Bardo was fascist connected once. There already is a wealth tax. The money goes from the poor to the rich. The idea amongst most classical economists was to encourage production for social benefit. They wanted to curb or eliminate (Adam Smith's term was euthanise) excess money that could be speculated in money making money or used to extract excessive economic rents. Lots of facts in Haring and Douglas (2012) 'Economists and the Powerful'. Some tendency to treat you colonials as dumb-ass that's inaccurate. I want to go further than a wealth tax and bring in a structured jubilee on household debt. This is complex and would need some international cooperation. My model comes from sports competition - that is designing competition that has rules, active refereeing subject to public scrutiny - but also tries to keep 'teams' in the competition, perhaps subject to relegation and promotion. We need competition that doesn't kill the other team or manipulate itself to monopoly. Just as you can't compete in soccer by using guns, you shouldn't compete in industrial manufacture through global wage/ conditions arbitrage. And we'd need some kind of showtime - as in people not buying the crap cars you make.
We generally miss something structural that's going on. I label this robot heaven - work has got a lot easier thanks to robots like tractors and much more productive. We could also look at stuff like education - in my view much of what we have is either an elitist route through the best schools and universities that gives the rich a reproductive (of themselves as rich) advantage under lies of meritocracy, or child-minding until 21 and debt peonage after. Humans are the only animals with the vile teenage period. I'd go for much higher child-minding and early education quality with better food until fourteen in small schools - free and with all year round child- minding. After that we'd go Internet with universities charged with civic social organisation and local-international work projects. Big questions arise about how much work we need and how much opportunity we can give or need to restrict. Much of our dire conditioning in medieval work ethics and forces of biological/ propaganda hierarchy doesn't help us believe we can do something this radical - and nor does bleeding heart liberalism on problems in policing bandits, politicians, corporations, sexist religions and nutters. There is also no point in modernising, say, farming in India, to see millions die because no other work/income opportunity is provided to prevent new owners just letting them die as the food is exported (manifests of food leaving Ireland during the potato blight are informative here). And there's no point in doing any of this if some people insist on breeding us to global warming oblivion. On 21 Apr, 18:59, nominal9 <nomin...@yahoo.com> wrote: > I sort of like the wealth tax idea because it looks to be more as wners > "progressive" (i.e., affects more the wealthy than the not-so-wealthy) > right off the bat... unlike an income "flat tax" rate... HAR.. I sort of > think that the way it's explained and sorted out in the wiki article.... it > might (almost definitely would) be strongly opposed by the "rich" and the > libertarian minded....The France way of instituting a wealth tax has > definitely caused a "capital flight".... There's the example of that actor > Gerard Depardieu, and I think I heard that even Brigitte Bardot backed the > "capital flight" > notion...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%A9rard_Depardieuhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brigitte_Bardothttp://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/brigitte-bardot-backs-gerard-de... > Depardieu, I can take or leave.....but Bardot.....well.... what hetero male > our age could possibly leave her behind (take the "behind" part any way > please HAR).... > Anyway.. it (wealth tax) seems to have worked well in other places..... > but, like I said.... it would likely be fought tooth and nail by the > conservatives here in the U.S.... in any format or in any combination of > things... > > > > > > > > On Saturday, April 20, 2013 5:59:30 PM UTC-4, Lonnie Clay wrote: > > > I never saw that article before... > > I read the whole thing with keen interest. Some points to consider : > > 1) The tax I propose is on the total wealth of all individuals and > > organizations (including government), without exceptions, not just a net > > wealth of individuals. > > 2) Paying the tax should be voluntary, without penalty for failure to > > declare some item of wealth, EXCEPT that undeclared wealth is not protected > > by legal processes. > > 3) The tax should render invalid other taxes on economic activity, rather > > than supplementing them. > > > Thanks for the link. > > > Lonnie Courtney Clay > > > On Saturday, April 20, 2013 1:07:10 PM UTC-7, nominal9 wrote: > > >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_tax > > >> Does this wiki entry do the wealth tax idea justice?.....I'm game.....but > >> I can just hear the (mixed metaphor)..."fat cats squeal like stuck > >> pigs"..... already.....HAR....now, all we have to do is get it enacted into > >> law..... that should take about 200 years, minimum, here in the U.S. > > >> On Saturday, April 20, 2013 1:02:10 PM UTC-4, Lonnie Clay wrote: > > >>> Three clauses of constitutional law should do it : > >>> 1) Value shall legally exist in civil law only to the extent that the > >>> applicable wealth tax was paid in advance of the legal issue. > >>> 2) Value shall exist in criminal cases as specified by applicable laws > >>> and regulations. > >>> 3) There shall be no taxation of economic activity, and usage fees shall > >>> be appropriate for expenses incurred by government entities. > > >>> So how about that? > > >>> Lonnie Courtney Clay > > >>> On Saturday, April 20, 2013 9:51:08 AM UTC-7, nominal9 wrote: > > >>>> Hi Lonnie....I'll accept you option to "tax wealth".....can you explain > >>>> "how" and "what" such a set of taxes would look like?.....cure my > >>>> ignorance... I will not mind at all.....really. > >>>> Here's another article, below... that follows up on the general notion > >>>> of world-wide economic