>And why we ask for fairness in life?
>What this fairness is
based on?
>When the innocent girl
in Dhemaji died, did we ask for fairness?
That must be a 'logical'( by your logi that is ) and
'philosophically profound' sounding explanation of why you charged me
with spinning your record, but refusing to explain how. But with my
lack of logical reasoning power I remain as befuddled as ever.
I must echo your favorite phrase of 'hobo-diyok baaru'. Moi
bujilw kothatw ( I understand). So I will not try to rub it in any
further :-).
At 10:21 AM -0500 6/30/05, Rajen Barua wrote:
I consider it fair in such case of "Betonit poril ow, baxu.deba.ye nomoh".
And why we ask for fairness in life?
What this fairness is based on?
When the innocent girl in Dhemaji died, did we ask for fairness?
Rajen
----- Original Message -----From: Chan MahantaTo: Rajen Barua ; [email protected]Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:30 AMSubject: Re: [Assam] Sunil Nath in Tehelka
People hope lot of things. ULFA hope that GOI will grant Independence. For its position also, ULFA has to distort lot of views. In some case it is better not to try to set the record right when you find that it does not serve any purpose. In such case we have a saying:
>Betonit poril ow, baxudebaye nomoh.That is fine Rajen. That is your choice.My only comment is that if that is how you wish to deal with it, then was it fair or appropriate to accuse ME of SPINNING, or attempting to distort the record of your views as expressed in Assam Net?cAt 9:16 AM -0500 6/30/05, Rajen Barua wrote:
*** But you have the ability, or so one might hope, to set the record straight. If I am distorting your views, spinning, why not tell everyone HOW ?
People hope lot of things. ULFA hope that GOI will grant Independence. For its position also, ULFA has to distort lot of views. In some case it is better not to try to set the record right when you find that it does not serve any purpose. In such case we have a saying:
Betonit poril ow, baxudebaye nomoh.
Rajen
----- Original Message -----
From: Chan Mahanta
To: Rajen Barua ; [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Assam] Sunil Nath in Tehelka
At 7:48 AM -0500 6/30/05, Rajen Barua wrote:
You are again violating the basic garden variety type logic and trying to spin.
*** But you have the ability, or so one might hope, to set the record straight. If I am distorting your views, spinning, why not tell everyone HOW ?
Bye Bye.
Rajen
----- Original Message -----
From: Chan Mahanta
To: Barua25 ; [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 7:35 AM
Subject: Re: [Assam] Sunil Nath in Tehelka
>It must be our desi gene that I cannot understand you
*** I won't necessarily debate the point.
>But if you question the very basis and legitimacy of such demands
*** That was in reference to your assertions.
>I had been voicing for such a platform for a long time.
*** You are the one who asserted with 'logical' analysis that ULFA had no basis for its demands or grievances for which it took up arms.
Then you turned around to recommend an alternative to ULFA to negotiate with GoI, when talk of ULFA/GoI talks seemed like a possibility. I know you have company, but it was amusing. Even people like Shantikam Hazarika and Dainik Asom Editors see no point in negotiations between the ULFA and GoI. That is from some of Assam's best among its movers and shakers.
If Assam had no grievances, no legitimate demands, then how come all of a sudden an alternative forum is required to negotiate with GoI ? You may not agree with ULFA's methods, but that is entirely different from Assam not having legitimate grievances, including that of self-determination. Something that its intelligentsia and its political class raised in the image of and beholden to the degenerated Indian system and accountable to none, failed to address, leading to the emergence of ULFA. That was what I wrote about when you proposed it and Ram rah-rahed it a few days back.What is the rationale here that I missed, other than seeming to try to have it both ways?
At 11:07 PM -0500 6/29/05, Barua25 wrote:
>But this whole thing is predicated upon whether there IS a problem, whether Assam has any legitimate grievances or demands.
