Hi, 2011/10/28 Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri <barbi...@profusion.mobi>: > Hello all, > > I'm writing this mail so it's unified and everyone can opine without > being in one place at one time (IRC/#edevelop). > > Recently I've talked to people and while I tried to express it at IRC, > raster just got pissed and left. Later people would join and agree > with me... so while I'm looking like a jerk I guess I'm not alone in > there. I'll try to be as clear and short as possible. > > WHY RELEASE? > 1. to clarify we know some snapshot is usable. This will get us in > more distributions by default. > 2. to remove that stupid karma over the 17 number if e. Will help > people that do not track us closely to know we're reasonable serious. > 3. we can start to bring in new technology without delaying it even > further (ie: elm and scripting language - js/elev8) > > WHY NOT RELEASE? > 1. there are both bugs (eg: efm) > 2. missing features (xrandr, taskbar, ...)
taskbar ? engage is much better than taskbar, why it's not in e17 ? > > EXTRA DISCUSSIONS > * e_widgets is amazingly boring and gets in the way, people expect > something like Elementary to help them. Or even better, for rarely > used features like a mixer control dialog, xrandr dialog, connection > manager configuration these things could be done with a high level > language such as elev8. Thus lots of people would be motivated to help > get more features in. But introducing this now would delay e17 even > more, thus a no go. (Personal note I'm highly demotivated to hack e17 > due this exact reason. Doing a mixer dialog in e_widget is like few > days, in elev8 it should take me few hours -- easier to find than few > days) > > * we'd like to have an officially supported and widely accepted > high level language. While I've created and maintained Python, seems > it's hatted and going nowhere. So if it's Python, Lua or JS it > doesn't matter, but we need one for most boring things like > configuration dialogs and non-critical paths... (READ: I don't want it > to be in composite manager, eborder, etc -- tho I'm open to have them > in gadcon) I'm not completly convinced by scripting language, but i would like to see more code using it, to use it myself, who know's i could fallen in love for javascript ... > > > AFTER RELEASE: I propose time-based releases, every 3 months we cook a > snap and put it out. Seems to work well for everyone out there, can't > see why it wouldn't work. IMO we can't have feature based snaps > because we don't have enough manpower to do this promises. > Longer release cycles are problematic as "wait my nice feature to get > in, it's one more week! Otherwise I'll have to wait 6+ months to get > it in!" and then this repeats forever as we see now. > Snap every 3 month is doable IMO. And as long as elementary is not released, we can't release e based on it ... > > BUT USERS WILL COMPLAIN ABOUT MISSING FEATURES: common argument for > xrandr, keyboard languages, taskbar. Users will complain, period. > We'll never be able to cope with minimum features, as this changes > from person to person. Moreover, the more we wait, the more we have to > do. Right now all other desktops implement the new systray and > application menu protocols, really soon this will be "a bare minimum" > for some users. There is proper PulseAudio mixer. Proper > ConnMan/NetworkManager. Soon we'll have the user-session and seat > management that GNOME is doing with systemd... This list is lways > growing. But we're short on human resources. Having a release and > getting Elev8 into E would help bringing more people to help. > > MY PROPOSAL: just fix the remaining efm bugs and other outstanding > crashes and do a release as is. Remove the e17 karma and get back to > normal life, get e18, e19... and things go into them as fast as we > can. I totally agree with you. > > > > -- > Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri > http://profusion.mobi embedded systems > -------------------------------------- > MSN: barbi...@gmail.com > Skype: gsbarbieri > Mobile: +55 (19) 9225-2202 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > The demand for IT networking professionals continues to grow, and the > demand for specialized networking skills is growing even more rapidly. > Take a complimentary Learning@Cisco Self-Assessment and learn > about Cisco certifications, training, and career opportunities. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/cisco-dev2dev > _______________________________________________ > enlightenment-devel mailing list > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel > -- Nicolas Aguirre Mail: aguirre.nico...@gmail.com Web: http://enna.geexbox.org Blog: http://dev.enlightenment.fr/~captainigloo/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ The demand for IT networking professionals continues to grow, and the demand for specialized networking skills is growing even more rapidly. Take a complimentary Learning@Cisco Self-Assessment and learn about Cisco certifications, training, and career opportunities. http://p.sf.net/sfu/cisco-dev2dev _______________________________________________ enlightenment-devel mailing list enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
