Mmmkay, this is a little late, but hey - when have I been known to shut
up?
On Sun, 10 Jun 2001, Jay Armstrong wrote:
> After my criticism, subsequent messages from others on the original thread
> ("RE: Oracle deal") also went through fine, but none of them were critical
> of Ironflare. In fact, all of them either told me to shut up (Greg
> Stickley and Hani Suleiman, who described the problem as a "pebble"), were
> complimentary of the deal, and/or tried to change the subject. Seems odd
> to me that not one, single critical comment about the most important
> business deal in Orion Server's history came after mine, unless the thread
> was being censored.
Good thing we've never heard of "paranoia." Oops, now we have.
> I would point out one of Karl's statements in his reply to me: "The purpose
> of the orion-interest has always been to promote the exchange of
> experiences and knowledge between our users, not as a channel to
> communicate with us."
> I interpret the statement above to be a veiled warning that "big brother is
> watching" and not to criticize Ironflare via orion-interest.
Dadgum, there's that paranoia thing again. If you've read the mailing list
archives, you'll see plenty of criticism of Ironflare, most of it
deserved, and none of it censored that I'm aware of. And I've even sent
some of it. As far as Karl's statement... it seems like you've an agenda,
and you're using a National Enquirer-like ability to read between
lines. "Hi, how are you doing" is not "I'M GOING TO KILL YOU!" and
"Orion-interest is a sharing area between users, not a channel to
communicate with us" is not "We hate everything you say that we don't
agree with, and will censor it."
> Don't you also find it odd that Ironflare did not make this announcement?
> Rather, it came from Bryan Young's discovery after trying oc4j. My guess
> is that Ironflare, possibly under orders from Oracle, wanted to keep this
> quiet and is now attempting damage control.
Damage control? Why? What damage, exactly has been caused? Ironflare
hasn't been sold; neither has Orion. The only damage I see is possibly
between a few sets of ears. As far as I can tell, this is ALL good for
Ironflare; people who want real J2EE and want a "real company" backing it
can buy OC4J and get the best of both worlds - support and quality. (Oh
no, what a horrifying thought, eh?) and people who want to stick with
"pure Orion" (i.e., those of us who don't want to run Oracle, or don't
need Oracle's support layer) can stick with what we have.
What horror.
> If it's a list problem, okay, but how can we possibly know? Time will
> tell, though it could also be that open discussions are not and have never
> been allowed in this "interest" group.
Man, you ARE paranoid.
> Jay
>
> At 04:37 PM 6/9/01 -0700, you wrote:
> >J,
> >
> >There have been lags and blackholes on the list last week. I suspect this is
> >because the two gents have been in San Francisco in the last week, and have
> >not been unable to keep up the maintenance. Sunday and Monday, and some of
> >Tuesday lastweek there were no messages.
> >
> >Its a list problem...don't blame Orion.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >the elephantwalker
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of J Armstrong
> >Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2001 3:50 PM
> >To: Orion-Interest
> >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Subject: Oracle deal gag
> >
> >
> >Just for fun, try bitching about the original issue.
> >I tried twice (two days ago and one day ago) to
> >respond to Karl Avendal's response to me on this
> >thread and it's not showing up.
> >
> >At 12:48 PM 6/9/01 -0700, you wrote:
> >>Haha, I know... Hani just said we should bitch so I
> >did :P
> >>
> >>- Phillip
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>--- elephantwalker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>> Phil,
> >>>
> >>> Orion also supports do's, even though the latest
> >"draft" doesn't include
> >>> do's (an earlier draft had major sections on do's).
> >Phil, this is a moving
> >>> target, and these guys will fix their ejb 2.0.
> >Please log the references
> >>> issue and bidirectional relations problem with
> >bugzilla, they will fix it.
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>>
> >>> the elephantwalker
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>__________________________________________________
> >>Do You Yahoo!?
> >>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail -
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> >>a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
> >>
> >>
> >
> >__________________________________________________
> >Do You Yahoo!?
> >Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35
> >a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
-----------------------------------------------------------
Joseph B. Ottinger [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://adjacency.org/ IT Consultant
