Man come on people. Don't stoop to downing someone elses recordings
because its just piano or guitar or singing by itself. Maybe thats
what they enjoy doing. But come on don't discredit there stuff if its
not up to your quality of recording standards. Heck you guies should
hear some of my old stuff that i recorded off of casettes haha. Not
that good. Anyway if you would chill out on the fighting on list i
would appreciate it. I feel sorry for whoever started this thread and
has to waid through all the garbage that has come up just to find the
answer to there question. And guys no bashing a beginning sonar user
please. I remember when i started out and didn't know crap. Remember
every single one of you started out at the same place and you learned
as you went along. So chill.
On 7/11/10, Chris Belle <[email protected]> wrote:
> If you put your effects pre eq, that means the eq is last in the chain.
>
> If you put your effects post eq, then the opposite is true, you eq
> before your effects.
>
> Depending on what you are doing, either is appropriate.
>
> In the event for example of a traditional d s processing chain where
> you want an eqed signal to control a compressor,
> you'd want your eq signal to be before the compressor.
>
> Most of us don't use physical side chaining anymore but that's how
> they used to do it.
>
> There are times you want to eq a signal before it hits the effect
> chain, or even put eq in between,
> for instance, I like to eq a reverb sometimes if I like the verb and
> it doesn't have it's own low cut or filters, and sometimes you get
> better results from eq, to cut out too much bass in the verb causing
> roar and rumble or cloudy mud in the mix.
>
> also if you have too much energy hitting a compressor, and you
> generally like the comp settings but you want to help ease the work
> the compressor is doing, eq before hand can do this.
>
> This using many buses and doing things in stages is a good way to
> process audio,
> you get more choices, and it's how the big boys do it,
> and the sweet thing in the box is that you can have as many buses as
> you like without adding noise.
>
>
> At 02:06 PM 7/11/2010, you wrote:
>>This is all very fascinating, but I think the real important question here
>> is:
>>
>>what's the difference between pre and post?
>>On 7/11/2010 11:15 AM, Phil Muir wrote:
>>>Chris wrote: Ok, now that I've had a belly full of the crap, let's just
>>> put
>>>things in perspective and lay them out on the table.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: before you do I unreservedly apologise if I have said
>>> anything
>>>that upset you. I especially would like to apologise for saying, "Chris,
>>> me
>>>thinks you may wish to take a little more time out to study Sonar's
>>>architecture before posting inaccurate stuff like this, especially if
>>> you're
>>>teaching students." I was flat out wrong to post that so, sorry.
>>>
>>>However, I stand by my comment about being able to access all 6 bands of
>>> the
>>>track/bus EQ in the track inspector which, I don't feel you explained
>>>thoroughly.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: The real deal is that you just can't stand anyone having a
>>>different idea about how to do things than you, I've seen it displayed
>>> even
>>>with very gentle knowledgeable people, who never go toe to toe with
>>> anyone,
>>>isn't mentioning any names, but I will say he's a cubass user and uses
>>>another screen-reader than the all glorious holy jaws 'grin'.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: not about to get into talking about others who are not on
>>> list
>>>and are therefore, not part of this discussion and not in the position of
>>>answering for themselves as that's not fair. I won't put words in other
>>>peoples mouths if they aren't here to agree/disagree. However, I will
>>> state
>>>that you and I did come to full agreement on a separate issue with regard
>>> to
>>>components not being fully revealed by a PC vender who builds PC's that
>>> came
>>>up on another list so, in spite of what has been posted here, Chris and I
>>> do
>>>agree on things quite a lot. Further more, Chris is using a PC built by
>>>another vender that I recommended to Chris, a guy called Jim Roseberry
>>> over
>>>at:
>>>
>>>http://www.studiocat.com/
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: You love to discredit me because you just can't stand it that
>>> I
>>>charge half or less than you do, and give better value, and I've stolen
>>> some
>>>of your students.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: better value is always a debatable point. If we weren't
>>> doing
>>>something right then, clients wouldn't keep on coming back. Sure,
>>>competition is a very good thing indeed.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Competition buddy, I even put out friendly feelers to work
>>> with
>>>you even giving you my first version of session drummer 3 but all I got
>>> from
>>>you was, oh, it's junk, I can do a better job of it.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: at no stage in the conversation with you Did I ever state
>>>that. What Chris wanted to do was offer that set to the freely available
>>>HSC sets and that would be as Chris stated his "contribution to the
>>> cause."
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Well, mister know it all, that prompted me to make it better
>>>and put it out myself, but thanks to people like Roy, and Tom Kingston,
>>> and
>>>folks who aren't threatened by a little competition, and who can work with
>>>others doing the same thing they are sometimes it turned out just fine. I
>>>was even going to split profits with you, but no, you couldn't be
>>> bothered.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: this wasn't a conversation that I ever had with you so, I
>>>think it's easy to state inaccuracies after the fact.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Despite the brush-off, you still get free rain to advertise,
>>>and share special stuff on my private list, and to your credit, at least
>>>there, you don't act like such an know it all, probably because you know
>>> the
>>>biggest brains are watching, I'm privileged to have some such on the list.
>>>
>>>But you need to quit it, whether you like it or not, there are other ways
>>> of
>>>doing things, even with sonar, and some of them may work better for some
>>>people than your sanctioned way, for instances, trashing the idea, yes you
>>>did, of using more than one bus to get extra eq, well, if we weren't
>>>supposed to use eq in this manner, why is it there?
