[cfaussie] Re: structure notation and queries

[Barry Beattie]

imho it's because queries are structs of arrays, where each struct key
is a column/field and each arrayIndex is the "row" of that struct key.

so it's obj.StructKey[arrayIndex]


this is why it's important that none of the arrays are uneven. they
are all the same length


On Feb 4, 2008 4:22 PM, Kay Smoljak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Hey guys,
>
> Can anyone explain to me "why is it so":
>
> when dynamically referencing a structure or an array, you would do:
> Struct[dynamicIndexVariable].StructKey
>
> Yet when you're dealing with a query, which I always understood to be
> basically the same thing, internally, you have to do:
> Query.ColumnName[dynamicIndexVariable]
>
> I was just working through some code with someone learning CF and the
> first time I got the query syntax the wrong way and it was hard to
> explain why it was that way... it didn't make sense to him or me,
> really.
>
> So is it an inconsistency in the language or is there a logical reason for it?
>
> Cheers,
> K.
>
> --
> Kay Smoljak
> business: www.cleverstarfish.com
> standards: kay.zombiecoder.com
> coldfusion: kay.smoljak.com
> personal: goatlady.wordpress.com
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] ColdFusion IM gateways quick question

[Barry Beattie]

before I disappear down a rabbit hole chasing this shiny thing... (for CF8)

I just wanted to check if this was still current:
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/coldfusion/articles/imgateway_print.html

and see what people were using for the XMPP server (Jive seems to have
been replaced with Openfire 3.4.4 - previously WildFire)

and perhaps ask if there was any "gotcha's" or decent reads (apart
from Matt Woodwards article)

any advice most welcome.

thanx
barry.b

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[cfaussie] clustering, multiple instances and application design

[Barry Beattie]

situation:

in our business, we do partnership deals with other organisations who
we license resources to and then finalise their output on their behalf
on our IT systems. we're looking at providing the tools for our
partners to logon and use to complete the middle part of the process.
There's about 20-30 partners. These "tools" will never be outside our
control (ie not on partners servers) and won't be individually
customised outside some basic settings (no forking of the code)

OK

I'll only have two ColdFusion 8 Enterprise server boxes to do this
(plus separate DB servers), at least to start with.

either

  - I run all the customers out of one instance of the application and
use their OrganisationID to differentiate each partner - sometimes
right down to the individual database row level, all in one db.
 - cluster both boxes and add a hardware load balancer in front of them
 - additional partners means adding another server into the cluster
 - I gain on fail-over but lose on application design.

or

 - I run each partner as a seperate CF8 instance off the same
codebase, forget about the OrganisationID, and use each instance's
CFIDE to point the DSN to the corresponding matching database - one
for each partner
 - don't bother clustering but try and spread the load by grouping customers
 - additional customers means adding another server to put the new customers on
 - I have no fail-over but it's a lot cleaner as far as rolling out
new customers.

any other options?

any suggestions?

many thanks
b

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[cfaussie] Re: clustering, multiple instances and application design

[Barry Beattie]

cool. thanks guys




On Feb 7, 2008 3:19 PM, Dale Fraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> We do almost exactly what you describe for our customers.
>
> Here's how using ColdFusion Standard.
>
> One application source.
> Multiple named instances of that application.
>
> So customer A goes to
> customerA.domain.com
>
> It says, hmm customerA you say, this is application customerA ie,
> application.cfc this.name = 'customerA', application.datasource =
> 'customerA' etc etc
>
> Works like a dream.
>
> PS: The single codebase is a dream, you might be tempted at some point to
> branch, but long term its better to add that feature to your core and have
> it as a configurable option.
>
> Regards
> Dale Fraser
>
> http://learncf.com
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of Barry Beattie
> Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2008 3:15 PM
> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [cfaussie] clustering, multiple instances and application design
>
>
> situation:
>
> in our business, we do partnership deals with other organisations who
> we license resources to and then finalise their output on their behalf
> on our IT systems. we're looking at providing the tools for our
> partners to logon and use to complete the middle part of the process.
> There's about 20-30 partners. These "tools" will never be outside our
> control (ie not on partners servers) and won't be individually
> customised outside some basic settings (no forking of the code)
>
> OK
>
> I'll only have two ColdFusion 8 Enterprise server boxes to do this
> (plus separate DB servers), at least to start with.
>
> either
>
>   - I run all the customers out of one instance of the application and
> use their OrganisationID to differentiate each partner - sometimes
> right down to the individual database row level, all in one db.
>  - cluster both boxes and add a hardware load balancer in front of them
>  - additional partners means adding another server into the cluster
>  - I gain on fail-over but lose on application design.
>
> or
>
>  - I run each partner as a seperate CF8 instance off the same
> codebase, forget about the OrganisationID, and use each instance's
> CFIDE to point the DSN to the corresponding matching database - one
> for each partner
>  - don't bother clustering but try and spread the load by grouping customers
>  - additional customers means adding another server to put the new customers
> on
>  - I have no fail-over but it's a lot cleaner as far as rolling out
> new customers.
>
> any other options?
>
> any suggestions?
>
> many thanks
> b
>
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Announce: First CFUG of the year! ... Tomorrow Night (Brisbane)

[Barry Beattie]

Welcome Back!

yes we're back up and running with lots of CF goodness this year. This
Wednesday!


and to herald in the new year our very own CFUG manager, Darren
Tracey, will show us some of the good (and facinating) development
ideas that his work uses: "Suncorp Iterative Development methodology
(SID)".

Suncorp is a large company with a lot of development where anything
they do has been done with a lot of thought. The development
methodology they use has taken years to perfect and is designed to
build in quality while minimising risk. But don't let Suncorps' size
fool you that this isn't for everyone - even small development houses
(and sole operators) will be able to walk out of Darren's session with
some "best practices" to take back to the boss (and save your hair
loss!)

plus we've got lots of news and give aways so DON'T FORGET TO RSVP!


(6:00pm for a 6:30 start)

RSVP here:
http://qld.cfug.org.au/index.cfm?event=showRSVPForm&meetingID=0BFA15F7-07C2-3A38-A524FB8479EC762C

see you there!

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[cfaussie] Re: OT: SQL Server - preserve single quotes

[Barry Beattie]

OK, I'm guessing that the reiinstall of SQLServer has introduced a
software update with it that has finally corrected  a bug within the
db software (or drivers interface), that has so far gone unnoticed by
letting the old behavior pass.

if you're already using PreserveSingleQuotes(), you'll find that
cfqueryparam makes it look like a hack  in comparison (ie: using
cfqueryparam doesn't need preserveSingleQuotes)

if the code has not changed but the database has, then, what ever has
not been eliminated, however improbable, must be the answer.




On Feb 14, 2008 2:57 PM, AJ Mercer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> no - but that is another world of pain I have to put up with
>
> Like I say, it used to work
>
>
> On Feb 14, 2008 1:53 PM, Zac Spitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >
> > are you using cfqueryparam?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Feb 14, 2008 3:27 PM, AJ Mercer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > Our SQL Server has just been reinstalled and now our CF application is
> > > throwing an error when inserting a string that has a single quote in it.
> > >
> > > It used to work, so I am thinking there might be a setting in SQL Server
> > > somewhere that enables this
> > >  Is this the case?
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > AJ Mercer
> > > Web Log: http://webonix.net
> > >  >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Zac Spitzer -
> > http://zacster.blogspot.com (My Blog)
> > +61 405 847 168
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> AJ Mercer
> Web Log: http://webonix.net
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Java Integration

[Barry Beattie]

Scott,

the only reason you're trying to get the JSP version going is to prove
that it works?

is just putting the jar into CF's lib directory (IIRC the default
depository of jars) and then just calling the java classes any good to
you?



or do you need the JSP version going first so you can then reverse
engineer what to do with CF?



On Fri, Feb 15, 2008 at 3:24 PM, Mark Mandel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  Scott,
>
>  I don't believe the JSPservlet container shares the Java classpath
>  that CF has.. in fact, I'm almost positive it does't.
>
>  Mark
>
>  On Fri, Feb 15, 2008 at 3:46 PM, Scott Thornton
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>  >
>  >  actually,
>  >
>  >  just trying to get the .jsp sample page to work first...
>  >
>  >  browsing this page via coldfusion web server.
>  >
>  >  I believe we have to unpack the  .jar file into 
> C:/CFusionMX/wwwroot/WEB-INF/.
>  >
>  >  example page follows:
>  >
>  >  
>  >
>  >
>  >  <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> import="com.crystaldecisions.reports.sdk.ReportClientDocument,
>  > com.crystaldecisions.sdk.occa.report.lib.*,
>  > 
> com.crystaldecisions.sdk.occa.report.data.*,
>  > 
> com.crystaldecisions.sdk.occa.report.lib.PropertyBag,
>  > java.io.*,
>  > com.crystaldecisions.reports.sdk.*"
>  >
>  >  %>
>  >
>  >  <%
>  >  /* Applies to: XI
>  >  * Date Created: April 4, 2005
>  >  * Description:  This sample application can assist with determining 
> database connection information that may be
>  >  *   required when changing database 
> connection information in a Crystal Report at runtime.
>  >  *   To help demonstrate how to use this sample, there are 2 
> sample reports included:  ReportA.rpt and
>  >  *   ReportB.rpt.  These reports are based off 
> 2 different SQL Server databases which use a JDBC
>  >  *   connection.
>  >  * Author: HP, BH
>  >  */
>  >
>  >  try {
>  >
>  > //Create a ReportClientDocument for each report
>  > ReportClientDocument oReportClientDocumentA = new 
> ReportClientDocument();
>  > ReportClientDocument oReportClientDocumentB = new 
> ReportClientDocument();
>  >
>  > //Parse out the report name using helper function below
>  > String ReportA = getReportName(request.getParameter("ReportA"));
>  > String ReportB = getReportName(request.getParameter("ReportB"));
>  >
>  > //Open both reports
>  > oReportClientDocumentA.open("jrc_display_connection_info/" + 
> ReportA, 0);
>  > oReportClientDocumentB.open("jrc_display_connection_info/" + 
> ReportB, 0);
>  >
>  > //Display the connection information about a report.
>  > //(code for the ConnInfoDisplayer class is below)
>  > ConnInfoDisplayer report1_displayer = new 
> ConnInfoDisplayer(oReportClientDocumentA);
>  > ConnInfoDisplayer report2_displayer = new 
> ConnInfoDisplayer(oReportClientDocumentB);
>  >
>  > //Begin a main table to display both reportA and reportB's 
> properties in.
>  > out.println("");
>  > out.println("");
>  >
>  > out.println("");
>  > out.println(report1_displayer.getTable(ReportA)); //list out the 
> properties of Report A
>  > out.println("");
>  >
>  > out.println("");
>  > out.println(report2_displayer.getTable(ReportB)); //list out the 
> properties of Report B
>  > out.println("");
>  >
>  > out.println("");
>  > out.println(""); // End the main table.
>  >
>  > //Close the ReportClientDocument to allow the JRC to release the 
> resources
>  > //tied to each report.
>  > oReportClientDocumentA.close();
>  > oReportClientDocumentB.close();
>  >
>  >  }
>  >  catch(ReportSDKException sdkEx) {
>  > out.println(sdkEx);
>  >  }
>  >
>  >
>  >  %>
>  >
>  >  <%!
>  >  /*** class ConnInfoDisplayer ***
>  >   *
>  >   * Used to display all the Connection Info properties from the first table
>  >   * of the given report in a nice HTML based table.
>  >   *
>  >   ***/
>  >  public class ConnInfoDisplayer
>  >  {
>  > private ReportClientDocument oReportClientDocument;
>  >
>  > 
> /
>  >  *
>  >  * Constructor - Save the reportClientDocument to be displayed
>  >  *
>  >  
> ***/
>  > ConnInfoDisplayer(ReportClientDocument oReportClientDocument)
>  > {
>  > this.oReportClientDocument = oReportClientDocument;
>  > }
>  >
>  > 
> /*

[cfaussie] Re: Web Reporting

[Barry Beattie]

for a situation where it was a Turnkey app (running off CF std OEM)
and needed dynamic user-defined fields and criteria ... the report
builder wasn't going to cut it.

it turned out for CF7, cfreport and cfdocument wasn't going to cut it either.

so one of the guys hacked the iText library to bits and did great
things with it, calling from CF. Does all the things you were talking
about to produce documents (esp PDF's) and he's now got it
pixel-perfect to be able to print cheques, invoices, etc. He spent
quite a while on it spread over the last couple of years but ended up
with very good results.

just an FYI on what someone else is doing.




(Gareth.E - you on list to say whether this is still viable
now-a-days, starting from scratch?)

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[cfaussie] Re: [Ann-Syd] Tonight: The "can't miss" meeting! (Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group)

[Barry Beattie]

I thought it was Adobe and Yahoo joining forces against Microsoft?



On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 11:58 AM, Dale Fraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  Ahh,
>
>  Wonder what this might be?
>
>  Im pretty sure it's the Apple buying Adobe announcement :P
>
>  Regards
>  Dale Fraser
>
>
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>  Of Chris Velevitch
>  Sent: Monday, 25 February 2008 12:48 PM
>  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
>  cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: [cfaussie] [Ann-Syd] Tonight: The "can't miss" meeting! (Sydney
>  Flash Platform Developers Group)
>
>
>  25th February, at 6pm for 6:30 start.
>  Join us for this "can't miss" meeting!
>
>  Adobe's RIA technologies enable you to rapidly build and deploy the
>  most engaging applications across browsers and on the desktop. We are
>  hosting a special live event to share exciting new information on
>  Adobe's platform tools and technologies for building RIAs. You'll see
>  an exclusive user group video presentation by Adobe Chief Software
>  Architect, Kevin Lynch, hear some important product news, plus get
>  your hands on some exclusive schwag and other giveaways.
>
>  Be part of the fun and excitement and join the rest of the Adobe
>  developer community by participating in this very special event.
>
>  Details http://sydneyflashdevfeb2008specialmeeting.eventbrite.com
>
>  You can still come even though registrations are closed and you miss
>  on the food and major prizes. Just drop me an email if you are coming.
>
>
>  Chris
>  --
>  Chris Velevitch
>  Manager - Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group
>  m: 0415 469 095
>  www.flashdev.org.au
>
>  Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group
>  February "Can't Miss" Meeting
>  Date: Mon 25th February 6pm for 6:30 start
>  Details and RSVP at
>  http://sydneyflashdevfeb2008specialmeeting.eventbrite.com/
>
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Simultaneous editing in CFEclipse

[Barry Beattie]

as a developer (and father of two children) I just gotta ask - why?

what happen if both of you want to play with the same "toy" at the same time?

if the file is that big, wouldn't it be more convenient to have it
refactored and modularised?


