And this is why I prefer RTD's Doctor Who over the newer series. I think he made greater strides for better, stronger female characters. Given Whedon was his inspiration, it doesn't surprise me.
~ "Where love and magic meet" ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of the Dark Moon series: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/books.html#darkmoon Dare to take The Oath in this erotic fantasy series: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/books.html#the_oath The future of psychic sex - Dawn of the Seraphs (m/m): http://www.adriannebrennan.com/dawnoftheseraphs.html On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 4:06 PM, Martin Baxter <martinbaxt...@gmail.com>wrote: > > > I'll take the latter for $2000, Mr Worf. Even in the 70s, when there were a > spate of shows with strong female leads, the shows still managed to work in > some level of male dominance (to say nothing of blatant sexualization). > > > On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 3:06 PM, Mr. Worf <hellomahog...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> True, there was also Ta'Pau the ruler of Vulcan. >> >> Yea I guess having women equal in power was a little too much to wrap >> their heads around. Still is for some guys. I wonder if the network got a >> large amount of letters and phone calls about the woman being in power or >> were they just being cowards? >> >> On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 9:21 AM, Keith Johnson <keithbjohn...@comcast.net >> > wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> Yeah, remember that Roddenberry was the first person on TV (to my >>> knowledge) to have a woman in a significant command role: Number One, who >>> was the second ranked bridge officer under Captain Pike. People looked to >>> her for advice, she ran the ship and dictated tactics when Pike was >>> kidnapped by the Talosians. But the network balked, and the character was >>> scrapped, the actress recast as Nurse Chapel--not even allowed to be a full >>> doctor. Even the term "Number One" disappeared until Picard resurrected it >>> in TNG. >>> >>> The funny thing? Even with that forward-thinking move in the pilot for >>> Star Trek, sexism was still endemic. In that pilot ep with Pike, he looks at >>> his female yeoman and grouses "I just can't get used to the idea of a woman >>> on the bridge". He then looks at Number One and apologizes to her, the idea >>> being she wasn't really thought of as a "normal" woman. So it was still hard >>> for people in the 60s to conceive that two centuries hence, women would be >>> considered equal to men outside of rare circumstances. >>> >>> I guess that, given the inborn sexism and the censors who couldn't deal >>> with strong women, Trek still gets credit for trying to advance >>> professional, capable women. Though the OS backed off on strong commanders, >>> they did deliver other women who were more than eye candy: there were female >>> officers portrayed as skilled psychiatrists, lawyers, historians, medical >>> researchers, and archaeologists. >>> >>> The one woman who arguably was the highest ranked in OS was the Romulan >>> Commander in "The Enterprise Incident". She commanded a ship, lead a small >>> task force, and the Romulan men obviously followed her orders >>> unquestioningly. Yet, she's then shown becoming "a woman" who loses her mind >>> after Spock macks her, so again, that 60s sexism rears its head. >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Mr. Worf" <hellomahog...@gmail.com> >>> To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >>> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2010 12:49:05 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >>> Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Series That Ended Badly >>> >>> >>> >>> I think that I remember watching a documentary about Rodenberry and how >>> they forced him to change that episode to its final form. >>> >>> On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 8:16 PM, Keith Johnson < >>> keithbjohn...@comcast.net> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I'd rank the Trek series' endings as follows, best to worst: >>>> >>>> * TNG - irritating as hell with another time travel story, but at least >>>> Picard finally let his "hair" down and played poker with the gang >>>> >>>> * DS9 - actually a satisfying ending, but Sisko's abandoning his family >>>> still angers me, so not number one. And note that, will time travel isn't >>>> critical to the story, there is a time travel element with Sisko's newfound >>>> powers >>>> >>>> * Voyager - at least they got back to Earth. But over usage of the Borg, >>>> and another time travel story?! >>>> >>>> * Enterprise - crappy in writing, acting, and execution, a complete >>>> non-story. And like DS9, time travel per se isn't critical, but there is >>>> time shifting since Riker and Troi are telling history story. Crap. >>>> >>>> Again, what the hell is the fascination with time travel from B&B?? >>>> >>>> Oh--the OS doesn't count because it didn't get a planned ending, but the >>>> last aired show sucked. Named "Turnabout Intruder", it's the one where an >>>> old jealous girlfriend of Kirk's literally changes bodies with him and >>>> takes >>>> over as Captain. A sexist show: she did it because women just couldn't be >>>> captains in Starfleet, and the last line was a trip. Of Janice, Kirk says, >>>> "Her life could have been as fulfilling as any woman's, if only...." the >>>> idea being, "if only she'd accepted her limitations as a woman and just >>>> learned to be happy". >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Martin Baxter" <martinbaxt...@gmail.com> >>>> To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com >>>> Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 3:48:57 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >>>> Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Series That Ended Badly >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> The V-Word series was a waste of both space, time and money, Daryle. And >>>> you hit it spot-on, calling "Endgame" the worst expected ending ever. >>>> (Pardon me... The Worst Expected Ending EVER. Deserves capitalization, >>>> that.) The only reason I tune din for it was because I'd caught this >>>> disgusting rumor that Paramount was going to take V-Word to the big screen, >>>> to replace Next Gen as the theater franchise. So I watched, hoping that I >>>> was wrong. >>>> >>>> Boy, was I. >>>> >>>> "We'regonnadiewe'regonnadiewe'regonnaDIEtheBABY'SHEREwe'regonnaDIE -- >>>> hey. We're back home." >>>> >>>> May all involved end in thirst. >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Daryle Lockhart < >>>> dar...@darylelockhart.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Voyager". What a complete waste of time. >>>>> >>>>> If you'll remember, I recently decided towatch the show from the >>>>> beginning at the suggestion of Garrett Wang. I have now watched every >>>>> episode of Voyager. "Year Of Hell" and "Unimatrix Zero" are worth the >>>>> price >>>>> of admission (episodes that remind me remarkably of where the "Lost" >>>>> finale went left, but I digress) . But Endgame was the worst ending of any >>>>> Star Trek show in history -- INCLUDING "Enterprise". >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On May 24, 2010, at 2:06 PM, Keith Johnson wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The talk of "Lost" and the less-than-spectacular ending (no Spoilers!) >>>>> made me think of "The Sopranos", whose ending angered many fans. And that >>>>> made me think of BSG, whose ending angered many fans. BSG made me think of >>>>> "Enterprise", whose ending angered many--get the drift? >>>>> >>>>> So I was thinking of shows that we loved or at least were attached to, >>>>> which ended in less than satisfactory methods. >>>>> "Enterprise" ticked me off by using another time-travel type device, by >>>>> killing Trip, and by inserting Riker and Troi unnecessarily. >>>>> >>>>> What other series can you think of whose endings you anticipated, but >>>>> which disappointed you? I'm talking about shows that actually got an >>>>> ending, >>>>> not those that were canceled and simply stopped airing new eps. This can >>>>> be >>>>> scifi, animation, or any real life drama. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> "If all the world's a stage and we are merely players, who the bloody >>>> hell wrote the script?" -- Charles E Grant >>>> >>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Celebrating 10 years of bringing diversity to perversity! >>> Mahogany at: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mahogany_pleasures_of_darkness/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Celebrating 10 years of bringing diversity to perversity! >> Mahogany at: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mahogany_pleasures_of_darkness/ >> > > > > -- > "If all the world's a stage and we are merely players, who the bloody hell > wrote the script?" -- Charles E Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > >
