[AFMUG] Parental controls/usage monitor

[Steve Jones]

We were about to sign the router limits contract when bark bought them.
Thought that would be cool, bark safety features on top of router limits
bandwidth monitoring and content filtering, which already worked with
cambium routers. Turns out bark bough router limits to shut off a competing
product (not really competing, barks filters are inferior to router
limits). Based on the quality loss and product change, I see cambium
investesting exactly zero time effort and cash into integrating bark.

So we are back looking for a parental control, content filter and
specifically a thing that will tell us what device used the bandwidth. I'm
assuming cambium got burned bad enough in this that it wont be a feature in
the R series CnPilot ever with any vendor, so I'm open to a third party
solution similar to router limits
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Ken Hohhof]

Anyone who has seen Pirates of the Caribbean knows QAnon has it wrong.  You 
need to harvest mermaid tears.

https://disney.fandom.com/wiki/Mermaids_of_Whitecap_Bay

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 9:20 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

babies arent gonna abort themselves man, somebodies gotta do the work

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 9:14 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Adrenochrome.  But only if you’re a liberal elite.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:43 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

When I was maybe 10 or 11 I fell out of a tree onto a sidewalk and got right 
back up.  Later that day I climbed the tree again, jumped out of the tree onto 
the roof of the house.  I had no way to get off the house except jump, so I 
jumped off and rolled the landing.  

Now I hurt myself if I sleep wrong.  What do I have to do to be invincible 
again?

 

On 12/4/2020 2:52 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

I'm only 42, but it's odd how much further down everything is now than it used 
to be. 

I keep alieve in reserve, I never take it like ibuprofen or tylenol so it stays 
effective. I can have a disk bulge and 2 or 3 alieve and I'm back jumping off 
barrels in 45 minutes

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk ruptures 
healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could heal.  But any 
jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to train yourself.  
Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a truck.  Nope, have to 
learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2 at a time any more.  

 

From: Lewis Bergman 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was 
favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it 
would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should not 
have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal operation for 
two months mas o menos.  

Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and 
suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.

Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.

My own damn fault..

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Re: [AFMUG] old and busted vs new hotness

[Daniel White]

Tell them on the newer style you are actually able to restrict their
speeds better so it will actually be a downgrade for them but an upgrade
for you.  Or that the older reflector is no longer made but gives them a
better signal which equals faster speeds.

photograph  
Daniel White
Co-Founder
phone: +1 (702) 470-2770
direct:+1 (702) 470-2766

> Ken Hohhof 
> December 4, 2020 at 13:56
>
> I regularly run into customers who want a new SM because we installed
> it several years ago and they assume there are newer, faster ones now
> and they should have one of those.
>
>  
>
> It doesn’t help when for example they see us install a 450b for a
> neighbor and it looks different from their classic 450 with a
> reflector dish.  It looks different.  Obviously the neighbor got the
> new fast radio, while they are stuck with the old slow one, and we
> need to come upgrade theirs.  I can try to explain why there’s no
> difference, or something about it being a software defined radio and
> theirs is running the latest FW same as the neighbor’s radio, or that
> we applied a license key to take theirs from 20M sustained to
> uncapped.  But they seem to think if they are paying their bill every
> month, they should get a new radio every couple years.  Like a new
> smartphone every 2 years?  Or maybe they think the only thing we did
> was install something on their roof, so why do they need to keep
> paying us if we don’t upgrade the thing on the roof, what are we doing
> to earn our money?
>
>  
>
> Anybody have a solution for this?  Or just continue ignoring them?
>
>  
>
>  
>
> In case you didn’t get the Men In Black reference:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-uagjJQ9k
>
>  
>
>
>

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

babies arent gonna abort themselves man, somebodies gotta do the work

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 9:14 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Adrenochrome.  But only if you’re a liberal elite.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 8:43 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>
>
>
> When I was maybe 10 or 11 I fell out of a tree onto a sidewalk and got
> right back up.  Later that day I climbed the tree again, jumped out of the
> tree onto the roof of the house.  I had no way to get off the house except
> jump, so I jumped off and rolled the landing.
>
> Now I hurt myself if I sleep wrong.  What do I have to do to be invincible
> again?
>
>
>
> On 12/4/2020 2:52 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
> I'm only 42, but it's odd how much further down everything is now than it
> used to be.
>
> I keep alieve in reserve, I never take it like ibuprofen or tylenol so it
> stays effective. I can have a disk bulge and 2 or 3 alieve and I'm back
> jumping off barrels in 45 minutes
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
> I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk
> ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could
> heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to
> train yourself.  Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a
> truck.  Nope, have to learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2
> at a time any more.
>
>
>
> *From:* Lewis Bergman
>
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>
>
>
> I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was
> favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it
> would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
> operation for two months mas o menos.
>
> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>
> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>
> My own damn fault..
>
> --
> AF mailing list
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>
> --
>
> --
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>
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>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Ken Hohhof]

Adrenochrome.  But only if you’re a liberal elite.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:43 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

When I was maybe 10 or 11 I fell out of a tree onto a sidewalk and got right 
back up.  Later that day I climbed the tree again, jumped out of the tree onto 
the roof of the house.  I had no way to get off the house except jump, so I 
jumped off and rolled the landing.  

Now I hurt myself if I sleep wrong.  What do I have to do to be invincible 
again?

 

On 12/4/2020 2:52 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

I'm only 42, but it's odd how much further down everything is now than it used 
to be. 

I keep alieve in reserve, I never take it like ibuprofen or tylenol so it stays 
effective. I can have a disk bulge and 2 or 3 alieve and I'm back jumping off 
barrels in 45 minutes

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk ruptures 
healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could heal.  But any 
jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to train yourself.  
Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a truck.  Nope, have to 
learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2 at a time any more.  

 

From: Lewis Bergman 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was 
favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it 
would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should not 
have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal operation for 
two months mas o menos.  

Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and 
suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.

Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.

My own damn fault..

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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Ken Hohhof]

I thought 2 was Chicago (Oakbrook).

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick - Lists
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 7:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

2-New Orleans.  Missed the one in Vegas 

Jeff Broadwick

CTIconnect

312-205-2519 Office

574-220-7826 Cell

jbroadw...@cticonnect.com  





On Dec 4, 2020, at 8:40 PM, Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net> > wrote:



I think I went to 3 - 9, other than 7.



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  
 
  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  
 
  The Brothers WISP
   
 





  _  


From: "Colin Stanners" mailto:cstann...@gmail.com> >
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 3:06:05 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

https://web.archive.org/web/20060701061713/http://www.wispcon.info/ 
 

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 2:15 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics.

 

bp


On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

 

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.

Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

 

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

 

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

 

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

 

From: Adam Moffett 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM

To: af@af.afmug.com   

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

 

 

From: Paul McCall 

Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

 

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.   

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, ru

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

Me and my buddy were talking about this the other day, we had one roof we
dangled off to get down, on roof we jumped into a tree to get down and two
roofs we were constantly testing parachute theory on (fyi, nothing works at
15 feet, umbrella, blanket, coat, garbage can, garbage bag, etc). Now we
would die if we even considered it. And this old dude, Glenn, he used to
sit on his porch just drinking "coffee" watching us.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 8:43 PM Adam Moffett  wrote:

> When I was maybe 10 or 11 I fell out of a tree onto a sidewalk and got
> right back up.  Later that day I climbed the tree again, jumped out of the
> tree onto the roof of the house.  I had no way to get off the house except
> jump, so I jumped off and rolled the landing.
>
> Now I hurt myself if I sleep wrong.  What do I have to do to be invincible
> again?
>
>
> On 12/4/2020 2:52 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
> I'm only 42, but it's odd how much further down everything is now than it
> used to be.
> I keep alieve in reserve, I never take it like ibuprofen or tylenol so it
> stays effective. I can have a disk bulge and 2 or 3 alieve and I'm back
> jumping off barrels in 45 minutes
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
>> I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk
>> ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could
>> heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to
>> train yourself.  Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a
>> truck.  Nope, have to learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2
>> at a time any more.
>>
>> *From:* Lewis Bergman
>> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>>
>> I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I
>> was favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it
>> and it would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I
>>> should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
>>> operation for two months mas o menos.
>>> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
>>> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>>> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>>> My own damn fault..
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> --
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>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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>>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Steve Jones]

So this begs the question, if its freezing out what are you able to do? Are
you plowing frozen ground?

I was wondering that tonite, why do fiber runs shut down in winter, what's
the difference between frozen ground and hard rocky soil? Really, I dont
know this

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 5:02 PM Chris Fabien  wrote:

> I would add a diesel powered water heater like hot water pressure
> washers use into the pressure circuit. This would help keep the vacuum
> hose from freezing while excavating, and then set up a recirculate
> system where they disconnect the wand and plug the end of the hose
> into a fitting that returns it to the tank. Then leave the heater and
> pump running on low and this will keep your water tank nice and warm.
> Might take some thermostats to make it be stable. I'm not sure if
> keeping the spoils warm in the tank would even matter that much, other
> than making it a pain to get empty.
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 3:17 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
> >
> > I bought a 12 volt dc air compressor with tank.  Going to have them blow
> out the spray hose when done spraying in the afternoon.  So that when they
> get back to the shop at least it will not be frozen stiff when they go to
> winterize everything.
> >
> > From: Colin Stanners
> > Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:10 PM
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps
> >
> > Some excavator manufacturers have "arctic" upgrade packages. My
> understanding is that as long as the vacuum truck is stored inside a warm
> shop when not in use, the clean water tank will have enough thermal mass to
> not freeze during most workdays. The vac design may be passing the engine
> exhaust underneath the tank to warm it too. A heater on the outgoing water
> helps protect the rest of the circulation system. Employees being careful
> of freezing risk is important too, not letting things "sit".
> >
> > On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 1:19 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low
> temps.  Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the
> water jacket or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that
> would blow out the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some
> kind of propane heater to warm up the water tank.
> >>
> >> Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam
> industry.  Might work.
> >>
> >> Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?
> >> --
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> >> AF@af.afmug.com
> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> > 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Adam Moffett]

When I was maybe 10 or 11 I fell out of a tree onto a sidewalk and got 
right back up.  Later that day I climbed the tree again, jumped out of 
the tree onto the roof of the house.  I had no way to get off the house 
except jump, so I jumped off and rolled the landing.


Now I hurt myself if I sleep wrong.  What do I have to do to be 
invincible again?



On 12/4/2020 2:52 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
I'm only 42, but it's odd how much further down everything is now than 
it used to be.
I keep alieve in reserve, I never take it like ibuprofen or tylenol so 
it stays effective. I can have a disk bulge and 2 or 3 alieve and I'm 
back jumping off barrels in 45 minutes


On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF > wrote:


I have learned  not to jump down from anything. ANYTHING.  My disk
ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know
they could heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the
injured list.  Hard to train yourself.  Simple things like a
lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a truck.  Nope, have to learn
not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2 at a time any more.
*From:* Lewis Bergman
*Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate
on. I was favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop
favoring it and it would get better but likely always have a
little hitch in it
On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza
 wrote:

Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in
August...I should not have tried to climb it since I had been
on bed rest from retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right
knee, and suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need
surgerydamn.
My own damn fault..
-- 
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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Jeff Broadwick - Lists]

2-New Orleans.  Missed the one in Vegas 

Jeff Broadwick
CTIconnect
312-205-2519 Office
574-220-7826 Cell
jbroadw...@cticonnect.com

> On Dec 4, 2020, at 8:40 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> 
> I think I went to 3 - 9, other than 7.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange
> 
> The Brothers WISP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: "Colin Stanners" 
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 3:06:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
> 
> https://web.archive.org/web/20060701061713/http://www.wispcon.info/
> 
>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 2:15 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>> Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  
>> There was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
>> competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
>> bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
>> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
>> To: af@af.afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
>> Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
>> cover quite a range of topics.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> bp
>> 
>> On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>> 
>> One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
>> posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
>> pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
>> and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they 
>> were not a subscriber to both lists or something like that. 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And 
>> then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
>> 
>> Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
>> getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
>> serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go. 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
>> then ... the barn door had been left open.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in 
>> contact rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it 
>> turns out he was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this. 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: Adam Moffett
>> 
>> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
>> 
>> To: af@af.afmug.com
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
>> 
>> On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: Paul McCall
>> 
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
>> 
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Its all good Ken 😊
>> 
>> Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
>> 
>> But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
>> 
>> (only us “long-times” will get that reference)
>> 
>> From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
>> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>> 
>> I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
>> 
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Paul McCall
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>> 
>> Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.  
>> 
>> 20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
>> aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a 
>> bunch of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 
>> 10 tech phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware 
>> of future proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a 
>> few years at least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill 
>> towers.  We overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH 
>> links wherever possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 
>> 50Mbit plans for less than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not 
>> everyone would of course.  ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage 
>> area, and we have lost 4 customers in 2 years to it.
>> 
>> But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
>> comes back.
>> 
>> They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
>> 
>> I’m good 😊
>> 
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
>> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
>> Sub

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Mike Hammett]

I think I went to 3 - 9, other than 7. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Colin Stanners"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 3:06:05 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk 


https://web.archive.org/web/20060701061713/http://www.wispcon.info/ 


On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 2:15 PM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 





Remember WISPCON? I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002. There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy. Also a 
competitor called Trango. I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere. Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet. 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Bill Prince 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM 
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk 

That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics. 
bp  

On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: 





One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing. He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that. 



In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff. And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line. 

Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down. I was getting 
emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list serv, put 
all the Motorola people on it and away we go. 



In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open. 



I am sure he never forgave me. But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice. We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT. As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental. 



Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this. 






From: Adam Moffett 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM 

To: af@af.afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk 



What was the deal with Bullit anyway? Some sort of control issues? 

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: 












From: Paul McCall 

Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM 

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 




Its all good Ken 😊 
Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL. 
But if I get any more crap, I QUIT hahahah 
(only us “long-times” will get that reference) 


From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 
I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you. 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 
Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken. 
20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things. Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3. We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible. I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers. We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds. Licensed BH links wherever 
possible. If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long. Not everyone would of course. ATT 
has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it. 
But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back. 
They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing! 
I’m good 😊 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 
You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless. On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science. On the other hand, Elon Musk and T-Mobile 
are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber. 
I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Du

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Mike Hammett]

As the man that purchased his network, an outage on his network isn't 
surprising. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Chuck McCown via AF"  
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Cc: "Chuck McCown"  
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:31:49 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk 




One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing. He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that. 