On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 3:30 PM, kazza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  Hi
>
>  We use CFEclipse for development at work. Me and my manager would like
>  to work on the same file at the same time from our respective work
>  stations. I am trying to find a plugin for Eclipse to accomplish it. I
>  have found one called Composent Collaboratoion Plugin
>  http://www.eclipseplugincentral.com/displayarticle172.html
>
>  Has anyone use this and can anyone suggest any other plugin?
>
>  cheers
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Web Based Equation Editors

[Barry Beattie]

> I am specifically looking for something that can be integrated with a rich
> text editor.

that's what a lot of LMS's (Learning management System) like
Blackboard do using WebEQ.

WebEQ uses MathML behind the scenes but is a java applet.

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=webEQ+%22Rich+text+editor%22+MathML

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[cfaussie] Re: Simultaneous editing in CFEclipse

[Barry Beattie]

you don't know my kids...

but seriously, two people editing the same lines of code - sends
shivers down my spine.

if it's a collaborative effort, then perhaps pair-programming? two
heads, two pair of eyes, one pair of hands.



On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 3:55 PM, Dale Fraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  But Barry,
>
>  Normally big toys are suitable for multiple kids to play with at once :)
>
>  Regards
>  Dale Fraser
>  http://learncf.com
>
>
>
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>  Of Barry Beattie
>  Sent: Monday, 25 February 2008 4:38 PM
>  To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Simultaneous editing in CFEclipse
>
>
>  as a developer (and father of two children) I just gotta ask - why?
>
>  what happen if both of you want to play with the same "toy" at the same
>  time?
>
>  if the file is that big, wouldn't it be more convenient to have it
>  refactored and modularised?
>
>
>  On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 3:30 PM, kazza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>  >
>  >  Hi
>  >
>  >  We use CFEclipse for development at work. Me and my manager would like
>  >  to work on the same file at the same time from our respective work
>  >  stations. I am trying to find a plugin for Eclipse to accomplish it. I
>  >  have found one called Composent Collaboratoion Plugin
>  >  http://www.eclipseplugincentral.com/displayarticle172.html
>  >
>  >  Has anyone use this and can anyone suggest any other plugin?
>  >
>  >  cheers
>  >  >
>  >
>
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] REMIND: This Wednesday: Brisbane FlashPlatform User Group - special "can't miss" meeting! Flex3 and AIR launch party!

[Barry Beattie]

meeting announcement: see here
http://qld.cfug.org.au/index.cfm?event=showMeeting&meetingID=8A0B0A96-9C14-BFB7-C328BC90967CAED6
 or here
http://flashplatformgroup.org/

Please RSVP as soon as possible - it will be very important for the
catering. Thanks.
-


As you may have heard, Adobe has announced the release of Adobe Flex 3
and Adobe AIR 1.0.  Now that the cat is out of the bag, this will be
the focus of our 27th Feb (this Wednesday) special meeting! Adobe is
sponsoring this meeting with food (we're taking the catering up a
notch to celebrate the occasion), giveaways and a raffle copy of Adobe
Flex Professional.

Flex 3 is a feature-packed release, adding new UI components like the
advanced datagrid and improved CSS capabilities; powerful tooling
additions like refactoring; and extensive testing tools including
memory and performance profiling, plus the addition of the automated
testing framework to Flex Builder.

Adobe AIR is game-changing in so many ways, delivering rich
applications on the desktop, enabling access to the local file system,
system tray, notifications and much more. Now you can write RIAs on
the desktop using the same skills that you've been already using to
create great web apps including both Flex and AJAX.

Don't miss out on this opportunity to see and hear about this highly
anticipated release of Flex 3 and AIR at this meeting.


STOP PRESS: we will also be bringing along a video camera to record 30
second spots for
http://www.30onair.com/about/

So, if you've got something to say ("Why Flex", "Why AIR, "Why
ColdFusion", "Why Adobe"), lets get it recorded!



date: Wednesday, February 27th

 Doors open at 6:00pm for a 6:30 start but we need you to RSVP
 beforehand - click here:

 
http://qld.cfug.org.au/index.cfm?event=showRSVPForm&meetingID=8A0B0A96-9C14-BFB7-C328BC90967CAED6
(I assure you, I've got the RSVP link correct this time)

 As usual, this is a free event and all who are interested are welcome
 (please RSVP) and food and refreshments are provided

 QANTM Auditorium
 QANTM House
 Level 9, 138 Albert St
 Brisbane City
 (Opposite the "Coffee Club")
 (for details on how to get there, see the RSVP link)

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[cfaussie] Re: Simultaneous editing in CFEclipse

[Barry Beattie]

you probably do this already ...

but if your development team isn't a rib-prod or yell (over the
partition) away...

... don't discount the use of ICQ/IM/chat for passing messages like

"file committed - do an update now" or "what was that URL again?" or
"is it beer o'clock yet?"

just a quick thought thrown out there...




On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 11:01 AM, Karan Joshi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> cheersI would just say No to that for a lot of obvious reasons
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 11:29 AM, Ricardo Russon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > *Dont shoot me*
> >
> > How about DreamWeaver?
> > Put the document on a shared drive and dreamweaver will notify the other
> person that the file has been updated and should be reloaded.
> >
> > Yes.. it has its own set of problems, I know.. just throwing it out there.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Photos from Adobe Air launch in the public domain

[Barry Beattie]

Mike, I must have missed you otherwise I would have said "G'day"

we had a small Queensland Contingent to attend (don't get too used to
us northerners attending Sydney events, Mark Blair - the airfares
aren't *that* cheap)

http://www.youtube.com/adobebrisbane

Rock'n'Roll quality video thanks to the Flip video camera

for some reason, Mark Blair up on that podium by himself reminds me of
Roger Waters out of Pink Floyd's "The Wall" - I was expecting the
hammers to come through any minute.

anyone else got any photo's or video to share?

cheers
barry.b


On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 4:03 PM, Mike Kear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  Here are some people who are obviously having a lot of fun at the
>  Adobe Air launch last week 
>
>
>  
> http://www.crn.com.au/Galleries/271,photo-gallery-adobe-air-launch-party.aspx/9006
>
>  Andrew Muller looking remarkably restrained and respectable.
>  --
>  Cheers
>  Mike Kear
>  Windsor, NSW, Australia
>  Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer
>  AFP Webworks
>  http://afpwebworks.com
>  ColdFusion, PHP, ASP, ASP.NET hosting from AUD$15/month
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Wanted: junior css/html ninja

[Barry Beattie]

I'd have to somewhat agree with Sean here, although I'm not going to
bag QUT or any other institution.

it's worth remembering that there are two distinct streams of
education past high schools

 - higher education (universities and colleges with degrees): judged
by how well you performed
 - vocational training (TAFE and other VET institutions):
competent/not yet competent.

the two are reasonably different.

as you can gather, vocational training is skills based, whereas
higher education deals with some of the bigger picture or takes a
larger holistic view. "HOW" verses "WHY" to put it bluntly.
Universities specifically *don't* teach you how to do tasks - you
should (in theory) be smart enough to pick that up yourself (which is
where the role of the tutor - and tutorials generally - is so
valuable)

what's happened in IT/Computer (and by extention us here in the webby
world) is a collision of these needs.

I'd argue that if you just want a coder, looks at TAFE's (et al) and
not universities. There are plenty or RTO's (registered training
organisations) deliving the ICA05 training packages (some diplomas are
specifically for web development)

but if you want a long-term employee who will grow well past that role
and into areas like management then a TAFE diploma by itself may not
cut it. Either get a Uni graduate and then skill them up or get an ex
TAFE student and allow them further education paths.
(this is just an FYI, no help for David in his specific case here)

I've heard tons of ex-uni students who complain bitterly that their
degrees taught then nothing but they learned much more moving to VET -
it comes down to what students are looking for. I also suspect that
many high school students have been let down by their guidance
councilor in helping them understand what these different forms of
education mean and what's best for them.

ICT is a bit special because it's so heavily involved in doing, and
how to do it is constantly changing. The demarcation between the two
forms of adult education can be clearer in areas like humanities where
training to get a diploma in social work does not equate to a bachelor
of arts.

(things are a fair bit more complicated than this  - I'm just watering
it down to make it easier to digest)

last point:

I won't speak for other states, but Queensland has embraced the
concept of "life long learning" where   the many levels of educational
institutions are starting to work together in concert. Certificate 2's
and 3's (or in some cases higher) or some first year Uni subjects
(like Griffith Uni's GUEST program) are able to be done in senior at
high schools. Part of it is marketing and capturing the minds of
prospective students earlier than the competition, but part is to try
and make the transition (all the way up to a Masters) flow a lot
better. The idea is not new - for the last 8 years (longer?) a Diploma
at Southbank TAFE has (generally) meant the first year off a degree at
QUT - but the integration is getting a lot smoother and is now
incorporating more high schools.

sorry, David, this (by itself) doesn't solve your problem ...just some
background in a nutshell...

but my suggestion is contact some TAFE's in your area and see if
they've got any graduates for "ICA50605 Diploma of Information
Technology (Website Development)"

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=ICA05+RTO


hope this helps
cheers
barry.b






On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 8:19 AM, Sean Bucklar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  I've certainly seen people I'd class as 'Juniors' graduating from uni.
>  As an employer I've seen kids come out of QUT's IT program having spent
>  3 years in the database stream and the only DB they've used is access,
>  and the only programming they know how to do is through a wizard.
>
>  If you go back to uni after working in the industry for a while, you'll
>  be horrified at how little the kids know, and how wildly out of
>  date/mickey mouse the course material often is. I've heard suggestions
>  that they deliberately push older/mickey mouse tech because it's more
>  widely used in small business which is where most Australians end up
>  working - but as an employer - it's much harder then it should be to
>  find a graduate who actually knows what they're talking about. Usually
>  we end up spending as much time training recent grads as we do training
>  an ex helpdesk monkey.
>
>
>
>  Steve Onnis wrote:
>  > Is there such a thing as junior developers these days?  I mean what sort of
>  > skill set does a uni student come out with these days and what unis still
>  > pump out web developers?
>  >
>  > -Original Message-
>  > From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>  > Of David Heacock
>  > Sent: Thursday, 6 March 2008 11:42 PM
>  > To: cfaussie
>  > Subject: [cfaussie] Wanted: junior css/html ninja
>  >
>  >
>  > Hi All,
>  >
>  > If anyone knows a junior developer with strong skills in CSS and HTML, I'm
>  > looking for a contractor in Canberr

[cfaussie] Re: Wanted: junior css/html ninja

[Barry Beattie]

>  D'oh - wasn't my intention to particularly bag QUT - they were just
>  intended to be a case in point.


I didn't take the reference to that institution as you singling it
out. I used to work there - there's a lot of dedicated hard working
staff who care - but it's probably safe to say that every institution
isn't 100% perfect.


>  - it's just a continuing point of frustration that
>  they so often, students who have 3 year degrees that on paper - should
>  relate directly to the work we're recruiting them for, have never been
>  exposed in any form to the tools that business actually uses.

hopefully I've given some clearer picture why this can happen.

I forgot to mention there's a third form of adult education: "The
School Of Hard Knocks"

don't laugh. it's actually becoming more viable:

http://whoyoucallingajesse.com/past/2007/11/13/education_not_important_comeon_37signals/
http://www.davidtucker.net/2007/10/31/why-education-matters-to-flex/#comment-128

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[cfaussie] Re: Wanted: junior css/html ninja

[Barry Beattie]

I heard some news over the weekend 
as an example of a national trend ...

I heard over the weekend that Western Sydney TAFE were having their
students snatched away before they even graduated (doing webby stuff).

considering TAFE diplomas are usually 18 months long (half that of a
degree), it seems the training model that TAFE was designed for is
working to plan ...

the other side of the coin, of course, is falling numbers of students
actually electing to study computing stuff as a career. An ad hoc
sample of a bunch of ex-High school students graduating last year, not
one is doing any direct form of IT. The closest are 3 engineering
students and two for film/television.

and yet:
http://www.peterelst.com/blog/2008/03/02/devine-digital-design-and-media/

go figure...




On Fri, Mar 7, 2008 at 2:23 PM, Dale Fraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  I know RMIT at least teach XHTML. Java, C++ and PHP.
>
>  Regards
>  Dale Fraser
>  http://learncf.com
>
>
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>
>
> Of Joel Cass
>  Sent: Friday, 7 March 2008 1:59 PM
>  To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Wanted: junior css/html ninja
>
>
>  I think there are a few ninja schools in Australia but I don't quite get
>  how this is related to coding, but whatever.
>
>  Uni is good but I don't think they teach HTML directly. You may hire
>  people who think that HTML was invented by MS-Word.
>
>  TAFE does teach HTML, they even have subjects devoted to it.
>
>  But then again you can learn how to HTML in your bedroom with some good
>  resource.
>
>  Perhaps just looking for someone with a website, a bit of enthusiasm and
>  knowledge of some HTML tools (e.g. anything but frontpage) will be a
>  good start.
>
>  Joel Cass Developer
>
>  Gruden - Design | Development | Implementation
>  t +61 2 9299 9462 f +61 2 9299 9463 m 0414 688 774 www.gruden.com
>
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>  Behalf Of Barry Beattie
>  Sent: Friday, 7 March 2008 12:28 PM
>  To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Wanted: junior css/html ninja
>
>
>  >  D'oh - wasn't my intention to particularly bag QUT - they were just
>  >  intended to be a case in point.
>
>
>  I didn't take the reference to that institution as you singling it
>  out. I used to work there - there's a lot of dedicated hard working
>  staff who care - but it's probably safe to say that every institution
>  isn't 100% perfect.
>
>
>  >  - it's just a continuing point of frustration that
>  >  they so often, students who have 3 year degrees that on paper -
>  should
>  >  relate directly to the work we're recruiting them for, have never
>  been
>  >  exposed in any form to the tools that business actually uses.
>
>  hopefully I've given some clearer picture why this can happen.
>
>  I forgot to mention there's a third form of adult education: "The
>  School Of Hard Knocks"
>
>  don't laugh. it's actually becoming more viable:
>
>  http://whoyoucallingajesse.com/past/2007/11/13/education_not_important_c
>  omeon_37signals/
>  http://www.davidtucker.net/2007/10/31/why-education-matters-to-flex/#com
>  ment-128
>
>
>
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Brisbane CFUG meeting this Tues (tomorrow) - FDS? LCDS? which one and why?

[Barry Beattie]

Brisbane CFUG meeting this Tues (tomorrow) - FDS? LCDS? which one and why?

6:00pm for a 6:30 start at Qantm house (level 9 auditorium) this Tuesday.

fact 1: there's a version of FlexDataServices bundled into all
versions of ColdFusion8 (yes, even the non-enterprise version!)

fact 2: Adobe Server products division have also released
LiveCycleDataServices 2.6, which can be integrated with CF without
much fuss.

fact 3: there's also a Community Edition of LiveCycleDataServices
(read: free ... as in beer)

fact 4: there's some cross-over of functionality between them all but
also major differences, especially when used with ColdFusion

fact 5: my head hurts trying to keep on top of all this... perhaps
yours does too?

fact 6: Tom Jordal has been part of the ColdFusion team for many years
now (the messaging gateway in CF being one of his babies) and is still
with the server products team working with LCDS. He's the perfect
person to explain what each of these products do, which one to chose
and why and how swap each out for the other. Come to the meeting to
hear Tom try and put the record straight.

fact 7: if you're looking at data transfer with CF using more than
simple remoting, then this presentation will get you up to speed on
what to chose where for why.

fact 8: even if you're NOT looking now, these server products could be
just the thing to solve a problem in the near future (esp if the
choice is between the bundled FDS and the free LCDS Community
Edition). Who knows what possibilities these server products can bring
to your CF set-up?

