Fw: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
- Original Message - From: debonair [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313 Detroit 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions? it's extremely sad that, behind all the idolization, hand shaking networking, etc., etc., there still exists this mean, cut down, tall poppy syndrome sheizer! as cyclone mentioned, derrick is definately a free spirit. LEAVE HIM ALONE. dante will see you all in purgatory hills. one day. james. - Original Message - From: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313 Detroit 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 9:20 AM Subject: Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions? I wasn't even go to reply to this but my hands got the better of me. hows about we all get together and pay you to give him chinese burns until he agrees to make another album. Man, I can't even believe people say these things. That would make him even less likely to do one. He is a free spirit and I'm sure he will do it when he feels the timing is right. Can you imagine how often Derrick must get asked this? Come up with some deep, leftfield, creative questions that challenge him, not the obvious ones. Try to empasise with him. Also if you want to ask him about the past, also ask him about now, the future. It's not very tactful to just ask artists about the past when they have so much more to offer. That's why the word 'icon' is better than 'legend' because it's timeless. I promise if you think about it, it will be really rewarding. or there's the question I once asked andy weatherall... being a 'legend', do you ever wonder you might go sh*t and no-one would tell you? I seriously doubt whether that would happen. Transmat artists are notoriously perfectionist about their work and hard on themselves and from what I can gauge they tell each other EXACTLY what they think - maybe that's something to do with the Detroit community, that creatice competitiveness, I don't know. Also I don't know why people feel the need to ask questions with a negative slant like that. The implication is kinda cruel. It's not like Derrick has ever released something substandard, it's not like he is overly prolific with no quality control. Even artists have feelings. If someone were to ask me that I would feel quite uncomfortable. I don't know how Derrick would react, but I would feel offended. It's like that Eryakah Badu line from the live CD that goes something like Be careful I'm an artist and I'm sensitive about my s**t. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
Ok you guys, stop getting your panties in a knot will ya??? =) And...please stop replying to all just to [EMAIL PROTECTED] don't need to get twice as much mail...thank you very much. Salute, Glyph. In a message dated 2/14/01 10:34:19 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. PUHLEEEAZE! how quick you are to categorize and generalize.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
RIGHT ON!!! WBMX was the shhyot! =) Was there when it happened, G. In a message dated 2/14/01 10:40:06 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: if it sounded like the hotmix 5 you would not hear me complaining.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month
In a message dated 2/14/01 1:09:21 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Some of the things you are talking about were covered during QA at the end. Something I have always wondered, is why Does detroit techno ( a black music) always get over looked as such. Or maybe I am over looking things, but I dont think I see Vibe writing about the music or the aritist and their accomplishments... what about BET, or the black music departments in record labels, the black radio stations etc... Hello Nancy, The reason I feel that Techno(in particular) gets overlooked in the Black community is largely due to the fact that this music is not the NORM as opposed to R B, soul, rap, hip-hop etc. It is probably considered a white music in their minds. The only mag I can see having an article about techno is CODE. It is like the Black GQ, Details and Maxim all rolled in one. To some black techno artists, making this music is going against stereotypes. They don't want to be R B, hip-hop, rap, etc because that is what everyone expects them to be and so does the general black community. Those magazines cater to the typical urban blacks who's minds would not be as open-minded to the abstract as alot of these techno artists are. It is called cultural terrorism...to always be something non-stereotypical. Its all very interesting to me, being that I'm Chinese and learning about Black culture mostly through House and Techno music. And what I have learned has some very deep implications. Stuff so heavy that you get tired just from hearing the experiences. Just from the responses to Otto's (salute, to the flying dutchman) post, you'll always have people who don't under- stand. And it is the same with the general black community. If any of the mediums you mentioned above covered Techno music... well, they must've did it in secret. =) To sum this up, these black techno guys are the odd men out. In my mind, this is what makes some of them the best of the best. This is why we have mailing lists chatting about their music, why we analyze and disect every note, and why we marvel at their brilliance. At least I know I do. Just my 1 dollar and no cents, g.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
In a message dated 2/14/01 4:34:45 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Can you imagine how often Derrick must get asked this? Come up with some deep, leftfield, creative questions that challenge him, not the obvious ones. Try to empasise with him. Also if you want to ask him about the past, also ask him about now, the future. It's not very tactful to just ask artists about the past when they have so much more to offer. That's why the word 'icon' is better than 'legend' because it's timeless. I promise if you think about it, it will be really rewarding. yeah, like ask him what was the last movie he saw recently that he liked? what's his favorite food? what country through his travels, has he had the best experience? what is the last book he read/ his favorite author? etc... G.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
christ, I post a half-serious message to 313 and I get responses filled with bigoted sh*te or suggestions that it's attitude's like mine which are stopping him releasing another album... (as if artists stop producing because people actually want to hear their music). Check the post cyclone, I did actually propose a serious question, regarding his (and other people's) general move away from the dancefloor as their work progresses. I know the possible reasons (and everyone's opinions -thanks) and would be interested to hear Derek's. As for the rest of the post, It was a f**king joke alright? I think derek might actually have a sense of humour, something a few people 'round here are lacking. Andy Weatherall found it funny... -s _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.
RE: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
or there's the question I once asked andy weatherall... being a 'legend', do you ever wonder you might go sh*t and no-one would tell you? . or that they would, and that's why you won't make another album?
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
In a message dated 2/13/01 7:03:02 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Actually, I've always wanted to know what 'problem' he has with out and out dancefloor music. For instance: He often says he doesn't like to use bass drums, because it's an easy way out / cheap trick / whatever. seemingly falling into the rather elitist pov that dancefloor material is less intelligent'... Perhaps he feels he's been there, done that. Also I remember him saying that he doesn't use bass drums because he feels that that is not the most important part of the song or track, the melody is...I'm sure we all agree on that from all that we've ever heard from Derrick. I think its kinda unfair to say elitist pov and if he is, I guess he has a right to be. Glyph
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
hello, In a message dated 2/13/01 7:03:02 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Actually, I've always wanted to know what 'problem' he has with out nd out dancefloor music. For instance: He often says he doesn't like to use bass drums, because it's an easy way out / cheap trick / whatever. seemingly falling into the rather elitist pov that dancefloor material is less intelligent'... I do not necessarily think that it is an elitist point of view, rather it might have something to do with how music is perceived. Personally, my favorite Derrick May tracks are the ones that do not have obvious floor potential. I also find rhythms that are not tied to a bass drum to be a bit more funky. You can change where the percussion accents fall in a bar, but that steady kick drum cancels it out somewhat. The other thing is, you did not always need huge kicks on early house and techno. They did not completely rely on hyper-compressed kicks to get the point across. I think part of the reason the big kick became so important is because in the 90's the music crossed over to a rhythmically impaired white-dj audience. The best example I can give is from the DEMF. Derrick goes on and plays this incredible soulful set, with change and variety, live percussion, spoken word, the whole bloody lot. It was a first class musical experience, still one of the best sets I've seen. Note, the white suburban audience hardly moved the whole time. Hawtin goes on next and does his 4/4 de9 thing. it was like electronic hoedown music, I was waiting for him to bust out a devilfish banjo and give square-dance commands. The music was so square, boxy, it barely changed, grooveless and without soul. I did notice, however, that the white kids were going apes--t. He played a single bar 909 pattern that was like a kick and a clap for 10 minutes and people loved it. It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. Perhaps he feels he's been there, done that. Also I remember him saying that he doesn't use bass drums because he feels that that is not the most important part of the song or track, the melody is...I'm sure we all agree on that from all that we've ever heard from Derrick. I think its kinda unfair to say elitist pov and if he is, I guess he has a right to be. The other thing to bare in mind is that dance music walked away from him. The smooth, deep electronic soul records that he wanted to make just were not selling like the stuff that went doof doof. I think there comes a point where you decide that if the public doesn't get it, then they do not deserve to hear it. You have two choices, you can write crap heavy metal techno and sell a bunch, or stay true to what 313 techno was about and drift into obscurity. I think Derrick made the right call, he left while he was still on top. It is sad though, I can only imagine where he would have gone if he had kept going. I do not believe that he would lose it, I think he would still make great records. The problem is that no matter what he does, it is going to be a let-down. He cannot live up to the hype that has been heaped around him for the last 8 years. He will never write another strings of life. Take care, Mike Glyph - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. DAMN THOSE WHITE PEOPLE, THEY JUST DONT GET IT! keeping racial distinctions alive well into the 21st century, chris
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
Entertainment UK Limited Registered Office: 243 Blyth Road, Hayes, Middlesex UB3 1DN. Registered in England Numbered 409775 This e-mail is only intended for the person(s) to whom it is addressed and may contain confidential information. Unless stated to the contrary, any opinions or comments are personal to the writer and do not represent the official view of the company. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this message from your system. Please do not copy it or use it for any purposes, or disclose its contents to any other person. Thank you for your co-operation. A bit of generalising if ever I saw it! Now you're getting into race issues (I would assume you're of black origin to make such comments). I appreciate melodic tunes as much as anyone, but in a club on a big soundsystem the Richie Hawtin style works well. Just remember - white men can funk!
