Tom,
There are good units out there. As far as seeing what's on charts, even on my unit, Standard Horizon had to make some decisions on what to show you at what level of zoom. The display, and this is why bigger is better, only has some much resolution so when your zoomed out many fine details would be an indistinguishable dot and not a chart symbol at all. So in the "Big Picture" view many details are suppressed. When you zoom in the details begin to appear. When my brother went to Mexico a few years ago I did shore support (back seat navigation). Before each hop after meeting with the other skippers he was sailing down with he would email me the waypoints from his CP150 and I would validate his route and use a couple of internet resources to forecast wind and sea conditions while they slept and send it back. What I did was enter the waypoints and then use the joy stick at the highest resolution follow his route looking for hazards. I only caught him running into one fixed oil platform, so he was doing fine on his own except that day they were in a thick fog. The oil platform only showed on the highest resolution view of this particular coastline chart. Like many boats of that size the radar display is at the nav station below, so it goes mostly unmonitored until something special comes up. The center cockpit console on the biggest Catalinas with radar overly GPS chart plotters in the cockpit really change the game. But even then you need your paper charts as a back-up. Phil Agur s/v Wing Tip Secretary/Treasurer Call Sign WCW3485 IC27/270A MMSI 366901790 <http://www.catalina27.org/> www.catalina27.org Vessel Doc# 1039809 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 7:43 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: catalina27-talk: GPS Thanks everyone ... I was at Cabala's yesterday and looked at some units before reading Phil's post this morning. I was wondering, cause I wasn't seeing the data that shows up on my charts. I didn't realize that someone would be irresponsible enough to market such crap to boaters. Thanks for clearing that up. I think I'll go ahead and mount it on the bulkhead by my other instruments. I was thinking that swing-out mount sounded like a good idea, and then I thought about how most of the time I'm doing DR anyway, and really want the thing when visibility goes down, which probably also means I have the companionway closed. Anyway, thanks, all, for the responses. Appreciate your input. Merry Christmas, Tom "Phil Agur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent by: [email protected] 12/14/2007 03:56 PM Please respond to [email protected] To <[email protected]> cc Subject RE: catalina27-talk: GPS I tend to get on a rant when it comes to GPS. They are not all created the same and it appears the most popular are the worst functionality wise and many models represent an actual hazard to mariners. The GPS suppliers get a little cagey by making up terminology regarding what they supply that they get to define reality leaving any collisions with uncharted islands the mariners fault. So what do I have and where is it mounted. Mine is a Standard Horizon CP150 (no longer available, as far as I can tell) on a fixed mount at the wheel. The current low end is a CP180. Since it runs in either north up or forward up modes have it fixed gets very handy. I know it's a tiller boat question, so I'd say the bulkhead. The caveat mariners ran into in the past was the source of the charts supplied in the non-marine professional marine GPS units was from a map database not a chart database. They determined position with good accuracy, did waypoints fine, would leave electronic bread crumbs, and would direct you home down the return path. When I warned Nicky, an avid ocean small boat angler, on a Friday afternoon about his new Garmin GPS on his new boat he scoffed (Nicky was a younger bright engineer at Intel) but on Tuesday he was a little more humble. Nicky tore the I/O drive out of his new boat Saturday. He set electronic bread crumbs at high tide on the way out as he passed over a line of rocks that would be shoaling rocks at low tide. On the way back in the uncharted (uncharted on his, charted on mine) rocks waited for him just under the surface. When I taught an intro to navigation Nicky's plight was always included. I also included the story of three boats that didn't want to hang with the main group of boats on a whale watch cruise out of Monterey, CA. They chose to sneak off to Stillwater Cover in Carmel, lost track of time and returned well after dark. All three skippers were running without charts and guessing their position by shore lights. When asked they said it was no big deal and estimated they were a good half mile offshore. The good news is they all three made it back the bad news is their path took them in close proximity to a rock pinnacle that shoals a half mile off shore at low tide. It's like 50 feet wide at its base and 70 tall and only about 8 feet in diameter when it breaks the surface. It's not on any map based GPS. Map based GPS units besides missing all depth data only show obstructions big enough to contain a road. The fun one around SF Bay was to have them look for Alcatraz Island. Not there! After some years is was added so I had them look for Red Rocks, again not there. Actually there literally dozens of un-mapped hazards on SF bay that are clearly charted on the real charts. Besides a true marine GPS having charts, some of them are using a chart database and not just a chart image. My GPS, and I would assume the newer Standard Horizon GPS units as well, can have an alarm set for depth out in front of the boat. Yes while you're giving instructions on the next tack it is looking at its internal chart database and based on the depth and distance you preset will sound an alarm before you reach the obstruction. A chart reading forward looking alarm beats the heck out a dumb straight down depth alarm. In the case of the rock pinnacle you'd be telling your wife to grab the ditch bag if you relied on a dumb straight down depth alarm. It's also pretty important since my GPS will directly send command to my Autohelm. The more automated things get the more you can do but the less oversight actually goes on. Here's automation that checks my work even when I get tired. Another feature on Standard Horizon GPS units is they interface directly with your Standard Horizon DSC VHF. When you hit the digital Mayday key on the VHF it automatically sends your ID, GPS location, and type of emergency. Actually most any GPS with a NEMA0183 interface can do that, but on my boat if I receive a DSC mayday is automatically plotted on my GPS as a waypoint and highlighted. Before I even pick up the Ram Mic to reply I can plot a course and estimate an arrival time on scene in the GPS. Don't you wish the CG had just bought the right GPS and radio combo back in the 90s instead of the system we are all still waiting to see deployed beyond a few test zones? Wow for under a $1000 they can receive a DSC distress signal and plot it's position without human intervention and head directly there. To review GPS is good, the right one will save your life, making it great. 1. Fixed mount trumps hand held so the display can be used forward as up. It helps keep you oriented correctly when fatigued in low light. 2. GPS must be chart based, showing water depth, and submerged obstructions. How about a field of submerged dols? 3. A great GPS can use chart data to sound an alarm on depth in your path. 4. A great GPS will plot distress calls automatically so we can assist mariners in distress, when we are in a position to do so. My brother was a real Garmin fan but when he prepped his IP38 for Mexico I made him a custom mount for a CP150 at the wheel. It was still performing flawlessly after a year when I joined him in Cabo for the bash up to San Diego. I used it to steer around sea mounts coming up the coast and we logged a consistently smother passage than the boats we were traveling with us who ran straight lines. So yes at the wheel not down below. Ok, but I did warn you about the rant. I'm not saying it must be Standard Horizon, but don't buy a unit with less features today than the one I mounted in ten years ago. And don't trust a salesman; have him show you the features. It's your boat and you'll be the one out there when things go wrong. Phil Agur s/v Wing Tip Secretary/Treasurer Call Sign WCW3485 IC27/270A MMSI 366901790 <http://www.catalina27.org/> www.catalina27.org Vessel Doc# 1039809 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 8:49 AM To: [email protected] Subject: catalina27-talk: GPS On a tiller C27, where do you all mount your GSP chartplotter ... or do you prefer a handheld (my family is collaborating to buy me something useful for Christmas rather than ......... well, I'll leave it there). Tom
