On 7/29/03 1:01 PM, "Nicola Ken Barozzi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:I've no issue with rules, except when we say we have rules but can't articulate them. Example #1. What should the names of the mailing lists and CVS be? [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED]
After spending considerable time off-list with Cliff preparing his
proposal, I'm getting a bit weary with all this rules stuff
ASF is incorporated. We have certain rules to abide to, like licensing et all. And also internal rules, that you know quite well, about voting, and about infrastructure policies.
I am here representing the XML PMC. I've been *waiting* for the incubator PMC to make up its mind on how to name projects, and now I am *waiting* for infrastructure to create some resources (and yes, I know they are busy with minotaur, and I am cutting them some slack). I'm not willing to cut the high and mighty incubator PMC some slack for rules and policy that should have been in place for a year and the failure to document such.. It's fine for us to come out with the high and mighty Apache way, but when we don't have basic stuff like this in order it makes us look bad. As a n ASF member, member of 2 PMCs, and former PMC chair, I find this to be an embarassment. If the incubator is incapable of doing its job then maybe an ASF member needs to introduce a resolution calling for its dissolution.And see, I don't think you're the person who should be responsible for them Nicola Ken. I think the XML PMC/Steven should. If they don't have time or are unable to, then the project should not be under their oversight because it will be their continuing responsibility. Just because you seal the ship with turpentine doesn't mean it won't sink later if you never do it again.
Which rules make you so tired? I just blocked the creation of some
resources for less than a week, and you are already tired? It takes
years to build good communities, and patience is a virtue. I don't
honestly think that some days will ruin it all.
Why are you blaming the XMLBeans guys for your not having your act together? It's all well and good for them to introduce themselves, but that's not what is holding us up right now. Right now, we're held up because we don't have a public mailing list where we can see whether their behavior matches their talk. They can say all they want about how they want to work as a community and allow non BEA developers and so forth, but we need to see them doing that. I thought that was the point of incubation.Suggestion: why don't we get to know the XMLBeans guys better? What
about if each of them sends us a mail with a brief bio and expectations?
That is an excellent idea.
I think it would be great for the XMLBeans team to introduce themselves. Maybe you'd rather that [EMAIL PROTECTED] took up the slack for [EMAIL PROTECTED] That's fine with me too.
Ted
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