On Wed, 1 Mar 2000, Sunder wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > > Most Americans are so dependent, so hopelessly inurred with the current
> > > lifestyle that they wouldn't recognize communism if it bit them in the ass.
> >
> > Agreed. That is precisely my point -- and yet they condemn it with all
> > of the passion that the state says a good citizen should.
> >
> > 10 minute hate sound familiar?
>
> It was the two minutes of hate, and it was from 1984 by George Orwell.
You're right. Been awhile since I read 1984. Two, ten .. man, I'm starting
to feel old my memory is getting worse everyday.
> But that's the reality of life. Sometimes you make a bad decision and it costs
> you your job, or your money, or even your life. It's reality. It may suck,
> but it can't be denied.
Gravity is a fact of reality too .. but once we understand it, we can
get side-step it.
I'm not saying that life isn't hard. I'm not saying that life is ever
going to be easy -- but I'd like to make a society that cushions it as
much as we can. Thats why we get together and make societies in the first
place .. to make life easier for individuals; a burden shared together
is less of a burden.
> > No. Let the companies pay for them. If I am going to give them my sweat,
> > time away from my loved ones and the fruit of my talents and labor the
> > least they can do is make my life a little more cushy .. or give me
> > more green up front.. either is acceptable. But if you are going to
> > scale down the wage, then be prepared to compensate the worker in other
> > ways.
>
> So if you have no job, how would you pay for health benefits for your loved
> ones?
If I had no job, and no real decent job prospects; I'd probably be a
small time drug dealer. A little risky ('cause of the cops) but it turns
a good profit -- and then I could pay the bills.
> Personally, I'd rather get the money back from the bunch spent on
> health care so that I can pick and choose my own provider.
Like I said, give me the benefits or the money .. either is acceptable.
> > My point is merely that I would rather have people who oppose communism
> > because they understand it, and do not agree, rather than a populace that
> > hates communism because the State tells them too.
>
> I would agree with this, but again, don't defend communism just because the
> sheeple think it's bad and don't understand it.
I don't defend communism per se, I just condemn the brainwashed 'opinions'
(if we decide to call them such) of the sheeple.
> > First, I'd like to see you argue from the foundations of communism that
> > socialism/communism REQUIRES such a tyrannical rule. Don't argue history.
> > Anyone who knows anything about Marx knows he would have hated the USSR
> > and China.
>
> Then I'd like you to argue from the foundation of capitalism that capitalism
> requires a government such as ours. Don't argue hostory. Anyone who knows
> anything about Ayn Rand, knows she would have hated our government...
I don't argue such a thing at all. But I also don't equate America to
capitalism. It seems to me (perhaps I'm wrong) that the major
assumption in many messages on this list so far equate communism
to Stalinism.
Thats the difference, as I see it.
Oh, and I asked you first :)
Michael J. Graffam ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
"Let your life be a counter-friction to stop the machine."
Henry David Thoreau "Civil Disobedience"
