And you're saying that there are not tough women in the US? You're a braver person than I am to say that. Let me know when you get out of the hospital - or when you recover from the beating.
Nichola Goddard's was a biathlete, and was a local scout troop leader (Although if that was in the US the national leadership would have had kittends). Sounds like a lot of women I know back in Canada. Not as many Honey Boo-Boo types. On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 10:36 PM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> wrote: > > I'd say with some of the environmental. Concerns of life in large parts of > Canada that yes women are probably tougher in a totally unverifiable way > haha. > > More women hunters and fisher persons probably as well. > On Feb 15, 2013 4:21 PM, "Larry C. Lyons" <larrycly...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> just to note, the first woman to die in combat in modern times with >> the Canadian army was an Artillery officer. If she could handle the >> physical requirements for the RCHA with the Canadian military (which >> is much smaller than the US army) then no doubt there are some women >> in the US who can handle the US requirements. >> >> Or do you think that American women are weaker than Canadians... >> >> On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 3:43 PM, Bruce Sorge <sor...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > Fine Justin, here. Oh, I just went to the HOF site and found the >> discussion. Cut and paste. >> > >> > 1. Physical Conditioning: While I do not doubt that there are women in >> the world who can perform as well or better than men in athletics, the >> majority cannot. I'll use the standard Army Physical Fitness standards for >> males and females in the 17-21 age category, which is the age bracket most >> people join the military. >> > >> > Mens standards: >> > Pushup event - two minutes - minimum standard is 42, 90% is 64 and 100% >> is 71 >> > Sit-up event - two minutes - minimum 53, 90% is 72 and 100% is 78 >> > Run event - two miles - minimum is 15:54, 90% is 13:42 and 100% is 13:00 >> > >> > Females standards: >> > Pushup event - two minutes - minimum standard is 19, 90% is 36 and 100% >> is 42 >> > Situp event - two minutes - minimum 53, 90% is 72 and 100% is 78 >> > Run event - two miles - minimum is 18:54, 90% is 16:24 and 100% is 15:36 >> > >> > You can clearly see that the pushup and run events are vastly different. >> The only thing that women have to do as well as men is the sit-up event. In >> fact, a female can max her time in a little less than what it takes a male >> to pass the minimum. >> > The reason I bring up the 90% range is because in the Infantry, 90%, or >> a total score of 270 is OUR standard. It's not a written official standard, >> it's the standard that we hold ourselves to. One of the reasons is that if >> you want to try out for the Expert Infantryman's Badge, you have to score a >> MINIMUM of 270 on the PT test. >> > >> > 2. Now let's get into some other physical aspects of the job. >> > Infantry often will be walking for miles on end with a rucksack weighing >> from 60 - 100 lbs, sometimes more. Soldiers going through Ranger School >> will carry even more weight. That is a lot to ask of a woman who does not >> have to have the same physical endurance level of a man. >> > >> > Armor has it's own set of challenges. Their ammunition weighs from 41 - >> 50 lbs depending on what type of ammunition it is, and a tank carries 48 >> rounds. So as a loader you would be expected to have to help load 48 rounds >> into a tank to make it ready for combat. And a loader is expected to be >> able to load a tank in a few seconds (that's putting a round in the breach >> from the ammunition rack). This is done in a very confined space and the >> rounds are awkward to hold. The M-2 machine-gun that sits on the commanders >> cupola weighs in at 84lbs. This has to be hoisted up onto the tank, then to >> the turret, then mounted on the machine-gun mount. Not an easy task for a >> physically fit man. >> > >> > Artillery has it's own set of challenges as well. Their ammunition >> weighs in at 106 lbs and they carry 28 rounds on the vehicle (this is an >> M-109 Paladin SPH). Again the loader is expected to be able to load a round >> every 15 seconds, sometimes faster. >> > >> > Tanks and artillery also have a LOT of heavy components to them. >> Breaking track is something that a crew of four men in a tank, three in a >> Bradley and four in a Howitzer, all in top shape struggle to do quickly. >> > >> > 3. Now let's talk hygiene. We all know that women have special hygienic >> needs. From bathing on a regular basis to managing menses, all of these >> things that are taken for granted at home are a challenge in the field. >> Often a combat arms soldier will go days and weeks, sometimes over a month >> without a proper shower in a training environment. In combat it's worse. At >> the opening of OEF and OIF soldiers often would go weeks without being able >> to have a proper shower. Fortunately for men all we really need are some >> baby wipes to wipe our pits and junk and were good. This is not the case >> with women. There are studies that show that women require more time to >> clean themselves properly than men do. A quick google search will produce a >> lot of results. >> > >> > 4. Now lets talk about the general climate of combat arms jobs. These >> are jobs (Infantry, Armor, Artillery, Special Forces, Delta Force, Ranger) >> that are only open to men and thus the workplace is a men only workplace. >> It's no myth that soldiers are crude and obnoxious to the outsider. >> Infantrymen do some strange things and say pretty much anything that is on >> their minds and no one really cares. (And I know some female soldiers who >> could give a male soldier a run for his money on shit talking as well, this >> is not an area where men have a lock). Anyway, there are way too many >> females in the Army who would be highly offended by some of the things we >> say or do on a regular basis. The words shit and fuck are part of everyday >> vocabulary to us. There is a constant climate of one upmanship that is >> alive and well in the infantry. We all want to be faster, better than the >> man to our right and left. Everything is a competition in the infantry, >> whether it's eating, doing PT or doing regular infantry shit, we are ALWAYS >> competing with each other. >> > >> > Now again, with this all being said, I am not saying that there are not >> SOME women out there would could thrive in this environment, but I feel >> that they are the exception and not the norm. The military would be hard >> pressed not to have two standards for men and women. In fact, they already >> to, the PT test. That is a great example of the double-standard that the >> Army has. >> > >> > While Israel is a good example of women performing well in combat arms, >> again I think that they are the exception rather than the norm. Israelis >> are raised with conflict. Men and women there, at least the last couple of >> generations and the generations to come are raised around war. Bombs, >> shootings and the like. They have a different mentality than women in >> America have (my own opinion not based on fact). I honestly believe that >> women in general in American will fail more than succeed if they are held >> to the same standard as men. Even Ranger School, there is no exception to >> the standard. WHether it is me as a 49 year old Infantryman trying out for >> the coveted Ranger tab, or an 18 year old kid, we both have to perform at >> the same standard, that of the 18 year olds. From my experience in my 17+ >> years in the Army, the standards will be lowered and morale will go down if >> women are allowed in combat arms. ' >> > On Feb 15, 2013, at 2:51 PM, Justin Scott <leviat...@darktech.org> >> wrote: >> > >> >> >> >>> We've already had this discussion. >> >> >> >> I see, you must not feel very strongly about it if you're not even >> >> willing to give a summary for those like myself who weren't in on the >> >> prior discussion. Have a great weekend! >> >> >> >> >> >> -Justin >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> >> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:361411 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
