I thought that's what it did. Well, if it's really as useful as you find it, I guess I'll give it another try. After all, it must be better than dom order to some users or it never would have stuck around. On Oct 29, 2012, at 12:38 AM, "Christopher-Mark Gilland" <clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> All it does is groups certain things together so you more quickly can jump > over them. Plus, it will thus cluster more things into one item, thus making > it easy to read in bigger chunks. Basically, then within a group of things, > if you want to then click a link within a group, or get to a form within a > group etc. then you interact with that group within the ntml content. > > HTH. > > Thank you kindly, > > Christopher-Mark Gilland. > Founder of CLG Productions > > Blog: > http://www.clgproductions.org > > Podcast: > http://clgproductions.podhoster.com > > E-mail: > ch...@clgproductions.com > > IMessage/Facetime: > theblindmusic...@att.net > > Windows Live Messenger: > ch...@blindperspectives.net > > Twitter: > @chris28210 > > Facebook: > http://www.facebook.com/christopher.gilland > > Skype: > twinklesfriend2007 > > Send me a fax from any standard fax machine: > 704-697-2069 > > Google Voice: (Please use sparingly): > 980-272-8570 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Alex Hall > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2012 10:52 PM > Subject: grouping web items (was mastering the mac) > > Vo-u is a handy feature. I guess my main sticking point is the lack of a flat > representation, so that absolutely every element has to be separated and read > individually, with accompanying pauses in speech even with sounds muted. I > tried grouping once, but it was much more awkward on forums than dom order so > I turned it off. Perhaps I don't really understand how it works? Could you > explain that further? > On Oct 28, 2012, at 10:46 PM, "Christopher-Mark Gilland" > <clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> It might just be an opinion thing, but between the rotor, quick navigation >> by headings, tables, etc. Plus the fact I turned on Group navigation instead >> of dom order, then the item chooser, plus vo+F, vo+G, and Vo+Shift G, I find >> it is extremely pleasant of an experience. Again, it's just my opinion, I >> never said you had to agree with it. LOL! >> >> Chris. >> >> >> Thank you kindly, >> >> Christopher-Mark Gilland. >> Founder of CLG Productions >> >> Blog: >> http://www.clgproductions.org >> >> Podcast: >> http://clgproductions.podhoster.com >> >> E-mail: >> ch...@clgproductions.com >> >> IMessage/Facetime: >> theblindmusic...@att.net >> >> Windows Live Messenger: >> ch...@blindperspectives.net >> >> Twitter: >> @chris28210 >> >> Facebook: >> http://www.facebook.com/christopher.gilland >> >> Skype: >> twinklesfriend2007 >> >> Send me a fax from any standard fax machine: >> 704-697-2069 >> >> Google Voice: (Please use sparingly): >> 980-272-8570 >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Alex Hall >> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2012 10:14 PM >> Subject: Re: mastering the mac >> >> I'm curious: why do you think windows is clunky compared to the mac? I'm not >> trying to start anything, I just want to understand and see if there's some >> fundamental thing I'm missing. For instance, when I go to the audiogames.net >> forums, I have to vo-right a bunch of times through users' information, On >> Windows I have to arrow less, since some of that information is on one line. >> However, because it is mostly links, the mac has to separate it all out, >> regardless of visual layout. The best browsing experience I have ever had is >> NVDA on Firefox with the option to use page layout enabled. In this meant >> that links and other controls in text were read along with the text, >> speeding up my browsing, particularly in articles with much of their text >> linking to other websites. It also helped when links were laid out >> horizontally, such as a bar of options above a chunk of text. You could >> still tab to a link, but if you wanted to skip all the links it was the >> matter of a single keypress. On the mac you must press an arrow for every >> link, plus one for any static text between the links such as a vertical