Linux-Advocacy Digest #52, Volume #30 Sun, 5 Nov 00 08:13:05 EST
Contents:
Re: Microsoft Speaks German! (2:1)
Re: I think I'm in love..... (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Linux growth rate explosion! (2:1)
Re: 2.4 Kernel Delays. (2:1)
Re: Linux and Mac instead of Windows. ("Erik Funkenbusch")
Re: Linux growth rate explosion! ("Simon Cooke")
Re: Chad Meyers: Blatent liar (2:1)
Re: Why Linux is great ("James")
Re: Linux growth rate explosion! ("John Hughes")
Re: history of term "software engineering" ("Daniel P. B. Smith")
Re: Linux growth rate explosion! (Artur Biesiadowski)
Re: More Certification (Matthias Warkus)
Re: Linux and Mac instead of Windows. (mlw)
Re: Why Linux is great ("James")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft Speaks German!
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 12:03:17 +0000
Chad Mulligan wrote:
>
> 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Chad Myers wrote:
> > >
> > > "Ilja Booij" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> <trimmed, try it sometime>
> > > > >
> > > > > Is that a good thing?
> > > > >
> > > > > Juding by how the Europe economy is doing, I'd say no. They could
> learn
> > > > > a few thousand things from the U.S.
> > > > I'm sorry, I'm not seeing a bad economy where i live. in fact, the
> > > > economy is growing quite rapidly. maybe not growing as fast as in the
> us,
> > > > but i we talk quality of life i don't see a big difference.
> > > > i'd rather have 6 weeks of free time a year, than earn more and and
> get
> > > > just 2 or 3 weeks of!
> > >
> > > The euro is way down.
> > >
> > > It's because we take 2-3 weeks off that you guys can take 6.
> >
> > Xenophobic bullshit.
> >
>
> Actually he's accruate on that score.
You guys taking 2-3 weeks off doesn't allow us to take off 6. That would
imply that the US supports europe for those intervening 3 weeks, which
it doesn't.
-Ed
> > >
> > > American's aren't lazy, we do all the work so Europeans can be snooty to
> > > us.
> >
> >
> <trimmed>
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Re: I think I'm in love.....
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 10:13:52 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (sfcybear) wrote in <8u330j$orp$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>> No, it is caused either the installation, Linux or Windows 98 SE.
>
>I'm still betting on the loose nut. OR the windows 98! MS software is
>always a pain when it comes to the MBR! Still, It has worked for me with
>several versions of windows (95, 98, NT, and 2000) I just can't seem to
>understand how you of all people have SOOOOOOOO, many problems when the
>people I know who use Linux have so few. Hmmmm,...Could it be you? Naw,
>never!
Well if it is me, I'd like to know how.
I use System Commander as my boot manager. Sometimes it complains when I
try to boot Linux about a missing "signature". So, I boot Linux with a
floppy, use DrakConf to reset LILO/GRUB and point it at /dev/hdb5 (which is
what the installation etc have always pointed at). Next time I try the
Linux option, System Commander is happy and Linux boots. Then later... I'm
back with the "missing signature" message.
So, care to explain how I'm figuring in the above? What exactly am I doing
to break it all?
>Bet it's still that loose nut
I doubt it. What can I do that could fix all fonts to fixed 11pt and refuse
to change?
>> Someone else, definately more helpful than you, and less insulting,
>has
>> pointed out this SIGSEGV is benign.
>
>Ahhh, poor little you, I've seen what you do with help offered.
Really, I'm curious to know what you mean by that? When help is offered
I'll accept it. When someone explains something to me in language that is
reasonable (i.e. doesn't call me names or insult me) then I'll accept that
too.
Replies like yours I respond in kind.
> You are
>not interested in that. If you want help, go to the techincal news
>groups. Infact when I do a deja news lookup, I see NOTHING posted from
>you to a technical news group about a: sound cards or B SIGSEGV's!
>NOTHING! it is clear to me that you are not here for help.