malaise..... > > >>>>http://www.sfgate.com/news/politics/article/G-20-countries-pledge-str... > > >>>> WASHINGTON (AP) — World finance leaders are pledging to pursue further > >>>> actions to bolster a disappointingly weak global recovery. They also > >>>> reaffirmed their commitment to avoid using their currencies as an > >>>> economic > >>>> weapon to gain unfair advantage in foreign trade. > > >>>> Finance ministers and central bank presidents from the leading rich and > >>>> developing nations, or Group of 20, wrapped up two days of talks Friday > >>>> with a joint statement that said they had managed to avoid some of the > >>>> biggest economic threats, but growth was still too weak in many countries > >>>> and unemployment too high. > > >>>> The joint statement revealed no major new policy initiatives but did > >>>> urge the United States and some other countries to emphasize efforts to > >>>> jump-start growth even if that meant less emphasis on deficit reduction > >>>> in > >>>> the near term. > > >>>> "Further actions are required to make growth strong, sustainable and > >>>> balanced," the G-20 said in their joint statement. > > >>>> The United States was represented at the talks by Treasury Secretary > >>>> Jacob > >>>> Lew<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>, > >>>> who was attending his first G-20 meeting since taking office in late > >>>> February, and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke. The discussions were > >>>> led by Russian Finance Minister Anton > >>>> Siluanov<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>whose > >>>> country is leading the G-20 this year. > > >>>> The G-20 joint statement singled out the recent aggressive > >>>> credit-easing moves pushed by Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo > >>>> Abe<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>, > >>>> saying they were intended to stop prolonged deflation and support > >>>> domestic demand. > > >>>> Those comments were viewed as giving a green-light to Japan's program, > >>>> which has driven the value of the yen down by more than 20 percent > >>>> against > >>>> the dollar since October. That sizable decline has raised concerns among > >>>> U.S. manufacturing firms that Japan's real goal is not to fight > >>>> deflation, > >>>> a destabilizing period of falling prices, but to weaken the yen as a way > >>>> to > >>>> gaining trade advantages. > > >>>> To address those concerns, the G-20 did repeat language it used in > >>>> February that all countries should not use their currency as a trade > >>>> weapon > >>>> and guard against policies that could trigger currency wars. > > >>>> Japanese officials told reporters following the discussions that they > >>>> were pleased by the support the G-20 had given them to pursue growth > >>>> policies in an effort to lift the world's third largest economy out of > >>>> its > >>>> two-decade slump. > > >>>> Haruhiko > >>>> Kuroda<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>, > >>>> head of the Bank of > >>>> Japan<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>, > >>>> said that Japan would continue with its monetary easing policies which he > >>>> said were aimed at stimulating domestic growth and fighting deflation and > >>>> not an effort to gain trade advantages. > > >>>> "There has been international understanding and acceptance of this so > >>>> we can have further confidence to appropriately conduct monetary policy," > >>>> he told reporters at a briefing after the G-20 talks ended. > > >>>> Siluanov told reporters at a news conference that the group did not > >>>> spend as much time discussing currency issues as they had in February. > > >>>> The United States had sought to get a strong endorsement of the need to > >>>> emphasize growth, given the weakness of the global economy, rather than > >>>> trying to achieve quick progress on cutting deficits. > > >>>> However, other nations, led by Germany, have resisted a move away from > >>>> austerity programs, saying it is critical to keep making progress in > >>>> getting government deficits under control. > > >>>> German Finance Minister Wolfgang > >>>> Schaeuble<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>apologized > >>>> to a Washington audience for being late for a speech after the > >>>> G-20 discussions, saying, "on reduction of indebtedness ... we have a > >>>> little bit of differences of opinion all over the world, to be very > >>>> frank, > >>>> and that's the reason I am a little bit late." > > >>>> Schaeuble said the German position remains that "if you promise to > >>>> deliver only immediately on growth, you will only create the next bubble" > >>>> in asset prices. > > >>>> The G-20 talks came in advance of meetings of the steering committees > >>>> of the 188-nation International Monetary > >>>> Fund<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>and > >>>> its sister organization, the World > >>>> Bank<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>. > >>>> Those talks began Friday and were scheduled to conclude on Saturday. > > >>>> "Strengthening global demand is imperative and must be at the top of > >>>> our agenda," Lew said in remarks Friday before the IMF panel. "Stronger > >>>> demand in Europe is critical to global growth." > > >>>> The G-20 statement said that there was an urgent need for the 17-nation > >>>> euro currency area to move towards a banking union and reduce the > >>>> "financial fragmentation" that now exists. > > >>>> Canadian Finance Minister Jim > >>>> Flaherty<http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=ne...>said > >>>> that the G-20 countries remain committed to setting hard targets for > >>>> reducing debt to a certain percentage of the economy, an idea first > >>>> raised > >>>> at an economic summit in Toronto in 2010. He said the issue would be > >>>> explored more when leaders of the G-20 countries hold their summit in > >>>> Russia in September. > > >>>> However, Siluanov told reporters he did not believe there was > >>>> widespread > > ... > > read more » -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Epistemology" group. 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