"The manufacturing, transportation, and erection of these things is not offset by the gains, its a net carbon loss at the end of the day."
I haven't seen any data that corroborates that statement. You basically have to look at how long they plan for them to run, the power generated during that time, include maintenance, and compare that to the cost to manufacture and erect. On Fri, Feb 17, 2017 at 11:21 AM, That One Guy /sarcasm <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote: > realistic dependency reduction is something we havent seen, regulating > industries out of buisines or to the point consumers cannot afford things is > not the way to go. > Imagine how many of these millions of windmills we have in the US without > huge consumptions of oil. exactly zero. The manufacturing, transportation, > and erection of these things is not offset by the gains, its a net carbon > loss at the end of the day. They dont even account for the technician carbon > footprint driving from turbine to turbine. I would like to see an actual > report on the oil cost per turbine, taking into account all factors, > including the oil for fedex to deliver replacement parts, and oil > consumption in rope and rigging. > > Solar is a joke en mass, from a carbon perspective, especially here where > all our power comes from nuclear. > > hydroelectric, maybe not a whole lod of oil consumption, but ecological > impact is catastrophic, what do we have now 2 salmon variants > > shut it all down > > > On Fri, Feb 17, 2017 at 10:11 AM, Josh Reynolds <j...@kyneticwifi.com> > wrote: >> >> That's a pretty irrational stance to take, being 100% against a resource I >> mean. >> >> It is not irrational to reduce dependency on anything though, for a >> variety of reasons. >> >> On Fri, Feb 17, 2017 at 10:08 AM, <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> > Try to make industrial amounts of electricity without oil. Even >> > hydroelectric turbines need lube. Transformers are filled with oil. If >> > you >> > are against oil, be against oil. >> > >> > -----Original Message----- From: Josh Reynolds >> > Sent: Friday, February 17, 2017 8:58 AM >> > To: af@afmug.com >> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Jaime's thread >> > >> > I'm trying to figure out what electricity has to do with oil from your >> > statement. >> > >> > You can also make a decision to reduce oil consumption where logical. >> > This would be a good thing from a monetary and national defense >> > standpoint among other things. >> > >> > On Fri, Feb 17, 2017 at 9:55 AM, <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Being against oil but using oil... >> >> Think FedEx can do its thing without oil? >> >> >> >> If you are truly against oil, stop using it. >> >> Go to the forest. No kerosene lamps, deer fat tallow candles perhaps. >> >> No guns, takes oil to make guns... >> >> >> >> etc >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- From: Josh Reynolds >> >> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2017 8:53 AM >> >> To: af@afmug.com >> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Jaime's thread >> >> >> >> Would you mind clarifying the follow a bit? Thanks >> >> >> >> "Being against oil but using electricity and vehicles and FedEx." >> >> >> >> On Fri, Feb 17, 2017 at 9:32 AM, <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> I like driving my gas and diesel vehicles. >> >>> I like the products derived from oil like the jacket on CAT 5 cable >> >>> and >> >>> printed circuit boards. >> >>> I like the price of oil to be as low as possible. >> >>> I prefer having sources in this hemisphere and not funding the Arab >> >>> world. >> >>> >> >>> I too have built many miles of copper and fiber over public and tribal >> >>> lands. I have gone through the exact same NEPA and FLPMA process as >> >>> the >> >>> pipeline many many times. I consider myself a NEPA expert and am >> >>> currently >> >>> advising the US Senate on ways to make that process work faster. >> >>> >> >>> Pissing and moaning that folks with more money than you are building a >> >>> pipe >> >>> to make even more money than you sounds like sour grapes and jealousy. >> >>> If >> >>> you are against the “commons” don’t use common frequencies. Don’t use >> >>> ROWs. >> >>> Don’t use electricity. >> >>> >> >>> I don’t get several things: >> >>> >> >>> Being against oil but using electricity and vehicles and FedEx. >> >>> Being against certain forms of arguably safer and more efficient oil >> >>> transportation. >> >>> Being against certain rich people doing business but attempting to >> >>> become >> >>> a >> >>> richer person yourself. >> >>> Being against the use of public and private ROWs for oil pipelines but >> >>> not >> >>> for water pipelines, natural gas pipelines, sewers, fiber cables or >> >>> electric. >> >>> >> >>> And being a second or third generation wanna-be 1960s social justice >> >>> warrior >> >>> going thousands of miles to hang with other like minded people and >> >>> think >> >>> you >> >>> are really doing anything be being cold, being an ass, being stupid >> >>> and >> >>> wasting your time and the resources of local, state and federal >> >>> authorities. >> >>> Those folks are punks. (Their parents probably have BA in liberal >> >>> arts). >> >>> >> >>> And yes, BTW, I too have made deals with tribes. It is as Lewis >> >>> describes. >> >>> You make the deal, you pay the money and more often than not when >> >>> tribal >> >>> leadership changes, the deal no longer exists and you have another >> >>> round >> >>> of >> >>> payola. I have native American heritage in my blood. Don’t get all >> >>> butt >> >>> hurt when I say it is called “indian giving” for a reason. Tribes >> >>> have >> >>> communal property. You never own anything, you just possess it for a >> >>> time >> >>> until some other tribal member decides they need it. That spills over >> >>> to >> >>> dealing with non tribal members. >> >>> >> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_giver >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> > > > > > > -- > If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as > part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.
