> I am trying to be a bit more optimistic that shaking things up may > help generate enthusiasm. Though given Paul's and other people's > response. I may be doing more harm than good. If these projects are > beyond salvage. So be it then. Question is should we even bother to > ask everyone with a VOTE or just give up right now... > VOTE is the final thing , and I still can not understand why most the people do not want to make Axis2 TLP. In other projects they try a lot to make a their project into TLP , here it is totally different. If no one agree to make Axis2 TLP , I would suggest RENAME WS into Axis2. Just having one Web service project inside Apache WS is not fair , I think right approached would be for the people against making Axis2 a TLP fight to get other Apache Web services project into Apache WS.
Deepal > thanks, > dims > > On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 7:41 AM, Samisa Abeysinghe > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Davanum Srinivas wrote: >> >>> Samisa, >>> >>> You have hit the nail on the head. People are who they are. Right now >>> the umbrella is so vast that everyone is able to hide behind others. >>> There is no accountability. When there is a smaller group of active >>> people, There will be better accountability to each other and to the >>> board and to our end users. >>> >>> There are tactics that we can employ for example, we should make a new >>> single release including all projects including XmlSchema, Rampart and >>> Sandesha with Axis2. But still make extra releases of say Sandesha2 as >>> necessary as well separately for Sandesha. You will ask, why can't we >>> do this today and i'll say that these kind of tactics work better with >>> a TLP like focus. >>> >>> >> IMHO, sometimes, even getting an Axis2 release out of the door becomes a >> rolling stone, and takes so much time. I am not really sure how it would be >> to combine all those efforts together. >> >> Some of the long running and trivial issues like the crappy web site can be >> easily solved, give some cycles. Even I can volunteer to do that. However, >> you have to consider the long tail, if at all a TLP is to be taken up. Even >> it might be a good idea to make Axis3 yes 3 a TLP, but not Axis2. Becase >> Axis2 as a TLP would not be the same as the Axis2 as it used to be, both in >> technical fronts as well as in non-technical fronts. >> >> Thanks, >> Samisa... >> >> >>> thanks, >>> dims >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 4:28 AM, Samisa Abeysinghe >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Davanum Srinivas wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Eran, >>>>> >>>>> Clearly you did not read my previous emails. *PLEASE* read them and >>>>> then we can continue. >>>>> >>>>> For example, I said "1. The proposal was to split Axis2+Anything that >>>>> Axis2 Uses+Anything that is built on Axis2 into a separate TLP." >>>>> >>>>> Also, i said this before, but repeat it again, The current status quo >>>>> sucks. What we have is not working. >>>>> - Really bad web sites >>>>> - Really bad status of JIRA issues >>>>> - Really bad track record of making releases periodically >>>>> - There are many disjoint islands >>>>> - The set of projects mentioned above is totally disjoint from other >>>>> projects in WS PMC. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> How can a TLP solve all these? If people are who they are now, even after >>>> making Axis2 a TLP, the bad websites and bad release cycles will remain. >>>> On the other hand, if we cannot sync the releases of Axis2's sub >>>> projects, >>>> then irrespective of Axis2 being a TLP, it would turn out to be a useless >>>> project. Because one of Axis2's key strenghts is the set of sub projects >>>> it >>>> has. >>>> >>>> So IMHO, what is more important is to solve the above problems. However, >>>> I >>>> doubt if TLP would be a solution for that. >>>> >>>> Samisa... >>>> >>>> >>>>> What we have is broken, We are not the only ones in this situation, >>>>> this has happened before at Apache with XML and Jakarta PMC's. Please >>>>> go and look at the history and how the projects are faring now after >>>>> becoming logical/smaller footprint PMCs. Please go ask them or ask the >>>>> board@ or ask members if you don't believe, let's learn from their >>>>> experiences. >>>>> >>>>> *IF* people who are on the current projects that are not in the " >>>>> Axis2+Anything that Axis2 Uses+Anything that is built on Axis2" list >>>>> want to tell us something, they should chime in and tell us what they >>>>> think and we'll take a vote. >>>>> >>>>> Right now it's just a few of us who are just repeating the same things >>>>> over and over again without even reading what the other person is >>>>> saying. >>>>> >>>>> thanks, >>>>> dims >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:07 PM, Eran Chinthaka >>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 5:42 PM, Davanum Srinivas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Chinthaka, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What are the problems that will be created? Please enumerate them. How >>>>>>> is it being handled / smoothed over now and what would change >>>>>>> specifically to make the cooperation not happen. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> Problems : >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Another member will have to waste time on doing PMC work >>>>>> 2. We will lose the tight dependency between Axis2 and related projects >>>>>> like >>>>>> Axiom, Neethi, Sandesha, etc., >>>>>> >>>>>> There are numerous things like this that will happen. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> If you can point your finger to specific scenarios. We can see if we >>>>>>> can come up with specific solutions. (Say common svn area where both >>>>>>> committers can have access). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> Let me back up. What is broken in the current layout that mandates us >>>>>> to >>>>>> go >>>>>> for different TLPs? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Also, Don't mind me, i repeat my mantra for the n-th time again. Those >>>>>>> who are actively working on a day to day basis should be taking the >>>>>>> decisions. What we are doing is not working and i propose we try >>>>>>> something new to see if it will work. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> My point is exactly this. Why do we waste time on going to fix >>>>>> something >>>>>> which is not broken? Let's get back to work ;) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Samisa Abeysinghe >>>> >>>> http://people.apache.org/~samisa/ >>>> >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Samisa Abeysinghe >> >> http://people.apache.org/~samisa/ >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> >> > > > > -- Thank you! http://blogs.deepal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