>>>
>>>yes, you can turn on automation and record your moves, but why not do
>>>precision snapshots, and why not put strategic eq in specific places where
>>>it is needed, maybe behind a d s bus to help the d s processing.
>>>
>>>And the ability to move it anywhere in the chain. Bet you never thought of
>>>that, you just told me it was a wrong thing to do.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: can't remember stating anything like that.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Well, tell it to cakewalk sonar, they invented it, and it's
>>>even mentioned in the help that the inspector pane is a useful thing, even
>>>sighted people do things this way buddy.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: yes, we all know that.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: so you loose 2 bands of eq, but you don't really because you
>>>can always open up the plug-in, or use another bus, how ever suits you
>>> best.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: and that's my point. At no point did you state that you can
>>>still access all 6 bands of the track/bus EQ in the track inspector. If
>>> you
>>>had then, I wouldn't have posted anything on this as there would have been
>>>no point.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: So talk about miss-leading people, my way of doing things is
>>>accessible to all screen readers too, and hnot just your precious hsc
>>> files,
>>>which don't work some of the time anyway, and yes, they have errors in
>>> them
>>>too.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: all software has bugs /errors. There will be a massive
>>> update
>>>for all free HSC sets coming out very shortly indeed which, should
>>> hopefully
>>>address any current issues. Those particular sets shall remain free.
>>>Talking of which, Chris, got anything HSC or otherwise that you would
>>> "like
>>>to contribute to the cause?"
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: So just admit, you can't stand any competition, and you have
>>> it
>>>easy, because your little sighted wife shows you everything going on on
>>> the
>>>screen,
>>>
>>>Phil replied: I am not about to make any disparaging comments about
>>> anyone's
>>>family members as that's way below the belt. I will say this though, any
>>>sighted help that I do have is extremely limited and I too have to spend a
>>>lot of time, coaming the screen for buttons etc as you do.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: I don't begrudge you that, but I bet you couldn't get as far
>>>without your built in eyes as some of us have by ourselves.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: wild speculation on you're part. The fact is that we would
>>>all get a lot further with all of this stuff with sighted help.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Not that that's a big deal, but it's worth mentioning when
>>> you
>>>feel it necessary to pull others down to make yourself look better.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: well it's obviously a big deal to you. Wasn't me who
>>>mentioned it.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: I think that's even been said to you on list by someone, even
>>>recently, it might have been by the same friendly humble non-offensive
>>>cubass user
>>>
>>>I have never but lifted you up and even encouraged people to use you for
>>>tutoring when I couldn't do it,k or even if i thought you might be better
>>> at
>>>something, for instance, with hsc, you are undisputedly the king.
>>>
>>>But you are so insecure, you have to slam me publically, and can not pay
>>>equal respect.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: as you well know, I have posted publicaly before about how
>>>much respect I have for you.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Well, not supprisingly when the going got tough you couldn't
>>>even stand up for your own faith, choosing to be politically correct
>>> instead
>>>of just correct.
>>>
>>>Most on here won't know what I'm talking about, but you sure will Philly
>>>boy.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: I am not about to defend my faith here as 1, it's not the
>>>place and 2, people who really know me, know exactly where I stand on that
>>>so, no need to defend anything.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: So whether I get kicked off her for calling you out or now,
>>> I'm
>>>not putting up with it anymore,\ if you think I'm not right, and really
>>> not
>>>right, yes, i can accept correction, and I'll be the first to say, hey, my
>>>bad, I said something wrong.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: as I stated before, you didn't cover the fact that you can
>>>access all 6 bannds in the track/bus EQ from within the track inspector.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: But this was just plane lame, and just flinging a pile of
>>> crap
>>>there was nothing technically wrong in what I stated.
>>>
>>>Because setting your options to open a plug-in and or manually insertintg
>>> it
>>>amounts to just about the same thing, in the inspector pane you get 4 and
>>> in
>>>the plug-in you get 6, and that was my point.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: again you miss stated the facts. You can access all 6 bands
>>>of the track/bus EQ in the track inspector which you did not state. Plus,
>>>you can switch the Track/Bus EQ from pree to post in the track inspector
>>>which, could be another good reason for using that over inserting a
>>> separate
>>>EQ such as the Sonitus EQ.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: So in an edited version of my little brother Damon's famous
>>> nhb
>>>radio salutation, f you, f you, and f you again.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: That was edited? Seriously though, it's possible to bhe
>>>eliquent without having to stoop to using the F word. May you have a
>>>blessed day.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote: Thank you for the in put of your giant brain.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: It's the same size as everyone elses brain.
>>>
>>>Chris wrote; No body knows as much as the great mighty Muure.
>>>
>>>Phil replied: why thank you! Seriously though, I sure don't know
>>>everything. Every day's a school day and if I don't know something then,
>>> I
>>>will be up front and say that.
>>>
>>>
>>>Regards, Phil Muir
>>>Accessibility Training
>>>Telephone: US (615) 713-2021
>>>UK +44-1747-821-794
>>>Mobile: UK +44-7968-136-246
>>>E-mail:
>>>[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
>>>URL:
>>>http://www.accessibilitytraining.co.uk/
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
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>>>
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>>>[email protected]
>>>http://jsonar.org/mailman/listinfo/jsonar_jsonar.org
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
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>>
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>
>
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