Totally agree, Telmo, regarding communication. On the Bostrom concept of Sims and, by extension, our reality being a sim, I like the concept, but in a way, it seems too simple, Rather than life being an illusion, let us conceive that its the result of a great program running and producing us as a result. Moreover, our program can be either revised, copied, or both, etc. This is one reason professor, Eric Steinhart's work seems compelling to me. The following summary is available from his book, Your Digital Afterlives, but here is a taste, from Steinhart's website-
http://ericsteinhart.com/FLESH/flesh-chabs.html The best of these theories is Promotion, but Steinhart views his own idea as flawed, because he wants it to be progressive rather then regressive. I don't see the logical regression he seemed concerned about, He did come up with Revision theory, as workable, however, these are merely, better-off clones of ourselves, and miss the continuity, that infers identity. Promotion is better, because it does exactly this, via pipelines, processes, data transfers, as well as uploading and teleportation. This is one reason I want to see if Ben Goetzel has an afterlife-resurrection theory, because they both appeared to have come to the same conclusions, independently, on several other concepts. Steinhart, like Goetzel, is a computationalist (digitalist) - (5 minute video) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfDB35y-5Z0 Please let me know if you uncover anything concerning Ben Goetzel's views. Thanks. Mitch -----Original Message----- From: Telmo Menezes <te...@telmomenezes.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Mon, May 4, 2015 9:08 am Subject: Re: Michael Shermer becomes sceptical about scepticism! On Mon, May 4, 2015 at 1:08 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: I sure did, Telmo. Scroll to the bottom and you shall view my last, number 26th, the last one. Ah there you are! And you are not the only one from this list commenting there, it's a small world. My bet on computational after-lives is that we are in one already (an infinity of times), but this is completely transparent to us. This kind of thing is interesting to me. I tend toward the materialist stuff since it seems to have potential. The mentalist stuff seems unreliable because people who have NDE's or trances have not come back with information. I would say that the important distinction is between communicable and non-communicable stuff. Science is about communicable stuff, but there is personal value in exploring the internal world -- although it won't get you a nobel prize or even any sort of recognition. -----Original Message----- From: Telmo Menezes <te...@telmomenezes.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Mon, May 4, 2015 4:19 am Subject: Re: Michael Shermer becomes sceptical about scepticism! On Sun, May 3, 2015 at 9:19 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: Hi Telmo, I have tried the Other Side stuff for a bit, and found it wanting. Not so surprising... The topic is a string attractor for quacks, for sure. Steinhart, said he had some experiences but decided they were not that significant to himself. He is more buzzed, he said, but the beauty of mathematics, emotionally. Here is a crowd funded 3D augmented reality game, due out next year, called Night Terrors, so much for the paranormal, yes? We maybe, could, have the paranormal adventure any time we choose. http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/05/01/survival-horror-augmented-reality-game-night-terrors-maps-your-house Wow, this is a brilliant/terrifying idea! I cross-posted a message to Ben Goetzel on his "Multiverse" website, as well as on Guilio Prisco's Turing-Church website sight concerning Goetzel's non-response, to my question to him, about afterlife ideas, if any? He seemed to touch on this in a recent article, as well as his 2006, The Hidden Pattern, which I had downloaded, a couple of months ago. Any data or opinion on Goetzel's view on all this? Have you seen this? http://multiverseaccordingtoben.blogspot.de/2015/03/paranormal-phenomena-nonlocal-mind-and.html Telmo. Mitch -----Original Message----- From: Telmo Menezes <te...@telmomenezes.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Sun, May 3, 2015 2:45 pm Subject: Re: Michael Shermer becomes sceptical about scepticism! Hi spudboy, I follow Ben Goetzel and have some of the books he recommends on the topic on my to-read list. I remain agnostic on this stuff, and just try to consider the simplest explanation, even if it's boring. In the case of this story, this sounds a lot like the event was staged by some nice person who cares about the bride. This doesn't mean that is the correct explanation, of course. What I am more curious about are replicable laboratory experiments. Some people, like Goetzel, are claiming that results with statistical significance are known. Maybe this is a nice opportunity for amateur science, because dealing with this topics would still career suicide for many people -- even if to find negative results. Of course believing in the supernatural is absurd -- what does that even mean? If, for example, ghosts were real, then this would just mean that current scientific theories are incomplete or wrong. Cheers, Telmo. On Sun, May 3, 2015 at 6:09 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: If you know of Ben Goetzel, and Damien Broderick, as well as Eric Steinhart, they have claimed Psi experiences, or spiritual experiences, but are split on the true significance? At the end of the day, it either works for us, or it doesn't. -----Original Message----- From: LizR < lizj...@gmail.com> To: everything-list < everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Sun, May 3, 2015 7:03 am Subject: Michael Shermer becomes sceptical about scepticism! Michael Shermer is the publisher of "Skeptic" magazine, which I used to subscribe to - but I could only take so many debunkings, lectures on science, and so on, and eventually I cancelled the sub, reasonably well convinced that I had by now obtained all the wherewithal I was ever going to need to give 123 reasons to explain any apparently supernatural event... http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/anomalous-events-that-can-shake-one-s-skepticism-to-the-core/ It's also a rather nice story. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. 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