On Saturday, August 24, 2019, Bruce Kellett <bhkellet...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 25, 2019 at 1:01 PM Russell Standish <li...@hpcoders.com.au> > wrote: > >> On Sat, Aug 24, 2019 at 07:34:26PM -0700, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything >> List wrote: >> > >> > >> > On 8/24/2019 6:31 PM, Russell Standish wrote: >> > > On Sun, Aug 25, 2019 at 10:06:38AM +1000, Bruce Kellett wrote: >> > > > On Sun, Aug 25, 2019 at 9:45 AM Russell Standish < >> li...@hpcoders.com.au> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > On Sat, Aug 24, 2019 at 05:18:47PM -0400, John Clark wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > >> OK so 0=1, that's fine. >> > > > > >> > > > > > No, that is not fine. If 0=1, pigs have wings. >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > Yes but that's OK too, if nothing physical exists then pigs >> and wings >> > > > can't >> > > > > cause problems because they don't exist. And there are no >> minds that >> > > > might be >> > > > > upset by paradoxes. >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > That's kind of the point, though. Minds are nonphysical >> things, and >> > > > there is no apriori reason why physical things need to exist >> for minds >> > > > to exist. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > You have evidence for disembodied minds? >> > > That's not an apriori reason. Assuming you're in principle OK with the >> > > concept of a brain in a vat (which is a disembodied mind), then the >> > > you too do not have an apriori reason for the existence of physical >> > > things. >> > > >> > > >> > >> > I don't see that a brain in a vat counts as a disembodied mind. Do you >> mean >> > a brain that has no environment to perceive or act on? I would deny >> that >> > such an isolated brain instantiates a mind. On the other hand, if the >> brain >> > has sensors and actuators operating, say a Mars Rover, then it isn't >> > disembodied. >> > >> > Brent >> > >> >> Yes - I know your argument. In the BIV scenario, the environment could >> be simulated. Basically Descartes' evil daemon (malin genie) >> scenario. Nothing about the observed physics (bodies and whatnot) >> exists in any fundamental sense. >> > > Presumably the vat is a physical object that provides nutrients, power, > etc to the BIV. That does not count as disembodied in my book. > > The mind is a pattern distinct from any of it's physical incarnations. Brains have mass, minds do not. Brains have definite locations, minds do not. Minds can exist in multiple locations at once, brains cannot. Minds can travel from one physical universe to another, or to locations beyond the cosmological horizon receding at speeds greater than c, brains cannot. Jason -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CA%2BBCJUioirdk01etpmeC9zxRf0FhqUKtRRb5Gtg9BjmE--s2XQ%40mail.gmail.com.