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff. And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line. 
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down. I was getting 
emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list serv, put 
all the Motorola people on it and away we go. 

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open. 

I am sure he never forgave me. But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice. We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT. As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental. 

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this. 




From: Adam Moffett 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM 
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk 


What was the deal with Bullit anyway? Some sort of control issues? 


On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: 










From: Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 



Its all good Ken 😊 

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL. 

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT hahahah 

(only us “long-times” will get that reference) 



From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you. 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken. 

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things. Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3. We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible. I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers. We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds. Licensed BH links wherever 
possible. If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long. Not everyone would of course. ATT 
has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it. 

But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back. 

They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing! 

I’m good 😊 




From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless. On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science. On the other hand, Elon Musk and T-Mobile 
are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber. 

I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty. Very difficult, 
yet customers would rather be doing something else. 




From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > 
Cc: Chuck McCown < ch...@go-mtc.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

Theodolite will. 



From: AF [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

LOL, definitely not in LOS territory. 90% of our rural stuff won’t see the 
towers. 

We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) to the 
tower. 


From: 

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Mike Hammett]

He liked one of TBW's posts in the past day or two. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Adam Moffett"  
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 7:57:21 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk 


What was the deal with Bullit anyway? Some sort of control issues? 


On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: 










From: Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 



Its all good Ken 😊 

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL. 

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT hahahah 

(only us “long-times” will get that reference) 



From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you. 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken. 

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things. Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3. We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible. I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers. We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds. Licensed BH links wherever 
possible. If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long. Not everyone would of course. ATT 
has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it. 

But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back. 

They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing! 

I’m good 😊 




From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless. On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science. On the other hand, Elon Musk and T-Mobile 
are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber. 

I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty. Very difficult, 
yet customers would rather be doing something else. 




From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > 
Cc: Chuck McCown < ch...@go-mtc.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

Theodolite will. 



From: AF [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

LOL, definitely not in LOS territory. 90% of our rural stuff won’t see the 
towers. 

We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) to the 
tower. 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:53 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 



When an account (in Powercode) is made through Towercoverage API, it'll add the 
estimated signals to the tower starting with the closest ones. That ticket 
could always be pulled up. 



As far as alignment, I would think you're in LOS territory with 5 GHz so once 
you know where the tower is, you can aim for it by eyeball instead of app. 






Josh Luthman 
24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:44 PM Paul McCall < pa...@pdmnet.net > wrote: 




We have that… looking for more of a compass time app that will point him to a 
tower, based on stored LAT / LONG 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:15 PM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > 
Cc: Chuck McCown < ch...@go-mtc.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs 

Google Earth 



From: AF [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Paul McCall 
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 10:07 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Isn't it Tylenol that can cause liver damage?
At any rate, when i take Tylenol, it's like Curly says, "Nothing
  happens."

If I go above 300 mg ibuprofen, I need to take a buffer before to
  reduce stomach issues.


bp

On 12/4/2020 4:35 PM, Chuck McCown via
  AF wrote:


  
  I notice my seemingly constant arm muscle aches are helped more by
  Tylenol than ibuprofen.  Worry about liver damage.
  
  Sent from my iPhone
  
On Dec 4, 2020, at 4:44 PM, Carl
  Peterson  wrote:
  

  
  

  I'm ex Army.  Perhaps the new kids get CBD and
a joint 
but for us it was pretty much:


Aches and pains?  800 Mg ibuprofen 
Broken bone?  800 Mg ibuprofen
Minor Amputation?  800 Mg Ibuprofen
Major Amputation?  1600 MG ibuprofen and a stiff
  drink.   


I'm pretty much on the same med schedule now except the
  aches and pains are a constant so I cut down the dosage
  somewhat.  
  
  
  
On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at
  3:12 PM Steve Jones 
  wrote:


  The ibuprofin thing with covid was removed
like 2 weeks into it, they realized it was based on bad
science
  
  
On Fri, Dec 4, 2020,
  1:18 PM Robert Andrews 
  wrote:

Except now with
  Covid ibuprofen->tylenol...
  
  On 12/04/2020 10:19 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
  > I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first
  time I tried (and failed) 
  > to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered
  through with that bum 
  > knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped.
  The doc said I will get 
  > arthritis in it sooner with only a partial
  meniscus, but I still refer 
  > to it as my good knee. The left one is a little
  tweaky, but is not a 
  > real issue. The last few years the right knee
  gets a little 
  > uncomfortable during cold weather, but is fine if
  I keep it moving.
  > 
  > My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of
  an issue these days. The 
  > problem was always that it is a long slow slog
  through therapy. The last 
  > time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it
  took almost two years to 
  > get it back to normal. What worked for me was to
  take moderate amounts 
  > of ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too
  drastic. Once the 
  > inflammation went down, I started doing VERY
  light weight dumbbell 
  > exercises and slowly worked my way up to normal
  weights. Go slow and 
  > easy, because even slight tweaks and you're back
  to square one.
  > 
  > 
  > bp
  > 
  > 
  > On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
  >> Some of you may know I fell off this side
  mount back in August...I 
  >> should not have tried to climb it since I had
  been on bed rest from 
  >> retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
  >> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn
  meniscus in right knee, 
  >> and suspected rotator cuff tear on right
  shoulder.
  >> Need to get MRIs and starting me on
  PT...might need surgerydamn.
  >> My own damn fault..
  >>
  > 
  > 
  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  
  
  
  -- 
  

  Carl Peterson
  
  PORT NETWORKS
  401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
  Baltimore, MD 21202
  (410) 637-3707 

  
   

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Ken Hohhof]

Arm muscles?  Try spinach.

 



 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:36 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Cc: Chuck McCown 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

I notice my seemingly constant arm muscle aches are helped more by Tylenol than 
ibuprofen.  Worry about liver damage.

Sent from my iPhone





On Dec 4, 2020, at 4:44 PM, Carl Peterson mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com> > wrote:



I'm ex Army.  Perhaps the new kids get CBD and a joint 

but for us it was pretty much:

 

Aches and pains?  800 Mg ibuprofen 

Broken bone?  800 Mg ibuprofen

Minor Amputation?  800 Mg Ibuprofen

Major Amputation?  1600 MG ibuprofen and a stiff drink.   

 

I'm pretty much on the same med schedule now except the aches and pains are a 
constant so I cut down the dosage somewhat.  

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 3:12 PM Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > wrote:

The ibuprofin thing with covid was removed like 2 weeks into it, they realized 
it was based on bad science

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:18 PM Robert Andrews mailto:i...@avantwireless.com> > wrote:

Except now with Covid ibuprofen->tylenol...

On 12/04/2020 10:19 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
> I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and failed) 
> to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum 
> knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get 
> arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer 
> to it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a 
> real issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little 
> uncomfortable during cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.
> 
> My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days. The 
> problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The last 
> time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to 
> get it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts 
> of ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the 
> inflammation went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell 
> exercises and slowly worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and 
> easy, because even slight tweaks and you're back to square one.
> 
> 
> bp
> 
> 
> On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I 
>> should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from 
>> retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
>> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, 
>> and suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>> My own damn fault..
>>
> 
> 

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PORT NETWORKS

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Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707 

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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Saratoga springs had a billboard showing a amusement park back in the day.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 4, 2020, at 2:52 PM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> 
> Sounds similar to my experience.
>  
> In 2001 I moved to a “remote” area of desert “new” city with not even a 
> street light.
>  
> I was dying for internet, had half working DSL and it sucked.
>  
> I had already been experimenting with 802.11 wireless transmissions and 
> manage to get myself a 2.4GHz link across Utah Lake using those old grid 
> antennas and a hacked WAP11.
>  
> But the internet was MUCH better, having sourced it from some random dudes 
> house that I found knocking on a few doors, lol!
>  
> After that my neighbors were like, “How did you get that?” and “How do I get 
> that too?”
>  
> A WISP was born out of that, with no funding, from the 
> ground/neighbors/neighborhood up.
>  
> Eventually we were big enough to change everything over to Motorola Canopy 
> and never looked back.
>  
> Sold that company after 10 years to JAB and did FTTH/FTTP.
>  
> Now I’ve come full circle and am doing WISP again with 60GHz gear and wishing 
> I had Cambium Terragraph.
> Looks like it may be time for another WISP “forklift” upgrade… Stupid WISP 
> stuff!
>  
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 2:07 PM
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>  
> Funny. I'm trying to remember when I went to what I think was a WISPCON 
> conference back around that time in San Jose.
> 
> I had just learned about the last mile problem, and I had been the designee 
> from our neighborhood group to figure out how we were going to get high speed 
> internet to our little region. It's a tough place to serve because there are 
> only about 1,000 households and we cover an approximate 500 square mile area 
> in the mountains.
> 
> I met someone from Cascade Networks. I don't remember now if it was Brian or 
> Jason. It might have been both. At any rate, they made a convincing argument 
> for some kind of Canopy-based network based on my description of where we 
> needed to provide service.
> 
> I went home and told my wife "I think we can do this.".  A few months later 
> we were on our way.
> 
> The original goal was to provide service to a few dozen of our closest 
> neighbors, and get an almost no cost internet for ourselves. That turned into 
> selling heroin to an addicted clientele (metaphorically speaking).
> 
>  
> 
> bp
> 
> On 12/4/2020 12:37 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
> I think we saw our first Canopy March 2003. 
>  
> From: Ken Hohhof
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:14 PM
> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>  
> Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  
> There was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
> competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
> bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.
>  
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>  
> That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
> Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
> cover quite a range of topics.
> 
>  
> 
> bp
> 
> On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
> One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
> posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
> pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
> and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they 
> were not a subscriber to both lists or something like that. 
>  
> In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And 
> then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
> Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
> getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
> serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go. 
>  
> In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
> then ... the barn door had been left open.
>  
> I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in 
> contact rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it 
> turns out he was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.
>  
> Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this. 
>  
> From: Adam Moffett
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>  
> What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
> 
> On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>  
>  
> From: Paul McCall
> Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>  
> Its all

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Chuck McCown via AF]

I notice my seemingly constant arm muscle aches are helped more by Tylenol than 
ibuprofen.  Worry about liver damage.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 4, 2020, at 4:44 PM, Carl Peterson  wrote:
> 
> 
> I'm ex Army.  Perhaps the new kids get CBD and a joint 
> but for us it was pretty much:
> 
> Aches and pains?  800 Mg ibuprofen 
> Broken bone?  800 Mg ibuprofen
> Minor Amputation?  800 Mg Ibuprofen
> Major Amputation?  1600 MG ibuprofen and a stiff drink.   
> 
> I'm pretty much on the same med schedule now except the aches and pains are a 
> constant so I cut down the dosage somewhat.  
> 
>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 3:12 PM Steve Jones  wrote:
>> The ibuprofin thing with covid was removed like 2 weeks into it, they 
>> realized it was based on bad science
>> 
>>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:18 PM Robert Andrews  wrote:
>>> Except now with Covid ibuprofen->tylenol...
>>> 
>>> On 12/04/2020 10:19 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>>> > I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and failed) 
>>> > to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum 
>>> > knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get 
>>> > arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer 
>>> > to it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a 
>>> > real issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little 
>>> > uncomfortable during cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.
>>> > 
>>> > My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days. The 
>>> > problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The last 
>>> > time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to 
>>> > get it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts 
>>> > of ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the 
>>> > inflammation went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell 
>>> > exercises and slowly worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and 
>>> > easy, because even slight tweaks and you're back to square one.
>>> > 
>>> > 
>>> > bp
>>> > 
>>> > 
>>> > On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>> >> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I 
>>> >> should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from 
>>> >> retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
>>> >> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, 
>>> >> and suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>>> >> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>>> >> My own damn fault..
>>> >>
>>> > 
>>> > 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> Carl Peterson
> 
> PORT NETWORKS
> 
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
> 
> Baltimore, MD 21202
> 
> (410) 637-3707 
> 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Carl Peterson]

I'm ex Army.  Perhaps the new kids get CBD and a joint
but for us it was pretty much:

Aches and pains?  800 Mg ibuprofen
Broken bone?  800 Mg ibuprofen
Minor Amputation?  800 Mg Ibuprofen
Major Amputation?  1600 MG ibuprofen and a stiff drink.

I'm pretty much on the same med schedule now except the aches and pains are
a constant so I cut down the dosage somewhat.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 3:12 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> The ibuprofin thing with covid was removed like 2 weeks into it, they
> realized it was based on bad science
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:18 PM Robert Andrews 
> wrote:
>
>> Except now with Covid ibuprofen->tylenol...
>>
>> On 12/04/2020 10:19 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>> > I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and
>> failed)
>> > to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum
>> > knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get
>> > arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer
>> > to it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a
>> > real issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little
>> > uncomfortable during cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.
>> >
>> > My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days.
>> The
>> > problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The
>> last
>> > time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to
>> > get it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts
>> > of ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the
>> > inflammation went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell
>> > exercises and slowly worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and
>> > easy, because even slight tweaks and you're back to square one.
>> >
>> >
>> > bp
>> > 
>> >
>> > On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>> >> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I
>> >> should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from
>> >> retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
>> >> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee,
>> >> and suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>> >> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>> >> My own damn fault..
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
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Re: [AFMUG] old and busted vs new hotness

[Nate Burke]

I haven't run into demanding customers, sometimes they'll ask if they 
have the fastest equipment, and I just tell them yes.


I did just have an install where the customers kid worked for a 
"security camera company" and "is up on all the wireless"  and he told 
them that we NEED to install 'The 2' dish antenna unit' so they could 
get the highest speed.  Had to explain that there's only 1 size dish 
available.


On 12/4/2020 4:10 PM, Darin Steffl wrote:
I rarely hear this from customers but we've always used a round dish 
of some sort. Nanobridge, powerbeam, epmp force 110, 200, 300


So we never used reflectors and customers can't tell the difference 
from the ground of any of the above dishes.