This is the advocacy group, is it not? I do not come here for help. I come
here to point out the weaknesses of Linux that I find.
--
Pete Goodwin
---
Why don't I use Linux?
Waiting for Borland to release Delphi.
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux growth rate explosion!
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 12:07:45 +0000
> > My list includes tools like Access. And a free web server that kicks ass
> >
> > khttpd is free. It seems to slaughter everything in sight.
>
> Never heard of it. No stats either.
khttpd aka Tux.
>
> >
> > > with dynamic content and even beats Apache with static content delivery.
> And
> > > many many other great things about Win2K.
> >
> > What has Access got to do with a web server.
>
> Access databases are used as to serve up dynamic content on IIS.
Databases are used for big websites. Access is not a big database.
Therefore it's fairly silly to use Access in this context.
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: 2.4 Kernel Delays.
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 12:16:33 +0000
> > > And by then it was, and everyone trying to use NT still had farms of
> > > dozens of machines behind load balancers hoping that a few would
> > > keep working.
> >
> > Are you suggesting the companies below only have one machine and don't use
> > load balancers?
>
> I'm suggesting that they don't have dozens of spares expecting them
> to be down.
>
> > > Do you consider google, deja, or sourceforge to be
> > > real servers?
> >
> > Sort of. There isn't much dynamic content involved. Just a lot of text
> > searching. No transactions.
>
> What part of 'dynamic' don't you understand?
>
ROFL!!
I don't get it. How is a search engine not dynamic?
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux and Mac instead of Windows.
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 04:27:38 -0600
"mlw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> So, where does Windows fit in? It (in any of its incarnations) is not as
> stable as Linux, and not as easy to use as the Mac, so what's the point?
If all factors were equal, I wouldn't be using Windows. I'd be using BeOS
or perhaps MacOS X (though I haven't used it enough to know for sure).
However, not all factors are equal. The applications and developer support
is what keeps me on Windows as both a user and developer. There are lots of
things about the Windows OS I don't like as a developer that I think others
have gotten right. However, most of these issues are minor frustrations
rather than big deals. It's not enough for me to go elsewhere, especially
since the two other major OS's are worse in many of those same aspects.
MacOS 9- is a pain in the ass to develop on, and Apples developer support
really bites compared to the MSDN. I also don't like the current MacOS's
interface. It's way too simplistic for my tastes.
Linux suffers from the too many cooks syndrome. No consistency between
environments or non environment-bundled applications. All kinds of wildly
different API's with totally diferent semantics. Very poor developer
support.
------------------------------
From: "Simon Cooke" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux growth rate explosion!
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 10:27:44 GMT
"Goldhammer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:TN4N5.36070$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >No; it's not designed for server applications.
>
> Then why is Schuck reccommending a migration path from
> Access to MS SQL server?
Because it's damn easy to do? Because Access is designed to migrate to SQL
Server? Step 1: Use MSDE as the backend, Access as the front-end. When
ready, go to Step 2: Use SQL Server as the backend.
[a lot of crap snipped]
> Who cares? I can get standards-compliant SQL for free under
> BSD, Unix, or Linux. Why do I need to bother with MS's
> bastardization?
Then use that then.
Simon
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Chad Meyers: Blatent liar
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 12:31:46 +0000
> A security bug in wu-ftpd can permit remote users, even without
> an account, to gain root access.
>
> http://www.redhat.com/support/errata/RHSA-2000-039-02.html
Long since fixed. So what? There have been serious bugs in ftp servers
for win.
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: "James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why Linux is great
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 12:49:14 +0200
Bob, a download manager is a tool that :
a) automates / schedules;
b) optimises;
c) assures
downloads.
