Guys- I read your post yesterday & thought about a little overnight... I
don't have a clue where you're coming from. Undoubtedly- Cisco is proud of
their LFH60/ Serial interfaces (but the need still exists) & when I hear
someone referring a T-1 access, I giggle picturing stoking a fire with
dollar bills. Having said this, I work in one of the largest Enterprise
networks in the world. We have OC- everything, a lot of Frame, DLSW
projects up the wazoo (replacing mainframe X.25) & @ last count just over
12,000 Cisco routers & switches. I work in the engineering department & we
deal with some pretty OK stuff. I've also worked @ a CLEC for a year & feel
very comfortable with how that world lives (on their butts with a cup of
coffee :o) I have been ordering DS-3's these past 2 weeks & know that a lot
hasn't changed since I left the CLEC business. I say all this to qualify
that I don't live & work in a vacuum.
The topics you have mentioned are very valid & if you have an opportunity to
look @ the past Networkers presentations, you'll get Cisco's spin on the
future. I think what you brought up does represent what we are seeing (yes
managed survice is getting better & available in more areas). What you are
supposing though- is that Telco's are going to modernize sooner than say a
Cisco can react, assuming they have no view into the future. We have H.323
because it's what we have to work with. We have MPLS because ATM circuits
are what we have to work with. We have VPN's because the wide open Internet
is all some companies can afford & Frame is very slow in the Southwestern
areas (TouchAmerica POP's). We have NAT because of IPV4, & we have fiber
going into housing developments because they were built where facilities do
not exist (it's called PairGain & it's only good for phones & 144 IDSL
services)
Again- you've made valid points, I just don't think it's going to come upon
us like a thief in the night.
Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Ramsey"
To:
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 6:32 PM
Subject: Re: RANT Longish, Why Cisco and not ...!!! [7:19933]
> preach on brother!
>
> I would have to agree with everything you said. Like I have posted
before,
> we were an extreme shop before we went cisco. (political BS) I have never
> loved a piece of gear so much than the purple packet pushers we had in
> house! :)
>
> Telcos are already running fiber into subdivisions and aprtmnt complexes.
> More and more sonet services are being deployed. And with WDM advancing
> like it has, serial connectivity will be a thing of the past!
>
> -Patrick
>
> >>> "Robert Hanley" 09/14/01 06:10PM >>>
> What a load of cisco bigotry crap! Thank god for you
> guys who know better, huh? Even the folks at cisco
> call this nonsense "drinking the kool-aid" for gods
> sake. At least they don't believe their own marketing
> BS. Normally I wouldn't even reply to such a post, but
> Ive got some residual anger to vent.
>
>
> Do yourselves a favor and wake up to the fact that
> there are lots of companies out there who make gear
> thats just as good if not better in many cases than
> cisco's. What are you going to do when all your old T1
> circuits are replaced by optical networks? Have you
> honestly looked at the market share cisco has in
> optical networking? Do you understand the products
> offered by the different vendors?
>
>
> I've got news for you folks, the skills you are all
> trying so hard to master are already yesterdays news!
>
>
> There is a whole new wave of networking technologies
> being deployed right under your noses that will
> totally change the way companies run their networking
> departments. Most enterprises in the future will
> outsource their MANs and WANs to managed service
> providers (running Nortel gear in many cases...horror
> of horrors) who will hand off an ethernet link at the
> customer premises. This will go into an L2/L3 switch,
> not "a router" as such (running EIGRP of course, so no
> other vendor's gear can be used). This will provider
> higher speed links at lower costs while flattening the
> MAN/WAN and eliminating a whole layer of storing and
> forwarding (read: L3 software based router).
>
>
> The L2/L3 LAN switching market has become so
> commoditized that the profit margins are slim to
> non-existent. The Catalyst switches are based on dated
> technology, and cannot deliver wire speed throughput
> while doing anything more than straight L2 (hence the
> "3-layer heirarchical model" a marketing exercise, NOT
> an engineering one, the whole point of switching was
> to flatten networks). Cisco will have to buy an
> established vendor (probably Extreme) in order to
> compete, since they've written down all the R&D they
> were doing along with their fledgling (CLEC) carrier
> business.