That said, if you can provide them their plan speed with the old SM 
and there isn't any improvement with the new one, you have no 
obligation to upgrade their hardware. You upgrade when their plan 
needs newer hardware or it's defective and needs replacement. As long 
as you own the gear, you decide when it's upgraded, period.


Where we're upgrading 1k or 2k to the 3k with 4x4 sector, we're 
proactively upgrading the top 10 customers on each sector to Force 300 
so we can see some mu-mimo action. They don't pay for the upgrade 
because it's our gear and we're doing it to increase capacity. The 
gear we swap gets reused elsewhere on the network where our 2k gear is 
sufficient and underloaded. We have some 6+ year old powerbeams that 
are elevated still chugging along too. They've made us a lot of money.


Cambium offering elevate for our ubiquiti cpe saved us over $400,000 
in hardware, labor, and opportunity costs.


On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 3:07 PM Steve Jones > wrote:


Install a new capped one

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:57 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:

I regularly run into customers who want a new SM because we
installed it several years ago and they assume there are
newer, faster ones now and they should have one of those.

It doesn’t help when for example they see us install a 450b
for a neighbor and it looks different from their classic 450
with a reflector dish.  It looks different.  Obviously the
neighbor got the new fast radio, while they are stuck with the
old slow one, and we need to come upgrade theirs.  I can try
to explain why there’s no difference, or something about it
being a software defined radio and theirs is running the
latest FW same as the neighbor’s radio, or that we applied a
license key to take theirs from 20M sustained to uncapped. 
But they seem to think if they are paying their bill every

month, they should get a new radio every couple years.  Like a
new smartphone every 2 years?  Or maybe they think the only
thing we did was install something on their roof, so why do
they need to keep paying us if we don’t upgrade the thing on
the roof, what are we doing to earn our money?

Anybody have a solution for this?  Or just continue ignoring them?

In case you didn’t get the Men In Black reference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-uagjJQ9k

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Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Chris Fabien]

I would add a diesel powered water heater like hot water pressure
washers use into the pressure circuit. This would help keep the vacuum
hose from freezing while excavating, and then set up a recirculate
system where they disconnect the wand and plug the end of the hose
into a fitting that returns it to the tank. Then leave the heater and
pump running on low and this will keep your water tank nice and warm.
Might take some thermostats to make it be stable. I'm not sure if
keeping the spoils warm in the tank would even matter that much, other
than making it a pain to get empty.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 3:17 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
> I bought a 12 volt dc air compressor with tank.  Going to have them blow out 
> the spray hose when done spraying in the afternoon.  So that when they get 
> back to the shop at least it will not be frozen stiff when they go to 
> winterize everything.
>
> From: Colin Stanners
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:10 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps
>
> Some excavator manufacturers have "arctic" upgrade packages. My understanding 
> is that as long as the vacuum truck is stored inside a warm shop when not in 
> use, the clean water tank will have enough thermal mass to not freeze during 
> most workdays. The vac design may be passing the engine exhaust underneath 
> the tank to warm it too. A heater on the outgoing water helps protect the 
> rest of the circulation system. Employees being careful of freezing risk is 
> important too, not letting things "sit".
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 1:19 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>>
>> Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low temps.  
>> Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the water 
>> jacket or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that would 
>> blow out the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some kind of 
>> propane heater to warm up the water tank.
>>
>> Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam industry.  
>> Might work.
>>
>> Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> 
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Re: [AFMUG] old and busted vs new hotness

[Darin Steffl]

I rarely hear this from customers but we've always used a round dish of
some sort. Nanobridge, powerbeam, epmp force 110, 200, 300

So we never used reflectors and customers can't tell the difference from
the ground of any of the above dishes.

That said, if you can provide them their plan speed with the old SM and
there isn't any improvement with the new one, you have no obligation to
upgrade their hardware. You upgrade when their plan needs newer hardware or
it's defective and needs replacement. As long as you own the gear, you
decide when it's upgraded, period.

Where we're upgrading 1k or 2k to the 3k with 4x4 sector, we're proactively
upgrading the top 10 customers on each sector to Force 300 so we can see
some mu-mimo action. They don't pay for the upgrade because it's our gear
and we're doing it to increase capacity. The gear we swap gets reused
elsewhere on the network where our 2k gear is sufficient and underloaded.
We have some 6+ year old powerbeams that are elevated still chugging along
too. They've made us a lot of money.

Cambium offering elevate for our ubiquiti cpe saved us over $400,000 in
hardware, labor, and opportunity costs.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 3:07 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> Install a new capped one
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:57 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> I regularly run into customers who want a new SM because we installed it
>> several years ago and they assume there are newer, faster ones now and they
>> should have one of those.
>>
>>
>>
>> It doesn’t help when for example they see us install a 450b for a
>> neighbor and it looks different from their classic 450 with a reflector
>> dish.  It looks different.  Obviously the neighbor got the new fast radio,
>> while they are stuck with the old slow one, and we need to come upgrade
>> theirs.  I can try to explain why there’s no difference, or something about
>> it being a software defined radio and theirs is running the latest FW same
>> as the neighbor’s radio, or that we applied a license key to take theirs
>> from 20M sustained to uncapped.  But they seem to think if they are paying
>> their bill every month, they should get a new radio every couple years.
>> Like a new smartphone every 2 years?  Or maybe they think the only thing we
>> did was install something on their roof, so why do they need to keep paying
>> us if we don’t upgrade the thing on the roof, what are we doing to earn our
>> money?
>>
>>
>>
>> Anybody have a solution for this?  Or just continue ignoring them?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> In case you didn’t get the Men In Black reference:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-uagjJQ9k
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Sterling Jacobson]

Haha!

The “Real” Wispcon

That cracks me up. I remember all the drama now.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Colin Stanners
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 2:06 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

https://web.archive.org/web/20060701061713/http://www.wispcon.info/

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 2:15 PM Ken Hohhof 
mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics.



bp


On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.

From: Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:


From: Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊
Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
(only us “long-times” will get that reference)
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.
But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back.
They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
I’m good 😊
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.
I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.  Very difficult, 
ye

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Sterling Jacobson]

Sounds similar to my experience.

In 2001 I moved to a “remote” area of desert “new” city with not even a street 
light.

I was dying for internet, had half working DSL and it sucked.

I had already been experimenting with 802.11 wireless transmissions and manage 
to get myself a 2.4GHz link across Utah Lake using those old grid antennas and 
a hacked WAP11.

But the internet was MUCH better, having sourced it from some random dudes 
house that I found knocking on a few doors, lol!

After that my neighbors were like, “How did you get that?” and “How do I get 
that too?”

A WISP was born out of that, with no funding, from the 
ground/neighbors/neighborhood up.

Eventually we were big enough to change everything over to Motorola Canopy and 
never looked back.

Sold that company after 10 years to JAB and did FTTH/FTTP.

Now I’ve come full circle and am doing WISP again with 60GHz gear and wishing I 
had Cambium Terragraph.
Looks like it may be time for another WISP “forklift” upgrade… Stupid WISP 
stuff!

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 2:07 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


Funny. I'm trying to remember when I went to what I think was a WISPCON 
conference back around that time in San Jose.

I had just learned about the last mile problem, and I had been the designee 
from our neighborhood group to figure out how we were going to get high speed 
internet to our little region. It's a tough place to serve because there are 
only about 1,000 households and we cover an approximate 500 square mile area in 
the mountains.

I met someone from Cascade Networks. I don't remember now if it was Brian or 
Jason. It might have been both. At any rate, they made a convincing argument 
for some kind of Canopy-based network based on my description of where we 
needed to provide service.

I went home and told my wife "I think we can do this.".  A few months later we 
were on our way.

The original goal was to provide service to a few dozen of our closest 
neighbors, and get an almost no cost internet for ourselves. That turned into 
selling heroin to an addicted clientele (metaphorically speaking).



bp


On 12/4/2020 12:37 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
I think we saw our first Canopy March 2003.

From: Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:14 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.

From: AF  On Behalf Of 
Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics.



bp


On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.

From: Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:


From: Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊
Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
(only us “long-times” will get that reference)
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower loc

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Chuck McCown via AF]

From: Sterling Jacobson 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Are you guys getting my posts on this email thread?

 

I sent a reply with a quote from one of those “I Quit” emails that I had saved 
from years ago…

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:26 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

See if you can find the pilot episode of the TV show Newsradio.  Mr. James 
hires Dave as the new news director, and his first job is to fire the old news 
director Ed.  Dave thinks his problem is solved when Ed does an “I QUIT”, but 
then he finds out that Ed quits all the time.

 

I worked with a guy like that once.  He would get mad and “quit” every couple 
weeks, ripping up his ID badge and throwing it out the car window.  The next 
morning he would be at HR getting a new badge.

 

You really want to be careful about quitting in a fit of pique (is that the 
expression?)  One manager I worked with kept a blank resignation form in his 
center desk drawer in case a certain employee quit.  I forget why the employee 
was un-fireable, maybe an EEOC thing, but if he ever quit his resignation would 
be accepted in a nanosecond before he could change his mind.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of James Howard
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:59 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

Funny sometimes how people say something like that out of frustration and then 
try to backtrack.  I’m on the board of a small non-profit and about 10 years 
ago just months after I joined, the current president sent out an email to the 
whole board stating “I am resigning as president effective immediately”.  I 
contacted the other officers about what we were going to do (we had a board 
meeting scheduled either that night or the next),  we came up with a plan and 
all showed up for the meeting expecting that the secretary would fill in since 
our VP at the time never came and the president walks in and sits down.  We 
asked him why he was even there since he resigned “effective immediately” and 
he acted like he never sent it out.  We ended up having to pull out a printout 
of his email, read it to him and ask what it meant.  He finally admitted that 
he “was planning to resign but not for a while”……….  We did actually let him 
stay on as interim president until we appointed someone new about a month later 
but it sounds like it was probably a situation similar to what happened with 
this.  

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:32 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: Chuck McCown 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

 

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.

Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

 

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

 

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

 

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

 

From: Adam Moffett 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM

To: af@af.afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

   

   

  From: Paul McCall 

  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM

  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

   

  Its all good Ken 😊

  Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

  But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

  (only us “long-times” will get that reference)

  From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

  I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

  From: AF  On Behalf Of Paul McCall
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

  Not in total agreement with that assessment

Re: [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

[Chuck McCown via AF]

I always thought you used the meth to help you climb. 

From: Jaime Solorza 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:36 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

I had a climber who wouldn't climb over 100 ft.  Cowboys fan...he pissed off 
another tower climber one evening...next day , he climbed up to 150 ft. where 
we were installing to 4 ft dishes...he took the other guys Dallas Cowboys hard 
hat and wire tied it up on top!  
Funny as hellhe had to use a spare helmet rest of the day...

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 8:23 AM Colin Stanners  wrote:

  
https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/woman-who-climbed-crane-in-winnipeg-likely-using-methamphetamine-police-1.5214303

  We have had new wireless installers that don't like climbing over 40ft. I 
jokingly chatted our HR... "if she gets off the drugs, do you want to hire her?"

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  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

The ibuprofin thing with covid was removed like 2 weeks into it, they
realized it was based on bad science

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:18 PM Robert Andrews  wrote:

> Except now with Covid ibuprofen->tylenol...
>
> On 12/04/2020 10:19 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
> > I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and failed)
> > to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum
> > knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get
> > arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer
> > to it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a
> > real issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little
> > uncomfortable during cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.
> >
> > My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days. The
> > problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The last
> > time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to
> > get it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts
> > of ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the
> > inflammation went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell
> > exercises and slowly worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and
> > easy, because even slight tweaks and you're back to square one.
> >
> >
> > bp
> > 
> >
> > On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
> >> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I
> >> should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from
> >> retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
> >> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee,
> >> and suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
> >> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
> >> My own damn fault..
> >>
> >
> >
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Steve Jones]

Not that I condone government run much of anything, but if it were
government run healthcare it should be based on what you put in if there
were to be any metric. That's also why I'm against government run
healthcare, my sisters retarded and lives in a home. Shes never input a
dime, but I'd like her to have healthcare.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:57 PM Brian Webster  wrote:

> That article or app or whatever it was should be something the public can
> think about with government run (paid for and likely rationed) will look
> like. Once the private insurance companies disappear and the private
> healthcare providers are gone, there will be no choice. Articles like this
> are a slow way to start getting people conditioned to the idea. The results
> are basically telling you what the ruling class think you and your life are
> worth. Don’t for a second think that the algorithms will have things
> factored in like your contributions to the tax base and such. That part
> will never see the public eye but a politician can’t sacrifice too many
> productive taxpayers before they lose their power.
>
>
>
> The process will take time, articles like this are part of that mental
> conditioning……
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Brian Webster
>
> www.wirelessmapping.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 2:47 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
>
>
>
> If you've recovered, you're last in line if at all since they announced
> you're immune
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:24 AM Harold Bledsoe 
> wrote:
>
> Matt jumps on his motorcycle he’s using to parachute out of a plane on…
>
>
>
> *From: *AF 
> *Date: *Friday, December 4, 2020 at 10:50 AM
> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group , Gino A.
> Villarini 
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
>
> Based on your risk profile, we believe it would be a waste of precious
> vaccine resources to provide you with one.  Even if they were widely
> available, just the time of a nurse to administer it could be better
> spent sitting in silence.   We’re honestly a little surprised that you
> haven’t died of COVID or any other number of communicable diseases yet,
> based on your lifestyle choices and stupidity.
>
> On 12/4/20 11:47 AM, Gino A. Villarini wrote:
> > Locally, Telecom falls under first responders…
> >
> > *GinoVillarini
> > *Founder/President
> > @gvillarini
> > t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> > aeronet-logo <
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aeronetpr.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=cXdP5ZlsYVo0qCpXiQ94H345oEQAgcUmuKVWFQH%2BuDc%3D&reserved=0>
> inc500
> > <
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.inc.com%2Fprofile%2Faeronet&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=mJLcWRqd47sTN%2BaYeJMK0SxtM1QY6aP8Qy9JBEWDyFs%3D&reserved=0>
> fb-logo
> > <
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Faeronetpr%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=HpP7tKewB%2FqaR8T8k2Rwiie7br42eKvDLUQjgSt%2FrgY%3D&reserved=0>
> insta-logo
> > <
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.instagram.com%2Faeronetpr%2F%3Fhl%3Den&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=VNjxBcy4Kx5%2F7ooqn%2BQ8FM0EcHdK%2FSnJICZqsOVuBlc%3D&reserved=0>
> in-logo
> > <
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fcompany%2Faeronet-broadband-corp&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=IPHRfuhWgoKW4dMPvkZyO4%2BQpubQXGCk9VpwT%2BCl8fE%3D&reserved=0>
> tw-logo
> > <
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FAeroNetPR%3Fref_src%3Dtwsrc%255Egoogle%257Ctwcamp%255Eserp%257Ctwgr%255Eauthor&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000164916%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=vnLbBaGr1mXik5gXRXyROTcgkqyoYmxNjCXdIf%2BkT6g%3D&rese

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Funny. I'm trying to remember when I went to what I think was a
  WISPCON conference back around that time in San Jose.

I had just learned about the last mile problem, and I had been
  the designee from our neighborhood group to figure out how we were
  going to get high speed internet to our little region. It's a
  tough place to serve because there are only about 1,000 households
  and we cover an approximate 500 square mile area in the mountains.
I met someone from Cascade Networks. I don't remember now if it
  was Brian or Jason. It might have been both. At any rate, they
  made a convincing argument for some kind of Canopy-based network
  based on my description of where we needed to provide service.
I went home and told my wife "I think we can do this.".  A few
  months later we were on our way. 

The original goal was to provide service to a few dozen of our
  closest neighbors, and get an almost no cost internet for
  ourselves. That turned into selling heroin to an addicted
  clientele (metaphorically speaking).



bp

On 12/4/2020 12:37 PM, Chuck McCown via
  AF wrote:


  
  
  
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Re: [AFMUG] old and busted vs new hotness

[Steve Jones]

Install a new capped one

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:57 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I regularly run into customers who want a new SM because we installed it
> several years ago and they assume there are newer, faster ones now and they
> should have one of those.
>
>
>
> It doesn’t help when for example they see us install a 450b for a neighbor
> and it looks different from their classic 450 with a reflector dish.  It
> looks different.  Obviously the neighbor got the new fast radio, while they
> are stuck with the old slow one, and we need to come upgrade theirs.  I can
> try to explain why there’s no difference, or something about it being a
> software defined radio and theirs is running the latest FW same as the
> neighbor’s radio, or that we applied a license key to take theirs from 20M
> sustained to uncapped.  But they seem to think if they are paying their
> bill every month, they should get a new radio every couple years.  Like a
> new smartphone every 2 years?  Or maybe they think the only thing we did
> was install something on their roof, so why do they need to keep paying us
> if we don’t upgrade the thing on the roof, what are we doing to earn our
> money?
>
>
>
> Anybody have a solution for this?  Or just continue ignoring them?
>
>
>
>
>
> In case you didn’t get the Men In Black reference:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-uagjJQ9k
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Colin Stanners]

https://web.archive.org/web/20060701061713/http://www.wispcon.info/

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 2:15 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.
> There was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also
> a competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show
> in a bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>
>
>
> That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband
> Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to
> cover quite a range of topics.
>
>
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly
> posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He
> was pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each
> list and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if
> they were not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.
>
>
>
> In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And
> then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
>
> Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was
> getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list
> serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.
>
>
>
> In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but
> by then ... the barn door had been left open.
>
>
>
> I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in
> contact rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it
> turns out he was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.
>
>
>
> Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.
>
>
>
> *From:* Adam Moffett
>
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
>
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>
>
>
> What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
>
> On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Paul McCall
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Its all good Ken 😊
>
> Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
>
> But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
>
> (only us “long-times” will get that reference)
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  *On
> Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
>
> 20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working
> aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a
> bunch of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less
> than 10 tech phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well
> aware of future proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we
> have a few years at least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and
> smaller fill towers.  We overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.
> Licensed BH links wherever possible.   If I had a local company that could
> provide 50Mbit plans for less than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.
> Not everyone would of course.  ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our
> coverage area, and we have lost 4 customers in 2 years to it.
>
> But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry
> ever comes back.
>
> They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
>
> I’m good 😊
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.
> On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and
> T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded
> fiber.
>
> I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running
> chainsaws, while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.
> Very difficult, yet customers would rather be doing something else.
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subjec

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

I use those dollar store ones with vix type stuff, freaking amazing stuff

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:32 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> The cbd oil made me sleepy... believe it or not, the El cheapo Dollar
> Store pain pads worked the bestI refused the Oxy they wanted to
> prescribe...Aleve Nighttime helps ...
> Pain is less and less each week...
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:05 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> I got a shoulder posture brace, that helped and recently got a lower back
>> brace. I wish I had been wearing that thing for the last 20 years.
>> I'm hoping to find a small chinese gentleman who will ride around with
>> his feet right between my shoulder blades and his hands pulling my
>> shoulders back. Was gonna post an ad but dont know what kind of pay to
>> offer since I'd be doing alot of the work carrying him around
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:00 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>>> I have trouble with sciatica.  Sitting for long periods is bad.  Lifting
>>> with back not legs is bad.  Walking actually seems good, easier said than
>>> done.  After my wife died, I walked her dog miles per day for a couple
>>> years which was probably good, but he’s gone almost 2 years now.  So I do
>>> all the bad things and none of the good.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The “standing desk” people would probably say that’s what I need to do.
>>> I don’t think standing is actually helpful, it’s not the same as walking.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Worst possible thing is to sit all day at the computer then lift
>>> something heavy.  I did that a couple months ago, felt like an electrical
>>> shock all down my left leg.  Usually it heals in 2-3 weeks, this time it
>>> mostly did but not 100%.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
>>> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 1:36 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk
>>> ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could
>>> heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to
>>> train yourself.  Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a
>>> truck.  Nope, have to learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2
>>> at a time any more.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Lewis Bergman
>>>
>>> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
>>>
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I
>>> was favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it
>>> and it would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I
>>> should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
>>> operation for two months mas o menos.
>>>
>>> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
>>> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>>>
>>> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>>>
>>> My own damn fault..
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Brian Webster]

That article or app or whatever it was should be something the public can think 
about with government run (paid for and likely rationed) will look like. Once 
the private insurance companies disappear and the private healthcare providers 
are gone, there will be no choice. Articles like this are a slow way to start 
getting people conditioned to the idea. The results are basically telling you 
what the ruling class think you and your life are worth. Don’t for a second 
think that the algorithms will have things factored in like your contributions 
to the tax base and such. That part will never see the public eye but a 
politician can’t sacrifice too many productive taxpayers before they lose their 
power.

 

The process will take time, articles like this are part of that mental 
conditioning……

 

Thank you,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 2:47 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

 

If you've recovered, you're last in line if at all since they announced you're 
immune

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:24 AM Harold Bledsoe  wrote:

Matt jumps on his motorcycle he’s using to parachute out of a plane on…

 

From: AF 
Date: Friday, December 4, 2020 at 10:50 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group , Gino A. Villarini 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

Based on your risk profile, we believe it would be a waste of precious 
vaccine resources to provide you with one.  Even if they were widely 
available, just the time of a nurse to administer it could be better 
spent sitting in silence.   We’re honestly a little surprised that you 
haven’t died of COVID or any other number of communicable diseases yet, 
based on your lifestyle choices and stupidity.

On 12/4/20 11:47 AM, Gino A. Villarini wrote:
> Locally, Telecom falls under first responders…
> 
> *GinoVillarini
> *Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> aeronet-logo 
>   
> 
>  
> &data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=cXdP5ZlsYVo0qCpXiQ94H345oEQAgcUmuKVWFQH%2BuDc%3D&reserved=0>
> inc500 
>   
> 
>  
> &data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=mJLcWRqd47sTN%2BaYeJMK0SxtM1QY6aP8Qy9JBEWDyFs%3D&reserved=0>
>  fb-logo 
>   
> 
>  
> &data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000154921%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=HpP7tKewB%2FqaR8T8k2Rwiie7br42eKvDLUQjgSt%2FrgY%3D&reserved=0>
>insta-logo 
>   
> 
>  
> &data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89

[AFMUG] old and busted vs new hotness

[Ken Hohhof]

I regularly run into customers who want a new SM because we installed it
several years ago and they assume there are newer, faster ones now and they
should have one of those.

 

It doesn't help when for example they see us install a 450b for a neighbor
and it looks different from their classic 450 with a reflector dish.  It
looks different.  Obviously the neighbor got the new fast radio, while they
are stuck with the old slow one, and we need to come upgrade theirs.  I can
try to explain why there's no difference, or something about it being a
software defined radio and theirs is running the latest FW same as the
neighbor's radio, or that we applied a license key to take theirs from 20M
sustained to uncapped.  But they seem to think if they are paying their bill
every month, they should get a new radio every couple years.  Like a new
smartphone every 2 years?  Or maybe they think the only thing we did was
install something on their roof, so why do they need to keep paying us if we
don't upgrade the thing on the roof, what are we doing to earn our money?

 

Anybody have a solution for this?  Or just continue ignoring them?

 

 

In case you didn't get the Men In Black reference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-uagjJQ9k

 

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Sterling Jacobson]

Thanks for the confirmation, wasn’t sure if it was getting through.

Those were good times I tell ya!

I was working contract part time for Motorola at the time he did that.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:50 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


Yah. It was in reply to Jaime's "Yup".



bp


On 12/4/2020 12:38 PM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:
Are you guys getting my posts on this email thread?

I sent a reply with a quote from one of those “I Quit” emails that I had saved 
from years ago…

From: AF  On Behalf Of 
Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:26 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

See if you can find the pilot episode of the TV show Newsradio.  Mr. James 
hires Dave as the new news director, and his first job is to fire the old news 
director Ed.  Dave thinks his problem is solved when Ed does an “I QUIT”, but 
then he finds out that Ed quits all the time.

I worked with a guy like that once.  He would get mad and “quit” every couple 
weeks, ripping up his ID badge and throwing it out the car window.  The next 
morning he would be at HR getting a new badge.

You really want to be careful about quitting in a fit of pique (is that the 
expression?)  One manager I worked with kept a blank resignation form in his 
center desk drawer in case a certain employee quit.  I forget why the employee 
was un-fireable, maybe an EEOC thing, but if he ever quit his resignation would 
be accepted in a nanosecond before he could change his mind.


From: AF  On Behalf Of 
James Howard
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:59 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Funny sometimes how people say something like that out of frustration and then 
try to backtrack.  I’m on the board of a small non-profit and about 10 years 
ago just months after I joined, the current president sent out an email to the 
whole board stating “I am resigning as president effective immediately”.  I 
contacted the other officers about what we were going to do (we had a board 
meeting scheduled either that night or the next),  we came up with a plan and 
all showed up for the meeting expecting that the secretary would fill in since 
our VP at the time never came and the president walks in and sits down.  We 
asked him why he was even there since he resigned “effective immediately” and 
he acted like he never sent it out.  We ended up having to pull out a printout 
of his email, read it to him and ask what it meant.  He finally admitted that 
he “was planning to resign but not for a while”……….  We did actually let him 
stay on as interim president until we appointed someone new about a month later 
but it sounds like it was probably a situation similar to what happened with 
this.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:32 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.

From: Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:


From: Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊
Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
(only us “long-times” will get that reference)
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Yah. It was in reply to Jaime's "Yup".


bp

On 12/4/2020 12:38 PM, Sterling
  Jacobson wrote:


  
  
  
  
  
Are you guys getting my posts on this email
  thread?
 
I sent a reply with a quote from one of
  those “I Quit” emails that I had saved from years ago…
 

  
From: AF
   On Behalf Of 
  Ken Hohhof
  Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:26 PM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
  
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
  

 
See if you can find the pilot episode of
  the TV show Newsradio.  Mr. James hires Dave as the new news
  director, and his first job is to fire the old news director
  Ed.  Dave thinks his problem is solved when Ed does an “I
  QUIT”, but then he finds out that Ed quits all the time.
 
I worked with a guy like that once.  He
  would get mad and “quit” every couple weeks, ripping up his ID
  badge and throwing it out the car window.  The next morning he
  would be at HR getting a new badge.
 
You really want to be careful about
  quitting in a fit of pique (is that the _expression_?)  One
  manager I worked with kept a blank resignation form in his
  center desk drawer in case a certain employee quit.  I forget
  why the employee was un-fireable, maybe an EEOC thing, but if
  he ever quit his resignation would be accepted in a nanosecond
  before he could change his mind.
 
 

  
From: AF
   On Behalf Of 
  James Howard
  Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:59 PM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
  
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
  

 
Funny sometimes how people say something
  like that out of frustration and then try to backtrack.  I’m
  on the board of a small non-profit and about 10 years ago just
  months after I joined, the current president sent out an email
  to the whole board stating “I am resigning as president
  effective immediately”.  I contacted the other officers about
  what we were going to do (we had a board meeting scheduled
  either that night or the next),  we came up with a plan and
  all showed up for the meeting expecting that the secretary
  would fill in since our VP at the time never came and the
  president walks in and sits down.  We asked him why he was
  even there since he resigned “effective immediately” and he
  acted like he never sent it out.  We ended up having to pull
  out a printout of his email, read it to him and ask what it
  meant.  He finally admitted that he “was planning to resign
  but not for a while”……….  We did actually let him stay on as
  interim president until we appointed someone new about a month
  later but it sounds like it was probably a situation similar
  to what happened with this.  
  
 

  
From: AF 
  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
  Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:32 PM
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Cc: Chuck McCown 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
  

 

  

  One day, mid day
  Michael was upset because someone cross posted or
  wrongly posted something about Motorola in a Trango
  list or some such thing.  He was pretty much a list
  nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each
  list and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering
  Trango questions if they were not a subscriber to both
  lists or something like that. 
  


   


  In any event he
  was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff. 
  And then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject
  line.


  Then, like
  immediately, the list serve went down and stayed
  down.  I was getting emails all afternoon about it and
  so I had my guys start up a list serv, put all the
  Motorola people on it and away we go.  


   


  In a day or two,
  Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it
  but by then ... the barn door h

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Sterling Jacobson]

Are you guys getting my posts on this email thread?

I sent a reply with a quote from one of those “I Quit” emails that I had saved 
from years ago…

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:26 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

See if you can find the pilot episode of the TV show Newsradio.  Mr. James 
hires Dave as the new news director, and his first job is to fire the old news 
director Ed.  Dave thinks his problem is solved when Ed does an “I QUIT”, but 
then he finds out that Ed quits all the time.

I worked with a guy like that once.  He would get mad and “quit” every couple 
weeks, ripping up his ID badge and throwing it out the car window.  The next 
morning he would be at HR getting a new badge.

You really want to be careful about quitting in a fit of pique (is that the 
expression?)  One manager I worked with kept a blank resignation form in his 
center desk drawer in case a certain employee quit.  I forget why the employee 
was un-fireable, maybe an EEOC thing, but if he ever quit his resignation would 
be accepted in a nanosecond before he could change his mind.


From: AF  On Behalf Of James Howard
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:59 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Funny sometimes how people say something like that out of frustration and then 
try to backtrack.  I’m on the board of a small non-profit and about 10 years 
ago just months after I joined, the current president sent out an email to the 
whole board stating “I am resigning as president effective immediately”.  I 
contacted the other officers about what we were going to do (we had a board 
meeting scheduled either that night or the next),  we came up with a plan and 
all showed up for the meeting expecting that the secretary would fill in since 
our VP at the time never came and the president walks in and sits down.  We 
asked him why he was even there since he resigned “effective immediately” and 
he acted like he never sent it out.  We ended up having to pull out a printout 
of his email, read it to him and ask what it meant.  He finally admitted that 
he “was planning to resign but not for a while”……….  We did actually let him 
stay on as interim president until we appointed someone new about a month later 
but it sounds like it was probably a situation similar to what happened with 
this.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:32 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.

From: Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:


From: Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊
Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
(only us “long-times” will get that reference)
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for custo

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Chuck McCown via AF]

I think we saw our first Canopy March 2003.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:14 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics.

 

bpOn 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

  One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

   

  In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And 
then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.

  Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

   

  In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

   

  I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in 
contact rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns 
out he was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

   

  Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

   

  From: Adam Moffett 

  Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM

  To: af@af.afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

   

  What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

  On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

 

 

From: Paul McCall 

Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

 

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.   

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.

But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry 
ever comes back.

They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!

I’m good 😊

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  
On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.

I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running 
chainsaws, while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.  Very 
difficult, yet customers would rather be doing something else.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Cc: Chuck McCown 
Subject: Re: [AFM

Re: [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

[Jaime Solorza]

I had a climber who wouldn't climb over 100 ft.  Cowboys fan...he pissed
off another tower climber one evening...next day , he climbed up to 150 ft.
where we were installing to 4 ft dishes...he took the other guys Dallas
Cowboys hard hat and wire tied it up on top!
Funny as hellhe had to use a spare helmet rest of the day...

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 8:23 AM Colin Stanners  wrote:

> https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/woman-who-climbed-crane
> -in-winnipeg-likely-using-methamphetamine-police-1.5214303
> 
>
> We have had new wireless installers that don't like climbing over 40ft. I
> jokingly chatted our HR... "if she gets off the drugs, do you want to hire
> her?"
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Nope, we were just trying to decide between Canopy and Proxim at that time.  
Went to WISPCON probably the next year.  Michael got into a pissing contest 
with the ISPCON folks.   There was a lawsuit.  Don’t recall details.  I know 
that WISPA got started due to a less than positive interaction between Michael 
and some folks.  At least that is what I remember Mac telling me once upon a 
time in Las Vegas.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:14 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics.

 

bpOn 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

  One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

   

  In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And 
then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.

  Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

   

  In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

   

  I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in 
contact rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns 
out he was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

   

  Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

   

  From: Adam Moffett 

  Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM

  To: af@af.afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

   

  What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

  On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

 

 

From: Paul McCall 

Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

 

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.   

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.

But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry 
ever comes back.

They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!

I’m good 😊

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  
On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.

I think it’s like gettin

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Jaime Solorza]

The cbd oil made me sleepy... believe it or not, the El cheapo Dollar Store
pain pads worked the bestI refused the Oxy they wanted to
prescribe...Aleve Nighttime helps ...
Pain is less and less each week...

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:05 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> I got a shoulder posture brace, that helped and recently got a lower back
> brace. I wish I had been wearing that thing for the last 20 years.
> I'm hoping to find a small chinese gentleman who will ride around with his
> feet right between my shoulder blades and his hands pulling my shoulders
> back. Was gonna post an ad but dont know what kind of pay to offer since
> I'd be doing alot of the work carrying him around
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:00 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> I have trouble with sciatica.  Sitting for long periods is bad.  Lifting
>> with back not legs is bad.  Walking actually seems good, easier said than
>> done.  After my wife died, I walked her dog miles per day for a couple
>> years which was probably good, but he’s gone almost 2 years now.  So I do
>> all the bad things and none of the good.
>>
>>
>>
>> The “standing desk” people would probably say that’s what I need to do.
>> I don’t think standing is actually helpful, it’s not the same as walking.
>>
>>
>>
>> Worst possible thing is to sit all day at the computer then lift
>> something heavy.  I did that a couple months ago, felt like an electrical
>> shock all down my left leg.  Usually it heals in 2-3 weeks, this time it
>> mostly did but not 100%.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
>> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 1:36 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>>
>>
>>
>> I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk
>> ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could
>> heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to
>> train yourself.  Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a
>> truck.  Nope, have to learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2
>> at a time any more.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Lewis Bergman
>>
>> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
>>
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>>
>>
>>
>> I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I
>> was favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it
>> and it would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
>> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
>> operation for two months mas o menos.
>>
>> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
>> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>>
>> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>>
>> My own damn fault..
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Ken Hohhof]

See if you can find the pilot episode of the TV show Newsradio.  Mr. James 
hires Dave as the new news director, and his first job is to fire the old news 
director Ed.  Dave thinks his problem is solved when Ed does an “I QUIT”, but 
then he finds out that Ed quits all the time.

 

I worked with a guy like that once.  He would get mad and “quit” every couple 
weeks, ripping up his ID badge and throwing it out the car window.  The next 
morning he would be at HR getting a new badge.

 

You really want to be careful about quitting in a fit of pique (is that the 
expression?)  One manager I worked with kept a blank resignation form in his 
center desk drawer in case a certain employee quit.  I forget why the employee 
was un-fireable, maybe an EEOC thing, but if he ever quit his resignation would 
be accepted in a nanosecond before he could change his mind.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of James Howard
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:59 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

Funny sometimes how people say something like that out of frustration and then 
try to backtrack.  I’m on the board of a small non-profit and about 10 years 
ago just months after I joined, the current president sent out an email to the 
whole board stating “I am resigning as president effective immediately”.  I 
contacted the other officers about what we were going to do (we had a board 
meeting scheduled either that night or the next),  we came up with a plan and 
all showed up for the meeting expecting that the secretary would fill in since 
our VP at the time never came and the president walks in and sits down.  We 
asked him why he was even there since he resigned “effective immediately” and 
he acted like he never sent it out.  We ended up having to pull out a printout 
of his email, read it to him and ask what it meant.  He finally admitted that 
he “was planning to resign but not for a while”……….  We did actually let him 
stay on as interim president until we appointed someone new about a month later 
but it sounds like it was probably a situation similar to what happened with 
this.  

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:32 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

 

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.

Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

 

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

 

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

 

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

 

From: Adam Moffett 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM

To: af@af.afmug.com   

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

 

 

From: Paul McCall 

Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

 

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.   

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of fu

Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Chuck McCown via AF]

I bought a 12 volt dc air compressor with tank.  Going to have them blow out 
the spray hose when done spraying in the afternoon.  So that when they get back 
to the shop at least it will not be frozen stiff when they go to winterize 
everything.  

From: Colin Stanners 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:10 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

Some excavator manufacturers have "arctic" upgrade packages. My understanding 
is that as long as the vacuum truck is stored inside a warm shop when not in 
use, the clean water tank will have enough thermal mass to not freeze during 
most workdays. The vac design may be passing the engine exhaust underneath the 
tank to warm it too. A heater on the outgoing water helps protect the rest of 
the circulation system. Employees being careful of freezing risk is important 
too, not letting things "sit".


On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 1:19 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

  Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low temps.  
Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the water jacket 
or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that would blow out 
the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some kind of propane 
heater to warm up the water tank.

  Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam industry.  
Might work.  

  Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Ken Hohhof]

Remember WISPCON?  I think I attended WISPCON II in something like 2002.  There 
was some startup called Motorola with a product called Canopy.  Also a 
competitor called Trango.  I probably still have a binder from the show in a 
bookcase somewhere.  Not sure if Wireless Beehive existed yet.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:38 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband 
Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to 
cover quite a range of topics.

 

bp


On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

 

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.

Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

 

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

 

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

 

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

 

From: Adam Moffett 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM

To: af@af.afmug.com   

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

 

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

 

 

From: Paul McCall 

Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

 

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.   

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.

But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back.

They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!

I’m good 😊

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.

I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.  Very difficult, 
yet customers would rather be doing something else.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Theodolite will.  

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Paul

Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Colin Stanners]

Some excavator manufacturers have "arctic" upgrade packages. My
understanding is that as long as the vacuum truck is stored inside a warm
shop when not in use, the clean water tank will have enough thermal mass to
not freeze during most workdays. The vac design may be passing the engine
exhaust underneath the tank to warm it too. A heater on the outgoing water
helps protect the rest of the circulation system. Employees being careful
of freezing risk is important too, not letting things "sit".

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 1:19 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low
> temps.  Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the
> water jacket or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that
> would blow out the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some
> kind of propane heater to warm up the water tank.
>
> Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam industry.
> Might work.
>
> Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Chuck McCown via AF]

I tried beet juice to deice solar panels on a mountain top once.  Had a hot 
water tank full of it.  Pressurized it with CO2.  Remote controlled nozzles.  
It worked the first time.  But yeah, it plugged up everything.  

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 12:49 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

Have you considered beet juice instead of water? Or will that muck up the 
innards

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:19 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

  Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low temps.  
Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the water jacket 
or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that would blow out 
the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some kind of propane 
heater to warm up the water tank.

  Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam industry.  
Might work.  

  Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

I got a shoulder posture brace, that helped and recently got a lower back
brace. I wish I had been wearing that thing for the last 20 years.
I'm hoping to find a small chinese gentleman who will ride around with his
feet right between my shoulder blades and his hands pulling my shoulders
back. Was gonna post an ad but dont know what kind of pay to offer since
I'd be doing alot of the work carrying him around

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 2:00 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I have trouble with sciatica.  Sitting for long periods is bad.  Lifting
> with back not legs is bad.  Walking actually seems good, easier said than
> done.  After my wife died, I walked her dog miles per day for a couple
> years which was probably good, but he’s gone almost 2 years now.  So I do
> all the bad things and none of the good.
>
>
>
> The “standing desk” people would probably say that’s what I need to do.  I
> don’t think standing is actually helpful, it’s not the same as walking.
>
>
>
> Worst possible thing is to sit all day at the computer then lift something
> heavy.  I did that a couple months ago, felt like an electrical shock all
> down my left leg.  Usually it heals in 2-3 weeks, this time it mostly did
> but not 100%.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 1:36 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>
>
>
> I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk
> ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could
> heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to
> train yourself.  Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a
> truck.  Nope, have to learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2
> at a time any more.
>
>
>
> *From:* Lewis Bergman
>
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>
>
>
> I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was
> favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it
> would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
> operation for two months mas o menos.
>
> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>
> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>
> My own damn fault..
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
>
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Ken Hohhof]

I have trouble with sciatica.  Sitting for long periods is bad.  Lifting with 
back not legs is bad.  Walking actually seems good, easier said than done.  
After my wife died, I walked her dog miles per day for a couple years which was 
probably good, but he’s gone almost 2 years now.  So I do all the bad things 
and none of the good.

 

The “standing desk” people would probably say that’s what I need to do.  I 
don’t think standing is actually helpful, it’s not the same as walking.

 

Worst possible thing is to sit all day at the computer then lift something 
heavy.  I did that a couple months ago, felt like an electrical shock all down 
my left leg.  Usually it heals in 2-3 weeks, this time it mostly did but not 
100%.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:36 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Cc: Chuck McCown 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk ruptures 
healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could heal.  But any 
jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to train yourself.  
Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a truck.  Nope, have to 
learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2 at a time any more.  

 

From: Lewis Bergman 

Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

 

I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was 
favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it 
would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it

 

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should not 
have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal operation for 
two months mas o menos.  

Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and 
suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.

Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.

My own damn fault..

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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[James Howard]

Funny sometimes how people say something like that out of frustration and then 
try to backtrack.  I’m on the board of a small non-profit and about 10 years 
ago just months after I joined, the current president sent out an email to the 
whole board stating “I am resigning as president effective immediately”.  I 
contacted the other officers about what we were going to do (we had a board 
meeting scheduled either that night or the next),  we came up with a plan and 
all showed up for the meeting expecting that the secretary would fill in since 
our VP at the time never came and the president walks in and sits down.  We 
asked him why he was even there since he resigned “effective immediately” and 
he acted like he never sent it out.  We ended up having to pull out a printout 
of his email, read it to him and ask what it meant.  He finally admitted that 
he “was planning to resign but not for a while”……….  We did actually let him 
stay on as interim president until we appointed someone new about a month later 
but it sounds like it was probably a situation similar to what happened with 
this.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 1:32 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: Chuck McCown 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.

From: Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk


What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:


From: Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊
Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
(only us “long-times” will get that reference)
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.
But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back.
They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
I’m good 😊
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.
I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Steve Jones]

I think I came rooting around right after this cause dslreports was just
making me angry. A bunch of crotchety old BBS type operators who had all
the answers I needed to get Motorola gear trucking.