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
Mike Taylor: (about how strong 4/4 kick-drum music is basically white folk's invention and the only thing that makes it move. Then:) ...The music was so square, boxy, it barely changed, grooveless and without soul. ...He played a single bar 909 pattern that was like a kick and a clap for 10 minutes and people loved it. That's funny, it sounds like Farley on a WBMX show in the 80's playing TRACKS :) And he was black if don't remember wrong ;) -Proffit _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
if it sounded like the hotmix 5 you would not hear me complaining. From: jim proffit [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions? Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 16:16:10 Mike Taylor: (about how strong 4/4 kick-drum music is basically white folk's invention and the only thing that makes it move. Then:) ...The music was so square, boxy, it barely changed, grooveless and without soul. ...He played a single bar 909 pattern that was like a kick and a clap for 10 minutes and people loved it. That's funny, it sounds like Farley on a WBMX show in the 80's playing TRACKS :) And he was black if don't remember wrong ;) -Proffit _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
Gary Girard in response to Mike Taylor: A bit of generalising if ever I saw it! Now you're getting into race issues (I would assume you're of black origin to make such comments). I appreciate melodic tunes as much as anyone, but in a club on a big soundsystem the Richie Hawtin style works well. Just remember - white men can funk! And [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. DAMN THOSE WHITE PEOPLE, THEY JUST DONT GET IT! keeping racial distinctions alive well into the 21st century, Let's keep things in perspective, shall we? Mike was making an observation of the behavior of the white crowd at the DEMF during Derrick May's set and Richie Hawtin's set. Those who were there can confirm that it was a pretty accurate observation (and before anyone asks, no, I wasn't there myself, I had to leave DEMF before Monday, but Mike's observation has been echoed by many people that I spoke to afterwards). Assuming that the majority of people were there to simply party (nothing wrong with that btw) and because Derrick's set was one for the partiers with a sense of musical history and broader musical interests, it fell flat on the ears of the prototypical white 18-year-old who has never heard of James Brown and couldn't care less. Richies set was more straightforward dance music and that's what they came there for, so they partied. Simple as that. Essentially it is the age-old debate of should the DJ give the audience what they want, or should the audience want what the DJ gives? (so let's not rehash that one) And while Mike's generalization to 'white audiences' may step on a few individual's toes, it is essentially correct. As long as you realize that it's a generalization! In other words, it is *generally* applicable, but not *universally*. For the majority it holds, but there are exceptions. The things that makes matters blurry is that the white people on this list tend to be such exceptions (hence the strong reactions). So yes Gary, white men can funk. But in the broader world of dance music in general, most of them can't. Why is that? If I may speculate a bit here, I think it has to do with musical upbringing and interest. Most people I know from this list are music freaks, in the positive sense of the word. Their tastes usually range quite far beyond Detroit techno, to include other genres of dance music, but also (and especially!) reference genres like funk, soul, disco, Krautrock, new wave, dub, etc. That gives them an appreciation for Detroit techno as music as well as a party tool. (downside is that they sometimes tend to be overly analytical about music and forgetting about the party bit...ahem). Since most of those reference genres are relatively old, they probably don't mean much to someone whose musical tastes were shaped in the last five years. In that case, it is much more party music and then you don't care about 'intricate rhythms' and 'complex soundscapes' (cue Brian Eno's quote about talking about music...), you want a straightforward kick and the obvious peak here and there for the party mood. I'm not a musical theorist or sociologist, so I can only speculate on why certain music genres are considered white and others are considered black, but I do think it is a reinforcing situation: if you're black you tend to grow up on black music and if you're white, you tend to grow up on white music. (yes, this is a generalization, I'm all too aware of that since I'm an exception myself: I'm white, but grew up on mainly black music). This of course shapes your future tastes. So if, like most white kids these days, you didn't grow up on funk-influenced music, you probably don't appreciate the funk element that most people on this list would associate with Detroit techno. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but I think it does explain what happened on Monday night at DEMF. Otto PS As a general sidenote about racial distinctions: IMO the main reason why we continue to have debates like this is that too many people deny that there *are* racial distinctions. They smooth them over, by saying things like 'keep race out of this' and 'skin color is irrelevant' etc. Though well-meant and heartfelt, it is rather superficial (and considered by some people of non-white races to be patronising), because racial distinctions are there and as one look around you will tell, they *do* matter! They *should* not matter, but the fact is, they do. It is not until we explicitly recognize those differences that we can move beyond them. As much as I hate to speak in soundbite-style, the phrase 'all different, all equal' springs to mind.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month
