http://homepage.mac.com/doubtboy/KENSHOSCHMENSHO.htm
In Sit Down and Shut Up, there is a description of an experience which someone other than Brad called kensho, and this link is Brad's response to that. On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 5:26 AM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Hi Chris, > > Is it handy for you to quote the whole paragraph so it can be read in > context? > > If it is from Sit down and shut up, can you tell me the page number? I will > look it up myself. > > Thanks, > Siska > ------------------------------ > *From: * ChrisAustinLane <[email protected]> > *Sender: * [email protected] > *Date: *Mon, 23 May 2011 09:33:15 -0700 > *To: *[email protected]<[email protected]> > *ReplyTo: * [email protected] > *Subject: *Re: [Zen] Zen, zen and Theravada Buddhism > > > > In the spirit of animated controversy, there is supposedly a quote by > Dogen: kensho is the animated activity of non-Buddhists. I have only seen > it quoted by Brad Warner, however. > > Thanks, > Chris Austin-Lane > Sent from a cell phone > > On May 23, 2011, at 9:08, [email protected] wrote: > > Hi Ed, > > I still cannot figure out clearly what kensho actually is, but from the > descriptions, it looks like kensho is very similar to nyana (insight) > experience as in Mahasi tradition in Theravada. > > Daniel, looking forward to your opinion (or correction). > > Siska > ------------------------------ > *From: * "ED" <[email protected]> > *Sender: * [email protected] > *Date: *Mon, 23 May 2011 13:45:08 -0000 > *To: *<[email protected]> > *ReplyTo: * [email protected] > *Subject: *[Zen] Zen, zen and Theravada Buddhism > > > > > > Hello All, > > Definitions: Zen = Zen Buddhism; zen = Zen minus the Buddhism > > The Noble Eightfold Path is sometimes divided into three basic categories > as follows: > > > I. Wisdom (Sanskrit: prajna, Pali: panna) > > 1. Right understanding > > 2. Right intention > > II. Ethical conduct (Sanskrit and Pali: sila) > > 3. Right speech > > 4. Right action > > 5. Right livelihood > > III. Concentration (Sanskrit and Pali: samadhi) > > 6. Right effort > > 7. Right mindfulness > > 8. Right concentration > > > o Theravada Buddhism embraces all three categories of the Noble Eightfold > Path. > > o Zen accepts all three categories, but tends to de-emphasize I and II, > in my obsevation/knowledge/belief. > > o zen accepts category III only, or possibly only steps 7. and 8. of > category III. > > ------- > > Zenists (and zenists) seek to achieve, or, without seeking, achieve in > kensho-satori, glimpses of: a sense of no-self or no I/me/mine; a sense of > an absolute nondual reality; a sense of nothing arising or perishing; a > sense of freedom from all bonds; and a sense of seeing directly and deeply > into the nature of things, without discriminating or discursive thinking. > > The experience of the ineffable mind-space decribed above has been labeled > 'realizing Buddha Nature". > > I say 'glimpses of a sense of'' because we have to take the practitioner at > his/her word, or the Zen Teacher at his/her word for this accomplishment or > non-accomplishment of a student of Zen experiencing the above state. > > And, it doesn't really matter because, no tangible benefits are promised to > ensue from these experiences. Do non-experiencers of kensho-satori observe > any tangible, positive transformation in Zenists who have experienced > kensho-satori? We do not know. > > ------ > > Of the dozens and dozens of zen/Zen centers in the US, perhaps only one > advocates 'zen'. Possibly for now we ought to only focus on comparing > Theravada Buddhism with *Zen*, and leave out zen. > > Daniel, kindly tell us if through Theravada Buddhist practices, > experiences of mind-states similar to the ones in kensho-satori tend to > arise. > > Thanks, ED > > > > > > >