Fools should have declined that subscription request

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:38 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline Broadband
> Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even though we manage to
> cover quite a range of topics.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly
> posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He
> was pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each
> list and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if
> they were not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.
>
> In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And
> then he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
> Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was
> getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list
> serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.
>
> In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but
> by then ... the barn door had been left open.
>
> I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in
> contact rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it
> turns out he was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.
>
> Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.
>
> *From:* Adam Moffett
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>
>
> What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
>
> On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
>
>
> *From:* Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
> Its all good Ken 😊
>
> Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
>
> But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
>
> (only us “long-times” will get that reference)
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
>
> 20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working
> aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a
> bunch of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less
> than 10 tech phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well
> aware of future proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we
> have a few years at least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and
> smaller fill towers.  We overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.
> Licensed BH links wherever possible.   If I had a local company that could
> provide 50Mbit plans for less than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.
> Not everyone would of course.  ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our
> coverage area, and we have lost 4 customers in 2 years to it.
>
> But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry
> ever comes back.
>
> They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
>
> I’m good 😊
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.
> On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and
> T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded
> fiber.
>
> I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running
> chainsaws, while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.
> Very difficult, yet customers would rather be doing something else.
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> Theodolite will.
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
> LOL, definit

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

I'm only 42, but it's odd how much further down everything is now than it
used to be.
I keep alieve in reserve, I never take it like ibuprofen or tylenol so it
stays effective. I can have a disk bulge and 2 or 3 alieve and I'm back
jumping off barrels in 45 minutes

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk
> ruptures healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could
> heal.  But any jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to
> train yourself.  Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a
> truck.  Nope, have to learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2
> at a time any more.
>
> *From:* Lewis Bergman
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore
>
> I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was
> favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it
> would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
>> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
>> operation for two months mas o menos.
>> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
>> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>> My own damn fault..
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Steve Jones]

Have you considered beet juice instead of water? Or will that muck up the
innards

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 1:19 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low
> temps.  Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the
> water jacket or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that
> would blow out the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some
> kind of propane heater to warm up the water tank.
>
> Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam industry.
> Might work.
>
> Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Steve Jones]

This is why you dont go to doctors. You didnt have any of those diagnosis
before seeing the doctor. The young kids say cbd oil cures everything
anyway, just get some pot, you'll be fine

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 12:31 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Thanks for the heads up
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:20 AM Bill Prince  wrote:
>
>> I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and failed)
>> to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum knee
>> for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get
>> arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer to
>> it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a real
>> issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little uncomfortable during
>> cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.
>>
>> My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days. The
>> problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The last
>> time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to get
>> it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts of
>> ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the inflammation
>> went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell exercises and slowly
>> worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and easy, because even slight
>> tweaks and you're back to square one.
>>
>>
>> bp
>> 
>>
>> On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>
>> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
>> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
>> operation for two months mas o menos.
>> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
>> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
>> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
>> My own damn fault..
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Steve Jones]

If you've recovered, you're last in line if at all since they announced
you're immune

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:24 AM Harold Bledsoe  wrote:

> Matt jumps on his motorcycle he’s using to parachute out of a plane on…
>
>
>
> *From: *AF 
> *Date: *Friday, December 4, 2020 at 10:50 AM
> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group , Gino A.
> Villarini 
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
>
> Based on your risk profile, we believe it would be a waste of precious
> vaccine resources to provide you with one.  Even if they were widely
> available, just the time of a nurse to administer it could be better
> spent sitting in silence.   We’re honestly a little surprised that you
> haven’t died of COVID or any other number of communicable diseases yet,
> based on your lifestyle choices and stupidity.
>
> On 12/4/20 11:47 AM, Gino A. Villarini wrote:
> > Locally, Telecom falls under first responders…
> >
> > *GinoVillarini
> > *Founder/President
> > @gvillarini
> > t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> > aeronet-logo <
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>  |
> Metro Office Park #18
> > Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
> >
> > *From: *AF 
> > *Date: *Friday, December 4, 2020 at 11:48 AM
> > *To: *AFMUG 
> > *Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
> >
> > Found this in the NYT:
> >
> >
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Bill Prince]

  
  
That's how I came to create my email address (part15 Skyline
  Broadband Service). In my mind this place is still part 15, even
  though we manage to cover quite a range of topics.


bp

On 12/4/2020 11:31 AM, Chuck McCown via
  AF wrote:


  
  

  One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross
posted or wrongly posted something about Motorola in a
Trango list or some such thing.  He was pretty much a list
nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango
questions if they were not a subscriber to both lists or
something like that.  
   
  In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this
kind of stuff.  And then he sent an email with I QUIT as the
subject line.
  Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and
stayed down.  I was getting emails all afternoon about it
and so I had my guys start up a list serv, put all the
Motorola people on it and away we go.  
   
  In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down
and fixed it but by then ... the barn door had been left
open.
   
  I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a
want to keep in contact rather than malice.  We had no idea
the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he was just
frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.
   
  Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of
this.  
  

   
  
From: Adam
Moffett 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
  

 
  
  
What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of
  control issues?
  

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck
  McCown via AF wrote:


  
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Chuck McCown via AF]

I have learned  not to jump down from anything.  ANYTHING.  My disk ruptures 
healed after lots of ibuprofen and PT.  I didn’t know they could heal.  But any 
jumping down will put me back on the injured list.  Hard to train yourself.  
Simple things like a lowboy trailer or the tailgate of a truck.  Nope, have to 
learn not to do it.  Can’t even hop down the stairs 2 at a time any more.  

From: Lewis Bergman 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 11:03 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was 
favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it 
would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza  wrote:

  Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should not 
have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal operation for 
two months mas o menos.  
  Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and 
suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
  Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
  My own damn fault..
  -- 
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  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Chuck McCown via AF]

One day, mid day Michael was upset because someone cross posted or wrongly 
posted something about Motorola in a Trango list or some such thing.  He was 
pretty much a list nazi about that because you had to subscribe to each list 
and he didn’t want Motorola folks from answering Trango questions if they were 
not a subscriber to both lists or something like that.  

In any event he was grouchy and trying to police this kind of stuff.  And then 
he sent an email with I QUIT as the subject line.
Then, like immediately, the list serve went down and stayed down.  I was 
getting emails all afternoon about it and so I had my guys start up a list 
serv, put all the Motorola people on it and away we go.  

In a day or two, Michael became aware his site was down and fixed it but by 
then ... the barn door had been left open.

I am sure he never forgave me.  But we did it out of a want to keep in contact 
rather than malice.  We had no idea the meaning of I QUIT.  As it turns out he 
was just frustrated and the outage was just coincidental.

Pretty sure part 15 went out of business because of this.  

From: Adam Moffett 
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 6:57 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?



On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:



  From: Paul McCall 
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

  Its all good Ken 😊


  Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.


  But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah


  (only us “long-times” will get that reference)


  From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs


  I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.


  From: AF  On Behalf Of Paul McCall
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs


  Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.   


  20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.


  But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back.


  They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!


  I’m good 😊



  From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs


  You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.


  I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.  Very difficult, 
yet customers would rather be doing something else.



  From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
  Cc: Chuck McCown 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs


  Theodolite will.  


  From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Paul McCall
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs


  LOL, definitely not in LOS territory.  90% of our rural stuff won’t see the 
towers.


  We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) to the 
tower.


  From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
  Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:53 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs


  When an account (in Powercode) is made through Towercoverage API, it'll add 
the estimated signals to the tower starting with the closest ones.  That ticket 
could always be pulled up.


  As far as alignment, I would think you're in LOS territory with 5 GHz so once 
you know where the tower is, you can aim 

[AFMUG] OT vac ex in freezing temps

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Trying to figure out how to keep my vacuum excavators working in low temps.  
Thinking of perhaps a heat exchanger dumping engine heat via the water jacket 
or exhaust into the water tank.  Thinking of an air purge that would blow out 
the hose every time they are done using it.  Perhaps some kind of propane 
heater to warm up the water tank.

Looked at heated hoses but most of those are for the spray foam industry.  
Might work.  

Any other ideas?  How do they do it in your part of the world Colin?-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Robert Andrews]

Except now with Covid ibuprofen->tylenol...

On 12/04/2020 10:19 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and failed) 
to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum 
knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get 
arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer 
to it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a 
real issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little 
uncomfortable during cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.


My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days. The 
problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The last 
time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to 
get it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts 
of ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the 
inflammation went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell 
exercises and slowly worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and 
easy, because even slight tweaks and you're back to square one.



bp


On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I 
should not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from 
retinal operation for two months mas o menos.
Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, 
and suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.

Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
My own damn fault..






--
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Jaime Solorza]

Thanks for the heads up

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:20 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and failed)
> to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through with that bum knee
> for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The doc said I will get
> arthritis in it sooner with only a partial meniscus, but I still refer to
> it as my good knee. The left one is a little tweaky, but is not a real
> issue. The last few years the right knee gets a little uncomfortable during
> cold weather, but is fine if I keep it moving.
>
> My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these days. The
> problem was always that it is a long slow slog through therapy. The last
> time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it took almost two years to get
> it back to normal. What worked for me was to take moderate amounts of
> ibuprofen, and try not to do anything too drastic. Once the inflammation
> went down, I started doing VERY light weight dumbbell exercises and slowly
> worked my way up to normal weights. Go slow and easy, because even slight
> tweaks and you're back to square one.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
> operation for two months mas o menos.
> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
> My own damn fault..
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Bill Prince]

  
  
I tore the meniscus in my right knee the first time I tried (and
  failed) to snow ski when I was 20 years old. I suffered through
  with that bum knee for almost 20 years, when I had is scoped. The
  doc said I will get arthritis in it sooner with only a partial
  meniscus, but I still refer to it as my good knee. The left one is
  a little tweaky, but is not a real issue. The last few years the
  right knee gets a little uncomfortable during cold weather, but is
  fine if I keep it moving.
My rotator cuff issues are similar, but less of an issue these
  days. The problem was always that it is a long slow slog through
  therapy. The last time I messed up (also my right shoulder), it
  took almost two years to get it back to normal. What worked for me
  was to take moderate amounts of ibuprofen, and try not to do
  anything too drastic. Once the inflammation went down, I started
  doing VERY light weight dumbbell exercises and slowly worked my
  way up to normal weights. Go slow and easy, because even slight
  tweaks and you're back to square one.


bp

On 12/4/2020 9:54 AM, Jaime Solorza
  wrote:


  
  Some of you may know I fell off this side mount
back in August...I should not have tried to climb it since I had
been on bed rest from retinal operation for two months mas o
menos. 
Well I finally got to see specialist...torn
  meniscus in right knee, and suspected rotator cuff tear on
  right shoulder.
Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might
  need surgerydamn.
My own damn fault..
  
  
  

  


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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Not Superman anymore

[Lewis Bergman]

I have the same in my left knee. Supposedly difficult to operate on. I was
favoring it and it was getting worse. He told me to stop favoring it and it
would get better but likely always have a little hitch in it

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 11:55 AM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Some of you may know I fell off this side mount back in August...I should
> not have tried to climb it since I had been on bed rest from retinal
> operation for two months mas o menos.
> Well I finally got to see specialist...torn meniscus in right knee, and
> suspected rotator cuff tear on right shoulder.
> Need to get MRIs and starting me on PT...might need surgerydamn.
> My own damn fault..
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

[John Osmon]

Rule #1 is likely correct.  Possibly #2...


pcap everything.  The disappearing packets leave your network, so they either:
  - get dropped in the transit networks
  - get dropped in the customer network

You'll likely find something on the client network that is breaking
things.  Probably something that is supposed to "help."




As for Rules #1 - #3, you also need to take into account Rule #0:
-
   It's actually an issue on the customer's network, but as a VoIP
   provider, you need to test their network better than their IT staff in
   order to show them the issue.

   Once you show them the issue, you likely need to fix it as well, because
   their staff would have fixed it if they understood the problem.

   Once you've fixed *their* issue that was causing problems with your
   service -- it will all work as intended.  

   All without a change to your VoIP system.

   ...And they'll tell people that they like your service, but there are 
   problems every once in a while, but you eventually fix things if they
   hound you enough.
-







On Fri, Dec 04, 2020 at 09:47:18AM -0600, Lewis Bergman wrote:
> You forgot Rule #3, It is the ISP's fault.
> 
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 9:32 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> > I thought the rules of troubleshooting VoIP were:
> >
> > Rule #1:  It's a NAT or ALG problem
> > Rule #2:  Refer to Rule #1
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> > Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:43 AM
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing
> >
> > I use Grandstream, and BLF is Broken when trying to use SIP over TCP.
> > I've never had a NAT problem before.  I was just checking the other Offnet
> > phones that I have, and through sheer happenstance, those handsets all
> > coming in and leaving on the same transit provider.
> >
> > Interesting is that the Grandstream Softphone client on my cell phone works
> > fine, it's only the Grandstream handsets that are the problem. I'm guessing
> > they are setting the call up in 2 different ways, and one is affected while
> > the other is not.  I haven't done enough packetcaptures to see if there is
> > a
> > difference between the packet streams.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 12/4/2020 8:07 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
> > > Is there a reason not to use SIP over TCP?
> > >
> > > I think in the past I thought retransmits were irrelevant in a
> > > realtime app, but the latency is low enough sometimes now that maybe
> > > it would actually help.  And TCP seems to traverse NAT more easily.
> > >
> > >
> > > On 12/3/2020 6:18 PM, Nate Burke wrote:
> > >> I'm trying to track down a strange Issue I'm having, and wondering if
> > >> anyone has run into something similar.
> > >>
> > >> I have a couple customers that I let take phone handsets home, the
> > >> Grandstream PBX is at our office.  It seems that if the SIP traffic
> > >> comes in one upstream, but leaves another upstream, really weird
> > >> things happen.
> > >>
> > >> The Phone registers to the PBX just fine, and can receive calls all
> > >> day long, it just cannot make calls.  If I take a /24 and force it to
> > >> enter and leave the network via the same provider, then everything
> > >> works fine.  Those of you that have multiple diverse paths, have you
> > >> seen something like this?  The Call in UDP Mode fails, the call in
> > >> TCP mode will succeed.
> > >>
> > >> This only appears to be an issue with the handset talking to the PBX.
> > >> All of our Sip Trunk traffic (Voip Innovations) works just fine.  For
> > >> some reason the handset SIP re-invite never makes it back to the
> > >> handset when multi-homing is in place.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> Lewis Bergman
> 325-439-0533 Cell

> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Harold Bledsoe]

Matt jumps on his motorcycle he’s using to parachute out of a plane on…

From: AF 
Date: Friday, December 4, 2020 at 10:50 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group , Gino A. Villarini 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
Based on your risk profile, we believe it would be a waste of precious
vaccine resources to provide you with one.  Even if they were widely
available, just the time of a nurse to administer it could be better
spent sitting in silence.   We’re honestly a little surprised that you
haven’t died of COVID or any other number of communicable diseases yet,
based on your lifestyle choices and stupidity.

