good ... I thought you had slipped off the deep end. not to worry ... the whole planet is taking on ISIS ... their demise is certain.
On Wednesday, January 13, 2016 at 11:57:38 AM UTC-6, KeithInTampa wrote: > > Come on Plain Ol'; I said that facetiously! I'm not advocating a > nuclear attack against anyone! > > > > On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 11:35 AM, plainolamerican <[email protected] > <javascript:>> wrote: > >> I see no other option other than nuclear......Let's do it and get it over >> with. >> --- >> says another warmongering zionist. >> take your war with the muzzies back to the middle east, zioboy. >> >> On Tuesday, January 12, 2016 at 5:18:47 PM UTC-6, KeithInTampa wrote: >>> >>> If that's the case, (which I don't believe.....*See *the whole concept >>> of "Hijra" then I see no other option other than nuclear......Let's do it >>> and get it over with. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 4:09 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Why ISIS Cannot Be Negotiated With >>>> --- >>>> because the damage that warmongering US neocons and zionists have done >>>> to the region are too severe for them to forgive. They would rather see >>>> their heads roll than to negotiate. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tuesday, January 12, 2016 at 2:05:53 PM UTC-6, Travis wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.defenseone.com/threats/2016/01/why-isis-cannot-be-negotiated/125020/ >>>>> ? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Why ISIS Cannot Be Negotiated With >>>>> >>>>> January 11, 2016 By H. A. Hellyer >>>>> <http://www.defenseone.com/voices/h-hellyer/11814/> >>>>> >>>>> Jonathan Powell argues that talking to terrorists has brought peace in >>>>> the past. But the Islamic State really is different. >>>>> >>>>> *In his recent Atlantic *piece >>>>> <http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/12/negotiate-with-isis/419157/> >>>>> on >>>>> “What to Do About ISIS >>>>> <http://www.theatlantic.com/special-report/what-to-do-about-isis/>,” >>>>> Jonathan Powell, a former senior British diplomat, posits that >>>>> eventually, >>>>> the West would have to negotiate with the so-called Islamic State. It’s a >>>>> comforting thought, in a way—the suggestion presupposes that ISIS, >>>>> just like many other armed organizations throughout history, is the kind >>>>> of >>>>> group that can eventually be reasoned with, however distasteful its >>>>> enemies >>>>> may find the prospect. Noting numerous examples in which governments have >>>>> talked their way to peace with terrorist organizations, Powell >>>>> acknowledges, “of course people argue that ISIS is completely >>>>> different from anything we have seen before. But people have said that >>>>> about each new armed group since the rise of the IRA in 1919.” >>>>> >>>>> If Powell’s historical analogies worked, the struggle against ISIS >>>>> would be a lot simpler. Unfortunately, the analysis underappreciates how >>>>> direly different ISIS actually is. The armed groups that Powell >>>>> describes as having accepted negotiated settlements were fundamentally >>>>> nationalist organizations—even where the group or “nation” on whose >>>>> behalf >>>>> they fought was sometimes defined partly in terms of religious >>>>> identity—with fundamentally political and pragmatic aims. ISIS is >>>>> instead a radical supra-nationalist group based on a deeply perverted >>>>> interpretation of Sunni Islam, and it has hugely maximalist goals. >>>>> >>>>> Powell’s key example is the Irish Republican Army, which was a >>>>> Catholic organization insofar as it used Catholic identity for political >>>>> ends, cultivating a sense of Irish Catholic nationalism to fight for the >>>>> ejection of the British from Northern Ireland and for political union >>>>> with >>>>> their Catholic brethren to the south. But the IRA was not trying to >>>>> conquer the whole of the British Isles for Catholicism, nor to hasten the >>>>> return of the Christian messiah and the end of the world. Powell, who was >>>>> the chief British negotiator in Northern Ireland when the