Hi siska,
> > "Note that not all variants of Buddhism recognize these stages." > Do you think zen is one of them, as in, there is no parallel to the nyanas in zen? Not that I know of. --ED PS: This interchange below taken from the Internet concerning nyanas or nanas, may be of interest to you. "For Buddhists, Have you ever heard about Vipassana nana sixteen step? Theravada Buddhism regards Vipassana (insight meditation) as the highest dharmma practice to purify mind and to liberate frome the suffering. However, the phenomena of experience in practice seems to be so mysterious. I have read Vipassana nana (insight meditation experience) which is classified into sixteen steps but I need more details about this point. il 5, 2011 at 10:46 am <http://mysticbanana.com/for-buddhist-have-you-ever-heard-about-vipassan\ a-nana-sixteen-steps-2.html/comment-page-1#comment-294828> Joe B answers: I was a vipassan monk doing intensive Vipassana meditation for some years in Asian monasteries. To get through the Nyanas you need to do intensive meditation and mostly with a trained monk from that specific tradition. As one passes through the various Nyanas certain things may happen to one's body. These can be all sorts of strange and unusual sensations. One is generally advised to ignore the sensations and concentrate on the object of meditation, which is often just to watch and see the breath come and go and observe how it effects our body. Nyana's are level's of insights about life and how we get through it. The first Nyana is called Nama Rupa ( body and mind) and if we really understand that Nyana we will see that everything we experience, emphasis on EVERYTHING, is first filtered through our minds. Normally we are completelly unaware of this dynamic but if we can become aware of it, it dramatically effects how we we experience everything. Once we stop intensive meditation the insights gained from Vipassand commonly fade from our lives unless we do one of two things. 1. Unless we maintain the practise. 2. Or unless we were very succesfull with our Vipassana meditations and achieved the higher Nyana's. Most Westerners are not that successful though, as we are just either to angry or neurotic etc. One generally has to seek out Vipassana teachers to get proper guidance. Google is great for this!! Also a big part of Vipassana practise is to do everything mega slowly and observe what happens second by second e.g. when walking lightly concentrate on one's feet. When eating, concentrate on sensations in the mouth. When brushing one's teeth actually concentrate on the sensations in the mouth etc. Do everything slowly and mindfully, that's the basis of Vipassan practise. Hope this helps. PS. Not all Theravada think Vipassana is the highest way, it seems Buddha did not practise Vipassana but rather Samatha meditation which leads to the 8 Jhana mind states called Divine Homes. It seems Vipassana became a popular method of meditation after a Sri Lanka monk called BuhhhaGosa ( BG) wrote his commentary on Buddhism. BG wrote an instruction manuel on meditation (VisudhiMaggha) and from that various forms of meditation arose. It seem BG was actually a Vedic scholar and included lots of ancient Hindu practises into his commentary." --- In [email protected], siska_cen@... wrote: > Hi Ed, "Note that not all variants of Buddhism recognize these stages." Do you think zen is one of them, as in, there is no parallel to the nyanas in zen? Siska Hi Mike and siska, See below. --ED Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Night_of_the_Soul <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Night_of_the_Soul> "Buddhist parallels In Buddhist vipassana meditation, the practitioner passes through the "Sixteen Stages of Insight" (nanas) towards Awakening. Steps five to ten are the "Knowledges of Suffering" (dukkha nanas): * Knowledge of Dissolution (bhanga nana) * Knowledge of Fearfulness (bhaya nana) * Knowledge of Misery (adinava nana) * Knowledge of Disgust (nibbida nana) * Knowledge of Desire for Deliverance (muncitukamayata nana) * Knowledge of Re-observation (patisankha nana) Western Buddhist meditators and teachers regularly compare this experience to the Dark Night, for example Jack Engler[6] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Night_of_the_Soul#cite_note-5> : The 16th century Christian contemplative, St. John of the Cross, called this phase "the dark night of the soul" for the same reason: the night is dark because it is overwhelmingly clear that neither God nor the soul nor the self as we knew them are any longer to be found. There is instinctive recoil and withdrawal: nothing seems sufficiently worth doing or caring about without them. These parallel experiences across faiths have led to speculation that the Dark Night is a common spiritual or mystical state or stage which is independent of the specific belief system. The Buddhist author Daniel Ingram, who also invokes St. John, uses the term "maps" for the sequence of mental states: The Christian maps, the Sufi maps, the Buddhist maps of the Tibetans and the Theravada, and the maps of the Khabbalists and Hindus are all remarkably consistent in their fundamentals. (â¦) These maps, Buddhist or otherwise, are talking about something inherent in how our minds progress in fundamental wisdom that has little to do with any tradition and lots to do with the mysteries of the human mind and body. Note that not all variants of Buddhism recognize these stages." --- In [email protected], mike brown <uerusuboyo@...> wrote: > > Hi ED, > > A couple of points. First, I think Siska was referring to the nanas (or nyanas) which are a bit different from the jhanas. Jhanas are states of absorption that one experiences as a result of concentrating (samatha) on an object of meditation (usually the breath). Nanas are (16) stages of insight (vipassana) gained when we look inside and become acutely aware of our sensate world. For example, by focusing our attention on bodily pain we can come to realise its impermanence > > and thus the 3 Characters of Existence (this is the 3rd stage of the nanas - the first 2 are: 1) body and mind and 2) cause and effect). The jhanas alone won't give you wisdom, only vipassana will, but they're useful for giving one the state of mind to go deeper into vipassana. > > Mike