GetRight (http://www.getright.com/) does all this and much more. For
example, you can schedule a download list after hours, segment files to
increase download speed, automatically resume if necessary. And even go
offline afterwards, or power down the PC. Sounds nice, doesn't it? :-)
James
"Bob Hauck" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Sat, 4 Nov 2000 22:26:37 +0200, James <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >Use a download manager like GetRight 4.3. Unfortunately there is no
Linux
> >equivalent. :-(
>
> WTF is a "download manager"? Is that anything like doing this:
>
> at 4:15am
> at> wget ftp://somewhere/some-file
> at> wget ftp://somewhere-else/some-file
> at> ^D
>
>
> --
> -| Bob Hauck
> -| To Whom You Are Speaking
> -| http://www.haucks.org/
------------------------------
From: "John Hughes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux growth rate explosion!
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 11:31:54 -0000
"Roger Lindsj|" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8u13lj$7nv$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >John Hughes wrote:
> >>
> >> "2:1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> <snip>
> >> >
> >> > And you seem incapable of grasping that anyone would want more then
MS
> >> > Office.
> >> >
> >> > Fool
> >> >
> >> > -Ed
> >> >
> >>
> >> So, whats better than MS Office? Show me it and I might want it.
> >
> >Star Office. And it's only $40.
>
> Isn't it free if you want to download it? I think it is even open source
now.
>
'something better' is not Star Office.
Its not open source when you have to sign a Sun agreement....is it?
------------------------------
From: "Daniel P. B. Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.arch,comp.os.netware.misc
Subject: Re: history of term "software engineering"
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 11:53:29 GMT
In article <8thf27$g43$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jonathan Thornburg) wrote:
> In article <nVQK5.329$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Caveman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Software engineering is an established science which has existed
> for over two decades, [[...]]
Wandering down memory lane...
To the best of my very hazy recollection, "computer science" originated
before "software engineering."
The term "computer science" was certainly unknown when I was at MIT,
1962-66. The University of Wisconsin Computer Science Department was
created sometime when I was there, 1966-1975. I think it was circa
1969-1970, and UW was at the leading edge but not the bleeding edge of
the wave. So, "computer science" = late sixties.
I am pretty sure that the phrase "structured programming" became popular
BEFORE the phrase "software engineering" did.
"Structured programming" was sweeping the nation around the end of the
time I was at Wisconsin, i.e. the mid-seventies.
By the time I joined Wang Labs in 1989, "software engineering" was such
a common term that it was the customary job title for software cobblers,
software artisans, software craftsmen, software hackers, and software
artists--when working for large corporations. The top of the
"individual contributor" career ladder at Wang was, however, "software
architect," a term which was either originated or popularized by Charles
Simonyi of PARC, then Microsoft.
Anyway I'd guess the term became widespread sometime between 1975 and
1985.
--
Daniel P. B. Smith
Current email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"Lifetime forwarding" address: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Visit alt.books.jack-london!
------------------------------
From: Artur Biesiadowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux growth rate explosion!
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 12:50:31 +0100
John Hughes wrote:
> 'something better' is not Star Office.
>
> Its not open source when you have to sign a Sun agreement....is it?
It is available under LGPL. No need to sign anything - just download or
checkout source from cvs.
I would not argue that Star Office is better than MS Office. But is is
almost same as good and unless you use some very elaborate functions
(99% of users don't) it is same as good in terms of functionality/user
friendliness. But a lot better in terms of cost. Not to mention that you
can use single solution for multiple platforms (yes, some companies do
have computers other than intel/windows).
Artur
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthias Warkus)
Subject: Re: More Certification
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 11:56:37 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It was the Sun, 5 Nov 2000 01:34:24 +0100...
...and [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> One of the best software engineer's I ever worked with had a degree
> in music!
Music, languages and computer science require similar skills. That's
why most computer scientists are better at spelling and expressing
themselves (in writing) than the average Joe, and lots of them make
music.
mawa
--
( ) Artikel Nr. RFC0793 Netzhemd aus Glasfaser-GeWWW kbps 64,00
Größe: [ ] SSL [ ] HTML [ ] XML
------------------------------
From: mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux and Mac instead of Windows.
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 07:32:14 -0500
Chip Anderson wrote:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mlw) wrote in <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> --snip--
> >So, if you want the hand-holding of an "idiot-box" (Idiot, as in the
> >slang name for indicator lights in a car.) then, I think Mac is the way
> >to go. If you want to do serious work, where things like data integrity
> >and "uptime" are important, then use Linux for FreeBSD.