RSVP and venue details here:

http://qld.cfug.org.au/index.cfm?event=showRSVPForm&meetingID=958EDC08-CF7E-0951-4F6D12859973BEA7

see you there!

the CFUG team

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[cfaussie] Re: Costing up a VPS for CF8 - how much RAM?

[Barry Beattie]

>  Of course it does depend on
> how busy you get with traffic. Can't really know for sure until you run some
> Load Tests

now, that strikes me as a possible CFUG meeting topic...

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[cfaussie] [ANN] next meeting QLD CFUG - Real-time Data Management with LiveCycle Data Services

[Barry Beattie]

hi all

one of the big differences between web apps and client/server apps is
 the fact that, by the time the data hits the browser... it's stale.

 this is a nightmare if you have multiple users potentially editing the
 same record. There *are* strategies to cope, but Adobe has gone one
 better - real time data management.

 LiveCycle DataServices has the ability to "see" when someone is
 editing a record and broadcast messages to everyone else viewing it
 that it's being edited - and then push the updated values to them all
 when saved.

 it's a specialised need, sure, but it could become a critical piece as
 the complexity of web apps grows.

 of course this LiveCycle DataServices feature is no good to a bunch of
 ColdFusion people unless there was integration points into the CF
 servers

 which is where Nick Kwiatkowski from the Michigan Flex User's Group
 comes in (he's a CF'er too - don't be decieved).

Nick is willing to wake up at 4:00am in the U.S to do a
 Breezo live for us to cover this topic. It'll be based loosely on his
 Oct 11th 2007 presentation  "Introduction to LiveCycle Data Services
 Part 2" he gave to his user group (look for the slides to give you
 some idea of what he's on about:
 http://theflexgroup.org/presentations.cfm - it's the "part 2" ones)
 but being a live presso where you can ask questions this will be a
 whole lot better and it will be a bit different is some areas to make
 it more relivant to us.

 next tuesday, usual spot. 6:00 for a 6:30 start.

 RSVP here:

http://qld.cfug.org.au/index.cfm?event=showRSVPForm&meetingID=1260335F-0A9E-BF5B-4E8249BA267AC7BA

 cheers
the QLD CFUG team.

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[cfaussie] Re: FarCry 5.0 Exclusive: 2pm Friday (Sydney Time)

[Barry Beattie]

please Geoff, a reminder to record it, if you can...

why? I've been looking forward to this release but, damn, tomorrow's
just not a good day



On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 10:13 AM, Mark Mandel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  Registered :oD
>
>  Mark
>
>
>  On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:04 AM, Geoff Bowers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>  >
>  >  Folks,
>  >
>  >  I'm doing an Adobe eSeminar on ColdFusion tomorrow (Friday) after
>  >  lunch.
>  >
>  >  Developer eSeminars
>  >  Using FarCry with ColdFusion
>  >  Friday 4 Apr 2008 - 14:00 - 15:00
>  >  Online eSeminar
>  >  
> http://events.adobe.co.uk/cgi-bin/register.cgi?country=pa&eventid=6503&venueid=6855
>  >
>  >  FarCry 5.0 is about to be released -- well anytime soon -- so I
>  >  thought I might showcase the latest the FarCry community has to
>  >  offer.  The presentation is all demo with a little bit of
>  >  programming.  Should be a good "kick up the feet" sort of session.
>  >
>  >  All the best,
>  >
>  >  -- geoff
>  >  http://www.daemon.com.au/
>  >  >
>  >
>
>
>
>  --
>  E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  W: www.compoundtheory.com
>
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: session, application, server scope, does ASP have the same?

[Barry Beattie]

which is why the few of us who started off with ASP (classic as
they're calling us) wasn't too fazed with Application.cfc - we'd seen
it all before... LIKE TEN YEARS AGO!

(c'mon ColdFusion 9 - give us "onServerStart" so we can properly
bootstrap start-ups)



On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 1:59 PM, Ricardo Russon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> global.asa is your friend
>
> http://www.w3schools.com/ASP/asp_globalasa.asp
>
> Ric.
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD from them too?

[Barry Beattie]

 - came across another recruter today (deliberatly not saying who) who
straight-up said that CF was on the way out.

and yet they (recruters) are looking for CF'ers and can't easily fill
the positions they've got on their books, converting PHP'ers to fill
positions, and in one case, getting apps made (for their recruting
business) in CFML.

sigh...

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[cfaussie] Re: CF8 clustering - adding new instance

[Barry Beattie]

George, if you're still after some more info:

http://alagad.com/go/blog-entry/ha-clustering-coldfusion-part-1-installing-cf

"HA - Clustering ColdFusion Part 1 - Installing CF"

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[cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD from them too?

[Barry Beattie]

to be honest Matt, playing it very gently, not wanting to bite the
hand that may feed me...


but then again, what _could_ I say that the obvious couldn't say better?





On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 11:03 PM, M@ Bourke
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> and your response to this person was??
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD from them too?

[Barry Beattie]

it's probably worth remembering that Barnes has cut CF code a lot
longer than he's been wearing an MS-logo'd jacket.


so when he says

"...I think the skill shortage in Australia is what's driving this
perception, my advice is to get back out there, hit the pavements and
start stimulating the CF Community again."

there's a fair bit of thought behind it.

you can't beat "vibe" for creating groundswells and getting a scene
happening. Whether it's "Kevin07" (or "It's Time" back in 1972) or the
Pepsi taste challenge or the promo for the Blair Witch Project, if you
haven't a vibe you just don't exist these days.

that thread I threw up this afternoon about "cfqueryparam 101"? - it
was an Ad (a very subtle one) advertising one of the many things that
the local user group can do to help people become better at their
craft, keep their skills up, have longeviy in the industry, etc.

Advertising the local CFUG for tonight (not expecting one extra person
to show, but at least it gets the name out there). Also pointing out
that there's CFUG's all around the region. From Andrew Mercer in Perth
to David Harris in NZ and people like Steve Onnis, Mark Mandel, Chris
Velevitch, Kai Koenig, Darren Tracey - Dale, you're in there helping
too.

you can stumble across all sorts of interesting things at CFUG's -
tonight for example it was about CF, LCDS and data management,
presented by a guy in the U.S who was up at 5:00am to present.
http://quetwo.wordpress.com/2008/04/07/speaking-at-the-queensland-cfug-tomorrow/

not your cup of tea? well, what is? and what are you going to do about it?

People who don't contribute to the CF community shouldn't be too quick
to bitch and moan about the lack of CF profile.

two ways to help:

 - actively drive the agenda of your local CFUG: don't just be a
passenger, but help set the direction to what you think would make it
better - and then help make it happen.

- contribute to open-source apps/code. Ray Camden's blogCFC is almost
ubiquitous but it's still not the "foot in the door" that PHPNuke
created for PHP (or many of the other PHP-based apps). FarCry's there
waiting to be used, etc.








On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 9:06 PM, CyberAngel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> *LOL*
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of M@ Bourke
>  Sent: Tuesday, 8 April 2008 9:05 PM
>
>  To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: [cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD
> from them too?
>
>
>
>
>
> Sorry yeah forgot, he now owns the whole .Net platform :)
>  and will soon become head of the new small department they'll have within
> the Microsoft basement, new little department will be called Yahoo!!, just
> to be cool MS will give Yahoo! 2 "!'s" so its Yahoo!!
>
>
>
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD from them too?

[Barry Beattie]

well, Geoff Bowers is doing smart evangelising (IMHO) with FarCry.

the leverage there is to get people interested in the FarCry
application framework - and the CMS as a killer app to get the
framework in the door.

just because it uses CF is not really the focus - building powerful
applications is.

this is pretty much the same model that saw a large spreading of PHP -
it wan't the "personal home page" concept - it was the "runtime" that
made PHPNuke or Wordpress run on people's machines.

thing edge of the wedge stuff

I'm seeing exactly the same thing with Sharepoint and MOSS (Microsoft
Office SharePoint Server) - sure they're products, but if you want to
add/modify it, you'll be doing so in .NET.

we need more killer apps.



On Wed, Apr 9, 2008 at 11:39 PM, Gary Barber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  Okay I'm not privy to where Geoff and Mark are doing these
>  presentations.  Is it to Coldfusion people.  If so it's a waste of time.
>
>  I've not hear of them and I do keep my ear to the ground so to speak in
>  relation to Coldfusion news outside of the Cf community.
>
>  Besides on or two vocal advocates I have heard nothing!
>
>  Do nothing and it won't effect me. But it will effect you guys.  Sorry
>  to be all serious here.
>
>
>  --
>  Gary Barber
>  Freelance User Interaction Designer/ Information Architect
>
>  Web: radharc.com.au
>  blog: manwithnoblog.com
>
>
>
>
>
> CyberAngel wrote:
>  > H...
>  >
>  > I think that Geoff, Mark and a few others are always doing presentations on
>  > Coldfusion related products.
>  >
>  > As for recommending I would think it will depend on the situation and the
>  > project.
>  >
>  > As for Killer sites, yeah well I agree...
>  >
>  > But I will say what Scott Barnes said, even though it is easier said than
>  > done. But he is right.
>  >
>  > Regards
>  > Andrew Scott
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > -Original Message-
>  > From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>  > Of Gary Barber
>  > Sent: Wednesday, 9 April 2008 7:25 PM
>  > To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>  > Subject: [cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD
>  > from them too?
>  >
>  >
>  > 
>  >
>  > Would I recommend Coldfusion to someone new in the industry, well
>  > frankly no. Realistically it has no future (puts on flame proof suit).
>  > So what can you do about it.
>  >
>  > DON"T be complacent.
>  >
>  > Consider this besides WebDU and your CFUG.  How many presentations have
>  > people done on Cold fusion.How many kill sites where highlighted as
>  > Coldfusion sites.
>  >
>  > I've not heard of any, so if I'm wrong tell me.  But people you need to
>  > get outside of the user groups back into the rest of the web industry.
>  > If you really love this product and it's more than a day job get out
>  > there promote it to others.  The rest of the web community hears about
>  > RoR, PHP and .Net all the time.. Coldfusion... - "oh thats that dead
>  > language".
>  >
>  > It's a PR problem.
>  >
>  > Okay you say "but I have all the work I need, why should I bother at
>  > all".  Well you can sit around with all your work, but in a few years
>  > the work level will start to drop and at that stage it will be terminal,
>  > Coldfusion will be dead.  The reason you have lots of work, simple
>  > others have left, and you are picking up their slack.
>  >
>  > Adobe are not going to help you.  Australia is a small market, if the
>  > Coldfusion numbers dropped in Australia but remained the same in the
>  > US.  I don't think Adobe HQ would really be that concerned.  Lets be
>  > very realistic here. Adobe doesn't make a lot of money out of Coldfusion
>  > in Australia, it makes more out of CS3 etc.
>  >
>  > Adobe guys, lets be real here, you don't have the budget. So if Adobe
>  > isn't going to help, what can you do.
>  >
>  > Encourage the installation of the CF opensource alternatives.  Okay they
>  > are not 100% cf8, but it is a good stable platform for  cfml development
>  > that is very low in cost.  Stop being purists.  CF has to Open source in
>  > Australia to help it survive.
>  >
>  > Also is you get industry to push the CF opensource alternatives, and
>  > educational institutions will follow suit and train graduates in CF.
>  > Adobe (US) may even wake up at some point.
>  >
>  > So what can you do now.  We email, phone, IM a web professional group
>  > that is not your CFUG and go organise to do a presentation of your
>  > latest CF project.
>  >
>  > I would love to see this happen, but a little part of me doesn't think
>  > you guys can do it. Prove me wrong.
>  >
>  >
>
>
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD from them too?

[Barry Beattie]

> But you are both non Australians, and here in Australia the job market is
> nonexistent and has been that way for 5 years.

Andrew, are you talking about raw numbers compared to .NET, Java, PHP?
then yes you're right - the available positions at any one time can't
compare

http://www.seek.com.au/jobsearch/index.ascx?DateRange=31&Keywords=coldfusion&searchfrom=quick

but with such low numbers (both of available developers and of
positions available)  small fluctuations impact greatly - businesses
not finding CF  people and therefore going elsewhere is one concern in
such conditions.

having said that, the project I'm now finishing off certainly wasn't
origionally written by an experianced CF developer...

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[cfaussie] Re: recruters say "CF on the way out"? ... FFS! not FUD from them too?

[Barry Beattie]

struth!

I started this thread a couple of days ago to highlight the irony in a
conversation with a recruiter. next thing you know incendiary bombs
are being thrown from all quarters.

well - just to add fuel to the fire...  one interesting project I'm
looking at - teaching and learning systems/distance education
(leveraging my domain knowledge) 

... turns out to be a .NET project...

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[cfaussie] who is going to cf.Objective this year?

[Barry Beattie]

just a shout out to anyone who is going to the cfobjective conference
next month...

(no, I'm not going, but I'm interested in who is)

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[cfaussie] Re: RE : Urgently needs Webfocus Developer for Jefferson City,MO !!!!!!!!!

[Barry Beattie]

sigh, recruiters ... there a breed, mate... a breed

Geoff, can u do the honors and make him go away, please for all our
sanity? even if it's just until he realises he's been bumped off the
list




On Tue, Apr 22, 2008 at 2:08 AM, Ranjit Patil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi,
> Greetings!!
>
> This is Ranjit from Coolsoft, hope you are doing well, we have the following
> requirement . Appreciate if you can forward your latest word format resume
> ASAP.
>
>  Its Urgent Requirement!!
>
> Position : WebFocus Developer
> Location : Jefferson City , MO
> Duration : 1 to 3 months.(may be extension)
> Rate : DOE
> Start Date:  ASAP
>
> Job Description
>
>  The Department of Revenue is looking for a WebFocus Developer
>  to create 20 reports for their department.
>  This project is estimated to last from 1 to 3 months.
>  (There is a possible extension of assignment depending on need
>  for further reports development).
>
>
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> RANJIT ,
> Technical Recruiter
> COOLSOFT LLC
> www.coolsofttech.com
>
>  >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Who is working for whom in Sydney, and are they looking for new people?