So ...I was at a small gathering last night of industry people that came to hear about Black Music: Past , Present Future with Jimmy Starks Hal Jackson speaking. Of course I would go!!! who would not want to hear these two HISTORICAL men speak about this music their amazing lives. Some of the things you are talking about were covered during QA at the end. Something I have always wondered, is why Does detroit techno ( a black music) always get over looked as such. Or maybe I am over looking things, but I dont think I see Vibe writing about the music or the aritist and their accomplishments... what about BET, or the black music departments in record labels, the black radio stations etc... I am kind of talking all over the place but, Jimmy also talked about sampling and how he hates that you can hear him more now than we he made records with James brown etc.. and he gets nothing for it, and people probably have no idea it is his guitar they sampled. He also feels very strong about live music, and everyone was talking about how live instruments are coming back. And the electronic music will die out soon. AR development people were talking about how they are soon to have certain RB/Hip-hop acts go on the road with live bands instead of a DJ etc... RB produces are talking about working with live musicians from now on and creating more jobs in the community as well as building albums not hit cookie cutter singles. I do beleive there is a strong future for electronic music, I mean think about when you have kids, they will grow up with this music always listening to electronic music. Just think what the music they make will sound like!! When my generation grew up before we had many influences, but there was know blueprint for detroit techno, the black music of the past present future. again talking all over the place.sorry, bare with me.. Hal, talked of how he hates this eminem character getting all of these awards ... it really seemed to bother him because it is a black music, well DR Dre does make his tracks right,I completely understand where he is coming from and have even heard the same comments about techno how this scene is mostly white, and the white artist get all of the press, credit,deals etc. I dont know where I am going with this , just thought I would share my night with ya'll.. I have lots more to say but will shut up as I know someone on here is going to rip me to shreds as always.(not that I care) best, nancy --- Otto Koppius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gary Girard in response to Mike Taylor: A bit of generalising if ever I saw it! Now you're getting into race issues (I would assume you're of black origin to make such comments). I appreciate melodic tunes as much as anyone, but in a club on a big soundsystem the Richie Hawtin style works well. Just remember - white men can funk! And [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. DAMN THOSE WHITE PEOPLE, THEY JUST DONT GET IT! keeping racial distinctions alive well into the 21st century, Let's keep things in perspective, shall we? Mike was making an observation of the behavior of the white crowd at the DEMF during Derrick May's set and Richie Hawtin's set. Those who were there can confirm that it was a pretty accurate observation (and before anyone asks, no, I wasn't there myself, I had to leave DEMF before Monday, but Mike's observation has been echoed by many people that I spoke to afterwards). Assuming that the majority of people were there to simply party (nothing wrong with that btw) and because Derrick's set was one for the partiers with a sense of musical history and broader musical interests, it fell flat on the ears of the prototypical white 18-year-old who has never heard of James Brown and couldn't care less. Richies set was more straightforward dance music and that's what they came there for, so they partied. Simple as that. Essentially it is the age-old debate of should the DJ give the audience what they want, or should the audience want what the DJ gives? (so let's not rehash that one) And while Mike's generalization to 'white audiences' may step on a few individual's toes, it is essentially correct. As long as you realize that it's a generalization! In other words, it is *generally* applicable, but not *universally*. For the majority it holds, but there are exceptions. The things that makes matters blurry is that the white people on this list tend to be such exceptions (hence the strong reactions). So yes Gary, white men can funk. But in the broader world of dance music in general, most of them can't. Why is that? If I may speculate a bit here, I think it has to do with musical upbringing and interest. Most people I know from this list are music freaks, in the positive sense of the word. Their tastes usually range quite far beyond Detroit techno, to
