--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > In the real world we do see that cause and effect > > > operate according to the laws of 'karma', or due > > > to cause and effect, however, in the real world we > > > do not see 'karma' operating as moral reciprocity: > > > sometimes bad people do bad things and are rewarded > > > with good things. > > > > Richard M. wrote: > > But maybe not in the long run ;-) > > > Maybe so, maybe not. > > However, all karma, mental or physical, is negated > by logical experience. > > In reality there's no causation, and no effect whatsover. > Things don't really move about and change; there's > really no time, nor duration, and no origination. > > Apparently we do not really act at all - all our > actions are due to karma, but we have no volition > - it's just the 'gunas' acting on each other. There's > no individual soul-monad to account for 'right' action. > > According to Guadapadacharya, the central doctrine of > Adwaita is 'ajativada', that is, non-production: > > Nothing is produced anywhere at any time; there is no > birth, no production of anything, no cause and effect. > So, the idea of 'karma', actions, or moral reciprocity > become just parts of the illusion. Things and events > are not exactly as they seem. Therefore, no real > objective world outside of consciousness. > > Actualy we are mistaken in our experience of things > and events. We only 'seem' to see things and things > only 'appear' to be real. All sensory and mental > experience, with the exception of pure contentless > consciousness, is illusion, just like in a dream. > > 22. Nothing whatever is brought into existence, > whether from itself or from something else: nothing > at all! Not anything existent, non-existent or both > is ever orginated. > > Nagarjuna, the brilliant Madhyamika logician, agrees > with this in his 'Four Negations'.
This sounds like a reincarnation of the ideas of the Greek philosopher Parmenides (though who is reincarnating who I do not have the dates to judge). He wrote about the (apparently) contradictory "Way Of Truth" (= change is an illusion) & the "Way Of Seeming" (= the world of change we live in, or seem to live in). Nothing new under the sun, eh! Do you remember the good 'ole days of the "Journal Of The Science Of Creative Intelligence"? I remember an article that impressed me then by Pete Russell called "And The Opposite Is Also True". As I recall (VERY foggily) that was concerned with the issues you raise. Perhaps this is THE problem for those sympathetic to the eastern philosophy world-view (viz the One and the many)? Rather like the problem of evil is THE problem for the western religious world view? > Work cited: > > 'Dispelling Illusion' > Gaudapada's Alatasanti > By Douglas A. Fox > State University of New York Press, 1993 > > > > There's no doubt that the laws of 'karma' indicate > > > cause and effect. But, the question is, does 'karma' > > > operate on the level of moral reciprocity? If the > > > universe is material, based on pure mechanics, > > > then there's no reason to posit a moral factor. > > > > > > If 'karma' indicated that there is a moral to cause > > > and effect, then we would expect to see people > > > who do good things get rewarded with good things, > > > and those that do bad things, should be getting > > > bad things. > > > >