[Barry Beattie]

>  I think that this should happen in Vic also.

every area is different, it comes down to what the users want:

a story:

in the latter half of 2006, Brisbane found itself faced with a
situation where lots of Flex and AIR interest was "infiltrating" the
multimedia-based user group (QMUG) and the CFUG. While the multimedia
(Dw,Ps, Pr, Ae,Fl, Dr, etc) one wasn't the best to dive into the
details of Actionscript coding, the CFUG too (while it had commonality
with application design) also wasn't the best fit. This was judged at
the time by the UG managers and the more proactive members across the
origional two groups (each group having long histories of 7+ years)

This is why Richard Turner-Jones and I took the chance to juggle
things to create a third - a "FlashPlatform" one. Fast forward to
today where we have more ASP.NET and PHP coders interested in Flex and
AIR than CFUG'ers.

sure it's hard work having three groups. and attendances could always
be better (it was a risk to split the audience, effectively forcing
members to attend potentially two groups a month) but it now gives the
freedome for the CFUG to persue LiveCycle and application development
practices, the QMUG to concentrate on new digital media the
FlashPlatform group to ride the Flex and AIR wave.

the .NET and PHP membership of the FlashPlatform group is an attempt
to reach out to a wider community - in much the same way that was
suggested in that war'n'peace thread here a short while ago.

most of us here have a huge investment in the Adobe Technology stack,
and we'd like to know our investment is in good hands. As part of the
Adobe "environment" we're faced with twin challenges of a lot of width
(from design tools to enterprise server products) and an immature
company still finding it's feet**.

three user groups in one city the size of Brisbane is a gamble, sure.
but until there's a groundswell of large numbers of proactive members
suggest otherwise and willing to roll up the sleeves, it's an
experiment we're prepared to run a bit longer.

but your milage may vary...
eh my 2c.
barry.b


** I stand by this statement: sure Adobe has been around for years,
but this is now Adobe Mk2, and the dust has yet to settle fully. Good
omlettes still need to break eggs.

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[cfaussie] Re: Who is working for whom in Sydney, and are they looking for new people?

[Barry Beattie]

totally honest answer?

occasionally it's very good (over two doz), but most of the time, it's
poor - for both. On those poor occasions, add both together and it'd
be up to good.

but there's the problem - throw the Flex stuff in with the CF and the
.Net and PHP'ers would wonder why they were there.

but the really important number is, to be honest, the number of active
members - people willing to put up their hand, or make suggestions and
then follow through, or even religiously turning up. and those
particular numbers are very poor. in all honesty.

I suspect that it's just Brisbane but it has to be a special event -
something they're particularly interested in - for bulk people to
bother.

and in a way it's like kids sport on the weekend. Some parents throw
the kids out the car as they try to escape as fast as they can, while
others are always at the oval volunteering as goal umpires,
timekeeper, linesmen or water carriers. Our little AFL team couldn't
play this season without a manager - the wife volunteered eventually,
the only one that bothered replying to the coach's email.

the place I'm just about to finish up at - half a dozen CF'ers - not
one has been to a CFUG, not one has heard of WebDU (that's a story in
itself). I asked one today how they kept their ProfDev up, kept their
skills current basically they don't. Because there;s been loose
talk about using a framework at the place, I sent them a link to
Mandel's Transfer Breezo tomorrow (2.00pm, BTW - check his site). I
don't think they've seen a Connect presentation either. People on this
list have (generally, gut feeling) so much more current skill than a
lot of CF'ers who aren't on this list. Forgvie me for stating the
obvious but staying still is actually going backwards - there's such a
thing as progress, ready to send the unwary the same direction as
COBOL programmers.

here endith the sermon.

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[cfaussie] starting now(ish) - Transfer ORM framework eSeminar (with URL)

[Barry Beattie]

Mark Mandel is just about to deliver his presentation

"Introduction to Building Applications with Transfer ORM"

more info

http://www.compoundtheory.com/?action=displayPost&ID=298

link to the eSeminar (Breezo):

http://pacific.adobe.acrobat.com/developer/

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[cfaussie] Re: Who is working for whom in Sydney, and are they looking for new people?

[Barry Beattie]

well, I don't necessarily disagree with you, Scott, but we are perhaps
saying the same thing but from two different viewpoints.

the idea of having different user groups is just having a core
technology "hat" to hang on. In the case of the CFUG, ColdFusion is
the lowest common denominator on which to start. From there comes lots
of variations on a theme - other server products, application design,
project mgt and execution, software development practices, webserver
tuning, databases, etc.

For the Flex/AIR group, I'm there for the "Better business application
building". Others for graphics manipulation and filters, still others
for video and audio (FMS->Flex->Cocomo). don't forget, Scott, the
FlashPlatform group got you to do a presentation on Silverlight at
around the same time that most of the MSDN members hadn't even heard
of it

"I for one cannot consume enough around Adobe, Google, Mozilla,
Microsoft and even the various partners around the world of each
technology and what they are doing."

being the alpha geek that you are (no disrespect in the term), that's
not the 80% of the CF coders who don't yet go to CFUG's [1]. for my
2c, that's the real target and growth market for membership.

Bottom line is you can't learn it all and be good at it. so you
triarge technologies and skills to what is relevant today [2] in your
job and which way you see the future going [3].

but in the end, it's not about the technology, it's about the people.
it's a "conversation" (as Trib would put it), and connections between
people. To bring this back to Eliseo (who's thread this is that you
and I are hijacking, Scott) it's about hearing someone is available
for work, and knowing other members who are looking.


[1] wild guess based on gut feeling. ymmv

[2] managers and team leaders could be well served to insist their
employees keep up to date with their skill set. Resting on the same
knowledge that they used 4,5,6 years ago isn't doing anyone any
favours: it's short-term thinking and holds the business back from
progress and opportunities. Productivity lost on professional
development is saved bigtime with better solutions.

[3] I know an organisation that have the strategic plan to shrink CF
in favour of .NET. Some of them think their VB6 skills will give them
a head start into .Net 3.0 ... boy are they in for a rude shock...

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[cfaussie] Re: starting now(ish) - Transfer ORM framework eSeminar (with URL)

[Barry Beattie]

"Yep, they are always recorded (provided nothing went wrong) and posted
online."

dangerous assumption ... user group managers (who have access to the
Connect accounts and the record button) can be just as dopey as any
other human... etiher by forgetting to start recording until part of
the way through, or being party to a botched presentation that
recording it for posterity would be best swept under the carpet [1]

there's still a large element of "rock'n'roll"- type risk in Connect
presentations...


[1] as learnt from experiance

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[cfaussie] Re: is there a more efficent way of finding keys in FORM scope?

[Barry Beattie]

>  Not sure you need this any more

I'm always up for learning better ways, so your ideas/help aren't
wasted (thanx). Besides, finishing at 3:00am this morning gives me the
nagging feeling I'll be doing a Schwarzenegger [1]


>  In your original form add another field called something like
>  "hdnPersPBA_fields" (and perhaps "selPersTit_fields") which contains a
>  dynamically built list of the fields you need:
>
>
>  "hdnPersPBA_1,hdnPersPBA_2,...,hdnPersPBA_n"
>
>  Then when the form is posted, you have a known set of fields to extract from
>  the form scope.

u mean: keep a record of what was created ( via the JS that's used to
clone new form elements and inject them into the DOM) and submit that
list as  "hdnPersPBA_fields.value"? Yeah, that'd work, although I'd
also have to remove them from that list when the user hits the "I
don't want those new text boxes anymore" buttons.



[1] ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I'll_be_back

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[cfaussie] FYI: the "pearls" of CF.Objective (CF goodness) now starting to surface

[Barry Beattie]

http://www.cfobjective.com/ is on the latter part of their program and
various speakers have starting to post their presentation online

check ouf FullAsAGoog to see them as they surface.

just an FYI, nothing more






===
teen son: we learnt some interesting things about plastic at school today
dad: I found plastics interesting at school too ...what can you tell
me about it?
teen son: I dunno! it was on the worksheet! I can't remember!
dad: well you didn't actually _learn_ anything, did you...

moral: data is not information, information is not knowledge.
===

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[cfaussie] Re: is there a more efficent way of finding keys in FORM scope?

[Barry Beattie]

> evaluate is generally considered a security risk and is also slower

yeah, a while ago there were a fair number of blog posts highlighting this.

> form["hdnPersPBA_"&X] and structkeyexists

or simply (and neater)

form["hdnPersPBA_#X#"]

the point about looping over this list *is* a better way, much simpler
to find the keys in FORM scope, although there is the additional
maintainance of pulling them out of the hidden field list if they
remove some of the injected form elements before submitting. That also
means this remove action is touching on the JS that removes the form
elements also. It's gone from server-side processing to a bit of
client-side maintaince to set the form up "just so"

I'm not saying it's difficult, just there seems to be a bit more to the story.

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[cfaussie] Re: ColdFusion Isn't a Programming Language?

[Barry Beattie]

that's F*cked!

it's been on that list for years (well the recent couple I remember)

I'm friggin insulted. bunch of wankers for dropping it.

so it's bloat-language ranking they want.' eh?

and if ActionScript's classes are written in C/C++, does that make it
a framework too?




On Mon, May 5, 2008 at 11:31 PM, Peter Bell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Has anyone else seen anything about this?!
>
> http://www.pbell.com/index.cfm/2008/5/5/ColdFusion-Isnt-a-Programming-Language
>
>
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: HOT REQ..for Database Analyst !!!!!!!!! Location: TX, Dallas/Ft. Worth

[Barry Beattie]

oh goodie - RANJIT is spamming us again.

Geoff's in SanFran at the moment, isn't he? has anyone else got the
keys to CFAussie to make this guy go away? second time in the last 4
or so weeks



On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 1:25 AM, Ranjit Patil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi,
> Greetings!!
> Hope that we make some difference to the world.
> Hope that we help someone to move ahead in life.
> Hope that we make someone realize their aspirations.
> Hope that we help someone reach their dreams.
>
> HAVE A GREAT DAY AHEAD!!
>
> This is Ranjit from Coolsoft, hope you are doing well, we have the following
> requirement. Appreciate if you can forward your latest word format resume
> ASAP.
>
>  Its Urgent Requirement!!
>
> Position: Database Analyst
> Location: TX, Dallas/Ft. Worth
> Duration: 8 Month
> Rate : DOE
> Start Date:  ASAP
>
> Job Description
>
> This position requires a specific skill set.
> Required Skills:
>
> Structured Query Language (SQL) - Expert
> MS Excel - Expert
> Visual Basic - Expert
> Perl - Intermediate
>
> Desired:
>
> Previous experience in an Operational Reporting role
>
> Skills:
> 1) Structured Query Language (SQL) Expert Required
> 2) MS Excel Expert Required
> 3) Visual Basic Expert Required
> 4) Perl Intermediate  Required
> 5) Operational Reporting Expert  Desired
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> RANJIT,
> Technical Recruiter
> COOLSOFT LLC
> 502-379-4456 Ex-117
> www.coolsofttech.com
>   >
>

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[cfaussie] finding duplicate entities

[Barry Beattie]

 - data entry form looking for possible previous entries when adding a
new one, possibly causing duplicates

I call it "soft duplicates" (ie: can't use "hard evidence" like a tax
file number or in this case, case number)

the idea is for the data entry operator to be flagged of a possible
match, shown the possibilities and clarify that with the new person
before the new record is saved (so they can throw it away and bring up
the previous record)

eg: where a possible soft duplicate for Kim Jong-il could be
Jong il Kim or
Kim Il-sung or
Kim Jong-suk

especially if they were at the same address, had the same date of
birth or some other factor was common between them.

I imagine it's the same sort of thing that Centerlink or the Tax
office would use to find fraudsters, although it doesn't have to be
that heavy-duty.

the  best idea I can think of so far (last hour or so) is to extract
out the possible matching fields
 - any name field to last name
 - address
 - date of birth

as a bunch of individual SQL statements using form fields triggered by
some form event (ie: onBlur of a field) to run an Ajax call to see if
a match. If so, return a message where another window displays the
possible matches for one being entered for the operator to choose.

... but is there a better way?

thanks
barry.b

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[cfaussie] Re: cf.Objective() Australia

[Barry Beattie]

> And yes, I'm aware that it might be a different target audience,
> different people attending etc. but still, it's a concern. That's
> why I like the idea of the extra track or extra day attached to our
> existing major
> conference.

I just get a bit concerned that people pin their whole PD onto just
one yearly conference. Especially when it's in one place (thoughts of
Dale Fraser's posts of traveling to WebDU kick in here...)

And I wish there were a higher percentage of CF coders to community
rank-n-file here in ANZ to make this a no-brainer. EG: there's a lot
of CF coders in this town I'm in, but not all of them are on this
list, have heard of WebDU nor turn up to CFUG's. I've met some of 'em
and it's an eye-opener.

Perhaps a Connect/virtual gathering is more the go? It gets around
having to travel to Sydney all the time and has the potential to reach
more people. I realise it does cheapen the experiance because watching
a conference in the comforts of a busy office isn't as ideal as being
there...

... although I do realise that a large number of CF'ers who turn up to
WebDU would certainly attend some of the CF-enterprise tracks.

To take a leaf out of Fred Hollows life, what's stopping it from
happening right now? rolling up the sleeves and saying "from next
Friday, every Friday, 12:00 to 1:00pm a Connect session on Enterprise
ColdFusion". Bugger official channels or sanction from Adobe - take it
right back to grass roots and just do it? There's enough Adobe User
Group managers floating around with Connect logins to have a "vehicle"
- heck, there's three on this thread already...

if employers "get it" (as far as PD for their employees) and can
suffer an hour or two of lost production time, say once a week (a la
the Friday Connect sessions from Adobe) then might be an
opportunity I'm confilcted - on one hand I'm trying to get more
bums on seats and on the other I reckon Aral Balkin's got something
with http://singularity08.com/

but yes, raising the profile (and standard) of enterprise development
(and best practices generally) is definately a good thing.

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[cfaussie] Re: finding duplicate entities

[Barry Beattie]

> But to find near matches you can use the SOUNDEX or DIFFERENCE
> functions in MS SQL.

I'd completely forgotten about them. that'd certainly simplify things
with name and address.

thanx for the reminder, Taco.

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[cfaussie] Re: cf.Objective() Australia

[Barry Beattie]

@Chong

I see where you're coming from - broaden it a bit to include
situations you'd see in the enterprise (or at least cover more than
the 12 most commonly used tags). Integrating CF with .NET DLL's could
possibly fit there too, I guess.


@Kai.

I'm game and I still reckon a practical guide to some Java design
patterns applied to CF might be a bit of a lead in to frameworks...
ease into it with some background topics before scaring people away
with big words.

I did have this nasty thought for a moment that this might undermine
the CFUG's (physical meetings) that we both work hard to support...
but I suppose it's a chance to try and reach a wider audience...