R: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
Otto, i beg to differ.completely it fell flat on the ears of the prototypical white 18-year-old who has never heard of James Brown and couldn't care less. sez who? thats an even greater generalization than saying white ppl cant funk! , white men can funk. But in the broader world of dance music in general, most of them can't. what the broader world of dance music? there's no such thing. even if you say its commercial dance, stuff that gets played on mainstream radio in europe the uk, its a collection of songs belonging to various genres. i think its safe to say that contemporary dance music is heavily influenced by black musicits a fact. that means that the ppl that produce it and the ppl to whom its marketed have been exposed to black music or music inspired by black music, or the funk or whatever. lets not assume an apologetic stance to racial stereotyping by justifying it with intellectualisms that i personally feel are inexact. and lets not also consider us whiteys on the list as being special because we CAN funk. cheers fab
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month
-- Forwarded by Oliver Barkovic/ObTech on 02/14/2001 02:15 PM --- nancy mitchell [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 02/14/2001 02:00:35 PM To: Otto Koppius [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org 313@hyperreal.org cc: (bcc: Oliver Barkovic/ObTech) Subject: Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month So ...I was at a small gathering last night of industry people that came to hear about Black Music: Past , Present Future with Jimmy Starks Hal Jackson speaking. Of course I would go!!! who would not want to hear these two HISTORICAL men speak about this music their amazing lives. Some of the things you are talking about were covered during QA at the end. Something I have always wondered, is why Does detroit techno ( a black music) always get over looked as such. Or maybe I am over looking things, but I dont think I see Vibe writing about the music or the aritist and their accomplishments... what about BET, or the black music departments in record labels, the black radio stations etc... I am kind of talking all over the place but, Jimmy also talked about sampling and how he hates that you can hear him more now than we he made records with James brown etc.. and he gets nothing for it, and people probably have no idea it is his guitar they sampled. He also feels very strong about live music, and everyone was talking about how live instruments are coming back. And the electronic music will die out soon. AR development people were talking about how they are soon to have certain RB/Hip-hop acts go on the road with live bands instead of a DJ etc... RB produces are talking about working with live musicians from now on and creating more jobs in the community as well as building albums not hit cookie cutter singles. I do beleive there is a strong future for electronic music, I mean think about when you have kids, they will grow up with this music always listening to electronic music. Just think what the music they make will sound like!! When my generation grew up before we had many influences, but there was know blueprint for detroit techno, the black music of the past present future. again talking all over the place.sorry, bare with me.. Hal, talked of how he hates this eminem character getting all of these awards ... it really seemed to bother him because it is a black music, well DR Dre does make his tracks right,I completely understand where he is coming from and have even heard the same comments about techno how this scene is mostly white, and the white artist get all of the press, credit,deals etc. I dont know where I am going with this , just thought I would share my night with ya'll.. I have lots more to say but will shut up as I know someone on here is going to rip me to shreds as always.(not that I care) best, nancy --- Otto Koppius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gary Girard in response to Mike Taylor: A bit of generalising if ever I saw it! Now you're getting into race issues (I would assume you're of black origin to make such comments). I appreciate melodic tunes as much as anyone, but in a club on a big soundsystem the Richie Hawtin style works well. Just remember - white men can funk! And [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. DAMN THOSE WHITE PEOPLE, THEY JUST DONT GET IT! keeping racial distinctions alive well into the 21st century, Let's keep things in perspective, shall we? Mike was making an observation of the behavior of the white crowd at the DEMF during Derrick May's set and Richie Hawtin's set. Those who were there can confirm that it was a pretty accurate observation (and before anyone asks, no, I wasn't there myself, I had to leave DEMF before Monday, but Mike's observation has been echoed by many people that I spoke to afterwards). Assuming that the majority of people were there to simply party (nothing wrong with that btw) and because Derrick's set was one for the partiers with a sense of musical history and broader musical interests