On 12/4/20 11:47 AM, Gino A. Villarini wrote:
> Locally, Telecom falls under first responders…
>
> *GinoVillarini
> *Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> aeronet-logo 
> 
> inc500
> 
>  fb-logo
> 
>insta-logo
> 
>   in-logo
> 
>tw-logo
> 
>yt-logo 
> 
>
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aeronetpr.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000164916%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=EdI43%2Ftuj9BVFwtabUg5SvlT9BTuvmOZEym0LXVP8Wo%3D&reserved=0
>  
> 
>  | Metro Office Park #18
> Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>
> *From: *AF 
> *Date: *Friday, December 4, 2020 at 11:48 AM
> *To: *AFMUG 
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
>
> Found this in the NYT:
>
> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2Finteractive%2F2020%2F12%2F03%2Fopinion%2Fcovid-19-vaccine-timeline.html&data=04%7C01%7C%7C17ec3d3937004d92eaa008d89874a313%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637426974000164916%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiM

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Jason McKemie]

Ha, nice!

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 11:13 AM Sterling Jacobson 
wrote:

> You mean this? Lol
>
>
>
> 
>
> Do you all want all the lists to be free?
>
>
>
> If so, I'll close up PART-15.ORG and you all can do whatever you want.
>
>
>
> I'm sick of all this B.S. If you don't want to support PART-15.ORG then
>
> don't and GO AWAY. Start your own damn lists somewhere else because
>
> PART-15.ORG will just fade away which appears to be what you guys want and
>
>
>
> I
>
> have no problem with that idea.
>
>
>
> And you know what Chuck, if people like Charles Wu would ever pay his
>
> bills/debts that he owes PART-15.ORG maybe he could get back on the lists.
>
> As far as the others go, the hell with them as far as I'm concerned. They
>
> don't want to support PART-15.ORG so why the hell should I let them in for
>
> free? B.S. I'm fed up folks.
>
>
>
> Michael
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Jaime Solorza
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 8:28 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk
>
>
>
> Yup
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 7:57 AM Bill Prince  wrote:
>
> Inside joke.
>
>
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 12/4/2020 5:57 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>
> What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
>
> On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Paul McCall
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Its all good Ken 😊
>
>
>
> Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
>
>
>
> But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
>
>
>
> (only us “long-times” will get that reference)
>
>
>
> *From:* AF   *On Behalf
> Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
>
>
>
> 20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working
> aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a
> bunch of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less
> than 10 tech phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well
> aware of future proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we
> have a few years at least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and
> smaller fill towers.  We overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.
> Licensed BH links wherever possible.   If I had a local company that could
> provide 50Mbit plans for less than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.
> Not everyone would of course.  ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our
> coverage area, and we have lost 4 customers in 2 years to it.
>
>
>
> But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry
> ever comes back.
>
>
>
> They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
>
>
>
> I’m good 😊
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.
> On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and
> T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded
> fiber.
>
>
>
> I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running
> chainsaws, while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.
> Very difficult, yet customers would rather be doing something else.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Theodolite will.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] *On
> Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> LOL, definitely not in LOS territory.  90% of our rural stuff won’t see
> the towers.
>
>
>
> We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) to
> the tower.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:53 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> When an account (in Powercode) is made through Towercoverage API, it'll
> add the estimated signals to the tower starting with the closest ones.
> That ticket could always be pulled up.
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Sterling Jacobson]

You mean this? Lol



Do you all want all the lists to be free?



If so, I'll close up PART-15.ORG and you all can do whatever you want.



I'm sick of all this B.S. If you don't want to support PART-15.ORG then

don't and GO AWAY. Start your own damn lists somewhere else because

PART-15.ORG will just fade away which appears to be what you guys want and



I

have no problem with that idea.



And you know what Chuck, if people like Charles Wu would ever pay his

bills/debts that he owes PART-15.ORG maybe he could get back on the lists.

As far as the others go, the hell with them as far as I'm concerned. They

don't want to support PART-15.ORG so why the hell should I let them in for

free? B.S. I'm fed up folks.



Michael


From: AF  On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:28 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

Yup

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 7:57 AM Bill Prince 
mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Inside joke.



bp


On 12/4/2020 5:57 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:


From: Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

From: AF  On Behalf Of 
Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a bunch 
of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less than 10 tech 
phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well aware of future 
proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at 
least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We 
overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans for less 
than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone would of course.  
ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage area, and we have lost 4 
customers in 2 years to it.

But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry ever 
comes back.

They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!

I’m good 😊


From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.  On 
the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and 
T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded fiber.

I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running chainsaws, 
while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.  Very difficult, 
yet customers would rather be doing something else.


From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Theodolite will.

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Paul McCall
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

LOL, definitely not in LOS territory.  90% of our rural stuff won’t see the 
towers.

We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) to the 
tower.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Josh Luthman
Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

When an account (in Powercode) is made through Towercoverage API, it'll add the 
estimated signals to the tower starting with the closest ones.  That ticket 
could always be pulled up.

As far as alignment, I would think you're in LOS territory with 5 GHz so once 
you know where the tower is, you can aim for it by eyeball instead of

Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Jaime Solorza]

Yup

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020, 7:57 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Inside joke.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 12/4/2020 5:57 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>
> What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?
>
> On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
>
>
> *From:* Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
> Its all good Ken 😊
>
>
>
> Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.
>
>
>
> But if I get any more crap, I QUIT  hahahah
>
>
>
> (only us “long-times” will get that reference)
>
>
>
> *From:* AF   *On Behalf
> Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.
>
>
>
> 20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working
> aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while doing a
> bunch of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled machine, less
> than 10 tech phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 or 3.  We are well
> aware of future proofing and are doing that wherever possible.  I think we
> have a few years at least even at 2.4, running 45 degree sectors, and
> smaller fill towers.  We overlay what we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.
> Licensed BH links wherever possible.   If I had a local company that could
> provide 50Mbit plans for less than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.
> Not everyone would of course.  ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our
> coverage area, and we have lost 4 customers in 2 years to it.
>
>
>
> But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that industry
> ever comes back.
>
>
>
> They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!
>
>
>
> I’m good 😊
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed wireless.
> On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other hand, Elon Musk and
> T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to mention government funded
> fiber.
>
>
>
> I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running
> chainsaws, while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of Duty.
> Very difficult, yet customers would rather be doing something else.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Theodolite will.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> LOL, definitely not in LOS territory.  90% of our rural stuff won’t see
> the towers.
>
>
>
> We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) to
> the tower.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:53 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> When an account (in Powercode) is made through Towercoverage API, it'll
> add the estimated signals to the tower starting with the closest ones.
> That ticket could always be pulled up.
>
>
>
> As far as alignment, I would think you're in LOS territory with 5 GHz so
> once you know where the tower is, you can aim for it by eyeball instead of
> app.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> 24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:44 PM Paul McCall  wrote:
>
> We have that… looking for more of a compass time app that will point him
> to a tower, based on stored LAT / LONG
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:15 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Google Earth
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 10:07 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs
>
>
>
> Anyone have a favorite app??  (android or iPhone) for putting in the
> LAT/LONG of all the towers, so that the newbies have 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Matt Hoppes]

Based on your risk profile, we believe it would be a waste of precious 
vaccine resources to provide you with one.  Even if they were widely 
available, just the time of a nurse to administer it could be better 
spent sitting in silence.   We’re honestly a little surprised that you 
haven’t died of COVID or any other number of communicable diseases yet, 
based on your lifestyle choices and stupidity.


On 12/4/20 11:47 AM, Gino A. Villarini wrote:

Locally, Telecom falls under first responders…

*GinoVillarini
*Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
aeronet-logo  	inc500 
 	fb-logo 
 	insta-logo 
 	in-logo 
 	tw-logo 
 
	yt-logo  	


www.aeronetpr.com  | Metro Office Park #18 
Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968


*From: *AF 
*Date: *Friday, December 4, 2020 at 11:48 AM
*To: *AFMUG 
*Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

Found this in the NYT:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/12/03/opinion/covid-19-vaccine-timeline.html

For me:

Based on your risk profile, we believe you’re in line behind 118.5
million people across the United States.

When it comes to California, we think you’re behind 12.3 million others
who are at higher risk in your state.

And in San Mateo County, you’re behind 225,500 others.


--
bp



--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Gino A. Villarini]

Locally, Telecom falls under first responders…


Gino Villarini
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
[https://mcusercontent.com/491678685aaddc31e08616413/images/968060a2-d5a8-4a76-b3b3-cee8c588e646.png]
[https://image.ibb.co/noQeyp/inc500.png] 
  
[https://image.ibb.co/e4pBB9/fb-logo.png]  
[https://image.ibb.co/nxuuW9/insta-logo.png] 
   
[https://image.ibb.co/jhSEW9/in-logo.png] 
 
[https://image.ibb.co/dqqq4U/tw-logo.png] 

[https://image.ibb.co/bAJcjU/yt-logo.png] 

www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 
Guaynabo, PR 00968
From: AF 
Date: Friday, December 4, 2020 at 11:48 AM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?
Found this in the NYT:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/12/03/opinion/covid-19-vaccine-timeline.html

For me:

Based on your risk profile, we believe you’re in line behind 118.5
million people across the United States.

When it comes to California, we think you’re behind 12.3 million others
who are at higher risk in your state.

And in San Mateo County, you’re behind 225,500 others.


--
bp



--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

[Josh Baird]

Man.. that was a great episode.  Love that show.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 11:35 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Like in That 70’s Show when they painted a pot leaf on the water tower?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Colin Stanners
> *Sent:* Friday, December 4, 2020 9:22 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth
>
>
>
> https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/woman-who-climbed-crane
> -in-winnipeg-likely-using-methamphetamine-police-1.5214303
> 
>
>
>
> We have had new wireless installers that don't like climbing over 40ft. I
> jokingly chatted our HR... "if she gets off the drugs, do you want to hire
> her?"
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

[Ken Hohhof]

Like in That 70’s Show when they painted a pot leaf on the water tower?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Colin Stanners
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 9:22 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

 

https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/woman-who-climbed- 

 crane-in-winnipeg-likely-using-methamphetamine-police-1.5214303

 

We have had new wireless installers that don't like climbing over 40ft. I 
jokingly chatted our HR... "if she gets off the drugs, do you want to hire her?"

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Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?

[Josh Luthman]

SC = stab and click
ST = stab and twist

Josh Luthman
24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Thu, Dec 3, 2020 at 6:06 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Green always equals angled.  APC   Angled polished connector.  Makes the
> reflected photons not make it back into the core.  Like a directional
> couple for RF.
> APC=Angled Polished Connector  or perhaps it is “Angle”.  That sounds more
> correct.
> APC=Green
>
> I have heard SC is Subscriber Connection  So SC-APC  To me SC= big
> LC= Small  There are also LC-APC  Small green.  Not sure who uses those.
>
> LC = Longhaul Connector (just things people say, no idea if it is rooted
> in fact.  Good mnemonic though).
>
> UPC= Universal Polished Connector
> UPC = Blue
>
> The end of the connector is straight and flat.  Like two cleaved fibers
> before you hit the splice button.  Like what you find in a mechanical
> connector.  Not sure why UPCs are used at all since APC seems to be
> technologically superior.
>
> You can have 4 versions
> LC-UPC
> LC-APC
> SC-UPC
> SC-APC
>
> Again, SC=big, LC=small
> UPC=blue
> APC=green
>
> What I normally see is blue small (LC-UPC) on everything not related to
> subscribers.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Thursday, December 3, 2020 8:53 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?
>
> Don't know what PC is.  LC is the teeny thing that goes in an SFP.
>
> UPC is uniform blue
>
> APC is angled green
>
> Josh Luthman
> 24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 3, 2020 at 10:41 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> Not being a fiber guy, I didn’t know the difference between PC, UPC and
>> APC, so I had to look it up:
>>
>>
>> https://community.fs.com/blog/pc-vs-upc-vs-apc-connector-selecting-the-right-fiber-connector-type.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
>> *Sent:* Thursday, December 3, 2020 9:25 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?
>>
>>
>>
>> They screwed us on our optitap premade as well.  See if you can find a
>> DLX field install kit for ~$10.  We got field install optitap for $10 and
>> will splice SC/APC on the other end (in which case you'd splice LC-UPC).
>>
>> For the record drop cables with LC is pretty weird and UPC is really
>> really weird.
>>
>>
>>
>> Don't expect Commscope to get any better on lead times or accurate ship
>> dates.
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> 24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 4:21 PM Paul McCall  wrote:
>>
>> Order placed months ago with Commscope (through a distributor) and
>> Commscope has pushed back expected delivery until February
>>
>>
>>
>> FXDXK1A0010F Cable, Drop, Flat, Dielectric
>>
>> DLX, 10 ft. - MINI DLX CABLE to connect
>>
>> Mini-MST DLX to LC-UPC
>>
>>
>>
>> Need 25 to 50 of these  (they are custom as normally they don’t make them
>> with an LC-UPC end)
>>
>>
>>
>> *Paul McCall, President *
>>
>> *Florida Broadband / PDMNet*
>>
>> *658 Old Dixie Highway*
>>
>> *Vero Beach, FL 32962*
>>
>> *772-564-6800*
>>
>>
>>
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[AFMUG] OT: Where do you stand in the vaccine line?

[Bill Prince]

Found this in the NYT:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/12/03/opinion/covid-19-vaccine-timeline.html

For me:

Based on your risk profile, we believe you’re in line behind 118.5 
million people across the United States.


When it comes to California, we think you’re behind 12.3 million others 
who are at higher risk in your state.


And in San Mateo County, you’re behind 225,500 others.


