Remember that a lot of those jobs will be from redundancies - Admin, HR, etc. will get hit the hardest, then manufacturing (for products that are being phased out).
----- Original Message ----- From: "William Lefkovics" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "MS-Exchange Admin Issues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 10:34 AM Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Wait til HP lays off the 10-15,000. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Beckett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 7:21 AM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller He's right, that is the market today. Which, if you are an IT individual really sucks. I have talked with recruiters and they salaries overall are down 25%. I don't think the market will really ever pick back up to the point that it was. It is now too flooded with IT wannabes with dollar signs in their eyes. -----Original Message----- From: Ray Zorz [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 10:11 AM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Not that I've seen. Right now, they want certs, and they want experience, and they want to pay as little as possible. And they'll be able to find that person. I've talked to a couple of recruiters who are seeing resumes from IT folks formerly making $70-$80k applying for $40k jobs. DHL announced they were opening an IT center out here, and supposedly got about 5 thousand resumes for about 50 positions. Yesterday I heard from someone that had over 700 resumes for a position. Some company that is apparently doing a very large w2k migration has been rejecting experienced NT4-w2k migration people with certs because they hadn't worked on "large enough" migrations. Someday, the economy will come back, and all the underpaid folks will jump to better paying jobs. -----Original Message----- From: Snook, Kevin S (ITD) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 7:38 AM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Do hiring people still talk about the "T" shape candidate. This doesn't refer to their physical shape although I guess it might. It refers to the fact that mostly recruiters want a guy with a broad experience of different technologies with in-depth knowledge of one or maybe two technologies. Just wundrin' coz it was all the rage when I left college (but that was some time ago now!). Kevin -----Original Message----- From: Bill Beckett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 06 June 2002 14:35 To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Definitely agree on the market plays a factor, no question...but overall a kid coming out of school expecting to make that amount is a bit ridiculous -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Carpenter [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 9:25 AM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Earlier someone mentioned a story about a kid saying that 60-90K was too low for OCPs, and he thought the kid was naive. Although I do agree that many kids go in with much higher $$ thoughts these days, instead of the love of protocols (JK), I don't think that 60-90K is all that high either. It all depends on your market, experience, and abilities. Market is a huge factor. I was offered a job that paid 3 times what I make here, simply due to market differences. Keep in mind that I make about $4.25/hour here on the Tex-Mex border though...jk -----Original Message----- From: Schwartz, Jim [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 7:20 AM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller He was an IBM Global Services guy and knew Cobol like he wrote the language. During Y2K, they would pay anyone who could write code some serious cake. The reason that the CIO's and CTO's make the $300k - $600k kind of money is due to all the medical care they need to have after having the lobotomy and spine removal surgeries. -----Original Message----- From: Ely, Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 9:56 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Well, where are these high paying jobs at. I'm underpaid! I want some of that "cheese"! :o) -----Original Message----- From: Schwartz, Jim [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 5:08 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Like I said. I've seen contracts for a whole hell of a lot more than that. I think the largest I've seen was $525 an hour plus expenses. If you were talking salary then 150hr x hours x 52 weeks = $312,000.00. Add in about 45% for benefits and taxes = $452,400.00 in salary costs. Not worth that. No offense to Don or anyone else. -----Original Message----- From: Mal Sasalu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 4:53 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller I am not cheap. I wasn't talking about Don's worth. I was talking about your authority to hire him or somebody like him. -----Original Message----- From: Schwartz, Jim [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 2:41 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller You're cheap. [1] [2] [1] Chorus: But not easy! [2] For someone like Don, who I KNOW has the experience $150 an hour would be a bargain. -----Original Message----- From: Ely, Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 3:58 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Something wrong with charging $150 an hour? That's my usual going rate... :o) -----Original Message----- From: Mal Sasalu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 3:40 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller Then you must be having authority to pay $150/hour as well. That's what Kevin said, he will be charging :-) -----Original Message----- From: Schwartz, Jim [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 2:10 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller And those of us with hiring authority do make it a practice to look into these lists and decide who is an idiot, who is new and trying to learn and who knows how to fix broke a$$ sh!t. -----Original Message----- From: Ely, Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 2:42 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller I have a great sense of humour provided someone works for a cert instead of this cramming crap, taking a test, and calling yourself certified. Too many paper MCSE's out there and those paper MCSE's don't know their a$$ from a hole in the ground. -----Original Message----- From: Bunting, Jeff [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 2:39 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller someone leave their sense of humor at home today? -----Original Message----- From: Ely, Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 2:29 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller You can keep thinking that... Just pray you never apply for a job that I'm hiring for. Don Ely - NMBOTWBAS and then some [EMAIL PROTECTED] -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Carpenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 2:11 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller It never matters HOW you get certified, as long as you ARE certified. Sheesh -----Original Message----- From: Ely, Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 12:56 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller We, unlike you, didn't/don't use CRAM sites. We actually use real world knowledge that we've learned over the years... -----Original Message----- From: Precht, David [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 1:58 PM To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller what cram site did you guys use ;) ? -----Original Message----- From: Paul Green [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 13:09 To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues Subject: RE: For Kevin Miller I got him certified in UCC+WCA. -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Carpenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Posted At: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 10:08 AM Posted To: Exchange 2000 Server Conversation: For Kevin Miller Subject: For Kevin Miller Would you mind enlightening us on what all that crap is after your name? Is that just a jab at the "certified" world, or are those real? I can not find anything on them in Google. (I had 2 minutes to spare to look) TIA List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.368 / Virus Database: 204 - Release Date: 5/29/2002 List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.368 / Virus Database: 204 - Release Date: 5/29/2002 List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---- -- The information contained in this email message is privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copy of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately notify Veronis Suhler Stevenson by telephone (212)935-4990, fax (212)381-8168, or email ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and delete the message. Thank you. ======================================================================== ==== == List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm List Charter and FAQ at: http://www.sunbelt-software.com/exchange_list_charter.htm