RE: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month
I get where you're going. What it comes down to is Music, any kind, whoever makes it, from whatever race etc. will be adopted by those that enjoy it, identify w/ it etc.. The audience may change, but CREATORS don't! Rap has African, African/American roots, but that white boy Eminem kicks. Techno was born from the collective experiences of three Detroit, middle class African Americans, that doesn't mean their music CAN or should be restricted to their people. As to why Techno's black roots are overlooked, I think its because most musicians don't accept the music as music, so the issue of its black roots is mute. I think their attitude is, if a person is not creating the music form a recognized musical instrument, note by note, its not music, its mixing, editing etc. Let's see how long it takes the music industry, as a whole, to recognize that a musical creation does not begin with a single sound of a single instrument. Techno is much more complex. Why isn't a record, a mixing board etc. not viewed as a musical instrument equal to a piano, guitar.or when will it be. -Original Message- From: nancy mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 2:01 PM To: Otto Koppius; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month So ...I was at a small gathering last night of industry people that came to hear about Black Music: Past , Present Future with Jimmy Starks Hal Jackson speaking. Of course I would go!!! who would not want to hear these two HISTORICAL men speak about this music their amazing lives. Some of the things you are talking about were covered during QA at the end. Something I have always wondered, is why Does detroit techno ( a black music) always get over looked as such. Or maybe I am over looking things, but I dont think I see Vibe writing about the music or the aritist and their accomplishments... what about BET, or the black music departments in record labels, the black radio stations etc... I am kind of talking all over the place but, Jimmy also talked about sampling and how he hates that you can hear him more now than we he made records with James brown etc.. and he gets nothing for it, and people probably have no idea it is his guitar they sampled. He also feels very strong about live music, and everyone was talking about how live instruments are coming back. And the electronic music will die out soon. AR development people were talking about how they are soon to have certain RB/Hip-hop acts go on the road with live bands instead of a DJ etc... RB produces are talking about working with live musicians from now on and creating more jobs in the community as well as building albums not hit cookie cutter singles. I do beleive there is a strong future for electronic music, I mean think about when you have kids, they will grow up with this music always listening to electronic music. Just think what the music they make will sound like!! When my generation grew up before we had many influences, but there was know blueprint for detroit techno, the black music of the past present future. again talking all over the place.sorry, bare with me.. Hal, talked of how he hates this eminem character getting all of these awards ... it really seemed to bother him because it is a black music, well DR Dre does make his tracks right,I completely understand where he is coming from and have even heard the same comments about techno how this scene is mostly white, and the white artist get all of the press, credit,deals etc. I dont know where I am going with this , just thought I would share my night with ya'll.. I have lots more to say but will shut up as I know someone on here is going to rip me to shreds as always.(not that I care) best, nancy --- Otto Koppius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gary Girard in response to Mike Taylor: A bit of generalising if ever I saw it! Now you're getting into race issues (I would assume you're of black origin to make such comments). I appreciate melodic tunes as much as anyone, but in a club on a big soundsystem the Richie Hawtin style works well. Just remember - white men can funk! And [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It was sad, because Derrick's set was so much better, and so completely over their head. DAMN THOSE WHITE PEOPLE, THEY JUST DONT GET IT! keeping racial distinctions alive well into the 21st century, Let's keep things in perspective, shall we? Mike was making an observation of the behavior of the white crowd at the DEMF during Derrick May's set and Richie Hawtin's set. Those who were there can confirm that it was a pretty accurate observation (and before anyone asks, no, I wasn't there myself, I had to leave DEMF before Monday, but Mike's observation has been echoed by many people that I spoke to afterwards). Assuming that the majority of people were there to simply party (nothing wrong with that btw) and because Derrick's
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