On 5/9/08, KC Kuok <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> All,
>
>
> I see where Kai is coming, I was thinking along the same lines too,
> but after thinking abit more about it I think cf.objective in AU will
> be a good thing.
>
> it brings exposure to CF in Australia. Considering there are numerous
> Java/.Net/PHP/Linux dedicated Conferences held regularly in Australia,
> I believe CF deserves to be in that group (where it has at least one
> dedicated conference). Though how many people will actually attend
> maybe another factor, and if there is not enough initial demand, Adobe
> might be motivated to do more to push CF in Aus.
>
> Suggestion of Topics,
>
> I need to know ideas/methods to more advanced Exchange integration
> stuff (though it is more probably to do with Active Directory and
> setting up some sort of 'Super' user in exchange). Looking at your own
> outlook stuff is ok, but doing more advanced stuff like sharing
> multiple calendars will be good. Replicating how you can see other
> people's free time (similar to making appointments via Outlook) will
> be a start and probably solutions can be based off that.
>
> FWIW,
> Chong
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Fixing up HTML Entities

[Barry Beattie]

is the "&" sourounded by spaces?

so you could do replace(myXML, " & ", "&")?**

or if not


// park all legit ones with a sentinal value
replace(myXML, "&", "X_SENTINALVALUE_X")
// replace all breaking & with the real thing
replace(myXML, "&", "&" )
// return the real things from the sentinal value
replace(myXML, "X_SENTINALVALUE_X", "&" )
xmlParse(myXML)



** is that the correct argument order? can't remember... Livedocs


On 5/9/08, Seona Bellamy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Hi guys,
>
> Hopefully a quick and easy one for someone - I'm sure this is going to
> be one of those things with an easy fix I'm just not seeing!
>
> I'm pulling in an XML file via an RSS feed. It has some &'s which are
> not encoded as & and some which are (as well as a smattering of
> "'s and other entities). Apparently, those unencoded &'s are what
> is preventing me running this data through xmlParse().
>
> Is there a way in which I can isolate those unencoded &'s and change
> them to & but leave every other & (ie, the ones already used as
> part of an entity) alone?
>
> I tired running htmlEditFormat() over it, but that translated
> everything including the structural stuff and so I couldn't parse it
> anyway. :(
>
> Cheers,
>
> Seona.
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Fixing up HTML Entities

[Barry Beattie]

I forgot to mention

you're going to have to park all the other HTML entities as well under
other sentinal values (eg "'s ) before getting rid of the nasty
single "&"

but I'm sure you get the idea.

On 5/9/08, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> is the "&" sourounded by spaces?
>
> so you could do replace(myXML, " & ", "&")?**
>
> or if not
>
> 
> // park all legit ones with a sentinal value
> replace(myXML, "&", "X_SENTINALVALUE_X")
> // replace all breaking & with the real thing
> replace(myXML, "&", "&" )
> // return the real things from the sentinal value
> replace(myXML, "X_SENTINALVALUE_X", "&" )
> xmlParse(myXML)
> 
>
>
> ** is that the correct argument order? can't remember... Livedocs
>
>
> On 5/9/08, Seona Bellamy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi guys,
> >
> > Hopefully a quick and easy one for someone - I'm sure this is going to
> > be one of those things with an easy fix I'm just not seeing!
> >
> > I'm pulling in an XML file via an RSS feed. It has some &'s which are
> > not encoded as & and some which are (as well as a smattering of
> > "'s and other entities). Apparently, those unencoded &'s are what
> > is preventing me running this data through xmlParse().
> >
> > Is there a way in which I can isolate those unencoded &'s and change
> > them to & but leave every other & (ie, the ones already used as
> > part of an entity) alone?
> >
> > I tired running htmlEditFormat() over it, but that translated
> > everything including the structural stuff and so I couldn't parse it
> > anyway. :(
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Seona.
> >
> > > >
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Microsoft Uses Flash!!!

[Barry Beattie]

it's all a moment in time.

While Flash is on Version 9, Silverlight still hasn't got the coverage
(or perhaps features the MS designers want)

... yet.

in other words you're talking about today, but not necessarily
tomorrow. May the best tool win.


On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 4:01 PM, AUG Vic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  I am sorry to burst your bubble, but Microsoft has been using Flash in
>  certain places for ages, pre Silverlight.
>
>  The people at end of doing serious stuff need to :-)
>
>  On May 14, 12:29 pm, "Owen West" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  wrote:
>
> > Check this out...
>  >
>  > http://www.worldwidetelescope.org
>  >
>  > Errr...Silverlight? Anybody?
>  >
>  > Gotta love Microsoft sometimes...
>  >
>  > Owen West  M.SysDev (C.Sturt) MCP MCAD MCSD
>  > Computer Programmer
>  > Applications Development Team
>  > Information Technology & Telecommunications
>  > Hunter New England Health
>  > Ph: (02) 4921 4194
>  > Fax: (02) 4921 4191
>  > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: queryAddRow

[Barry Beattie]

> No haven't submitted it anywhere yet.  Only wrote it before


cough!

cflib.org

/cough!

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[cfaussie] "Virtually" lost .... (an OT VMWare question)

[Barry Beattie]

"OK, so the plan is to move these web-, application- and database
servers into a virtual environment"...

(sigh, I obviously wasn't fast enough to keep my head down...)

so I've RDC's into the host machine (win2003 server) and I'm looking
at the VMWare virtual infrastructure client (a control panel that
shows how much drain on resources each virtual server has on the
host)...

now what?

I've got (at a start) Apache and Oracle to install on these virtual boxes...


any one care to draw me a mudmap on how to get started? perhaps some
google search terms to try?

thanx
b

** PS: I can't use the VMWare conversion tool to automatically migrate
a physical box to a virtual environment... one of the physical
webservers is NT4...

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[cfaussie] Re: "Virtually" lost .... (an OT VMWare question)

[Barry Beattie]

thanx Chris

IIRC it's NT4SP6 (or perhaps 6a) so according to the spec, it fits

HOWEVER...

... the Unisys guys flown in from N.Z to do this have previously tried
it and failed on this NT4 box.

so that means plan B ...

(I'm gonna have to change my name ... perhaps starting with "Z" so I'm
not the obvious choice for "plan B's")



On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 9:02 AM, Chris Velevitch
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 11:39 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> ** PS: I can't use the VMWare conversion tool to automatically migrate
>> a physical box to a virtual environment... one of the physical
>> webservers is NT4...
>
> Is the NT4 box SP4? (see
> http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/converter_datasheet.pdf)
>
>
>
> Chris
> --
> Chris Velevitch
> Manager - Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> m: 0415 469 095
> www.flashdev.org.au
>
> Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> May meeting: tbd
> Date: Mon 26th May 6pm for 6:30 start
> Details and RSVP soon
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: "Virtually" lost .... (an OT VMWare question)

[Barry Beattie]

ah ha!

now it's starting to make sense.

not only can I RDC into the host machine, but, using the IP address of
each virtual instance, RDC into each one as well.

once checking the "disc drives" option in RDC I can now map drives to
each virtual instance.

now to download Oracle 10g...


On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 9:27 AM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> thanx Chris
>
> IIRC it's NT4SP6 (or perhaps 6a) so according to the spec, it fits
>
> HOWEVER...
>
> ... the Unisys guys flown in from N.Z to do this have previously tried
> it and failed on this NT4 box.
>
> so that means plan B ...
>
> (I'm gonna have to change my name ... perhaps starting with "Z" so I'm
> not the obvious choice for "plan B's")
>
>
>
> On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 9:02 AM, Chris Velevitch
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 11:39 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> ** PS: I can't use the VMWare conversion tool to automatically migrate
>>> a physical box to a virtual environment... one of the physical
>>> webservers is NT4...
>>
>> Is the NT4 box SP4? (see
>> http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/converter_datasheet.pdf)
>>
>>
>>
>> Chris
>> --
>> Chris Velevitch
>> Manager - Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
>> m: 0415 469 095
>> www.flashdev.org.au
>>
>> Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
>> May meeting: tbd
>> Date: Mon 26th May 6pm for 6:30 start
>> Details and RSVP soon
>>
>> >>
>>
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Microsoft Uses Flash!!!

[Barry Beattie]

> They wouldn't make life harder for end users just to win this war
> would they?

I wouldn't be too concerned just yet.

thoughts on adding code for plug-in detection (and prompt for
download) is still secret squirrel stuff it seems:


"50 New Silverlight 2 Beta 1 Screencasts"
http://www.mtaulty.com/SLVideos.html

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[cfaussie] Re: what the hell is widgetsoft

[Barry Beattie]

Andrew, good on you for bringing this up.

> Junior developers
> asking whether they should try to learn it.  bosses asking whether we
> should start including the word in our pitches.  clients who have had
> a visit from their adobe rep asking whether this new stuff is really
> going to be valuable to them.

IMHO, these are the sort of questions that go down really well at
ColdFusion user groups.

sure it's one night out a month but you can tap into people who can
give you great answers to what it is and what it means for ColdFusion
developers

just the other week Dale Fraser in Melb did a CFUG presso on CF + Flex.

1) no one is an island.
2) CFUG's are there to help people
3) people forget 1) and 2)


(it's a programmers way to make Flash applications: Actionscript -
like C# or JavaScript with a HTML type mark-up language. alternative
to fancy Ajax-based web apps)


On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:50 PM, andrewlorien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I don't think Scott was referring to you, Mike.
> so i'm changing the subject of your thread, because it's much more
> interesting...
>
> you said:
>
>>And I had two calls this week from clients asking me what this
>>"Silverlight" thing is, and should they install it.   I was hoping to
>>be able to call them back and say something like "yes it's ok to
>>install.  have a look at  and you can see for
>>yourself what it does".
>
> As a coldfusion developer (who joined this list hoping people might
> sometimes talk about coldfusion, and not just whether it's dead), i
> get in a lot of conversations lately about Flex.  Junior developers
> asking whether they should try to learn it.  bosses asking whether we
> should start including the word in our pitches.  clients who have had
> a visit from their adobe rep asking whether this new stuff is really
> going to be valuable to them.
> But try to find a page you could show any of those people describing
> Flex
> adobe.com/flex was my first bet.
> you get this single sentence:
> "Flex is a highly productive, free open source framework for building
> and maintaining expressive web applications that deploy consistently
> on all major browsers, desktops, and operating systems."
> ok, so it's like html?
> the first link is to a video showing how to build a flex app.  lucky
> i'm a web programmer, and lucky i use Eclipse, it's at least a bit
> familiar to me.
> but after 30 seconds i stop it and go to the next link, "see sample
> apps".  but they aren't sample apps, they're tutorials.  i don't know
> what it is yet, so i haven't installed it, so tutorials aren't going
> to help me.
> so i try the last link on the page "view live flex apps".  which is
> finally going to help my boss and his client.  and i realise it's the
> same as the "view the flex showcase" link just UNDER "download flex"
> on the titlebar.
>
> i'm just doing the same rant as you were, Mike - complaining about
> being forced to install stuff before i know what it is.
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: what the hell is widgetsoft

[Barry Beattie]

Mike it's the teacher in me not yet dead yet.

I don't automatically assume people already know

besides, I fight against the gobble-de-gook promotion-speak that lots
of companies use

... esp Microsoft.


On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 4:27 PM, Mike Kear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:59 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> (it's a programmers way to make Flash applications: Actionscript -
>> like C# or JavaScript with a HTML type mark-up language. alternative
>> to fancy Ajax-based web apps)
>>
>
>
> Well done for you, Barry!   Thats the first time i have seen anyone
> attempt to explain what Flex is.   I wonder why no one in Adobe thinks
> they should explain what Flex is?
>
>
> Cheers
> Mike Kear
> Windsor, NSW, Australia
> Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer
> AFP Webworks
> http://afpwebworks.com
> ColdFusion, PHP, ASP, ASP.NET hosting from AUD$15/month
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Coldfusion Plesk File not found index.cfm

[Barry Beattie]

I've never heard of Plesk before... (sheltered life I suppose) ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plesk


is it any good? and if so, how?



On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 2:34 PM, Guennadi M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> It's probably of no use to you right now, but Plesk 8.4 (came out last
> week) now supports CF8 on Linux. May like to update your plesk to that
> (from within plesk) and then run CF/Plesk connection script from
> within Plesk control panel.
>
> Guennadi M
>
>
> On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi, I have a windows server with Plesk 8 and Coldfusion 7, after a
>> reboot Cold fusion stopped working.
>>
>> http://trainingdirectory.com.au/
>>
>> The web site you are accessing has experienced an unexpected error.
>> Please contact the website administrator.
>>
>> File not found: /index.cfm
>>
>> Coldfusion administrator still works and URLs to other files on the
>> website still work
>> http://trainingdirectory.com.au/images/1girl_000.jpg
>>
>> and other non cfm websites work on the server.
>>
>> So I guess its a mapping issue as plesk uses vhosts now wwwroot.
>>
>> Please help, Case of beer to best helper!
>>
>> I have remote admin access.
>>
>> Urgent please
>> >
>>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Coldfusion Plesk File not found index.cfm

[Barry Beattie]

don't leave us hanging with a mystery...

what fixed it? Gremlins?



On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 3:19 PM, Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Ok, I have CF working again, thanks for all your help, its great to
> see an active and helpful CF community.
>
> I understand why Server admins get gray hair and age 2 times faster
> than government workers. I need a beer.
>
> On May 22, 3:14 pm, Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Plesk is great, until you get a problem, as plesk changes your default
>> server settings.
>>
>> For users of the control panel, plesk much easier to use than cpanel.
>> I have used both. Cpanel offers more options though.
>>
>> Its a fedora server not window.
>>
>> The server has been running fine for 2 years, then for no reason, CFM
>> stops working. I have got to say that the reliability of coldfusion
>> server on windows is not that good if you where to compare it to PHP
>> which I have had allot less issues. I guess CF8 will fix these issues.
>>
>> Plesk reccomends installing CF then Plesk, this was done 2 years ago,
>> and the servers been fine up to now.
>>
>> can anyone help with CF going bad on linux?
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: CF Meetup 8am Tommorow

[Barry Beattie]

and just to confirm

for those people who have CFMeetup blocked by their corporate Nazi's,
thinking it's a waste-of-time social site...

the actual Breezo URL is at

http://experts.acrobat.com/cfmeetup/

yes?



On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 8:01 PM, George Lu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Sounds great! Dale. Just a bit earlier for me. I want to learn how to
> configure CF and Flex connection.
>
> 2008/5/22 Dale Fraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>
>> Anyone interested in my ColdFusion and Flex talk, I'll be giving it on the
>> CF Meetup tomorrow.
>>
>>
>>
>> You can tune in or watch the recording later.
>>
>>
>>
>> http://coldfusion.meetup.com/17/calendar/7928523/
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Dale Fraser
>>
>> http://learncf.com
>>
>> http://flexcf.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Adobe Online Festival - July 1

[Barry Beattie]

call me obtuse if you must, but I couldn't see anywhere on that
"Flash-y thing" that actually mentioned the date. At least it's not
obvious..

so if I was to forward the link on then it makes it a bit tricky for
the target to know when it's on (to see if they should register or
not).

Stick the date++ in the email? sure - if they remember to refer back
to it: it's seperating two pieces of data that then travel via two
different mediums. Multimodal literacies.




On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 12:14 PM, KC Kuok <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Just got this in the mailbox... On a sidenote I could not select
> Coldfusion 8 or Coldfusion 7 or earlier as I ran into some error that
> it threw, It went registered fine without both Coldfusion selected but
> failed if either or both were selected.
>
> http://www.adobeonlinefestival.com/
>
> :) the Adobe folk are going to get a hard time if they dont fix that
> by Webdu...
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: WebDU

[Barry Beattie]

> I've been to so many conferences and whatnot in Darling Harbour the
> last few years I'm sick of the place :)


surprising...

and they say you sand gropers never get a chance to escape...

