Excluding license fees, high quality unlicensed radios are at or higher than the cost of licensed radios. Granted this is my limited experience with one link and five vendors vetted. The trade off in path profile validity with no interference has an immeasurable value, pricing the licensed links way under the unlicensed gear. you also want to take into account the price point keeping the spectrum cleaner. If say UBNT came out with some licensed link at 2k. Everybody and their brother would hop on those links, eat up the available spectrum shut down the market, leaving you only the option to put fiber in the ground, now that licensed link wouldnt seem so expensive. I dont want to see licensed links come down in price for that very reason alone. We cover an area where the average joe is priced out of that market, we just finally got to the point we can get into licensed links on a small scale. I know there are alot of regular entities putting up air fiber to get 100mbit throughput. There are tons of ptp cambium radios in the air around here, all of which would be licensed links if they came down even 5%. Then there would be nothing left in a short period of time
On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 8:54 AM, Mike Hammett <[email protected]> wrote: > Well right, we need more bandwidth per link, but also that in many areas > there's no links to be had, so we have to make do with what we have. > > For instance in that spot I'm working on the GigE links for, there's no 6 > GHz, 11 GHz and only 2x horizontal 18 GHz licenses available. It's not > exactly suburbia or HFT alley, either. > > I think the next step will have to be IP20 type solutions from more > vendors. > > Patrick is talking all kinds of engineering finesse that lowers how much > signal LTE needs to work well by like 10 - 15 dB. I wonder how much of that > would help licensed links. The thought there is that having more signal to > work with means that higher QAMs aren't as fragile as without that > fanciness. > > > Roadmap to 10G via licensed, anyone? > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > > ------------------------------ > *From: *"Ken Hohhof" <[email protected]> > *To: *[email protected] > *Sent: *Thursday, January 15, 2015 8:41:42 AM > > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Licensed backhaul pricing - still ridiculous > > All good points, not sure they address Erich’s issue of needing more > bandwidth per link without multiple antennas per link on the tower. I > think he’s saying an IP20 class radio is too expensive, and over the next > few years lots of us are going to need that kind of radio. > > *From:* Mike Hammett <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Thursday, January 15, 2015 8:27 AM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Licensed backhaul pricing - still ridiculous > > Pull all of the active licenses with old ass gear and feed their contact > information to the vendors? ;-) Maybe newer gear for hte existing guys > would cut down on how much they need. ;-) > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > > ------------------------------ > *From: *"Mike Hammett" <[email protected]> > *To: *[email protected] > *Sent: *Thursday, January 15, 2015 8:25:39 AM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Licensed backhaul pricing - still ridiculous > > 10 GHz unlicensed would help. I sometimes think the license protections > are a bit excessive. > > Maybe loosen the geographic restrictions on 7 GHz and 13 GHz? > > Maybe some effort into getting 4 GHz and other legacy PtP bands opened > back up? They don't have a ton of room and don't allow for huge channels, > but some is better than none and maybe since the HFT guys care more about > lower latency and less about throughput, they''ll build longer hops and > leave our 11 and 6 gig alone? ;-) > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > > ------------------------------ > *From: *"Mike Hammett" <[email protected]> > *To: *[email protected] > *Sent: *Thursday, January 15, 2015 8:18:58 AM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Licensed backhaul pricing - still ridiculous > > You could drive around to all of the HFT sites and look for links that are > no longer there, but still licensed. Document. Come back 30 days later and > document again, submit to the FCC (or wherever Liz says is best) and have > those licenses revoked. ;-) > > But yeah, I do like Ceragon's 4x4 setup. Two radio heads, four > transmitters, two licenses, tons of bandwidth. > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > > ------------------------------ > *From: *"Erich Kaiser" <[email protected]> > *To: *[email protected] > *Sent: *Thursday, January 15, 2015 8:15:57 AM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Licensed backhaul pricing - still ridiculous > > The conversation goes deeper. In several areas we are out of spectrum, it > may be due to HFT or just plain out. So most WISPs if they have deployed > Licensed, they have to deal with what spectrum they have. The question > is, where do you see the licensed backhaul market in the next few years, > are they just going to be adding qams or finding other creative ways to add > capacity? I am not in the WISP business anymore so I have decided to try > and focus on the things that drove me nuts to help others. > > Erich Kaiser > North Central Tower Consulting > [email protected] > Office: 630-621-4804 > Cell: 630-777-9291 > > On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 7:33 AM, Daniel White <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Your issue is really then with promo’s and capacity keys – which is >> marketing and different ways to make revenue on a product. >> >> >> >> Just like the PtMP space, not all PtP vendors do capacity keys and play >> those games either. >> >> >> >> Daniel White >> >> (303) 746-3590 <%28303%29%20746-3590> >> >> >> >> *From:* Af [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Erich Kaiser >> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 14, 2015 9:47 PM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Licensed backhaul pricing - still ridiculous >> >> >> >> From my experience the price has not changed very much. Someone needs to >> take the reigns on the market. Even with certain companies throwing you a >> promo price, if you really look at it fully loaded, the price is still high >> for what you get. >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 10:35 PM, Jason McKemie < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >> I think we're already seeing it. They're not wifi chipset based radio >> kind of prices, but they can be found for less than half of what you could >> get them for just a few years ago. >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 10:30 PM, Erich Kaiser < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >> After several years, when will we see Licensed radios come down in >> price? There is so much margin in these things. Its ridiculous.... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > -- All parts should go together without forcing. You must remember that the parts you are reassembling were disassembled by you. Therefore, if you can't get them together again, there must be a reason. By all means, do not use a hammer. -- IBM maintenance manual, 1925