I wasn't even go to reply to this but my hands got the better of me. hows about we all get together and pay you to give him chinese burns until he agrees to make another album. Man, I can't even believe people say these things. That would make him even less likely to do one. He is a free spirit and I'm sure he will do it when he feels the timing is right. Can you imagine how often Derrick must get asked this? Come up with some deep, leftfield, creative questions that challenge him, not the obvious ones. Try to empasise with him. Also if you want to ask him about the past, also ask him about now, the future. It's not very tactful to just ask artists about the past when they have so much more to offer. That's why the word 'icon' is better than 'legend' because it's timeless. I promise if you think about it, it will be really rewarding. or there's the question I once asked andy weatherall... being a 'legend', do you ever wonder you might go sh*t and no-one would tell you? I seriously doubt whether that would happen. Transmat artists are notoriously perfectionist about their work and hard on themselves and from what I can gauge they tell each other EXACTLY what they think - maybe that's something to do with the Detroit community, that creatice competitiveness, I don't know. Also I don't know why people feel the need to ask questions with a negative slant like that. The implication is kinda cruel. It's not like Derrick has ever released something substandard, it's not like he is overly prolific with no quality control. Even artists have feelings. If someone were to ask me that I would feel quite uncomfortable. I don't know how Derrick would react, but I would feel offended. It's like that Eryakah Badu line from the live CD that goes something like Be careful I'm an artist and I'm sensitive about my s**t.
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?
Otto Koppius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Assuming that the majority of people were there to simply party (nothing wrong with that btw) and because Derrick's set was one for the partiers with a sense of musical history and broader musical interests, it fell flat on the ears of the prototypical white 18-year-old who has never heard of James Brown and couldn't care less. Richies set was more straightforward dance music and that's what they came there for, so they partied. Simple as that. Essentially it is the age-old debate of should the DJ give the audience what they want, or should the audience want what the DJ gives? (so let's not rehash that one) ...something for your mind and your body... I think it's rather pretentious to say that Derrick's set was for partiers with a sense of musical history and broader musical interests. So without this sense of history and a broad musical interest, one would experience a lesser enjoyment of the set? That's absurd. His set was, pardon the unacademic term, totally bumpin'! Granted, he may have made allusions to musical history with his style and selections, but above all he threw down and that's what I think most people enjoyed. I would venture to say that the visceral ranked far above the cerebral. I saw Derrick in a small club in San Francisco in August with an, at least, 90% white audience and that little room was a sweat box and everyone danced hard. I doubt everyone was high-fidelty-style well-versed in musical history, yet I didn't see anyone not enjoying themselves. When I saw Richie on 10/28 at St. Andrew's and he played Front 242's headhunter, all of us old people freaked out and danced even harder -- I saw a lot of slightly perplexed 18 year old faces around me, but they didn't stop having fun. I caught the reference and that was awesome, but it wasn't necessary for me to enjoy myself that night and neither was it that way for them. Interesting points made all around, I just hate seeing things needlessly over-academicized. peace, dk David Knapik - Web Developer Northwestern University School of Law - MC B71 (312) 503-2771 | mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] re: Derrick May questions?-black history month
He also feels very strong about live music, and everyone was talking about how live instruments are coming back. And the electronic music will die out soon. AR development people were talking about how they are soon to have certain RB/Hip-hop acts go on the road with live bands instead of a DJ etc... RB produces are talking about working with live musicians from now on and creating more jobs in the community as well as building albums not hit cookie cutter singles. Interesting but then how come the so-called neo-soul artists are not selling as well as the more electronic - based? Sophomore projects from Maxwell, D'Angelo, Erykah Badu all sold well below expectations. Maxwell's biggest hit single was a track produced by R Kelly whose sound is more programmed than Maxwell's. Eric Benet made for a more obviously urban album second time around because of his first record's lack of commercial success. I would say that Macy Gray only blew up like she did because it has a rock/blues feel to it, I don't think that the so-called urban' market took to her - not here anyway. The Black Eyed Peas have built up a following on the road but complain that radio in the US won't support their stuff. The Roots took years and years to find commercial success with Things Fall Apart. Also in small markets it's just too expensive to tour a band so they just use DAT. It could only be in the States and parts of Europe and parts of Asia where they could sustain the costs.