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[cfaussie] Re: CODE WAR Day 0 needs you...

[Barry Beattie]

> Make that 6 - two teams have already entered from Queensland, so be
> quick!


GO QUEENSLAND!



On Wed, Jun 4, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Robin Hilliard
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On 03/06/2008, at 9:57 PM, Robin Hilliard wrote:
>
>> all we need are EIGHT LOCAL TEAMS!
>
> Make that 6 - two teams have already entered from Queensland, so be
> quick!
>
> Robin
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: cfchart problem

[Barry Beattie]

Duncan,

"I have an issue with cfchart - cf8 on windows. This issue is not
happen in cf7, it only surfaced when we upgraded"


have you checked the release notes of CF8? it's highly likely there's
some difference between the two versions.

http://www.adobe.com/support/documentation/en/coldfusion/8/releasenotes.pdf

"Previously, if you plotted more than one chart series with multiple
points, such that some points are present in one series but
missing from the other one, the cfchart tag would extrapolate the
values for the missing points. This behavior could not be
controlled by the user.
In this release, a new attribute isInterpolated="true|false",
controls this behavior. You specify this attribute in the style file of
the chart inside the  tag."





On Sat, Jun 7, 2008 at 11:00 AM, Duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> All,
>
> I have an issue with cfchart - cf8 on windows. This issue sis not happen in
> cf7, it only surfaced when we upgraded.
>
> go to www.checkmyrate.com.au and do a search with the following details:
>
> CBA, Standard Variable, 9.44, 30 years, 30, Principal and Interest.
>
> See how the green lin (Best CBA) sits at 0 until it meets the Red line (your
> rate)?
>
> Thats because there are 22 numbers for the CBA, and 30 for My Loan. Can
> anyone give me a clue as to how I stop the green line at 0 and stop CF
> joining it to the red line on 0?
>
>
> Here is the data for those lines:
>
> CBA:(22)
> 295806.718
> 291251.136435
> 286301.952624
> 280925.15933
> 275083.811097
> 268737.770376
> 261843.431736
> 254353.422238
> 246216.27592
> 237376.08016
> 227772.091486
> 217338.31819
> 206003.066882
> 193688.449861
> 180309.849929
> 165775.338963
> 149985.046249
> 132830.472245
> 114193.743047
> 93946.8004467
> 71950.5220054
> 48053.7651068
>
> My Loan: (30)
> 298206.718
> 296244.150179
> 294096.315957
> 291745.726183
> 289173.240735
> 286357.91266
> 283276.817616
> 279904.867199
> 276214.604662
> 272175.981343
> 267756.111982
> 262919.006953
> 257625.279209
> 251831.823567
> 245491.465712
> 238552.578075
> 230958.659445
> 222647.874897
> 213552.552287
> 203598.631224
> 192705.060011
> 180783.135676
> 167735.781684
> 153456.757476
> 137829.793381
> 120727.643877
> 102011.051459
> 81527.6127166
> 59110.5373572
> 34577.2900839
>
>
>
>
> --
> Duncan I Loxton
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: cfchart problem

[Barry Beattie]

"the cfchart tag would extrapolate the
values for the missing points"

additionally,you may not actually have missing points as such, unless
the CBA points/data 23 - 30 (your example) are "missing" compared to
the other amount. it would be because they are missing at the end of
the series where CBA is $0 and the new "isInterpolated" attribute
mightn't help. I'm thinking "X-Y" plotting with the X years duration
and Y loan $$$

"Thats because there are 22 numbers for the CBA, and 30 for My Loan"

exactly. while we (as humans) can compare the two curves of each
series, they are not the same because they each have different amounts
of points to plot (22 v 30). To plot the two series within the same
chart, CBA's points 23-30 (30 = my loan last point) are $0. both now
have 30 points.

is it possible, instead of using the X axis as the main part of the
series (which have variant plotting points), use the Y axis? both
loans start and finish the same (Y axis), only the X axis changes -
they should both generate the same number of points then. both CBA and
"My Loan" would then hit $0 on their 30th point  (just at diffent
years), although it'd be a  hell'o'a' calculation, since at the moment
you're obviously using years to calculate each $ amount.

this might not be a CF7/CF8 problem per se, but a more correct
interpretation by CF8 on how the chart should work in this situation
(ie: CF7 was sloppy, CF8 tightened it up - this is not unheard of)

just throwing ideas around, YMMV

cheers
barry.b







On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 8:50 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Duncan,
>
> "I have an issue with cfchart - cf8 on windows. This issue is not
> happen in cf7, it only surfaced when we upgraded"
>
>
> have you checked the release notes of CF8? it's highly likely there's
> some difference between the two versions.
>
> http://www.adobe.com/support/documentation/en/coldfusion/8/releasenotes.pdf
>
> "Previously, if you plotted more than one chart series with multiple
> points, such that some points are present in one series but
> missing from the other one, the cfchart tag would extrapolate the
> values for the missing points. This behavior could not be
> controlled by the user.
> In this release, a new attribute isInterpolated="true|false",
> controls this behavior. You specify this attribute in the style file of
> the chart inside the  tag."
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 7, 2008 at 11:00 AM, Duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> All,
>>
>> I have an issue with cfchart - cf8 on windows. This issue sis not happen in
>> cf7, it only surfaced when we upgraded.
>>
>> go to www.checkmyrate.com.au and do a search with the following details:
>>
>> CBA, Standard Variable, 9.44, 30 years, 30, Principal and Interest.
>>
>> See how the green lin (Best CBA) sits at 0 until it meets the Red line (your
>> rate)?
>>
>> Thats because there are 22 numbers for the CBA, and 30 for My Loan. Can
>> anyone give me a clue as to how I stop the green line at 0 and stop CF
>> joining it to the red line on 0?
>>
>>
>> Here is the data for those lines:
>>
>> CBA:(22)
>> 295806.718
>> 291251.136435
>> 286301.952624
>> 280925.15933
>> 275083.811097
>> 268737.770376
>> 261843.431736
>> 254353.422238
>> 246216.27592
>> 237376.08016
>> 227772.091486
>> 217338.31819
>> 206003.066882
>> 193688.449861
>> 180309.849929
>> 165775.338963
>> 149985.046249
>> 132830.472245
>> 114193.743047
>> 93946.8004467
>> 71950.5220054
>> 48053.7651068
>>
>> My Loan: (30)
>> 298206.718
>> 296244.150179
>> 294096.315957
>> 291745.726183
>> 289173.240735
>> 286357.91266
>> 283276.817616
>> 279904.867199
>> 276214.604662
>> 272175.981343
>> 267756.111982
>> 262919.006953
>> 257625.279209
>> 251831.823567
>> 245491.465712
>> 238552.578075
>> 230958.659445
>> 222647.874897
>> 213552.552287
>> 203598.631224
>> 192705.060011
>> 180783.135676
>> 167735.781684
>> 153456.757476
>> 137829.793381
>> 120727.643877
>> 102011.051459
>> 81527.6127166
>> 59110.5373572
>> 34577.2900839
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Duncan I Loxton
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >>
>>
>

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[cfaussie] CFLIB.org re-release - lots of CF code - check it out

[Barry Beattie]

The new http://www.cflib.org/ is now live! and it looks a lot better too!

for those that might not have known (or forgotten), CFLib is a
repository of a vast number of utility functions and helpers (all
written in CFScript). it's been around since CF5.0 days.

you shouldn't need to write your own date functions, or conversions
from queries to arrays of structs: it's already been done!

thanks to David Harris (CFugNewZealand) for the heads-up of the re-release



CFMLLib
Last Updated September 18, 2007
Number of UDFs: 23
A library that mimics CFML tags.

DatabaseLib
Last Updated February 15, 2008
Number of UDFs: 16
A library containing database specific funcitons (written in CFML).

DataManipulationLib
Last Updated April 30, 2008
Number of UDFs: 142
A set of functions that work with data. For example, converting a
query to a structure.

DateLib
Last Updated June 4, 2008
Number of UDFs: 149
A library of date/time related functions.

FileSysLib
Last Updated January 22, 2008
Number of UDFs: 60
A set of funcitons that interact with the file system at various
levels (drive, directory, file).

FinancialLib
Last Updated June 4, 2008
Number of UDFs: 10
A library devoted to financial (monetary) based functions.

MathLib
Last Updated January 2, 2007
Number of UDFs: 132
A set of mathematical functions. This includes geometry, trig,
statistical, and general math functions.

NetLib
Last Updated January 12, 2006
Number of UDFs: 17
A library for Internet related UDFs.

ScienceLib
Last Updated April 9, 2007
Number of UDFs: 21
A set of UDFs dedicated to scientific equations.

SecurityLib
Last Updated April 9, 2007
Number of UDFs: 22
A set of security related functions.

StrLib
Last Updated April 11, 2008
Number of UDFs: 319
A set of string functions. This includes HTML stripping and other
string manipulating functions.

UtilityLib
Last Updated June 5, 2008
Number of UDFs: 133
A set of utility functions for dealing with miscellaneous tasks.

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[cfaussie] Re: CFLIB.org re-release - lots of CF code - check it out

[Barry Beattie]

ahhh ... I think that's because you're drilling down into the
individual libraries as you're checking out the functions within each
of them.

the individual libraries are top-level and not static (although slow
to change - it's rare that a totally new library would be created -
but not impossible)

so what you're saying is that, by the time you're in the bowels of one
library, you lose where you are? it's perhaps deceptive that it's only
three layers deep: front page-> functions within each library ->
individual function listing. But there *is* a lot of width there.

perhaps a simple breadcrumb trail to bring you back up to the front
page where all the libraries are llisted?

just kicking around ideas.



On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 2:41 PM, andrewlorien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> i got lost too, trying to guess which rabbithole to run down...
> the search box worked great.
>
> andrew
>
> On Jun 10, 2:10 pm, "Steve Onnis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Once you drill down into the site it becomes a bit difficult to navigate
>> around I am finding. There is no menu system at all.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>>
>> Of Raymond Camden
>> Sent: Tuesday, 10 June 2008 10:50 AM
>> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: [cfaussie] Re: CFLIB.org re-release - lots of CF code - check it
>> out
>>
>> Thanks for the mention Barry. If anyone has any questions or objections, I'm
>> on the list, so ask away.
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 9, 2008 at 6:02 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > The newhttp://www.cflib.org/is now live! and it looks a lot better too!
>>
>> > for those that might not have known (or forgotten), CFLib is a
>> > repository of a vast number of utility functions and helpers (all
>> > written in CFScript). it's been around since CF5.0 days.
>>
>> > you shouldn't need to write your own date functions, or conversions
>> > from queries to arrays of structs: it's already been done!
>>
>> > thanks to David Harris (CFugNewZealand) for the heads-up of the
>> > re-release
>>
>> --
>> ===
>> Raymond Camden, VP of Software Dev, Broadchoice
>>
>> Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Blog :www.coldfusionjedi.com
>> AOL IM : cfjedimaster
>>
>> Keep up to date with the community:http://www.coldfusionbloggers.org
> >
>

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[cfaussie] GO QUEENSLAND!

[Barry Beattie]

http://www.rocketboots.com.au/blog/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=716A74E1-F4BE-4D1D-7D4F8DE8F61E977D
http://www.rocketboots.com.au/blog/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=2D14685D-D381-1033-FB37E4910079A845


and no, I don't mean Maroons vs the Blues tonight.


Good to see Qld fielded two teams in the Code Wars while Sydney (and
Melbourne) could only manage one each...








(geez this list is dead this week ... anyone think that there's
something happening elsewhere...)

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[cfaussie] Re: GO QUEENSLAND!

[Barry Beattie]

"Anyone not going has any burning questions to ask Adobe?"

yeah, since this is a CF list 

...what's Adobe people's opinions - real opinions, not a watered down
company line/politician-speak that says nothing - on both Open
BlueDragon and the free-Railo teaming up with JBoss...

... roadmap for, not just CF9 but where CF10 is heading, esp in
regards to both LCDS/BlazeDS and the LiveCycle ES (J2EE workflow
product) (and whether these plans are for just Enterprise edition or
all)








On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 10:51 AM, KC Kuok <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Its called the calm before the storm... Anyone not going has any
> burning questions to ask Adobe? We could probably field it for you
> (And it might be a question we have not thought about yet so don't be
> shy)
>
> On Jun 11, 10:08 am, "Barry Beattie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> http://www.rocketboots.com.au/blog/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=716A74E...http://www.rocketboots.com.au/blog/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=2D14685...
>>
>> and no, I don't mean Maroons vs the Blues tonight.
>>
>> Good to see Qld fielded two teams in the Code Wars while Sydney (and
>> Melbourne) could only manage one each...
>>
>> (geez this list is dead this week ... anyone think that there's
>> something happening elsewhere...)
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: GO QUEENSLAND!

[Barry Beattie]

well, far be it of me to rub salt into the wounds


but in addition to Queensland thrashing NSW 30-0 at the State of
Origin league game last night


it was another Queensland win at last nights' Code Wars with
(unofficial reports**) the Qld team "Tane Coders" winning the "War".
Good on yer Gareth and team.


thanks to Robin Hilliard for orgainising the Code Wars, Geoff Bowers for WebDU.

surprised no one has blogged about this yet. they all must be
hung-over/busy with the Keynote...


(** thanx Andrew Mercer - CFUG-WA -  with a quick IM of the news)



On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 10:21 AM, Rony Fayyad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Go Sydney  in the war...and Go the blues tonight
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of Barry Beattie
> Sent: Wednesday, 11 June 2008 10:08 AM
> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [cfaussie] GO QUEENSLAND!
>
>
> http://www.rocketboots.com.au/blog/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=716A74E1-F4BE-
> 4D1D-7D4F8DE8F61E977D
> http://www.rocketboots.com.au/blog/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=2D14685D-D381-
> 1033-FB37E4910079A845
>
>
> and no, I don't mean Maroons vs the Blues tonight.
>
>
> Good to see Qld fielded two teams in the Code Wars while Sydney (and
> Melbourne) could only manage one each...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> (geez this list is dead this week ... anyone think that there's
> something happening elsewhere...)
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: WebDU twitter group?

[Barry Beattie]

nine? huh?

you mean you, me and seven others? surely there's more [1]

so far any WebDU news is very slow to leak out. took a bit of
detective work to see who won last nights Code Wars (or are you
Victorians embarrassed it was a Qld win too?[2])



[1] maybe there will be after people have read this
[2] more salt. just for good measure...




On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 9:43 AM, Mark Mandel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Who is the master for this?
>
> As we need to get them to get them to follow all 9 people on the webDU
> twitter group ;o)
>
> Mark
>
> On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Mark Mandel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> webDU needs to follow the people following it, so there is a way to
>> view all the things those people are saying ;o)
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 4:04 PM, Rae Buerckner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> Sounds good, I'm now following @webdu :)
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Rae
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 1:03 PM, Geoff Bowers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

 On Jun 11, 11:50 am, "Andrew Muller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 > What about using Twemes:http://twemes.com/??