Good Friday >>>>> Accords helped bring an end to decades of violence in the country, notes >>>>> that “when we sat down with the Republicans … we found that there were a >>>>> series of legitimate subjects they wanted to discuss—from power-sharing >>>>> between Catholics and Protestants to the protection of human rights.” >>>>> >>>>> ISIS, by contrast, is not fundamentally nationalist in this way, as >>>>> Powell implies in his emphasis on the group’s appeals to Sunni identity, >>>>> whether in Syria or Iraq. Rather, even while individual paths to joining >>>>> ISIS may vary tremendously, and no doubt do in some cases rest on >>>>> nationalist Sunni grievances, the leadership of the group has been quite >>>>> clear about its genuinely held aims, which include the complete >>>>> domination >>>>> of Syria, Iraq, and locations far beyond. >>>>> >>>>> It’s not the presence of religious identity as such that makes ISIS >>>>> different. As Powell points out, there have been a number of militant >>>>> groups in history that have used religion for political goals and were >>>>> still susceptible to negotiated peace. The Irish Republican Army was one >>>>> such example, as were various Muslim groups, including the Moro Islamic >>>>> Liberation Front in the Philippines, which Powell points to as proving >>>>> that >>>>> governments have “made peace with Islamic [sic] guerrillas before … so it >>>>> is not impossible to do.” Religion, or even strong ideology, as in the >>>>> case >>>>> of the FMLN in El Salvador, does not make negotiation impossible. >>>>> Indeed, many, if not most, of the rebel groups currently fighting Bashar >>>>> al-Assad’s repugnant and brutal regime in Syria are motivated by >>>>> religious >>>>> precepts, and instrumentalize religion for political ends. Those groups >>>>> can >>>>> and should be negotiated with, and in some cases empowered against Assad >>>>> and ISIS, even while their interlocutors must continuously >>>>> interrogate any faults, flaws, or failings they may have. >>>>> >>>>> <a href=" >>>>> http://ad.doubleclick.net/N617/jump/defenseone.com/section_threats;pos=defenseone-instream;sz=600x300;"; >>>>> >>>>> title="">< img alt="" src=" >>>>> http://ad.doubleclick.net/N617/ad/defenseone.com/section_threats;pos=defenseone-instream;sz=600x300;tile=4;"/>< >>>>> >>>>> /a> >>>>> >>>>> <a href=" >>>>> http://ad.doubleclick.net/N617/jump/defenseone.com/section_threats;pos=contextual-large-rectangle-tablet;sz=700x350;"; >>>>> >>>>> title="">< img alt="" src=" >>>>> http://ad.doubleclick.net/N617/ad/defenseone.com/section_threats;pos=contextual-large-rectangle-tablet;sz=700x350;tile=5;"/>< >>>>> >>>>> /a> >>>>> >>>>> <a href=" >>>>> http://ad.doubleclick.net/N617/jump/defenseone.com/section_threats;pos=contextual-large-rectangle-mobile;sz=300x150;"; >>>>> >>>>> title="">< img alt="" src=" >>>>> http://ad.doubleclick.net/N617/ad/defenseone.com/section_threats;pos=contextual-large-rectangle-mobile;sz=300x150;tile=6;"/>< >>>>> >>>>> /a> >>>>> >>>>> But these other groups, from Ireland to the Philippines to Syria, >>>>> fought or are fighting for limited political goals, within a defined >>>>> geographic space—whether those goals were Catholic rights in Northern >>>>> Ireland, Moro autonomy in the Philippines, or the reformation or end of >>>>> the >>>>> Assad regime in Syria. ISIS, however, is not primarily a Sunni Arab >>>>> uprising aimed at protecting the civil or political rights of Sunni >>>>> Muslims >>>>> in Syria or Iraq. ISIS is an outgrowth of a broader uprising. But it >>>>> is more than that. >>>>> >>>>> This is evident, for example, in the context of the Syrian Civil War, >>>>> where ISIS is one of the major combatants, but is correctly not >>>>> invited to international negotiations >>>>> <http://www.politico.com/story/2016/01/iran-saudi-arabia-us-syria-217318> >>>>> aimed >>>>> at resolving the conflict. On that battlefield, and in contrast to other >>>>> groups there, ISIS is not just an insurgency working for a >>>>> specifically Syrian political cause. Its has regional and global >>>>> ambitions >>>>> that go far beyond defeating Assad’s army. And