>
>
> That is why companies like Nortel are not even trying
> to compete in the conventional router market. Their
> R&D resources have all gone into next generation
> equipment that surpasses anything that cisco can do.
> Nortel's enterprise clients are buying Multiservice
> WAN switches, Sonet, and DWDM; NOT ROUTERS! Hint hint
> nudge nudge wink wink! Get it ?
>
>
> --- David Toalson wrote:
> > I work at a subsidiary of a large healthcare
> > company. My office is 100%
> > Cisco for Routers and Switches. We have a total of
> > 30 routers and 8
> > switches. I work with 30 remote sites, a main
> > office and separate Data
> > Center. I have attached a show version from one of
> > our two 7505 core
> > routers. As you can see it has been up for over 4
> > years without any
> > problems. Our second has been up almost 2 years.
> > My parent company is a
> > "Nortel" shop. They have to re-boot their core
> > router about every 45-60
> > days or more offten and many of their switches on a
> > regular basis. Granted,
> > they push a lot more data through their system, but
> > still...... As
> > approximately 1/3 of my remote sites run across the
> > Parent company WAN a
> > majority of the down time I am faced with is because
> > of the "Nortel"
> > equipment.
> >
> > I don't know if this will help, but it makes me feel
> > better to vent a
> > little. Please call me if you want any more
> > specifics.
> >
> > CHSDCB>sh clock
> > 10:17:14.824 UTC Fri Sep 14 2001
> > CHSDCB>sh ver
> > Cisco Internetwork Operating System Software
> > IOS (tm) GS Software (RSP-JV-M), Version 11.1(9)CA1,
> > EARLY DEPLOYMENT
> > RELEASE S
> > Synced to mainline version: 11.1(9)
> > Copyright (c) 1986-1997 by cisco Systems, Inc.
> > Compiled Wed 26-Mar-97 22:34 by bellb
> > Image text-base: 0x60010900, data-base: 0x60A0A000
> >
> > ROM: System Bootstrap, Version 5.3.2(3.2) [kmac
> > 3.2], MAINTENANCE INTERIM
> > SOFTWE
> > ROM: GS Software (RSP-JV-M), Version 11.1(6),
> > RELEASE SOFTWARE (fc1)
> >
> > CHSDCB uptime is 4 years, 23 weeks, 2 days, 14
> > hours, 26 minutes
> > System restarted by reload at 19:50:36 UTC Fri Apr 4
> > 1997
> > System image file is "slot0:1119ca.bin", booted via
> > slot0
> >
> > David Toalson
> > 816-701-4142
> >
> > > ----------
> > > From: chica[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > Reply To: chica
> > > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 8:43 AM
> > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > Subject: Why Cisco and not ...........!!!
> > [7:19933]
> > >
> > > Hello Guys,
> > >
> > > after recovering from the shock of WTC,I just
> > > remembered that life still has to goes on.
> > > I have a quest and it is : I am due to appear on
> > an
> > > interview on Monday 17th Sep., and I have to give
> > a
> > > presentation on why cisco, and not other
> > competitors.
> > > I have to be able to convince my interviewers in
> > fine
> > > english, why(and how) cisco products(old and new),
> > > protocols,strategy or policy gives cisco an edge
> > over
> > > other competitors, and therefore places cisco at
> > the
> > > top most position.
> > > I have gathered some facts already from cisco's
> > > website
> > > and have acquired some knowledge of cisco over the
> > > years from experience and certifications, but as
> > this
> > > is a matter of do it well and get the job,or not,I
> > > thought it was a good idea to share your
> > > experiences,advice,facts etc,etc.
> > > I would be very thankful for any input at all.
> > > Thank you.
> > >
> > > > chika
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help?
> > > Donate cash, emergency relief information
> > >
> >
> http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help?
> Donate cash, emergency relief information
> http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/
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