Employers who lack the skills to judge good programmers sometimes fall back on certifications as a ranking mechanism. Therefore, certification can help you get a job, but those are not the sort of organisations that I like to work for.
These days I am slightly embarrassed by my certification (MCSD) and I no longer list it on my resume. On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 3:49 PM, Michael Minutillo < michael.minuti...@gmail.com> wrote: > Well it all really depends on the programmer, the course, the teacher, > etc. > > Whilst at university (CS) I learned about Trees and Hashtables and Lists > and when to use one or the other. I learned boolean algebra and how to > simplify such an expression where appropriate. I learned about reference > types (pointers anyway) and value types and when to use one or the other. > And a whole host more. All of that is stuff you can teach yourself but for > some people actually sitting down and doing it at university helps to get > the knowledge in and ensure you don't have any gaps**. > > Just yesterday I used Isolated Storage in a Winforms app I am working on. I > did not know that such a thing existed before studying for an MS Cert (that > I did not sit for but that's devestating to my case) and would have been > messing around trying to write text into a file in a temp folder or > something. Before that I worked on an MVC2 app which is a framework I taught > myself with no coursework whatsoever. > > When two programmers come to an interview and one has sit an exam (or has a > uni degree) and the other doesn't then I expect the one that has to have a > broader knowledge base of the topic area (but not necessarily a deeper one). > I still wouldn't exclude someone from an interview process because they > didn't have an MS Cert or Uni degree. It all depends on what you need when > you're hiring I guess. > > ** Imagine knowing about the collections stuff in .NET 1.1 but never having > learned the generic collections in .NET 2.0. *shudder* > > > On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 1:33 PM, David Walker < > david.wal...@planbonline.com> wrote: > >> I agree - several of our best programmers have never been to University at >> all. You have to wonder if three years worth fluff is really any good for a >> career - especially as the lecturers are generally poor teachers who are >> forced to give lectures as part of their tenure... >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com on behalf of Nathan Schultz >> Sent: Thu 11/11/2010 13:03 >> To: ozDotNet >> Subject: Re: [OT] Usefulness of Microsoft Certifications >> >> I know one IT manager who actually likes employing programmers with >> degrees >> outside of CS. People with vastly different backgrounds tend to think >> about >> problems differently. I remember reading Boeing does the same when they >> develop their flight-systems, which are not only are quadruple-backed up, >> but are written by totally different teams with different backgrounds, as >> to >> help minimize a bug being in the same place. >> >> There is also one programmer at work without a tertiary degree but is >> passionate about it and is one of the best guys here. >> >> That said, I still believe getting a CS degree (at the very least) is >> worthwhile. >> >> >> >> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 12:51 PM, David Connors <da...@codify.com> wrote: >> >> > On 11 November 2010 14:26, David Walker <david.wal...@planbonline.com >> >wrote: >> > >> >> Yeah fair enough. We all have CS degrees now - is it worth extending >> these >> >> to a Software Engineering degree/masters degree? >> > >> > >> > I think it depends on the institution and course. When I was at uni I >> did a >> > bachelor of information technology with a major in SE and minor in AI. >> I >> > think all the degrees are pretty well rounded these days with soft >> systems >> > methodology type stuff rather than just 100% dry comp sci. >> > >> > >> >> Does any education provider offer something like this? My CS course >> spent >> >> alot of time dealing with topics which honestly I have never used, and >> will >> >> never use - PRNG's, assembly etc... >> >> >> > >> > The particular language programming task or language isn't really the >> issue >> > - it is all the foundation knowledge and theory you get in the process. >> That >> > stuff is good for a lifetime transcends language/runtime/programming >> > problem. >> > >> > -- >> > *David Connors* | da...@codify.com | www.codify.com >> > Software Engineer >> > Codify Pty Ltd >> > Phone: +61 (7) 3210 6268 | Facsimile: +61 (7) 3210 6269 | Mobile: +61 >> 417 >> > 189 363 >> > V-Card: https://www.codify.com/cards/davidconnors >> > Address Info: https://www.codify.com/contact >> > >> > >> >> > -- Liam McLennan. l...@eclipsewebsolutions.com.au http://www.eclipsewebsolutions.com.au
