You are selfless no matter what you do. 

But it sounds like you are beset. If there is anything the folks on the 
listserv can do, I trust you to let us know. Perhaps you may find this debate 
fun. 

I find the difference between being "surrounded by devils" and being 
"surrounded by boddhisattva's" usually is a reflection of my nervous system. 
Who suffers more than the cruel?  What cruelty is not interlaced with ordinary 
good?  Tyrants try to perfect evil only to fail. 

Thanks, 
Chris Austin-Lane
Sent from a cell phone

On Sep 13, 2011, at 6:37, [email protected] wrote:

> 
> 
> Good for you.
> 
> I don't care about what others have in mind whenever they are being kind. I 
> do know that I'm not selfless when I'm being kind although I never ask for 
> anything in return.
> 
> It's easy to be happy when all the boddhisatvas are around. I wanna be in 
> peace whether it is boddhisatvas or devils or demons that surround me. 
> 
> Still a long way to go.
> 
> Siska
> From: ChrisAustinLane <[email protected]>
> Sender: [email protected]
> Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2011 06:08:59 -0700
> To: [email protected]<[email protected]>
> ReplyTo: [email protected]
> Cc: [email protected]<[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Fwd: Re: [Zen Living] Supreme Vehicle
> 
> Wow, that is really different from my experience. I am constantly living in a 
> sea of kind action. Food is shared, cars yield, smiles are smiled, sesshins 
> are planned, children are taught, people send emails with interesting 
> conversations for me to enjoy. I can scarcely go ten feet without running 
> into another marvel.
> 
> In Three Pillar's of Zen, someone says: when you begin to tread upon the 
> Buddha path, ten thousand boddhisattvas spring up to help you. 
> 
> That has totally been my daily life. 
> 
> Someone may wish to argue that I can't peak into the heads of all these 
> helpful folks and see what thoughts they has during their action, but how are 
> their thoughts any more essential than my thoughts? Such a judgmental 
> question would cause me to miss so much good food and moments, I will please 
> skip it.
> 
> Thanks,
> Chris Austin-Lane
> Sent from a cell phone
> 
> On Sep 13, 2011, at 5:20, [email protected] wrote:
> 
> > Hi Mayka,
> > 
> > I agree there are people who serve 'selflessly' for the benefit of people. 
> > 'Selfless' here is in the sense where the actions are not performed for the 
> > benefit of oneself but others, and nothing is expected in return from 
> > people who receive the kindness. I believe this is what you are saying. And 
> > again, I agree.
> > 
> > On the other hand, unless it is an action of an enlightened person (or in 
> > Zen's words perhaps of Buddha Mind), then there is still 'self' or 'ego' 
> > behind these 'selfless' acts. Most people still do an act of kindness with 
> > a purpose, for example, to see others happy. What happen if others are not 
> > happy? What happen if the conditions of people being helped is not improved?
> > 
> > This is not to say that there is absolutely no one, on this earth, who do 
> > kindness just for the sake of doing it, just like eating when hungry and 
> > sleeping when sleepy, without identifying the kindness as something more 
> > special than the act of eating and sleeping. There may be. I just have not 
> > met any.
> > 
> > Siska
> > ------Original Message------
> > From: Maria Lopez
> > Sender: [email protected]
> > To: [email protected]
> > ReplyTo: [email protected]
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] Fwd: Re: [Zen Living] Supreme Vehicle
> > Sent: Sep 11, 2011 15:53
> > 
> > Siska: They may be a tiny minority left in the world but still there are 
> > people who do things for the wellbeing of life and other human fellows for 
> > nothing. It's empathy what leads this minority to act in that way. There 
> > also culutres consider as an undevelop that they also do things for the 
> > sake of doing it. And there is not a catch when they do that. On the other 
> > side of the spectrum and Living in that "develop" societies that seem to go 
> > crazy in the worst way of destructive madness for all what is simple and 
> > beautiful and giving as a result selfish self-centered individuals doesn't 
> > mean that everyone is on that boat. Mayka --- On Sun, 11/9/11, 
> > [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote: From: [email protected] 
> > <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Zen] Fwd: Re: [Zen Living] Supreme 
> > Vehicle To: [email protected] Date: Sunday, 11 September, 2011, 
> > 4:27 Hi Mayka, > A high percentage of English people met, they tended to be 
> > very friendly only when they're not in their own land or also when they 
> > want something from you. Don't we all? Each of us is selfish being. It's 
> > only the extend we apply it in our actions that is a little different. 
> > Unless we're enlightened. Siska From: Maria Lopez 
> > <[email protected]> Sender: [email protected] Date: Sat, 10 
> > Sep 2011 15:07:04 +0100 (BST) To: <[email protected]> ReplyTo: 
> > [email protected] Subject: Re: [Zen] Fwd: Re: [Zen Living] Supreme 
> > Vehicle Billl: If someone from the all over the world student s studying in 
> > England hear you about this "friendly people" may give you a good slap in 
> > the face to help see reality in England. American people are very helpful 
> > and friendly, that is a true statement. But, THE ENGLISH LIVING IN 
> > ENGLAND?. I don't think so!!. A high percentage of English people met, they 
> > tended to be very friendly only when they're not in their own land or also 
> > when they want something from you. . Mayka --- On Fri, 9/9/11, Bill! 
> > <[email protected]> wrote: From: Bill! <[email protected]> Subje
> > 
> > ------------------------------------
> > 
> > Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are 
> > reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> 

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