> >
> >So, where does Windows fit in? It (in any of its incarnations) is not as
> >stable as Linux, and not as easy to use as the Mac, so what's the point?
> >
> >
>
> A much broader application base.
This is an artifact, not a strategy.
>
> Chip
--
http://www.mohawksoft.com
------------------------------
From: "James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why Linux is great
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 14:34:43 +0200
"Chad Mulligan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:xV7N5.20904$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > James wrote:
> > >
> > > ... and is almost entirely useless as a corporate desktop.
> > >
> > > I :
> > >
> > > 1. Cannot scan images from my USB scanner.
> >
> > It works with a lot of scanner, perhaps not yours.
> >
> > > 2. Cannot print to my USB printer.
> >
> > I have never seen a USB printer. FYI it works on my HP just fine.
> >
>
> I see a trend here. Could it be that he just has a problem with USB.
No, it works perfectly with Win2k and even crappy WinMe/9x.
BTW the devices are :
a) Epson Perfection 610 USB
b) Epson Stylus Colour 900 (also has a parallel port - which is slower than
USB)
Mandrake 7.1 does not configure these devices - but I can probably get these
working if I go on a Linux sabbatical - but then again it is just too much
effort. :-)
>
> > > 3. Cannot read my GroupWise mail.
> >
> > What is GroupWise mail, never heard of it.
> >
>
> Novell's Group ware.
>
> > > 4. Cannot reliably share MS Office docs (what most companies use)
with
> my
> > > colleagues.
> >
> > I don't have any problem.
> >
>
> You may not, Mark, but a large percentage of businesses have Terabytes of
> legacy documents that they cannot afford to abandon or translate.
>
> > > 5. Cannot run SAP* for staff info.
> > What is SAP?
> >
>
> Enterprise level cost accounting.
>
> > > 6. Cannot document/read business processes (Visio Pro).
> > We usually print to PDF graphics files because not everyone will have
> > Visio (or what ever) installed. (This means Windows machines too)
> >
>
> What would you recommend an enduser use to draw a flow chart. This user
> isn't a programmer or techie.
>
> > > 7. Cannot run BusinessObjects to access company warehouse.
> >
> > What are "BusinessObjects" ?
> >
> > > 8. Etc, etc, ....
> >
> > You have named cases where it is clear that your IS department chose
> > avenues that were Windows-Only. For most cases, this is not true.
> >
> > >
> > > This is apart from the fact that almost everyone I know would prefer
the
> > > Win2k interface to that of Linux (Gnome or KDE). In fact most users
> don't
> > > give a damn about the OS they are using - they just want to get the
job
> > > done. That is why our company is migrating all desktops (some 25000+
to
> > > Win2k).
> >
> > I know of no one that lines the UI of NT better than Gnome.
> >
> > >
> > > Basically Linux is USELESS as a corporate desktop.
> >
> > I disagree completely.
> >
> > >
> > > James
> > >
> > > *Open to correction here.
> > >
> > > "mlw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > >
> > > > Where else can you find a system, which can be downloaded for free,
or
> > > > any price for that matter, that has:
> > > >
> > > > Object Relation SQL database.
> > > > C/C++ compiler
> > > > Programming editors
> > > > Office Packages
> > > > Debuggers
> > > > Network file servers
> > > > Printer Servers
> > > > Entire Internet service package
> > > > remote administration tools
> > > > e-mail servers/clients
> > > > Choice of desktops
> > > > Various programming languages besides C/C++
> > > > Calendar programs
> > > > CDR tools
> > > >
> > > > The list continues, 100s of utilities and tools, most (if not all)
of
> > > > what anyone would want to do with a computer.
> > > >
> > > > There is no reason to buy Windows or NT!
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > http://www.mohawksoft.com
> >
> > --
> > http://www.mohawksoft.com
>
>
------------------------------
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