 Looks like we now have:
 #webdu for the tweme
 @webdu for the tweets


 That sound right?

 -- geoff
 http://www.daemon.com.au/

>>>
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> W: www.compoundtheory.com
>>
>
>
>
> --
> E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> W: www.compoundtheory.com
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

> Best book ever.
>
> Head First: Design Patterns

seconded.

but be careful, many people have made the mistake to throw as many
patterns at a project as possible.

all patterns do is give you a Linga Franks (common language) to
communicate various common/frequent problems and some possible
answers. the whole reason is to identify something that's been seen
before to then find a solution.

Think of it as a dictionary of ideas where people having similar
experiences can communicate.

favourites?
singleton ("there can be only one" .. oops, that's Highlander)
Factory classes, factory methods: (the cookie cutter)
adapter pattern (cheap converter code that can fit between two API's
without needing to change the API's)

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

(I meant lingua franca ... getting my Latin mixed up... mea maximus culpa**)


another though - get Robin Hilliard to present at your local user
group. He's got a couple of presentations now on OO stuff (inc
CFInterface). what with a bit of a read of the book Andrew suggested
and hearing Robin going on about "Gold code" and "disposable code" and
MVC and whatnot, it'll all start making sense soon enough










** "my bad"







On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 3:57 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Best book ever.
>>
>> Head First: Design Patterns
>
> seconded.
>
> but be careful, many people have made the mistake to throw as many
> patterns at a project as possible.
>
> all patterns do is give you a Linga Franks (common language) to
> communicate various common/frequent problems and some possible
> answers. the whole reason is to identify something that's been seen
> before to then find a solution.
>
> Think of it as a dictionary of ideas where people having similar
> experiences can communicate.
>
> favourites?
> singleton ("there can be only one" .. oops, that's Highlander)
> Factory classes, factory methods: (the cookie cutter)
> adapter pattern (cheap converter code that can fit between two API's
> without needing to change the API's)
>

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

(last post - promise)

actually, Charlie Arehart's CFMeetup group are having an online presso
tomorrow morning (8:00am)


[blurb]


When: Thursday, June 12, 6:00pm US EDT (UTC/GMT-5) (What time is that
for you? See 
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2008&month=06&day=12&hour=18&min=00&sec=0&p1=25
which shows the time as US EDT and you can choose your city from the
list offered to see what time that is in your own timezone.)

Meeting URL: http://experts.acrobat.com/cfmeetup/
Duration: Approx. 1 hour

Our talk for Thursday, June 12 will have Dan Wilson presenting
"Refactoring in ColdFusion: From Procedural to OO".

Description: (provided by the speaker)

If you would like to know how to migrate an existing procedurally
programmed application into an object oriented one, grab a chair and
sit for a while.

We'll discuss some sensible guidelines designed to help you make
incremental changes towards OO nirvana.

We'll also look at lots of code samples, we all like code samples, right?





On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 4:10 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> (I meant lingua franca ... getting my Latin mixed up... mea maximus culpa**)
>
>
> another though - get Robin Hilliard to present at your local user
> group. He's got a couple of presentations now on OO stuff (inc
> CFInterface). what with a bit of a read of the book Andrew suggested
> and hearing Robin going on about "Gold code" and "disposable code" and
> MVC and whatnot, it'll all start making sense soon enough
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ** "my bad"
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 3:57 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> Best book ever.
>>>
>>> Head First: Design Patterns
>>
>> seconded.
>>
>> but be careful, many people have made the mistake to throw as many
>> patterns at a project as possible.
>>
>> all patterns do is give you a Linga Franks (common language) to
>> communicate various common/frequent problems and some possible
>> answers. the whole reason is to identify something that's been seen
>> before to then find a solution.
>>
>> Think of it as a dictionary of ideas where people having similar
>> experiences can communicate.
>>
>> favourites?
>> singleton ("there can be only one" .. oops, that's Highlander)
>> Factory classes, factory methods: (the cookie cutter)
>> adapter pattern (cheap converter code that can fit between two API's
>> without needing to change the API's)
>>
>

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[cfaussie] wow! WebDU must be brilliant this year... all I hear is crickets chirping

[Barry Beattie]

everyone must be having a great time and really riveted to their presentations:

the blogosphere is empty
hardly anyone is on IM
even the twittering has dried up: http://twemes.com/webdu

too busy to report back... sounds like a case of no news is _very_ good news.

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[cfaussie] Re: wow! WebDU must be brilliant this year... all I hear is crickets chirping

[Barry Beattie]

at this rate, ESP or other forms of divination...



On Fri, Jun 13, 2008 at 9:07 AM, MrBuzzy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm here... on the other side of the world :)
>
> What's the best way to follow the WebDU happenings from a far?
>
> On Fri, Jun 13, 2008 at 12:00 AM, Rae Buerckner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Barry,
>>
>> Are you at WebDU, twitter says too many tweets, it's down.  My shoulder is
>> killing me from 10 pin bowling :S  running very late, may make it back to
>> WebDU by about 10:30 :)
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rae
>>
>> On Fri, Jun 13, 2008 at 8:51 AM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> everyone must be having a great time and really riveted to their
>>> presentations:
>>>
>>> the blogosphere is empty
>>> hardly anyone is on IM
>>> even the twittering has dried up: http://twemes.com/webdu
>>>
>>> too busy to report back... sounds like a case of no news is _very_ good
>>> news.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: wow! WebDU must be brilliant this year... all I hear is crickets chirping

[Barry Beattie]

so, did anyone get an answer to my two questions?

(1) ...what's Adobe people's opinions - real opinions, not a watered down
company line/politician-speak that says nothing - on both Open
BlueDragon and the free-Railo teaming up with JBoss...


(2) ... roadmap for, not just CF9 but where CF10 is heading, esp in
regards to both LCDS/BlazeDS middleware (on one side) [1] as it works
in with Java-backends
 - and - the LiveCycle ES (J2EE workflow product) [2]


[1] keeping in mind what CF already has built-in, and has been there
in one form or another since CF6.1
[2] specifically integration points (if any) as well as some (and only
some) areas where both encroach on each other as

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[cfaussie] "ColdFusion's Future So Bright I Gotta Wear Shades"... (CF9 details)

[Barry Beattie]

as the coffee settles and people start to wake up, check out some of
the announcements coming out of CFUnited:


http://www.tofinha.com.br/blog/index.cfm/2008/6/18/The-Future-of-ColdFusion-by-Adobes-CF-United-Keynote

(which for me are the two most important points: educational
institution use, committee for a formal spec)

http://www.insideria.com/2008/06/coldfusion-9-details.html

with a ton of other stuff emerging (WTF? Hibernate Baked In? v.cool)

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

Barnes' thoughts (or similar) are being echoed over on the CFC Dev
list at the moment with people like Peter Bell, Sean Corfield, Brian
Kotek and our very own Mark Mandel, amongst others.

http://groups.google.com/group/cfcdev/browse_thread/thread/2e90c0dbfecf5a59
" Doubts about Best Practices"

why was fusebox invented in the firstplace? to push people into doing
something more than writing spaghetti code. but you gotta have an idea
of how to fix it before you can fully appreciate the problem. Hence
the value of learning about design patterns. See the Donald Rumsfeld
quote at the bottom

let me leave you with some quotes:

 ... two from Albert Einstein

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more
violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move
in the opposite direction."
 - and -
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler."

 ... one I got reminded from by (of all people) Gary Menzel

"Code for maintainance"

... and Donald Rumsfeld really sums it up

"As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know.
We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there
are some things we do not know.
But there are also unknown unknowns, The ones we don't know we don't know."

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

a fair point, Blair

the other side of the equation of course is too much hand-holding that
it gets in the way, either by abstracting too much of the detail so
you don't know what's happening under the covers - or - it just plain
gets it wrong in edge-cases (special headers needed in CF webservices
spring to mind)

I've still got a great memory of a WebDU breakfast a couple of years
back where Chuck was showing how easy it was to build an ASP.NET
application in VS2005 ... which promptly broke when he ran it and he
had to go back to rebuild it and apply some setting he'd forgotten ...
happens to the best of us.


but this isn't helping Adam much...

Adam, if you're still reading this, revisit the CFC dev website to get
a feel for how important "it depends" means when someone like Sean
Corfield says it.

simple things will get you most of the way there
 - keep your view totally separate from your data access code
 - identify the "Gold" code (ie: it costs a fortune to make) and
protect that "investment" (eg: from change + retesting)
 - you can probably get away with having DAO's for single record
access (CRUD) and "gateway" CFC's for the rest. At least it's
something. Lots of choices to join up the middle bits
 - look at what Transfer can give you as a way to get things happening
quickly for data access
 - queries are more convenient (and faster) than arrays of objects,
structs easier to pass around than single objects
 - you gotta know the rules before you break them but breaking them is OK

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

is this turning into a Frameworks Vs tools debate?


Imagine you're used to using both. if you had to loose one, which one
would you loose?

personally, I'd rather write code using a framework with Notepad than
spaghetti code with VS2005.


(and Scott: there's a lot of similarities between the core .NET
"framework" and CF's abstraction of it's underlying Java code)







On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Rae Buerckner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Lol.. Scott you do make me laugh, in a good way ;)
>
> The difference is the frameworks in CF are about community and are open
> source, and Flex Builder has a plugin for CF Frameworks as does the Eclipse
> IDE :)  Which makes the frameworks part of the tool.
>
> Cheers,
>
> R
>
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 4:00 PM, Scott Barnes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>>
>> I wasn't there but i never missed an oppurtunity to rub his nose in that
>> one... chuck says hi btw :)
>>
>> .NET = Framework that's the zinger in this convo.. We agree frameworks
>> rock, we also agree that tools play a roll in keeping the code maitenance in
>> a happy state.. point is, if you're writing a framework to keep your
>> codebase maintainable when a tool could in theory take over the burden, then
>> what problem is being solved and who should own it tommorow (you own it
>> today, but it shouldn't stop there).
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 11:56 PM, Rae Buerckner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Lol... I remember that breakfast Barry!
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 4:44 PM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> a fair point, Blair
>>>>
>>>> the other side of the equation of course is too much hand-holding that
>>>> it gets in the way, either by abstracting too much of the detail so
>>>> you don't know what's happening under the covers - or - it just plain
>>>> gets it wrong in edge-cases (special headers needed in CF webservices
>>>> spring to mind)
>>>>
>>>> I've still got a great memory of a WebDU breakfast a couple of years
>>>> back where Chuck was showing how easy it was to build an ASP.NET
>>>> application in VS2005 ... which promptly broke when he ran it and he
>>>> had to go back to rebuild it and apply some setting he'd forgotten ...
>>>> happens to the best of us.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> but this isn't helping Adam much...
>>>>
>>>> Adam, if you're still reading this, revisit the CFC dev website to get
>>>> a feel for how important "it depends" means when someone like Sean
>>>> Corfield says it.
>>>>
>>>> simple things will get you most of the way there
>>>>  - keep your view totally separate from your data access code
>>>>  - identify the "Gold" code (ie: it costs a fortune to make) and
>>>> protect that "investment" (eg: from change + retesting)
>>>>  - you can probably get away with having DAO's for single record
>>>> access (CRUD) and "gateway" CFC's for the rest. At least it's
>>>> something. Lots of choices to join up the middle bits
>>>>  - look at what Transfer can give you as a way to get things happening
>>>> quickly for data access
>>>>  - queries are more convenient (and faster) than arrays of objects,
>>>> structs easier to pass around than single objects
>>>>  - you gotta know the rules before you break them but breaking them is
>>>> OK
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

> Heh, well I use Transfer, but I'm, biased, no? ;o)

Mark, still worthy of 2c worth of comment:

Why did you develop Transfer in the first place?

Those that use it (and you strike up a rapport with) - why do they use it?

Those that did use Transfer but seldom do so now ... why did they change?

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

this seems to be timely on this topic:

http://www.12robots.com/index.cfm/2008/6/29/MVC--IoC--ORM--Amazing-learning-experience-and-a-lot-of-fun

"It's been coming along nicely, yet slowly, as I learn and rework
things. It has really been an awesome learning experience. I am amazed
by the frameworks and the OO methodologies."

(and Transfer gets _another_ mention ... geez it's everywhere ... like
a weed...)

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[cfaussie] Re: Text change percentage or score

[Barry Beattie]

just kicking around ideas...how do you define what is changed?

individual letter placement?
words?
order?

is this a 100% change?

1) Hi my name is Steve
2) name Hi is Steve my


how about this?

1) Hi my name is Steve
1) hI MY NAME IS sTEVE




On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 4:20 PM, Steve Onnis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Does anyone know of a method where you can calculate either by percentage or
> score or something as to how much a string has changed?
>
> For example:
> 1) Hi my name is Steve
> 2) Hi my name is John
>
> Only the name has changed to the actual percentage change would be low, like
> 20%
>
> Or
>
> 1) Hi my name is Steve
> 2) The cow jumped over the moon
>
> The percentage change would be high, like 100%
>
>
>
> Steve
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Is this safe?

[Barry Beattie]

if it's going to be checked somewhere (and you can trust it), sure.
you gotta know the rules before you can break them.

you got contingency for an empty date being passed into that functions argument?



On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 11:24 AM, Chris Velevitch
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I have a function that runs a query and the function has a required
> argument of type date.
>
> Would it be safe to use the argument in the query without using
> cfqueryparam for that argument?
>
> I'm thinking that the function argument type would be checked the time
> the function is called.
>
> --
> Chris
> --
> Chris Velevitch
> Manager - Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> m: 0415 469 095
> www.apugs.org.au
>
> Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> July meeting: Taming The Code
> Date: Mon 28th July 6pm for 6:30 start
> Details to follow.
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Is this safe?

[Barry Beattie]

well, because ColdFusion doesn't have generics nor nulls, no date is
actually an empty string (although it's still an argument passed)
...but that isn't a date and a datatype mismatch error is thrown.




On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 12:00 PM, Seona Bellamy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> But that just checks that the argument was passed something. I don't
> think it checks that it's not an empty string, does it? Just that it
> exists in the call to the function.
>
> ~Seona
>
> 2008/7/3 Chris Velevitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 11:29 AM, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> you got contingency for an empty date being passed into that functions 
>>> argument?
>>
>> Doesn't making the argument required handle that?
>>
>>
>> Chris
>> --
>> Chris Velevitch
>> Manager - Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
>> m: 0415 469 095
>> www.apugs.org.au
>>
>> Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
>> July meeting: Taming The Code
>> Date: Mon 28th July 6pm for 6:30 start
>> Details to follow.
>>
>> >
>>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Per application mapping

[Barry Beattie]

Rony,

just to back up Ray's comment of "If something breaks, its your code's fault"

think of it as a ticking time-bomb just waiting to go off.
 - one job: an upgrade from CF6.1 to CF7 broke the use of request
headers for an ISAPI filter-based authentication. The ISAPI filter was
broken and CF6 hid it.
 - another: upgrade from CF6.1 to CF7 showed the incorrect use of
cfbreak within cfswitch and some arrays that were assumed (by an
experienced C programmer new to CF) to be passed by reference (but
obviously by value).

of course, if the app has a shelf life of only the rest of the year,
then it's not worth it, but if something breaks on a straightforward
change like App.cfm to App.cfc, there's a bigger story there that may
pay dividends in getting to the bottom of. An accident waiting to
happen, perhaps?

just bringing up some points as ammunition if you're talking to the
boss, nothing more.