bar >> or comma. >> On Oct 28, 2012, at 10:04 PM, "Christopher-Mark Gilland" >> <clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> For the record, I'll say a total 1 80, I think browsing on Windows is the >>> most clunky, worst experience I've ever seen. I'll do it if that happens >>> to be the computer I'm working currently on at the time, but I'd rather not >>> if I could help it. I love y Safari, oh, and let's not forget Google >>> Chrome! >>> >>> Chris. >>> >>> >>> Thank you kindly, >>> >>> Christopher-Mark Gilland. >>> Founder of CLG Productions >>> >>> Blog: >>> http://www.clgproductions.org >>> >>> Podcast: >>> http://clgproductions.podhoster.com >>> >>> E-mail: >>> ch...@clgproductions.com >>> >>> IMessage/Facetime: >>> theblindmusic...@att.net >>> >>> Windows Live Messenger: >>> ch...@blindperspectives.net >>> >>> Twitter: >>> @chris28210 >>> >>> Facebook: >>> http://www.facebook.com/christopher.gilland >>> >>> Skype: >>> twinklesfriend2007 >>> >>> Send me a fax from any standard fax machine: >>> 704-697-2069 >>> >>> Google Voice: (Please use sparingly): >>> 980-272-8570 >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Alex Hall >>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2012 9:41 PM >>> Subject: Re: mastering the mac >>> >>> It's not you, I think the web browsing experience is smoother on windows >>> because screen readers use a flat representation, so they can do things >>> like read text like a document, not stop at links in text, and so on. I >>> prefer web browsing on windows, just not enough to sacrifice everything >>> else the mac does better. I also like the iCloud tabs feature and really >>> easy downloads interface, just not the actual web browsing experience. >>> >>> As to first letter navigation, just go to the vo utility, the commanders >>> category, the quicknav tab, and check the relevant box. Once in a great >>> while it will still fail, but you can use vo-cmd with many keys to move >>> around if that happens. Vo-cmd-h, for instance, moves to the next heading. >>> >>> For edit fields, I find they behave oddly with quicknav on. If that >>> happens, I just turn it off, type my text, and turn it on if I need it. >>> Between the vo-cmd keystrokes and the web rotor (vo-u), though, I don't use >>> quicknav much at all anymore. >>> On Oct 28, 2012, at 9:15 PM, Kliphton <kliph...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>>> Okay, I bought my first mac june 2011, it was actually a fathers day >>>>> present. I went cold turkey for over a month, trying to learn my way >>>>> around the OS, and how it worked. Over 18 months later, I'd say I am >>>>> pretty good, and can even help others. I know how to inter act with >>>>> tables, rename documents, open and close folders and apps, and even a few >>>>> advanced things. My biggest challenge has been safari. I use the item >>>>> chooser, and have the things in the rotor that I like to navigate by. >>>>> But I still find it a little clunky compared to IE. I still have to use >>>>> windows to manage my business, but that's all I use it for, and of course >>>>> to download torrents. But does anyone have any hints or tips to help me >>>>> get over this safari hump? I think my biggest gripe is trying to set up >>>>> first letter navigation, and trying to inter text in to edit fields. >>>>> Other than that, I think I got it. But all suggestions are welcome >>>>> please! >>>>> >>>>> Kliphton Senior >>>>> >>>>> (Twitter&Skype) kliphton72 >>>>> >>>>> (iMessage, facetime&Email) kliph...@gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> (Life Journal) Kliphton.wordpress.com >>>>> >>>>> (Sharrie’s ScratchPad) missie844.wordpress.com >>>>> >>>>> http://facebook.com/kliphandsharrie >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> >>> Have a great day, >>> Alex (msg sent from Mac Mini) >>> mehg...@gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> >> >> >> Have a great day, >> Alex (msg sent from Mac Mini) >> mehg...@gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > > > Have a great day, > Alex (msg sent from Mac Mini) > mehg...@gmail.com > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. Have a great day, Alex (msg sent from Mac Mini) mehg...@gmail.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
