On Thu, Aug 6, 2015 at 5:13 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote:
> >>> >>> the nuance is not in the name or in the pronouns, but in the 1p/3p >>> difference, or in the 1-1p/3-1p difference. >> >> >> >> In a world with people duplicating machines what exactly is the >> difference between >> *THE* >> 1p >> and the >> 3p difference >> and >> >> the difference between >> *THE* >> 1-1p >> and the >> 3- >> 1 >> p difference >> ? And whose "1p" is it anyway? >> > > > > > It is the difference between what is written in a diary of a person, > > and what an outsider can describe > If after the duplication Bruno Marchal can point to the one and only person that unambiguously wrote all that stuff in that diary then it will have been proven that there really is such a thing as **THE** 1P, if not then Bruno Marchal is talking gibberish. > >> > Expects? That depends entirely on who the Helsinki guy is, as > interminable posts on this subject have conclusively shown John Clark and > Bruno Marchal expect very different things. > > > > But we do agree on who the guy is. He is the guy who remember Helsinki. > But today is thursday so we don't agree. >> >> But why is this even relevant? > > > > You would read step 4, 5, ... you would have a pretty clear idea why it is > relevant > If step 4 is built on the foundations of step 3 then it would be pointless to read step 4 until the blunders in step 3 are repaired, and if it is not built on those foundations then it was unnecessary and foolish to include step 3 at all in your "proof". > >> >> The Helsinki guy will have whatever future subjective experience he has > > > > > The point is that there are more than one which is available. > So you agree the Helsinki guy will have a future subjective experience of Moscow and you agree the Helsinki guy will have a future subjective experience of Washington but insist the Helsinki guy will not experience Moscow and Washington in the future. Are you sure you're a logician? > >> and his expectations, correct or incorrect, have absolutely positively >> *NOTHING >> *to do with it. > > > ? > Which word didn't you understand? > > >>> >> >>> >>> w >>> >>> e have agreed on: both the M and W men are the same person as the H-man >> >> >> >> >> >> Yes the Moscow man and the Washington man are the Helsinki man, but it's >> important to remember that >> t >> he Washington man >> is *NOT* the Moscow man; and that's why personal identity can only be >> traced from the past to the present, never from the present to the future. >> > > > > Your own copies in W and M refute this immediately. > Bullshit. W says I remember seeing Washington one minute ago, and M says I remember seeing Moscow one minute ago, so W is *NOT* M . But both W and M say I remember seeing Helsinki one hour ago so both W and M *are* H. > > >> Until a city was spotted John Clark would know that John Clark had NOT >> been duplicated, although John Clark's body may or may not have been. > > > > So you say that at a time he might know what happened. Pure nonsense. > Until different outside stimulation is received , like seeing a different city , both brains would be running identical programs in parallel , so John Clark would have only one conscious experience regardless of how many identical brains were involved. > > He should just never expect experiencing being in two cities, and the > point is that the guy cannot see the difference, unless telepathy Telepathy?? Oh for christ sake! John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
