On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 09:16:33 -0800 (PST), JS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > G: And Christianity is actually dying in Europe and the people there are > becoming rejecting religion more and more. So what exactly do you think > Western technological and material advances prove? What kind of model do > they point to? > Are technological and material advances ANY kind of proof of spiritual > validity anyway?
> J: Technological advances prove the vitality and power of the mind. > > ' "Before all else, God created the mind." From the dawn of creation, it was > made to be revealed in the temple of man. ' -Abdu'l-Baha Sure, "The first thing created by God was the Intellect" (Prophetic hadith) I guess there might be a question of what kind of knowledge and what kind of intellect is more important, And what kind of knowledge is related to spirituality. > > ' Consider carefully: all these highly varied phenomena, these concepts, > this knowledge, these technical procedures and philosophical systems, these > sciences, arts, industries and inventions--all are emanations of the HUMAN > MIND. WHATEVER PEOPLE has ventured deeper into this shoreless sea, has come > to EXCEL THE REST. The happiness and pride of a nation consist in this, that > it should shine out like the sun in the high heaven of knowledge. "Shall > they who have knowledge and they who have it not, be treated alike?"(Qur'an > 39:12) ' -Abdu'l-Baha > (I think the Quranic reference numbers is the wrong one but yes I've read similar things in the Quran. But again, I'm not convinced that the primary meaning is that countries with microwave ovens and cell phones are supposed to be spiritually more advanced than the countries which don't. > ' Have they forgotten the celebrated hadíth (Holy Tradition): "Seek after > knowledge, even unto China"? It is certain that the people of China were, in > the sight of God, among the most rejected of men, because they worshiped > idols and were unmindful of the omniscient Lord. Gilberto: I actually wouldn't say that. Buddhism and Taoism would have been growing in China by then and I wouldn't just want to dismiss those beliefs as simple idolatry. I'm not saying that the hadith excludes seek worldly secular knowledge. A Muslim should seek all kinds of knowledge, both sacred and secular. But that's besides the point. All I'm saying is that secular knowledge doesn't prove spiritual superiority. > > > G: The populations of many of these countries are religious Muslims and > > so if you "democratize" and had governments which were more inclusive > > and responsive to popular will, I suspect that in alot of places > > religious leaders might have more influence in government, not less. > > > J: How unfortunate for Baha'is if it be so. > > G: The way you are conceiving the problem doesn't allow for any kind of > unity or compromise. > > J: We would love to be in unity with the Muslims around the world. Will > you and your brothers accept me if I told you nothing you can do will shake > my belief that Baha'u'llah is the Lord of the Day of Judgement? We sure > accept you because we accept the Prophet Muhammad and His Book the Qur'an. I can accept you as an individual regardless of what you believe. Peace Gilberto "My people are hydroponic" __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:archive@mail-archive.com To unsubscribe, send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe, use subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu/read/?forum=bahai-st News - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Public - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaist Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
