On 28/10/11 15:07, Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri wrote: > WHY RELEASE? > 1. to clarify we know some snapshot is usable. This will get us in > more distributions by default. > 2. to remove that stupid karma over the 17 number if e. Will help > people that do not track us closely to know we're reasonable serious. > 3. we can start to bring in new technology without delaying it even > further (ie: elm and scripting language - js/elev8)
4. To let slow bureaucratic distros that don't include "unstable" packages include e17... 5. Gnome3 sucks, KDE4 sucks, xfce is actually pretty decent, but generally, many people I know are leaving the linux world because of that, they usually tell me: "Linux no longer serves me better than the other options." and they usually blame Gnome3 for that. I agree with them, Gnome3 is what made me move to e17 full time (both at work and at home). > WHY NOT RELEASE? > 1. there are both bugs (eg: efm) As I said many times before, yeah, efm is nice and should be fixed, but we should add better support for using other file managers, which are better and more feature rich. > 2. missing features (xrandr, taskbar, ...) I consider those as extras, really. But language support is pretty painful, it's hard for Latin users to understand, but it's really needed. :) > EXTRA DISCUSSIONS > * e_widgets is amazingly boring and gets in the way, people expect > something like Elementary to help them. Or even better, for rarely > used features like a mixer control dialog, xrandr dialog, connection > manager configuration these things could be done with a high level > language such as elev8. Thus lots of people would be motivated to help > get more features in. But introducing this now would delay e17 even > more, thus a no go. (Personal note I'm highly demotivated to hack e17 > due this exact reason. Doing a mixer dialog in e_widget is like few > days, in elev8 it should take me few hours -- easier to find than few > days) Yeah, I agree, lets kick e17 out the release door and get on jigging with some real toolkits ;P > > * we'd like to have an officially supported and widely accepted > high level language. While I've created and maintained Python, seems > it's hatted and going nowhere. So if it's Python, Lua or JS it > doesn't matter, but we need one for most boring things like > configuration dialogs and non-critical paths... (READ: I don't want it > to be in composite manager, eborder, etc -- tho I'm open to have them > in gadcon) > I actually like Python, better than most other high level languages I guess, but heck, I also vote for JS. :) > > AFTER RELEASE: I propose time-based releases, every 3 months we cook a > snap and put it out. Seems to work well for everyone out there, can't > see why it wouldn't work. IMO we can't have feature based snaps > because we don't have enough manpower to do this promises. > Longer release cycles are problematic as "wait my nice feature to get > in, it's one more week! Otherwise I'll have to wait 6+ months to get > it in!" and then this repeats forever as we see now. Lets make it 3-6, i.e per release, tbh, I'm a real believer in release early-release often, but I guess that only works for some of the people. There's no reason why not release a minor version a week or two after a big bug was fixed. I guess we'll call e17 enlightenment version 17.0.0, just because it'll feel more natural to most people (e17 1.0 and then e18 1.0 would be too weird, same goes for e17 2.0) or, we can "rename" it back to e and make it a 1.0, but that's really something to think about, PR-wise. I vote for e 17.0.0. If that's the case, there's no reason why not to release a 0.0.1 version every couple of weeks, and only 0.1.0 version every couple of months 3-6. > > > BUT USERS WILL COMPLAIN ABOUT MISSING FEATURES: common argument for > xrandr, keyboard languages, taskbar. Users will complain, period. xrandr: that can be set and forgotten, or you can use a 3rd party app, for taskbar, we have engage, yeah not perfect for everyone, but it does the trick (I use it as an old-school taskbar) as for languages: as I stated above, I really think it's a top priority. I don't care as much for myself, as I just added a hackish script that calls setvxkbmap... > This list is lways > growing. But we're short on human resources. Having a release and > getting Elev8 into E would help bringing more people to help. > > MY PROPOSAL: just fix the remaining efm bugs and other outstanding > crashes and do a release as is. Remove the e17 karma and get back to > normal life, get e18, e19... and things go into them as fast as we > can. Yeah, I agree. - Tom. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ The demand for IT networking professionals continues to grow, and the demand for specialized networking skills is growing even more rapidly. Take a complimentary Learning@Cisco Self-Assessment and learn about Cisco certifications, training, and career opportunities. http://p.sf.net/sfu/cisco-dev2dev _______________________________________________ enlightenment-devel mailing list enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
