For the Radian Page 59 of the operators manual ( it’s a different set of environmental specifications than the install manual or data sheets) 2000m max altitude.
Jay Peltz power. > On Apr 16, 2019, at 12:11 PM, <ch...@oasismontana.com > <ch...@oasismontana.com> wrote: > > Let’s see it in writing, in the manuals included with the components and in > the online, downloadable manuals. Clarity is of the essence! > > Chris Daum > Oasis Montana Inc. > 406-777-4309 or 4321 > 406-777-4309 fax > www.oasismontana.com > > > > From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf Of > Lones Tuss > Sent: Friday, April 12, 2019 1:14 PM > To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> > Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] High altitude off-grid systems > > Hello All > Outback’s Product Warranty is not based or negated by the altitude of the > installation. Altitude ratings ensure full spec operation of the equipment > up to the stated elevation . As noted in several posts due to thinner air > cooling of equipment can be affected. Additional cooling may be required and > or additional products to achieve the necessary load requirements. > > > > From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf Of > jerrysgarage01 > Sent: Friday, April 12, 2019 11:26 AM > To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> > Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] High altitude off-grid systems > > Wrenches > Here is the math, well the answer at sea level your body has 14.70 PSI > exerted on it, at 10,000 feet you only have 10.163 PSI, reduced air pressure, > reduced cooling or heating ability adjusted for standard sea level temp or > just over 69%. > I have done work in Hawaii on the big island up at the summit, it can be warm > and very thin air, without air to cool no inverter will perform very well. I > have some SMA, FX and Raidians in warm high altitude locations and added > extra cooling to compensate for the lack of air. You will hear the cooling > fans spinning faster, moving less air at higher altitudes. > SMA sunny island does have a 9k plus operating altitude but de-rates at less > the 7k. > Jerry > PV inspector > > > > Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > > -------- Original message -------- > From: Jay Pozner <j...@nunatakenergy.com> > Date: 4/12/19 10:06 AM (GMT-08:00) > To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> > Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] High altitude off-grid systems > > > > We do a fair amount of systems at "altitude". Recently we had an issue with > a Radian system at about 10,000'. An 8048 inverter screaming (fans running > hard) with just 2000 watts of load. I hounded tech support for two years, > and even after switching power modules, etc in the end the techs claim a > fairly substantial deration (that I can't quote right now) of inverter > performance because of cooling issues. We ultimately added another inverter > to the system at the end of last summer. I hope this season we will see a > better result. It makes sense, given the difference in air density, but I > do scratch my head and wonder why we haven't seen such issues with the older > FX's, and some of the older legacy systems? > > I also know that the Midnite classic charge controllers seem to run the fans > quite hard as well. I haven't had to replace any of the fans, and the > controllers are performing great, but wonder if that will be an issue in the > future. It would be great if some manufactures would give us a quality, > competitively priced, equipment that is rated for altitude, but I don't think > there are that many options out there as of now > > > . > > Jay Pozner > (970) 642-5554 > www.nunatakenergy.com > NABCEP Certified PV Installer: > Cert.#031310-177 > > > > On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 9:17 AM Steve Higgins <st...@surrette.com> wrote: > Not to add fuel to the fire... and it's been almost 7 years since I've been > with an Inverter manufacturer so here is my .02 cents... So again, I hope > I'm not overstepping the boundaries of the Wrenches list. > > If I remember correctly the main issue with the high altitude installs are > some of the components that are used to build the inverter/controllers aren't > rated to be used at high altitude, one of the main components that have this > issue is the electrolytic capacitors. Of course, the specs vary from > component to component. I've seen some rated as low as 8000 ft to some as > rated as high as 30,000 ft. It really just depends on the part(s) that the > manufacturer used to build the product. > > As you gain altitude the temperatures and the air pressure decrease, as it > was explained to me years ago the problem is with the temperature decrease, > this will affect the capacitance of the capacitor. The colder temps will > reduce the overall capacitance of the capacitor, just like it will with a > battery. > > These caps are generally used to filter noise from circuits, so when these > fail, or the capacitance values fall, you don't get the filtering you need > and this induces noise into your circuitry possibly causing overall failure > or worse, the dreaded intermittent failure. Generally, if the > inverters/controllers are kept on and warm, you won't have too many problems, > it's when they are in extremely cold temperatures is when you will start > having issues. > > Hope this helps! Have a good weekend! > > > > Steve Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager > t +1.902.597.4020 m +1.206.790.5840 > f +1.902.597.8447 e st...@surrette.com > > CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted herein is intended only for the > addressee and may contain confidential, proprietary and/or privileged > material. Any unauthorized review, distribution or other use of or the taking > of any action in reliance upon this information is prohibited. If you receive > this email in error, please contact the sender and delete or destroy this > message and all copies. > > > On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 7:47 AM <ch...@oasismontana.com> wrote: > Folks: > > The issue here ulltimately isn’t whether it works or not, it’s if it’s > WARRANTED. Some purchasers (in this case the USFS) mandate that all > equipment be warranted for high altitudes. And that leaves out several major > suppliers. > > > Chris Daum > Oasis Montana Inc. > > > From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf Of Ray > Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2019 10:55 PM > To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] High altitude off-grid systems > > We've had some systems at 11,000 ft plus, for almost 20 years. We have > mixtures of Outback, Midnite, Blue Sky, and old Trace equipment. Never any > issues with electronics related to altitude. Actually the altitude related > system issues are generator derating, and array output exceeding STC ratings > on really clear cold days due to the thin atmosphere. The third issue would > be installers not being able to catch our breath after jogging back to the > truck. > > Ray Walters > Remote Solar > 303 505-8760 > On 4/11/19 3:39 PM, Dan Fink wrote: > Hi Chris; I am deeply concerned about this as nearly 100% of the systems I > install are at 8000 ft (2500m) or higher. I've never had a problem with > warranty claims to Outback or Schneider up to this time. If this is a "new > thing" I'd really like to know about it, on list or off. > > The alitude de-rate stuff seems to involve dialectric ratings on the > transformer coils, and low air density for cooling. I think that's all in > ANSI. > > > Dan Fink > Director of Solar Education, Greendustrial Training LLC > IREC Certified Instructor™ for: > ~ PV Installation Professional > ~ Small Wind Installer > NABCEP PV Associate > Executive Director, Buckville Energy Consulting > NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers > dan.f...@greendustrialtraining.com > 970-672-4342 > > > > > On Thu, Apr 11, 2019 at 1:28 PM <ch...@oasismontana.com> wrote: > Hi folks: > > I am curious as to how many of you sell/install battery/inverter systems at > high altitudes? Have you had any particular issues with them? Last year we > discovered (in a mostly costly fashion) that Schneider inverters (and also > Outback) are not warranted above 6500 ft. > > Magnum inverters are warranted to 15,000 ft max altitude. > > Best, > > Chris Daum > Oasis Montana Inc. > 406-777-4309 or 4321 > 406-777-4309 fax > www.oasismontana.com > > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org >
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