unlike the Kurds, whose >>>>> own >>>>> regional ambitions extend only to the lands Kurds have historically >>>>> occupied, ISIS specifically rejects territorial limits to its power: >>>>> Its very slogan >>>>> <http://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/menasource/is-isis-still-remaining-and-expanding> >>>>> is >>>>> “remaining and expanding.” >>>>> >>>>> The IRA was not trying to conquer the whole of the British Isles for >>>>> Catholicism, nor to hasten the return of the Christian messiah and the >>>>> end >>>>> of the world. >>>>> >>>>> An insurgency can end through negotiation and the satisfaction of >>>>> certain, often predictable, political aims, such as the withdrawal of >>>>> foreign military forces, or the granting of autonomy. But ISIS does >>>>> not demand the withdrawal of foreign military forces—quite the contrary, >>>>> it >>>>> has expressed the wish to draw foreign armies into its territory >>>>> <http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/>, >>>>> >>>>> and to export its military force beyond Syria and Iraq. It does not call >>>>> for the simple granting of autonomy to its members and supporters in >>>>> Syria >>>>> and Iraq—it works to end the autonomy of others in both places, and far >>>>> beyond, not least through ethnic cleansing and the worldwide export of >>>>> wanton violence. If ISIS were willing to be satisfied by, say, a >>>>> joint Sunni Arab zone in Syria and Iraq, governed under a perverted form >>>>> of >>>>> Islamic law, then one could talk about the possibility, if not the >>>>> laudability, of negotiation. But the point of ISIS is precisely that >>>>> it cannot be satisfied without forcibly changing the very contours of the >>>>> current international order. >>>>> >>>>> Powell suggests that “even if some of the hardline leaders of ISIS … >>>>> want nothing less than their full demands (including ushering in the >>>>> apocalypse), other more moderate leaders will, under military pressure, >>>>> be >>>>> prepared to settle for more modest gains.” Negotiations should, in his >>>>> view, “strengthen those moderates’ positions in ISIS’s internal >>>>> discussions.” Indeed, it is possible to “peel away” ISIS members, as >>>>> evidenced by the number of occasions on which ISIS recruits have >>>>> defected <http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-28269596> after >>>>> realizing that the group isn’t all it is cracked up to be. But those >>>>> “moderate” former members are essentially irrelevant to the group (unless >>>>> of course they’re targeted for execution); they are not about to >>>>> influence >>>>> discussions within ISIS, much less take it over. These defections >>>>> have in no way pushed the group toward being more palatable to >>>>> international norms—in fact ISIS’s continued ability to recruit >>>>> depends in part on the leadership’s very refusal to accept “nothing less >>>>> than their full demands.” If ISIS remains true to its principles, >>>>> that’s also the reason the world can accept nothing less than the group’s >>>>> full defeat. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> __._,_.___ >>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>> Posted by: "Beowulf" <[email protected]> >>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Visit Your Group >>>>> <https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/grendelreport/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJmazlyODZsBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzIwMTk0ODA2BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMyMzY2NwRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzE0NTI2MjIwMDI-> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> - New Members >>>>> >>>>> <https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/grendelreport/members/all;_ylc=X3oDMTJnbXZjcTI0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzIwMTk0ODA2BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMyMzY2NwRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2bWJycwRzdGltZQMxNDUyNjIyMDAy> >>>>> >>>>> 1 >>>>> >>>>> [image: Yahoo! 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