This doesn't meet the requirements, unfortunately. sdh:C11 is a temporal entity -- the state of being named something -- and not a name itself. While interesting, as previously States have been widely decreed as an anti-pattern to be avoided, it does not meet the requirements set forth for E33_E41, which is that an Appellation itself can have a Language.
So I believe that this does not solve the problem as stated - that E33_E41_Linguistic_Appellation does not have a description outside of the RDFS document. Rob On Wed, Dec 14, 2022 at 3:54 PM Martin Doerr via Crm-sig < crm-sig@ics.forth.gr> wrote: > Dear Francesco, dear George, > > After the discussion in the last CRM SIG meeting, I propose to follow > Francesco's "sdh:C11 Appellation in a Language > <https://ontome.net/class/365/namespace/3> class." as *a longpath for P1*. > > > I propose to generalize the context. It could be a language, it could be a > country, a Group. I propose to analyze, if this can be mapped or identified > with LRM Nomen and its properties. It can further be made compatible with > the RDF labels with a language tag, which are domain instance specific and > not range specific, and of course can represent the TGN language > attributes. For VIAF, we would need a "national" context, i.e., the > national library. > > Best, > > Martin > > > > > > On Sat, 12 Nov 2022, 2:43 pm Francesco Beretta via Crm-sig, < > crm-sig@ics.forth.gr> wrote: > >> Dear Martin, all >> >> Sorry to intervene so late in this interesting exchange, I was away for >> some days and I'm going through my emails now. >> >> I encountered the same questions while working a few years ago in a >> history project interested in the evolution of the use of names and >> surnames. >> >> The approach of the project was similar to the one presented by Martin >> below and amounted to saying that it is difficult to state to which >> language a first name, or surname, belongs in itself, except for some cases >> or if we consider the region of origin, but what is relevant is that this >> specific string of characters is used at a given time (and attested in the >> sources) in a language or in another (i.e. in a society speaking this >> language) to identify a person or an object. >> >> To capture the information envisaged in the project in the sense of this >> approach I decided to stick to the substance of crm:E41 Appellation class: >> >> "This class comprises signs, either meaningful or not, or arrangements of >> signs following a specific syntax, that are used or can be used to refer to >> and identify a specific instance of some class or category within a certain >> context. Instances of E41 Appellation do not identify things by their >> meaning, even if they happen to have one, but *instead by convention, >> tradition, or agreement*." (CRM 6.2). >> >> and to add in what has become the SDHSS CRM unofficial extension the sdh:C11 >> Appellation in a Language <https://ontome.net/class/365/namespace/3> >> class. >> >> This class has as you'll see a clear social, i.e. intentional flavor, and >> captures the information that some appellation is considered as a valid >> appellation of a thing in a language (i.e. society speaking his language) >> during an attested time-span. >> >> This was also an attempt to cope with the frbroo:F52 Name Use Activity >> issue: >> >> 413 Pursuit and Name Use Activity to CRMsoc >> <https://cidoc-crm.org/Issue/ID-413-pursuit-and-name-use-activity-to-crmsoc> >> 573 CRMsoc & F51 Pursuit & F52 Name Use Activity >> <https://cidoc-crm.org/Issue/ID-573-crmsoc-f51-pursuit-f52-name-use-activity> >> >> which is somewhat slowed down by the ongoing exchanges around the nature >> and substance of the social world as foundation of the CRMsoc extension. >> >> But one could easily provide another substance to an *Appellation in a >> Language* class making it a Name Use Activity (in a Language) class (and >> subclass of crm:E13 Attribute Assignment >> <https://ontome.net/class/13/namespace/1> or crm:E7 Activity). >> >> This would be in my opinion a good way of coping with the wish expressed >> by George at the beginning of this exchange to "make [this kind of classes] >> full classes in the standard so that they are fully vetted and controlled. >> It is a fundamental class. It should be in the standard in the first >> place", wish that I definitely share. And also to stick, as far as I can >> understand, to the modelling principles reminded by Martin. >> >> And it would also finally solve the issues still open, to my knowledge, >> concerning the original FRBR-oo class. >> >> Best >> >> Francesco >> >> >> >> >> >> > -- > ------------------------------------ > Dr. Martin Doerr > > Honorary Head of the > Center for Cultural Informatics > > Information Systems Laboratory > Institute of Computer Science > Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH) > > N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton, > GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece > > Vox:+30(2810)391625 > Email: mar...@ics.forth.gr > Web-site: http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl > > _______________________________________________ > Crm-sig mailing list > Crm-sig@ics.forth.gr > http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig > -- Rob Sanderson Director for Cultural Heritage Metadata Yale University
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