Op za, 06-05-2006 te 11:00 +0200, schreef Harry Vennik: > Op vrijdag 5 mei 2006 23:53, schreef Vivia Nikolaidou: > > On Fri, 5 May 2006, Harry Vennik wrote: > > > > [OFF] minimise instead of close -> in preferences > > > > This is something only set once. From usability point of view > > > > it's even wrong to minimise a window (to the tray) when the close > > > > button is used as this should do the same as the "close" entry in the > > > > main menu. Though, this is an often requested feature, so it should > > > > be kept, and it's place is in the preferences window. > > > > > > I do not agree 100% here, but I think you're close. The tray icon should > > > be regarded as a separate window. Pressing the close button or close in > > > the main menu should both only close the window they're in, the main > > > window in this case. There should also be a 'Quit' or 'Exit' item > > > appended to the first menu that will terminate aMSN, and thus make the > > > trayicon disappear too. > > > > No, no, please NOT. First, the average user won't see the difference > > between Close and Exit, I've never seen such a thing in any applications. > You're not using KDE I guess??? > > In KDE an item called 'Close' will always close only a window (or if there is > only 1 window for the instance of the app, just the document), and a 'Quit' > will close the app.
> > Second AND most important: the close button with the X in the program's > > main window is there for quitting the program, for goodness' sake! Yes it > > is for closing the window they are in, but isn't this the same as the icon > > down right, or the window in the taskbar? > No, because I'll get really annoyed (and so will many other users) if > clicking > the close button will terminate aMSN!!! I want it to be always running, and > when I close the window, I do so to get rid of that window, and no more than > that. >From usability point, a close button on the main window *should* terminate the application. THe trayicon is just over mis-used by much IM-clients. You know, that tray is a "notification area". The place for minimised windows to represent their respective application is still alive *is* the taskbar. Having 2 places for this is just confusing. You, you are used to it because you just learned it this wqay, but you don't want new-comers to be like "wtf ?". I saw more then one un-experienced user just close a program like this with the close button without knowing it's still alive. MSN Messenger, the first time, shows a warning to say like "Hey, I'm going to do something you won't expect, so I warn you". Why should the user memorise "for this application closing means removing the closing means minimising to an icon" and "gfor that application 'minimise' means the same but instead of just an icon it shows an icon and a title in the menubar" and "for this, close means exit the application completely". This "notification area" idea is made for the OS and applications (mostly deamons that don't have a window on the desktop) to notify the user about things. One way where aMSN could use the notificationj area would be to have an icon there when a new message arrives or a mail arrives. Though, I'm sure most of our users will complain if we only have an icon for this kind of 'notifications'. Therefor, let's keep the icon always shown for now (maybe have it plug-in'able) and have the main window just behave like any other aplication by default. This means, press "close" or choose Account > Close means the window closes and the application is terminated. We could have an (advanced) preference for having it "minimise to tray" on close then for those who can't live without it, but this should *NOT* be default. This way, novice users aren't confused and those more advanced users who do want to have it minimise, they are the ones who know where to find it. > > > Then why shouldn't the Close button just close it and keep it in the taskbar > > (ie, minimized)? It's like this in every program that I've seen, apart from > > some IMs which insist on laughing at you: "you want to close me? Haha, you > > can't, I want to stay open!". One of the reasons why I first loved aMSN is > > that it obeyed to the normal rule. > Clicking the Minimize button will keep the window open, and just hide it, and > it will keep taking space on the taskbar for example. Clicking close should > really close the window (it really isn't there anymore, so it won't be on the > taskbar either), but still not hurt the trayicon. Those IMs you're talking > about can still be terminated by right-clicking the trayicon and choosing > quit. > Most, I think all, apps that have a tray icon will not terminate on closing > the window, but stay stand-by in the tray. > > > Now that I saw that the HIG people think like this too, I'm even capable of > > placing a veto here. Really. > No, I don't think so. ;-) But you are only thinking about users of your sort, the "advanced computer users". > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > > Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? > > Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job > > easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache > > Geronimo > > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 > > _______________________________________________ > > Amsn-devel mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? > Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier > Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 > _______________________________________________ > Amsn-devel mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel > ------------------------------------------------------- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 _______________________________________________ Amsn-devel mailing list [email protected] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel
