Well, you could designate an instrument you aren't using, e.g., Mellophone to be Horn in E and use it in the score wherever you want Horn in E. But then all your horn section would sound like Mellophones in those passages.
I hadn't about it but you're right. The choice of Chromatic or non-chromatic transposition has absolutely nothing to do with what instrument is playing. On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 8:21 PM, Ryan <[email protected]> wrote: > Thanks. Unfortunately, I do care about playback. > While the method you suggest works for just a single line, it is completely > unusable in an orchestral score [without SIGNIFICANT workarounds]. > It is quite a regression in functionality, isn't it? I guess I'll keep > running Fin2010 for a while for certain pieces. > It does appear that "Horn in Eb" is a canned instrument, but it defaults to > show a key signature. I prefer to use the "chromatic" transposition that > doesn't use key signatures, but I see no way to get it to change for the > selected measures. > It seems that an "easy" fix for them would be the ability to add custom > instruments with specific transpositions. > > On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 5:59 PM, Robert Patterson < > [email protected]> wrote: > > > The challenge is that there is no canned instrument "Horn in E". The > whole > > Fin12 approach is based on the ill-conceived assumption that a change of > > transposition means a change of instrument. > > > > If you don't care about playback, it's fairly simple. For the sections of > > Horn in E, use Utilities->Change Instrument to change the instrument to > > anything other than Horn if F. Then in Score Manager you can edit the > > transposition and name for the section that is covered by that > instrument. > > If you want it to play back like a horn, I don't have an answer. > > > > On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 7:40 PM, Ryan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > OK, Darcy & Robert, > > > Maybe I've missed something in the help file, but how do I change > > > transpositions within a piece? > > > Example, I'm re-writing an orchestral horn part so I can read off of a > > > clean copy without years and years of pencil marks and erasures. > > > It's written for Horn in F for a while, then changes to Horn in E, then > > > back again. I used to use staff styles for this, but now I can't. > > > Thanks! > > > Ryan > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Robert Patterson < > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > I heartily agree the previous way was flawed, and the more I tinker > > with > > > > the new way the more I find it okay and in some ways improved. One > > > concern > > > > I do have, though, is setting up and applying transpositions other > than > > > > those one encounters in a wind band is quite tedious, especially > > compared > > > > with the old way, because they aren't available in the drop down > lists > > > for > > > > "Change Instruments". > > > > > > > > The idea that transpositions are features of an instrument is > > > questionable > > > > to me. It makes sense for woodwinds, but not so much for brass, esp. > > > horns > > > > and trumpets. Transposition on the latter instruments was *never* an > > > > instrument specification. A couple hundred year ago it specified a > > crook. > > > > These days, even for pieces written since the invention of valves, > > > > transposition merely specifies what notes to play on the axe you have > > > > chosen to be playing for that piece. > > > > > > > > While I am generally getting comfortable with the Score Manager way > of > > > > changing instruments, I am not particularly happy that transposition > is > > > > tied to them. FWIW: In pre-Fin12 I usually applied transposition > > changes > > > > and instrument name changes as separate staff styles. > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 3:11 PM, Darcy James Argue < > > > [email protected] > > > > >wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Robert, > > > > > > > > > > I agree the lack of visual feedback regarding transposition changes > > is > > > a > > > > > serious problem and needs fixing. > > > > > > > > > > On the other hand, the old system of using staff styles for > > instrument > > > > > changes was severely broken. When clearing measures of entries (via > > the > > > > > clear key), the instrument staff style would also be cleared, and > > > > > constantly needed to be reapplied. (It was frustratingly easy to > > > forget, > > > > > and to be left with untransposed passages mixed in with transposed > > > > passages > > > > > in the parts.) Transposition staff styles would sometimes be active > > in > > > > the > > > > > score, but not the parts. And the "copyability" cuts both ways -- > it > > > was > > > > > far too easy to accidentally copy a transposition from one staff to > > > > > another, when you only wanted to copy the entries. > > > > > > > > > > Also, it is now MUCH easier to obtain correct playback on staves > with > > > > > instrument changes -- no more messing around with keyswitches or > > > > > channel-changing expressions. > > > > > > > > > > Once MakeMusic adds visual feedback indicating instrument changes, > > I'll > > > > be > > > > > quite happy with the Score Manager. It really is a dramatic > > improvement > > > > > over using Staff Styles for instrument changes. > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > > > > > - DJA > > > > > ----- > > > > > WEB: http://www.secretsocietymusic.