I think you may call it my desi gene. I donot understand what you are trying to say here. I think Roy's whole proposition was to come up with a set of alternate practical demands for negotiation with GOI. But if you question the very basis and legitimacy of such demands, and an Assamese suspects that Assam may not have any legitimate demands at all, then how one will negotiate with GOI and on what basis GOI will grant anything to Assam. Without your knowledge you are also making ULFA's sacrice and their struggle for the last 25 years a Hobo Diok type of big joke for Assam. You are saying something like Tarun Gogoi who is saying now that there is no problem of illegal immigration problem in Assam. The question is how then you support Roy in his proposal to come up with a set of alternate demands. Are you suggesting that someone should again come up a set of alternate demands purely on emotion like ULFA did 25 years ago.
It must be our desi gene that I cannot understand you
I say Hobo Diok.
Rajen
----- Original Message -----
From: Chan Mahanta
To: Barua25 ; [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 10:06 PM
Subject: Re: [Assam] Sunil Nath in Tehelka
But this whole thing is predicated upon whether there IS a problem, whether Assam has any legitimate grievances or demands.
Those who cannot acknowledge that to begin with, cannot possibly embark on developing those demands to bring to the table with GoI, can they? If they do, they would be some of those despicable characters that attempt to have it both ways.
At 9:55 PM -0500 6/29/05, Barua25 wrote:
>If forces outside the ULFA want to influence the terms of negotiation and get their ideas about what a secondary set of >demands ought to be, they ought to go about forming public opinion on this independently of the ULFA and hope the >organization will echo them in their own political interest.
I agree in principle to this idea. In fact I had been voicing for such a platform for a long time. This we may call the Assam-GOI platform, outside of the ULFA-GOI box (virtually ignoring ULFA). This is a must for the Hobo Diok Assamese whether there is ULFA or not. The idea is to come up with a set of sensible legitimate and rational demands for Assam which ULFA itself cannot raise on technical grounds. For obvious reasons, ULFA cannot (and should not) enter this platform during the negotiation phase for reasons pointed out by you. (It would be incredibly stupid if the leaders of the ULFA were to say we want independence for Assam and, by the way, lets also talk about handing over the rights to oil extraction to the state government.). In fact ULFA should understand that this Assam-GOI platform is going to discuss issues which ULFA cannot on its own discuss or negotiate due to the position they are taking. This way ULFA can achieve something without loosing face. Once GOI has agreed to grant some agreed broad issues to Assam through this Assam-GOI discussions, ULFA can later join the platform activley in finalization of details.
Now the question is what may be a set of such demands. This is not easy that one can just come up with a list. It will need indepth study of Assam's onging problems. I am really surprised that so far there has not been any such platform among the Assamese population for discussion of these problems. Even among the political parties there is no such discussions. Frankly speaking this means that we donot know what we want for Assam short of sovereignty.
In order to quantify what we want and why we want we need to discuss among ourselves, intellectually and rationally, so that we can decide what is in Assam's best interest short of sovereignty and short of trying to throw the Indian system out.
Rajen Barua
.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roy, Santanu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 9:04 PM
Subject: RE: [Assam] Sunil Nath in Tehelka
> I think one should not forget the logical contradiction between demanding sovereignty and making public a set of supplementary demands. This holds no matter how unlikely or unrealistic the event that the GOI is going to agree to grant independence. Sovereignty is virtually all encompassing. It would be incredibly stupid if the leaders of the ULFA were to say we want independence for Assam and, by the way, lets also talk about handing over the rights to oil extraction to the state government.
> Even if the ULFA leadership is not Harvard trained, they have at least shown the intelligence to not say something like that.
> If forces outside the ULFA want to influence the terms of negotiation and get their ideas about what a secondary set of demands ought to be, they ought to go about forming public opinion on this independently of the ULFA and hope the organization will echo them in their own political interest. But they should not expect that at this stage (and even many stages ahead), the ULFA is going to go around publicly voicing the details of their minimum acceptable point.
> Santanu.
>
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