).
ms
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