Don’t forget Schrődinger saying that the world looks to him like a great thought rather than a great machine.
----- Original Message ---- From: off_world_beings <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, January 9, 2008 7:25:16 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Same Grandfathers of Physics Speak Out.......was/The Grandfathers of Physic --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj <vajranatha@ ...> wrote: > > > On Jan 9, 2008, at 2:45 PM, off_world_beings wrote: > > > Vaj...they are saying religion "no", consciousness "yes". > > The question really wasn't about "religion" per se Off, but instead > about religious questions (in the parlance of that day). Today we > might phrase it "spiritual questions".> > Yes, 'mysticism' and the like, which, as any TM'r knows has nothing to do with 'consciousness' or Sir Roger Penrose's "quantum consciousness" But you never learned TM so you would not know that. > > And no, they are not saying "consciousness yes". In fact none of your > quotes are even from the aforementioned physicists!> > You need to read it again. There was a specific quote from Max Planck, which stated: "Consiousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative of consciousness" . Planck is huge, and you are backed into a corner now Vaj, so you just shut the quote out of your mind. You cannot get around Planck. There was also a description of Erwin Schrödinger's theory from a legitimate source. You also have Bernard D'Espagnat quoted from the Scientific American, and finally renound neurosurgeon Wilder Penfield was quoted. In addition, you cannot get around Penrose and his "quantum consciousness" You chose to ignore those quotes because you know they refute your posts. OffWorld > > If you still believe so, please post their equation for this > "consciousness" you mention. > > > > > "Erwin Schrödinger was among the first to point out that many of the > > unique characteristics of living organisms are consequences of the > > microscopic origins of life and quantum mechanical roots within the > > DNA — among these characteristics, the phenomenon of > > consciousness. "(1) > > > > "Max Plank - regarded as one of the greatest minds of the 20th > > century regarded, quote: "Consiousness as fundamental. I regard > > matter as derivative of consciousness" .(1) > > > > French Physicist Bernard D'Espagnat: "The doctrine that the world is > > made up of objects whose existence is independent of human > > consciousness turns out to be in conflict with quantum mechanics and > > with the facts established by experiment"( 2) > > > > In an essay entitled "The Materialist Superstition" , AI technology > > guru George Gilder writes "the usual materialist assumption is that > > the brain, the hardware, comes first and mind somehow emerges from > > it." > > He then quotes neurosurgeon Wilder Penfield's conclusion after he'd > > conducted extensive research of the brain: "I, like other scientists, > > have struggled to prove that the brain accounts for the mind." > > http://csmweb2. emcweb.com/ durable/2001/ 06/28/p14s1. htm > > > > References: > > (1) Klien, D.B., 1984, 'The Concept of Consiousness: A Survey', > > Lincoln University of Nebraska press, (adjacent to title page). > > (2)'The Quantum Theory and Reality', D.'Espagnat, B., Scientific > > American, 1979, 241(5, p. 158). > <!-- #ygrp-mkp{ border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:14px 0px;padding:0px 14px;} #ygrp-mkp hr{ border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #ygrp-mkp #hd{ color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:bold;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0px;} #ygrp-mkp #ads{ margin-bottom:10px;} #ygrp-mkp .ad{ padding:0 0;} #ygrp-mkp .ad a{ color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} --> <!-- #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc{ font-family:Arial;} #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd{ margin:10px 0px;font-weight:bold;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad{ margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 0;} --> <!-- #ygrp-mlmsg {font-size:13px;font-family:arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} #ygrp-mlmsg table {font-size:inherit;font:100%;} #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {font:99% arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {font:115% monospace;} #ygrp-mlmsg * {line-height:1.22em;} #ygrp-text{ font-family:Georgia; } #ygrp-text p{ margin:0 0 1em 0;} #ygrp-tpmsgs{ font-family:Arial; clear:both;} #ygrp-vitnav{ padding-top:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;margin:0;} #ygrp-vitnav a{ padding:0 1px;} #ygrp-actbar{ clear:both;margin:25px 0;white-space:nowrap;color:#666;text-align:right;} #ygrp-actbar .left{ float:left;white-space:nowrap;} .bld{font-weight:bold;} #ygrp-grft{ font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;padding:15px 0;} #ygrp-ft{ font-family:verdana;font-size:77%;border-top:1px solid #666; padding:5px 0; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo{ padding-bottom:10px;} #ygrp-vital{ background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:2px 0 8px 8px;} #ygrp-vital #vithd{ font-size:77%;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:bold;color:#333;text-transform:uppercase;} #ygrp-vital ul{ padding:0;margin:2px 0;} #ygrp-vital ul li{ list-style-type:none;clear:both;border:1px solid #e0ecee; } #ygrp-vital ul li .ct{ font-weight:bold;color:#ff7900;float:right;width:2em;text-align:right;padding-right:.5em;} #ygrp-vital ul li .cat{ font-weight:bold;} #ygrp-vital a{ text-decoration:none;} #ygrp-vital a:hover{ text-decoration:underline;} #ygrp-sponsor #hd{ color:#999;font-size:77%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov{ padding:6px 13px;background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul{ padding:0 0 0 8px;margin:0;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov li{ list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;font-size:77%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a{ text-decoration:none;font-size:130%;} #ygrp-sponsor #nc{ background-color:#eee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:0 8px;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad{ padding:8px 0;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad #hd1{ font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold;color:#628c2a;font-size:100%;line-height:122%;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad a{ text-decoration:none;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad a:hover{ text-decoration:underline;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad p{ margin:0;} o{font-size:0;} .MsoNormal{ margin:0 0 0 0;} #ygrp-text tt{ font-size:120%;} blockquote{margin:0 0 0 4px;} .replbq{margin:4;} --> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com