Mike,
You can do this with just VM:Tape and VM:Operator ...
no Linux, no other screen scraper necessary! And the mounts go
quickly!
JR (Steven)
Imler
CA
Senior Software Engineer
Tel: +1 703 708
3479
Fax: +1 703 708
3267
From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Walter
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 05:58 PM
To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU
Subject: Re: VM for DB2 Backups
Thanks, Kris. Different environments and experience levels. From time working in Europe 25 years ago, I remember the customers being much more subservient to vendors (go ahead, Chuckie... drool at you want!).
I'm certainly not going to install a PROP server when we already have VM:Operator perfectly capable of intercepting and CP SMSGing those few commands. And the thought every single tape mount having to go through a workstation (and perhaps a firewall) to get to z/OS ,to get to the Sun/STK VTS is just too much to bear. Rube Goldberg must certainly be smiling.
Sun/STK will have to do a lot of explaining why their Linux-certified app cannot run on any Linux distro, and why it can't run in a virtual machine. IMHO "because we haven't tested it" will not be an acceptable answer from a vendor charging what they do for this hardware and software. BUT...in their defense, they have not quite said that yet -- "we'll try to work with you on this" is more along the lines of what I've heard so far from the local Sun/STK folks. Again, we'll see how this all plays out.
Mike Walter
Hewitt Associates
The opinions expressed herein are mine alone, not my employer's.
| "Kris Buelens"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent by: "The IBM z/VM Operating System" <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU> 05/31/2006 04:30 PM
|
|
LMS/VM comes with two service machines, one is a PROP based server to
catch VMTAPE mounts
My customer is too nice (I guess) and they will add yet 2 other servers in
two dedicated HW boxes to the 1000's they already have... but this one
will run Linux (as opposed to 99% of the others). The LMS/VM people were
not prepared to really discuss why they couldn't run this in a virtual
machine "we discussed this internally, it must be a PC, with Windows or
Linux". I don't remember which flavor of Linux it is. But, as in the
proposal STK also takes care of installing & managing these 2 servers, the
distro didn't matter to my client.
Kris,
IBM Belgium, VM customer support
Mike Walter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: The IBM z/VM Operating System <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU>
2006-05-31 22:41
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The IBM z/VM Operating System
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IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU
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Subject
Re: VM for DB2 Backups
Dennis ... yeah, that's it (LMS/VM), I was just too lazy to look it up.
We used to run a product called LMS/VM (Library Management System) from
Sutmyn (nee: Memorex-Telex) when we had their big (huge) robotic tape
libraries. Those things were great, even if they pretty much needed an
on-site C.E. and even if the marketing was worse than nonexistent. The
MTC 3490 ACLs held 25 tapes! Talk about "lights out" before it's time!
IMHO: great hardware and software design killed by miserable marketing.
Kris ... PROP? That's why I wrote: "... (or VM:Operator) action routines
...". Wouldn't even consider running PROP since we've heavily used
VM:Operator since it was in Alpha-test. You wrote "We too asked if the
Linux server couldn't run under z/VM...", but then never explained if your
customer will actually run using a Linux virtual machine -- and which
distro. Can you fill us in?
Thanks!
Mike Walter
Hewitt Associates
The opinions expressed herein are mine alone, not my employer's.
"Kris Buelens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: "The IBM z/VM Operating System" <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU>
05/31/2006 02:40 PM
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"The IBM z/VM Operating System" <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU>
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Re: VM for DB2 Backups
My customer tested this solution and will start using this solution in
production the weekend of 10 June. We too asked if the Linux server
couldn"t run under z/VM...
We will not use the PROP user they provide: a VMOPER action routine
directly issues the SMSG's to the "IP talking" service machine. It was
just too simple to not to use the extra PROP server.
Kris,
IBM Belgium, VM customer support
Mike Walter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: The IBM z/VM Operating System <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU>
2006-05-31 20:08
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Re: VM for DB2 Backups
Odd... we're installing a Sun/STK VTS here, and we fully expect z/VM to
work with it. Getting it to work is lots more complex than installing
RMSMASTR and having VM:Tape work with IBM's VTS. (I used to think *that*
was hokey -- live and learn).
The Sun/STK solution is significantly (and needlessly) more convoluted.
We have not started the Sun/STK installation on the z/VM system yet (z/OS
needs it first, and will get it first), but my current understanding is
that it requires PROP (or VM:Operator) action routines, a CMS service
machine that talks "IP" to a Linux server. The Linux box will talk over
IP to a started task on a z/OS system. The z/OS system started task
application talks directly to the Sun/STK VTS. All that to simply get the
robot in the VTS to finally move (the actual data will flow over FICON).
Sun/STK tells me that the Linux server should be Redhat (Fedora?) Linux on
a Solaris box. I told them no way!; we will install a SuSE Linux virtual
machine (just like all the other Linux on zSeries servers we plan) in the
same z/VM system that needs access to the Sun/STK VTS. No firewalls. No
routers. No problems.
OTOH, Sun/STK will have to support their application in that environment.
They want our money, they need to support our environment. We'll see how
that all pans out. Man plans, God laughs.
Mike Walter
Hewitt Associates
The opinions expressed herein are mine alone, not my employer's.
"Moore, Terry A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: "The IBM z/VM Operating System" <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU>
05/31/2006 12:51 PM
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"The IBM z/VM Operating System" <IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU>
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VM for DB2 Backups
Our data center is eliminating an STK tape silo and implementing STK's
Virtual Tape product. They tell me that there is no interface from VM for
STK Virtual Tape. The data center manager wants to know if we could take
DB2/VM backups from MVS (shared dasd environment). Our DBA has suggested
the alternate solution (below) for DB2/VM backups.
Has anyone got experience with doing DB2/VM backups in such an environment
or care to comment on either proposed solution?
Terry A. Moore
Proj Mgr - IT Infrastructure
Terry,
Here is the problem. We have several VM for DB2 database servers.
Currently they use vmbackup to take database and log backups using the
tape silo. The tape silo is being replaced by a virtual tape
machine(from STK). VM cannot talk to the virtual tape machine so
utilizing that is not an option. My thoughts currently are to take a
weekly backup of all the DB2 for VM database machines data disk utilizing
a FAT tape(s) and throughout the week take log backups for the database
machines that do online updating. I am still trying to test this
scenario to make sure it will work.
Currently, we use a product called VM:DBA from CA that allows us to
automate all the backups so no operator intervention is required. In
order to use FAT tape(s) to backup all the databases at one time, I will
create a vmbackup template that will have all the databases data disks and
then it will be submitted via an exec by VM:DBA after all the databases
have been brought down. The problem here is VM:DBA will not be able to
track when the backups are done and keep track of the volume serial
numbers use in the backup process so the restore process will now have to
a more manual process outside of the VM:DBA product. Also, a routine to
bring the databases back online after the backup is done will need to
created.
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