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 15 Feb 2012, at 9:29 AM, Robert Patterson wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I am just a newbie to Fin12, but I am coming to really hate the > > Score > > > > > > Manager. I suppose if I had never learned the old way it wouldn't > > > seem > > > > so > > > > > > bad, but I'm an old dog, and this seems like a new trick of > little > > > > value. > > > > > > > > > > > > Up until now I had refrained from whining about the Score Manager > > > > > because I > > > > > > hadn't really worked with it for real and because I couldn't see > > that > > > > it > > > > > > was really worse, rather just (arbitrarily) different. But this > > issue > > > > of > > > > > > change of transposition seems like a regression to me. Under the > > new > > > > > scheme > > > > > > I can no longer look at the page and see where the transposition > > > > changes > > > > > > are. (Before, you could turn on staff style display and see at a > > > > glance.) > > > > > > Also, it means you can no longer copy a transposition from one > area > > > to > > > > > > another the way you could copy staff styles. (At least with my > Mass > > > > Copy > > > > > > plugin, although I think it was possible in Finale itself too.) > > > > > > > > > > > > Someone explain to me why I am a whiner. > > > > > > > > > > > > R > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 8:07 AM, Christopher Smith < > > > > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >> That's okay, I had missed it entirely myself and had to get this > > > > > technique > > > > > >> from Tech Support. So I pass it on! > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Christopher > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> On Wed Feb 15, at WednesdayFeb 15 8:16 AM, Bernard Nussbaumer > > wrote: > > > > > >> > > > > > >>> Great, thanks Christopher, > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> I did look in the Help Files, but not in the best place... I > > should > > > > > have > > > > > >>> read more carefully the "Score Manager" chapter; as English > isn't > > > my > > > > > >>> primary language, I understand almost everything I read in the > > Help > > > > > >> Files, > > > > > >>> but sometimes I miss something important (while trying to > > > understand > > > > > >>> quickly) ... > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Bernard > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> 2012/2/15 Christopher Smith <[email protected]> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>>> You go to the part, open the Score Manager. Only the part you > > are > > > in > > > > > >> will > > > > > >>>> show. Click Unlink All Instruments in This Staff and you can > > > change > > > > > >>>> instruments without it showing in the score. You can do this > to > > > > create > > > > > >>>> alternate parts, too, like bass clef trombone and Bb treble > clef > > > > > >> trombone > > > > > >>>> using the same score staff, without having to add and hide > > > > additional > > > > > >> score > > > > > >>>> staves. > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> Christopher > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> On Tue Feb 14, at TuesdayFeb 14 6:21 PM, Bernard Nussbaumer > > wrote: > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>>> Hi all, > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> (Finale 2012 - Windows) > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> In the "Staff Styles" Window, the transposition and the clef > > > > settings > > > > > >>>> have > > > > > >>>>> disappeared (since these settings are to be found in the > Score > > > > > >> Manager). > > > > > >>>>> I need to set a part as a transposed instrument, but I don't > > want > > > > the > > > > > >>>>> transposition to apply in the Score. > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> Any ideas? > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> Thanks, > > > > > >>>>> Bernard > > > > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > > > > >>>>> Finale mailing list > > > > > >>>>> [email protected] > > > > > >>>>> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> _______________________________________________ > > > > > >>>> Finale mailing list > > > > > >>>> [email protected] > > > > > >>>> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > > > > >>> Finale mailing list > > > > > >>> [email protected] > > > > > >>> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > >> > > > > > >> _______________________________________________ > > > > > >> Finale mailing list > > > > > >> [email protected] > > > > > >> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > Finale mailing list > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Finale mailing list > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Finale mailing list > > > > [email protected] > > > > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Finale mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Finale mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > _______________________________________________ > Finale mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > _______________________________________________ Finale mailing list [email protected] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