On Fri, Jul 4, 2008 at 7:42 AM, Rony Fayyad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Ray, thanks for that.
>
> I have not investigated the reason why the application failed , but it is
> beyond my control and my decision as to whether we move to application.cfc
> or not.
>
> I do find that application.cfc is much easier and cleaner and I love it. I
> use it for all my other projects  but with this existing application, I
> simply cannot ( at the present time anyways ).
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of Raymond Camden
> Sent: Friday, 4 July 2008 1:21 AM
> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Per application mapping
>
>
> I'm not sure this comment really makes sense. Having a OO designed
> model isnt' really something that forces you to use Application.cfc.
> The main thing App.cfc gives you is more fine grained control over
> application events and settings.
>
> That being said - Rony, definitely switch. If something breaks, its
> your code's fault. I'd be willing to bet you guys used onRequest and
> that broke your web service/flash remoting calls. The fix for that is
> to just remove it. ;)
>
> On Wed, Jul 2, 2008 at 11:51 PM, Scott Barnes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> Application.CFC is the only way to fly as you set yourself up for better
> OO
>> composition.
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Rony Fayyad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Well one of my colleagues was saying that using application.cfc broke
> some
>>> of the application. Can't recall what it was but that is why we have not
>>> moved into the application.cfc yet.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks for your feedback Mark. Much appreciated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>>> Behalf Of Mark Mandel
>>> Sent: Thursday, 3 July 2008 2:18 PM
>>> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Per application mapping
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yup, you can only do it application.cfc
>>>
>>> Why don't you convert the application.cfm to a .cfc, it's usually pretty
>>> straight forward.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Rony <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> I have utilised the CF8 per application mapping in a couple of my
>>> projects that all use application.cfc.
>>>
>>> Now, I am working on a project that uses application.cfm. Doing what i
>>> did in the application.cfc for other projects DID NOT work for the
>>> application.cfm
>>>
>>> Does the per application setting ONLY work for application.cfc and NOT
>>> application.cfm?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> W: www.compoundtheory.com
>>>
>>> >>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ===
> Raymond Camden, VP of Software Dev, Broadchoice
>
> Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Blog : www.coldfusionjedi.com
> AOL IM : cfjedimaster
>
> Keep up to date with the community: http://www.coldfusionbloggers.org
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: cfinclude and parent document variables

[Barry Beattie]

> The only times I have seen this occur is when

> 3. The application name is changed

[mad guess, inspired by above]

how about there being a ton of websites on the same machine, it's
either CF professional - or - enterprise not sandboxed correctly, and
two applications having the same name?

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[cfaussie] Re: cfinclude and parent document variables

[Barry Beattie]

it might if one site checks for some application scope variable in
Application.cfm, doesn't find it (wrong site), and has code to reload
application scope again.

... OK so it's a mad thought in between fighting my own apps behaving badly...

back to the real world:

@David: how is this product_name used within the included file?





On Fri, Jul 4, 2008 at 12:19 PM, Simon Haddon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Interestingly enough I don't believe that would cause a variable to
> dissappear.  If 2 applications shared the same name then you could probably
> cause a lot of other undesired results or use it to corrupt/steal
> information from another application but it should not result in a variable
> dissappearing.
>
> On 04/07/2008, Barry Beattie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> > The only times I have seen this occur is when
>>
>> > 3. The application name is changed
>>
>> [mad guess, inspired by above]
>>
>> how about there being a ton of websites on the same machine, it's
>> either CF professional - or - enterprise not sandboxed correctly, and
>> two applications having the same name?
>> >>
>

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[cfaussie] Re: CFC Design Patterns

[Barry Beattie]

just in case anyone is still reading this thread and looking at
getting their toes wet with ORMs (as a way of _NOT_ writing a ton of
SQL - and - looking at life through more object-focussed eyes)...


Bob Silverberg has written a bunch of blog posts on using Transfer:
--
http://www.silverwareconsulting.com/index.cfm/2008/6/23/How-I-Use-Transfer--Part-I--Introduction

* How I Use Transfer - Part IV - My Abstract Service Object (July 3, 2008)
* How I Use Transfer - Part III - Abstract Objects (June 30, 2008)
* How I Use Transfer - Part II - Model Architecture (June 24, 2008)
--

certainly worth the read, IMHO.

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[cfaussie] Re: How do I do concurrent database CRUD in the same application?

[Barry Beattie]

for a while I've been trying to work out what's actually happening
within CFTransaction. if anyone knows for definite, I'm all ears.

the best I've come up with is that it uses only one db connection (it
has to: otherwise you couldn't do "serialzable"). What I suspect is
that it throws the SQL at the database but holds the commit command
until the  is run and the rollback isn't triggered (or
the commit is explicitly called).

so it's likely that all SQL within the body of the 
tag is held in an uncommitted state and none of it - logging calls in
another cfquery block within included - will be committed if rollback
occurs.


I can see what you're getting at: ensuring the log details refers
directly to that transaction taking place, whether it succeeds or
fails.

apart from suggesting a trigger/doing the logging on the db side, the
only other thing I can think of (in the 30 seconds of though I've
given it) is give up on the transaction for the logs and just collect
enough info within the transaction (inc a success/fail flag) to do a
log entry straight after?









On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Chris Velevitch
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> How do you do application logging into the same database inside a
> transaction that might get rolled back?
>
> --
> Chris
> --
> Chris Velevitch
> Manager - Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> m: 0415 469 095
> www.apugs.org.au
>
> Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> July meeting: Taming The Code
> Date: Mon 28th July 6pm for 6:30 start
> Details to follow.
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: How do I do concurrent database CRUD in the same application?

[Barry Beattie]

"Now the thing that I am not 100% sure on is a nested cftransaction"


sorry, they are an item that was conspicuous in it's absence in CF8.
for us who are used to such things elsewhere it's something that could
come in handy (although they do have their own pain, as far as how CF
would be able to deploy the idea)


maybe for CF9?

http://www.alagad.com/go/blog-entry/cf-wishlist-named-transactions




On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 4:52 PM, CyberAngel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Chris,
>
> I am surprised you haven't gotten a reply as of yet.
>
> The way I understand it, and I haven't had a chance to look at it yet. But
> if I think it works the way it should then you could do something like this.
>
> 
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
>
> Now the thing that I am not 100% sure on is a nested cftransaction
> action="commit" so it could look something like this.
>
> 
>  
>
>  
>   ... Do the log transfer
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
>
> However, if it was me and I am not sure how you are doing this or what logic
> you have. But it sounds like a log is going to happen no matter if a
> transaction to the DB is successful or not. Which means this is your better
> bet.
>
> 
>  
>  .. do your sql logic here
>  
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
>  ... Do the log transfaction
> 
>
> This way the log is done no matter what, but both scenarios should work.
> Just never done it myself.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of Chris Velevitch
> Sent: Monday, 7 July 2008 11:28 AM
> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [cfaussie] How do I do concurrent database CRUD in the same
> application?
>
>
> How do you do application logging into the same database inside a
> transaction that might get rolled back?
>
> --
> Chris
> --
> Chris Velevitch
> Manager - Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> m: 0415 469 095
> www.apugs.org.au
>
> Adobe Platform Users Group, Sydney
> July meeting: Taming The Code
> Date: Mon 28th July 6pm for 6:30 start
> Details to follow.
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: Linkedin and similar - any one finds them useful?

[Barry Beattie]

Hi Rae

> check out www.acidlabs.org

anything specific you're referring to of Stephens thinking? I mean,
Trib's right on top of the action when it comes to social media,
connecting people, etc ... and he's got some really good ideas and
thought provoking thoughts ... but is there anything specific relating
to Linkedin you're referring to?

Mike, IMHO, you can have too much of a good thing. I'm not a gun for
hire like you are so I find things like Linked-In of limited use to go
nuts with. In fact I get more action tracing someone else's profile
(eg a potential employer) than building my own. I got berated recently
for letting my Facebook page languish with cobwebs.

but there are a ton of registry/connecting spaces around. Pretty hard
to manage them all. It's also pretty hard to twitter / forum post /
blog / present / be seen at a sustainable high level (although Trib
seems to manage fine) - but I can just imagine if you stop people
would suspect you've fallen off a cliff or something.

in the end, just like I found in the music industry, it always comes
down to people who's at the front of your mind that always gets the
gig. Talented people who aren't everywhere being seen get forgotten
easily. Typical supermarket  checkout magazine fodder show the other
side of that coin (the talentless who are everywhere).

meh, as always, it's not what you know, it's who. and if they hardly
know you and you get a call, they're getting desperate.

my cynical 2c from seeing it all before
barry.b

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[cfaussie] Re: ReReplaceNoCase - return only a decimal number

[Barry Beattie]

@Scott

Zac has the correct/official way of doing what you want:

from livedocs on LSParseCurrency:

"Converts a locale-specific currency string into a formatted number.
Attempts conversion by comparing the string with each the three
supported currency formats (none, local, international) and using the
first that matches."


what you do is correct - for your locale - but

europeans do wierd stuff with thousands seperators and decimal places.
you say which locale you're working in and LSParseCurrency adjusts to
exactly what you want.

eh my 2c, learnt from bitter experience.
barry.b

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[cfaussie] Re: ReReplaceNoCase - return only a decimal number

[Barry Beattie]

I think one of the biggest sources of misunderstanding is simply the
fact that ColdFusion is loose datatypes.

$123,456.78 is a string. A string representing a monetary amount.

but if you look at that going into a database (or even code doing
calculations like tax percentages), that's where the need is to
convert it to a (usually four decimal place) float (number).

am I advocating Coldfusion to become strongly typed like Java and C#?
no way, not in a million years. it ain't broke. but it does need an
extra "implicit" data conversion in the mind of the coder...

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[cfaussie] Re: ReReplaceNoCase - return only a decimal number

[Barry Beattie]

> LSParseCurrency would be used if you want to convert a number to a currency

no, it will try to parse anything - string, number, whatever - to a
the currency subtype of a float.
the official docs says it will take a string, and in CF speak, that
means anything you throw at it. whether it errors is another issue.

if Scott is looking for a quick fix, then, yes, Steve has the answer
with his RegEx because of that typo. But I gotta ask, how could that
typo get there in the first place? (since it's the only thing stopping
LSParseCurrency from being used)

and what would happen with $21o.08? on a keyboard "o" is right next to
the zero. is that twenty-one dollars or two hundred and ten after
conversion?


>
> Did I read the original question right? If so then why not just use
> NumberFormat(string, mask)... But if you can't guarantee a validated number
> string, dollar format then Steve's regex will work.
>
>
> --
> Senior Coldfusion Developer
> Aegeon Pty. Ltd.
> www.aegeon.com.au
> Phone: +613 8676 4223
> Mobile: 0404 998 273
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of Zac Spitzer
> Sent: Wednesday, 9 July 2008 2:22 PM
> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [cfaussie] Re: ReReplaceNoCase - return only a decimal number
>
>
> did you try using LSParseCurrency ?
>
> On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 2:16 PM, Scott Thornton
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I would like to create an expression to remove all text and special
> characters from a string, returning only a decimal-like looking number..
>>
>> eg
>>
>> $12,345.00 -> 12345.00
>> $+10.65 -> 10.65
>> $-5.65 = -5.65
>>
>> etc
>>
>> I suck at regular expressions
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>
>>
>> Scott Thornton, Programmer
>> Billing Unit
>> Hunter-New England Area Health Service
>> ext: 51762 p: +61 02 491 51762 m: 0413 800 242
>>
>>
>>
>> >
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Zac Spitzer -
> http://zacster.blogspot.com (My Blog)
> +61 405 847 168
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] Re: ReReplaceNoCase - return only a decimal number

[Barry Beattie]

> I just want to stop crazy people inputting junk and causing cf\sql errors.

try/catch. be brutal on the loonies. they gotta learn somewhere and
they're taking your time with their dumb tricks.



> For this specific case though I am allowing users to search on a monetary 
> amount, but want to remove the currency formatting from user input

just remember, don't run your app in Europe...

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[cfaussie] Re: Date range formatting

[Barry Beattie]

> I did it the hard way in the end! Argh, nested loops and arrays.

be a dear and submit it to cflib.org. yes? in the date formatting and
string manip library. Even if you're not happy with it, it's better
than what some people have - nothing.

who knows, you might be famous some day saving someone's bacon as they
use it (and buy you a beer)

meh, just a (community) thought. YMMV.

b

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[cfaussie] Re: Melbourne CFUG

[Barry Beattie]

can you call the report generation as a webservice and return the
resultant PDF as a byte stream?





On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 4:18 PM, Steve Onnis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> - building an invoice with repeating items across multiple report pages and
> generate a PDF
> - Incorporating images and other assets in the report to customise designs
> of reports
>
> they would be good
>
> Steve
> 
> From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
> Of Dale Fraser
> Sent: Tuesday, 19 August 2008 3:18 PM
> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [cfaussie] Melbourne CFUG
>
> Just a reminder that I'm doing a Report Builder talk on Thursday at the
> Melbourne CFUG.
>
>
>
> If anyone has specific stuff they would like covered, let me know and I'll
> try to include it.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Dale Fraser
>
> http://learncf.com
>
> http://flexcf.com
>
>
>
>
>
> >
>

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[cfaussie] suggestions best practices in consuming webservices? (timeout woes)

[Barry Beattie]

I suspect it's because of dodgyness of our networks but we're hitting
more than the occasional intermittent webservice timeout.

I was just about to propose to the guys to have a wrapper across all
the webservice calls so if it times out, retry. If it fails the second
time then treat it as fatal error and handle accordingly.

anyone bothered doing something like this?
anyone suggest a better way?

thanx
b

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[cfaussie] Re: suggestions best practices in consuming webservices? (timeout woes)

[Barry Beattie]

that's a good point (OK, so I haven't gotten to that far yet)

CFThread and getTickCount()?





On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 9:13 AM, Mark Ireland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> How do you test for a webservice timeout?
>
>> Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 09:03:25 +1000
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: [cfaussie] suggestions best practices in consuming webservices?
>> (timeout woes)
>>
>>
>> I suspect it's because of dodgyness of our networks but we're hitting
>> more than the occasional intermittent webservice timeout.
>>
>> I was just about to propose to the guys to have a wrapper across all
>> the webservice calls so if it times out, retry. If it fails the second
>> time then treat it as fatal error and handle accordingly.
>>
>> anyone bothered doing something like this?
>> anyone suggest a better way?
>>
>> thanx
>> b
>>
>> >
>

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