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I'm not certain where one draws the line between astral projection/lucid
dreaming and meditation, but I would suggest that they are clearly different
things. I believe I recall seeing a letter/compilation from the House on
the subject of psychic forces several years
The Baha'i Studies Listserv
Literally, the Holy Land. . . .
Figuratively, who knows?
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This Holy Land hath been mentioned and extolled in all the sacred
Scriptures. In it have appeared the Prophets of God and His chosen Ones.
This is the
I have in fact seen Daniel's book. Maybe I didn't read carefully enough,
but I'm not sure he has proven his point. To you and me it looks like
some
of the material in the NT supports a physical resurrection, but this looks
to me in conflict with the Baha'i position.
David,
What are the
Does that need to be understood literally? I think the common Baha'i
belief that Zoroaster, Buddha and Krishna are from the seed of Abraham
is probably a myth.
warmest, Susan
Susan,
With so much focus on Issac and Ishmael many people sometimes forget (or
never hear about) the other children of
If the Manifestation can convince so wicked and spiritually blind a man as
the Sultan in ten minutes; surely the next Manifestation will be able to
prove His or Her mission to the House of Justice.
Brent,
If, as some might interpret it to, the Tablet of the Holy Mariner, at
least on one level,
22:35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked
him a question, tempting him, and saying, 22:36 Master, which is the great
commandment in the law? 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy
God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy
mind.
22:38 This is
Richard,
I'm not certain of the Arabic here, but there could be a connection between
branch sapling. There are a number of hardwood tree species (willow,
cottonwood, aspen, etc.) where a branch cutting will root when placed in wet
soil become a cloned sapling.
Patti
- Original Message
The Civil Rights act was passed in the latter part of 1964, not 1963. It
grew out of the Civil Rights protests which began in 1955 with the
Montgomery Bus Boycott.
Oops. Thanks Susan. I've never claimed to be a historian I had Rosa
Parks associated with the 60's rather than 50's. I wasn't
Gilberto Wrote:
"I'm refering to the idea that
Jewish suffering for the past 2000 years or so was somehow due to the things
which *some* Jews might have tried to do to Jesus. Or the idea that Muslims
might be suffering due to what *some* Muslims might have done to Bahais."
Patti's
It is also possible that He was not restricting beings with souls to this
planet, but I am just speculating.
Mark,
Certainly, the idea that He might only be referring to this planet didn't
even enter my mind. I think of God as independent of space time.
Patti
IMO, `Abdu'l-Baha is saying that there was always a being with a soul
(somewhere).
Mark,
I take it even further than this in that the human soul existed in the plan
of God, but was not necessarily somewhere, but sometime.
Patti
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You are
Does anyone know how to contact (by email) the people that produce Ocean?
Or can someone point out a link to them on the Ocean/Baha'i Education
website?
James
If you have Ocean installed on your computer there is a link to the author
under the resources button on the toolbar (and also under
I don't believe that the Nicean creed is necessarily authentic
Christianity. The real Christians were probably all eaten by lions or
never left the catecombs. There are some Jewish Christian (like
Ebionites) groups with docetic tendancies which from a Muslim
perspective seem a likelier
Gilberto:
Ok, I believe you. But then when you are in your Bahai paradigm, and
read that the Buddha is identified with being a Manifestation, but the
teachings of real live Buddhists in the world don't seem to be
consistent with the Bahai teachings, I'm not sure what you do. Do you
bracket
But in the Kitab I-Iqan is the section which has often been quoted to me:
How could God, when once the Day-star of the beauty of Jesus had
disappeared from the sight of His people, and ascended unto the fourth
heaven, cause His holy Book, His most great testimony amongst His
creatures, to
I took up Susan on her challenge to ask about new prophets among
Christians.
Below is my original question and the first few responses.
Thanks Gilberto,
It is interesting to read these.
Patti
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Gilberto:
I might have. Personally, I would have to make a serious study of
Daniel and Revelation before I would feel really confident responding
in a specific way. Offhand my impression is that Biblical prophecies
are really murky, and given the range of different interpretations
given to
Gilberto:
Not exactly. Consider 1 Corinthians 12
[4] Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit;
[5] and there are varieties of service, but the same Lord;
[6] and there are varieties of working, but it is the same God who
inspires them all in every one.
[7] To each is given the
According to Baha'u'llah, an arsonist can be either burned alive or
sentenced to life in prison.
It seems that the harshness of this punishment is, at least in part, related
to and intended to be a deterrent to acts such as the wholesale genocidal
burning of homes villages that we've been seeing
What the House did, after reviewing the Text and the authorized
interpretations by the Master and the Guardian, was conclude that the Text
states that membership on the House is limited to men, and that it cannot
change that provision.
It's my understanding that there is also the future
There are numerous texts in the Quran and hadith where husbands are
told to treat their wives kindly and mercifully. And they are told
specifically not to beat them.
Gilberto,
Thanks for pointing these out.
Patti
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As far as the Hands or Counselors having the station of a Minor Prophet,
it seems to me there are many differences. For example, Minor Prophets
possess stainlessness or immaculacy, but this protection is not given to the
Counsellors. The Minor Prophets possess the power of accurate
The appearance of dependent Manifestations prior to the next Independent
Manifestation are, in my view, ruled out by a different verse -- the closing
verse of the Will and Testament of Abdu'l-Baha, in which He states to turn
to the Center of the Cause (the Guardian) and the Universal House of
This could be useful, especially if one can apply a more rigid notion
of fulfillment of prophecy. Where you have a prophecy which clearly
designated as a prophecy, and where it is clear what conditions would
satisfy the prophecy and what would not. But very very very few
prophecies are like that.
"Taking Gilberto's side on this, how do we explain that there is a need for
a new revelation if Islam (given than the writings in the Hadith and Qur'an are
accurate) is already here, and as Gilberto has shown us, there are many teaching
already in Islam that we Baha'is claim to be unique to
Gilberto:
Yes, exactly. Many religions prosyletize. But the Bahais give the
impression of prosyletizing, but not admitting that they are
prosyletizing.
. . .
And looking at the Bahais by themselves it might be possible to say
that there is just some isolated misunderstanding. But then
Gilberto:
Bahais claim that they don't prosyletize. And when I've looked into an
explanation I've been told that it means that they don't threaten
non-Bahais with hellfire for not believing. But then that's exactly
what is found in the writings of the Bab.
Patti:
I agree that there is a problem
Gilberto:
Just a few issues around the question of Biblical corruption:
[2.79] Woe, then, to those who write the
book with their hands and
then say: This is from Allah, so that they may
take for it a small
price; therefore woe to them for what their hands have
written and woe
to them
Gilberto:
Not exactly. I'm was saying **Jesus** didn't change the laws. But then
Pauline Christianity after him declared most or all of the rules of
the Torah abrogated. I think there is a fairly large disconnect
between what Jesus taught and Christian doctrines.
Patti:
I largely agree with
Brent:
Fulfill. Not co-opt.
Gilberto:
So what do you think co-opt means?
Hi Gilberto,
Please allow me to jump in here. I think it might be useful to look at how
Christ fulfilled the law of Moses:
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come
to destroy,
... how true the Bible--and how the convergence between the two will
inspire you to reconsider both your Scripture and your Einstein.
Schroeder is widely identified (correctly, in my view) with the
intelligent design movement, a particularly obnoxious species of
creationism.
Hi Mark,
I guess
As you can see you have some literal phrases in here... first
duty... and serve those that have recognized. In my
subsequent responses I've responded to what I thought was your
interpretation of the found passage. Which does not, in
fact, combine those two phrases of first duty or serve
A third of Americans are biblical literalists who believe that the Bible is
the actual word of God and is to be taken literally, word for word.
Mark,
You are probably already aware of this, but if not: . . . our sufficiency
is of God; 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new
Dear Kazeh,
Thank you for sharing this. Also, I'm cutting
and pasting some of my thoughts from a post to the list a couple of years ago,
I'm not certain whether or not you saw it because it was at the bottom of a
longer post on a different subject. Also, Susanreminded me back then
that it
It should not be imagined that the people of Persia are inherently
deficient in intelligence, or that for essential perceptiveness and
understanding, inborn sagacity, intuition and wisdom, or innate capacity,
they are inferior to others. God forbid! On the contrary, they have
always excelled all
Where in the Quoran does it say "kill the infidel
wherever you find him". It doesn't come up in Ocean.
I think this is what you are looking
for:
That is because those who
misbelieve follow falsehood, and those who believe follow the truth from their
Lord. Thus does God set forth for men
"That is certainly not what they would say they were doing. What they do is
take the verse "kill the infidel wherever you find him" which was revealed
later, as abrogating "let there be no compulsion in religion." But let me
stress, only some Muslims do this. "
Susan,
Here are some of my
Several years ago I noticed the allegorical use of the term merchant in
the Book of Revelation to refer to religious leaders who use religion to
satisfy their own quests for either the physical riches of the earth or to
feed their vanity and egos on the souls of men.
Speaking of Babylon, the
Well, don't forget Muhammad and the Bab were
chants too. ;-}
I wasn't forgetting (it came out in the Ocean
search when I was tracking down the exact quotes I was thinking about). In
this caseI'm referringonly to the allegorical "merchants" of
corrupted religion--Babylon, not earthly ones
"To a limited degree, this is reasonable. But it escapes this mind
how one whose station is as great as that of Quddus could think of himself as a
Manifestation. 'Abdu'l-Baha and the Guardian, for example, were quick to
discount being thought of as a Manifestation. Why would someone as
It is even possible that the condition of those who have died in sin and
unbelief may become changed - that is to say, they may become the object of
pardon through the bounty of God, not through His justice - for bounty is
giving without desert, and justice is giving what is deserved.
--
suppose He just walked or ran back while the smoke was in the air. How
long
would it have taken Him to get back, and could He have done so in time if
I'm not certain exactly how far apart the two doors were. But, from this
description in The Dawn-Breakers, which places the nail in the wall
"We don't even know for sure it was a miracle. Remember, the regiment
in question had no wish to kill the Bab."
Susan,
Yes, it's true that the leader of the regiment did not wish to kill the
Bab; however, I doubt that he could have ordered his 750 soldiers to shoot for
the ropes and for
However, one must begin with a literal understanding of a word (one may
even
find it necessary to repair to a dictionary). One must also begin with
fundamental principles. It is, I think, better to adhere to plain
meanings,
dictionary definitions and fundamental principles rather than step
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