--
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Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

[Lewis Bergman]

You forgot Rule #3, It is the ISP's fault.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 9:32 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I thought the rules of troubleshooting VoIP were:
>
> Rule #1:  It's a NAT or ALG problem
> Rule #2:  Refer to Rule #1
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:43 AM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing
>
> I use Grandstream, and BLF is Broken when trying to use SIP over TCP.
> I've never had a NAT problem before.  I was just checking the other Offnet
> phones that I have, and through sheer happenstance, those handsets all
> coming in and leaving on the same transit provider.
>
> Interesting is that the Grandstream Softphone client on my cell phone works
> fine, it's only the Grandstream handsets that are the problem. I'm guessing
> they are setting the call up in 2 different ways, and one is affected while
> the other is not.  I haven't done enough packetcaptures to see if there is
> a
> difference between the packet streams.
>
>
>
> On 12/4/2020 8:07 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
> > Is there a reason not to use SIP over TCP?
> >
> > I think in the past I thought retransmits were irrelevant in a
> > realtime app, but the latency is low enough sometimes now that maybe
> > it would actually help.  And TCP seems to traverse NAT more easily.
> >
> >
> > On 12/3/2020 6:18 PM, Nate Burke wrote:
> >> I'm trying to track down a strange Issue I'm having, and wondering if
> >> anyone has run into something similar.
> >>
> >> I have a couple customers that I let take phone handsets home, the
> >> Grandstream PBX is at our office.  It seems that if the SIP traffic
> >> comes in one upstream, but leaves another upstream, really weird
> >> things happen.
> >>
> >> The Phone registers to the PBX just fine, and can receive calls all
> >> day long, it just cannot make calls.  If I take a /24 and force it to
> >> enter and leave the network via the same provider, then everything
> >> works fine.  Those of you that have multiple diverse paths, have you
> >> seen something like this?  The Call in UDP Mode fails, the call in
> >> TCP mode will succeed.
> >>
> >> This only appears to be an issue with the handset talking to the PBX.
> >> All of our Sip Trunk traffic (Voip Innovations) works just fine.  For
> >> some reason the handset SIP re-invite never makes it back to the
> >> handset when multi-homing is in place.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
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>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

[Ken Hohhof]

I thought the rules of troubleshooting VoIP were:

Rule #1:  It's a NAT or ALG problem
Rule #2:  Refer to Rule #1

-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:43 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

I use Grandstream, and BLF is Broken when trying to use SIP over TCP.  
I've never had a NAT problem before.  I was just checking the other Offnet
phones that I have, and through sheer happenstance, those handsets all
coming in and leaving on the same transit provider.

Interesting is that the Grandstream Softphone client on my cell phone works
fine, it's only the Grandstream handsets that are the problem. I'm guessing
they are setting the call up in 2 different ways, and one is affected while
the other is not.  I haven't done enough packetcaptures to see if there is a
difference between the packet streams.



On 12/4/2020 8:07 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
> Is there a reason not to use SIP over TCP?
>
> I think in the past I thought retransmits were irrelevant in a 
> realtime app, but the latency is low enough sometimes now that maybe 
> it would actually help.  And TCP seems to traverse NAT more easily.
>
>
> On 12/3/2020 6:18 PM, Nate Burke wrote:
>> I'm trying to track down a strange Issue I'm having, and wondering if 
>> anyone has run into something similar.
>>
>> I have a couple customers that I let take phone handsets home, the 
>> Grandstream PBX is at our office.  It seems that if the SIP traffic 
>> comes in one upstream, but leaves another upstream, really weird 
>> things happen.
>>
>> The Phone registers to the PBX just fine, and can receive calls all 
>> day long, it just cannot make calls.  If I take a /24 and force it to 
>> enter and leave the network via the same provider, then everything 
>> works fine.  Those of you that have multiple diverse paths, have you 
>> seen something like this?  The Call in UDP Mode fails, the call in 
>> TCP mode will succeed.
>>
>> This only appears to be an issue with the handset talking to the PBX.  
>> All of our Sip Trunk traffic (Voip Innovations) works just fine.  For 
>> some reason the handset SIP re-invite never makes it back to the 
>> handset when multi-homing is in place.
>>
>>
>>
>


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[AFMUG] OT? climbing on meth

[Colin Stanners]

 https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/woman-who-climbed-crane
-in-winnipeg-likely-using-methamphetamine-police-1.5214303


We have had new wireless installers that don't like climbing over 40ft. I
jokingly chatted our HR... "if she gets off the drugs, do you want to hire
her?"
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[AFMUG] LTE SIM cards

[David Coudron]

As we make our way into LTE for fixed wireless we are finding a new wrinkle 
with the management of sim card data.   It seems the SIM card manufacturers 
only print the ICCID on the card, but want to send the rest of the data fields 
separately.   We are finding that they will send a spreadsheet of additional 
information like the IMSI, K, and OPC values separately.   We understand why 
that might increase the security of the SIM cards, but it makes for a messy 
management of the data.   We'll have to created a central spreadsheet that the 
techs and office folks can access to look up the SIM card data to enter it into 
the EPC.   What we'd like is a SIM card that has these data fields printed and 
barcoded on the card itself so that the Tech can either scan/enter it in 
themselves, or the office folks can scan it in ahead of time.   Anyone run into 
a better solution for retrieving/managing the additional SIM data?

Regards,,

David Coudron


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Re: [AFMUG] Repairs

[Colin Stanners]

Assuming that you mean "who does it other than Cambium", Paul McCall's
PDMNet used to do it - not sure if they still do - WirelessUnits in
Pennsylvania too.

On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 8:58 AM Matt  wrote:

> Who all does cambium 450 repairs etc?
>
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[AFMUG] Repairs

[Matt]

Who all does cambium 450 repairs etc?

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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Inside joke.


bp

On 12/4/2020 5:57 AM, Adam Moffett
  wrote:


  
  What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control
issues?

  
  On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown
via AF wrote:
  
  


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Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

[Nate Burke]

I use Grandstream, and BLF is Broken when trying to use SIP over TCP.  
I've never had a NAT problem before.  I was just checking the other 
Offnet phones that I have, and through sheer happenstance, those 
handsets all coming in and leaving on the same transit provider.


Interesting is that the Grandstream Softphone client on my cell phone 
works fine, it's only the Grandstream handsets that are the problem. I'm 
guessing they are setting the call up in 2 different ways, and one is 
affected while the other is not.  I haven't done enough packetcaptures 
to see if there is a difference between the packet streams.




On 12/4/2020 8:07 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:

Is there a reason not to use SIP over TCP?

I think in the past I thought retransmits were irrelevant in a 
realtime app, but the latency is low enough sometimes now that maybe 
it would actually help.  And TCP seems to traverse NAT more easily.



On 12/3/2020 6:18 PM, Nate Burke wrote:
I'm trying to track down a strange Issue I'm having, and wondering if 
anyone has run into something similar.


I have a couple customers that I let take phone handsets home, the 
Grandstream PBX is at our office.  It seems that if the SIP traffic 
comes in one upstream, but leaves another upstream, really weird 
things happen.


The Phone registers to the PBX just fine, and can receive calls all 
day long, it just cannot make calls.  If I take a /24 and force it to 
enter and leave the network via the same provider, then everything 
works fine.  Those of you that have multiple diverse paths, have you 
seen something like this?  The Call in UDP Mode fails, the call in 
TCP mode will succeed.


This only appears to be an issue with the handset talking to the 
PBX.  All of our Sip Trunk traffic (Voip Innovations) works just 
fine.  For some reason the handset SIP re-invite never makes it back 
to the handset when multi-homing is in place.









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Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

[Larry Smith]

Hmmm, why would that not be a NAT problem.
Translation tables are built based on TO and FROM
packets - so a change in either means the packet
is not part of an established translation and gets dropped.

-- 
Larry Smith
lesm...@ecsis.net

On Thu December 3 2020 18:32, Nate Burke wrote:
> I don't think it's a NAT problem, as the only thing I change is my
> upstream routing.  The Handset is connected via WIFI to my 4g hotspot it
> goes from not working to working just by changing the BGP Announcement.
> It's like one of the internet paths is dropping the traffic as rogue
> traffic because the other direction of the packet didn't flow through them.
>
> I'm seeing the packet leave my network, it's just never getting to the
> destination until the inbound traffic is over the same provider.
>
> On 12/3/2020 6:22 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
> > There is such a tool. There is a lower capability free version and a
> > paid version. VoIPMonitor 
> > Tough to say what might be going on. On the face it seems like the re
> > invite doesn't know where to go as there is no NAT table connection
> > entry from that port to the internal IP.
> >
> > On Thu, Dec 3, 2020 at 6:13 PM Chuck McCown via AF  > > wrote:
> >
> > I used to think SIP was OK.  I even helped GenBand (or whatever
> > the Northern
> > Telecom manufacturer was called after they were Northern Telecom )
> > fix their
> > SIP stack.  Took a ton of wire sharking and deep packet inspection
> > but they
> > had a fault.
> >
> > But I have forgotten everything I ever knew about SIP.  I am sure
> > there is
> > someone that makes a SIP tool the is like wire shark but decodes
> > things into
> > a much more easy to read format and then is able to launch SIP
> > packets
> > too... but too lazy to see if one exists.  A SIP simulator, or
> > spoofer or
> > stingray type of box.
> >
> > Needs to be made out of metal and have buttons, lights and meters
> > on it.
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Ken Hohhof
> > Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2020 4:57 PM
> > To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing
> >
> > I thought re-invites were used to get the media stream to flow
> > directly
> > between the endpoints and bypass the PBX.
> >
> > And if you took out the asymmetric routing, the other symptoms
> > would make me
> > think it's a NAT traversal or SIP ALG problem in the customer's
> > router.  But
> > with the dependency on how the traffic flows over the Internet, I
> > haven't a
> > clue.
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: AF  > > On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> > Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2020 5:18 PM
> > To: Animal Farm mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
> > Subject: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing
> >
> > I'm trying to track down a strange Issue I'm having, and wondering
> > if anyone
> > has run into something similar.
> >
> > I have a couple customers that I let take phone handsets home, the
> > Grandstream PBX is at our office.  It seems that if the SIP
> > traffic comes in
> > one upstream, but leaves another upstream, really weird things
> > happen.
> >
> > The Phone registers to the PBX just fine, and can receive calls
> > all day
> > long, it just cannot make calls.  If I take a /24 and force it to
> > enter and
> > leave the network via the same provider, then everything works
> > fine.  Those
> > of you that have multiple diverse paths, have you seen something
> > like this?
> > The Call in UDP Mode fails, the call in TCP mode will succeed.
> >
> > This only appears to be an issue with the handset talking to the PBX.
> > All of our Sip Trunk traffic (Voip Innovations) works just fine.
> > For some
> > reason the handset SIP re-invite never makes it back to the
> > handset when
> > multi-homing is in place.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com 
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com 
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com 
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Lewis Bergman
> > 325-439-0533 Cell

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Re: [AFMUG] Offnet SIP and Multi-homing

[Adam Moffett]

Is there a reason not to use SIP over TCP?

I think in the past I thought retransmits were irrelevant in a realtime 
app, but the latency is low enough sometimes now that maybe it would 
actually help.  And TCP seems to traverse NAT more easily.



On 12/3/2020 6:18 PM, Nate Burke wrote:
I'm trying to track down a strange Issue I'm having, and wondering if 
anyone has run into something similar.


I have a couple customers that I let take phone handsets home, the 
Grandstream PBX is at our office.  It seems that if the SIP traffic 
comes in one upstream, but leaves another upstream, really weird 
things happen.


The Phone registers to the PBX just fine, and can receive calls all 
day long, it just cannot make calls.  If I take a /24 and force it to 
enter and leave the network via the same provider, then everything 
works fine.  Those of you that have multiple diverse paths, have you 
seen something like this?  The Call in UDP Mode fails, the call in TCP 
mode will succeed.


This only appears to be an issue with the handset talking to the PBX.  
All of our Sip Trunk traffic (Voip Innovations) works just fine.  For 
some reason the handset SIP re-invite never makes it back to the 
handset when multi-homing is in place.






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Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?

[Adam Moffett]

On 12/4/2020 1:05 AM, fiber...@mail.com wrote:

Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2020
From: "Chuck McCown via AF" 

Not sure why UPCs are used at all since APC seems to be technologically 
superior.

   Slight cost differential. APC used to have a slightly higher insertion loss. 
Preference to have same connectors everywhere.


Jared



Yup, and on the LAN you don't have to care about a db here or there 
because you have 2km optics running 200 feet.




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Re: [AFMUG] I QUIT! jk

[Adam Moffett]

What was the deal with Bullit anyway?  Some sort of control issues?

On 12/2/2020 4:59 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

*From:* Paul McCall
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:52 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Its all good Ken 😊

Didn’t mean to sound defensive LOL.

But if I get any more crap, I QUIT hahahah

(only us “long-times” will get that reference)

*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:29 PM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

I didn’t mean that to be an insult, more like kudos, you honey badger you.

*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 3:16 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Not in total agreement with that assessment Ken.

20 years of having a fixed wireless division without really working 
aggressively for customer acquisition, over 1000 customers, while 
doing a bunch of other things.  Network running like a well-oiled 
machine, less than 10 tech phone calls per 24 hours, sometimes just 2 
or 3.  We are well aware of future proofing and are doing that 
wherever possible.  I think we have a few years at least even at 2.4, 
running 45 degree sectors, and smaller fill towers.  We overlay what 
we can in 5 Ghz to give peak speeds.  Licensed BH links wherever 
possible.   If I had a local company that could provide 50Mbit plans 
for less than Mr. musk, I would take it all day long.  Not everyone 
would of course.  ATT has had fixed wireless in 80% of our coverage 
area, and we have lost 4 customers in 2 years to it.


But, I have other businesses, and a recording musician if that 
industry ever comes back.


They key is to be a honey badger at whatever you are doing!

I’m good 😊

*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:07 PM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

You are a brave man trying to make a business out of NLOS fixed 
wireless.  On the one hand, it’s magic not science.  On the other 
hand, Elon Musk and T-Mobile are wanting to eat your lunch, not to 
mention government funded fiber.


I think it’s like getting people to pay to see you juggle running 
chainsaws, while they could instead watch Netflix or play Call Of 
Duty.  Very difficult, yet customers would rather be doing something else.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 2:49 PM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
*Cc:* Chuck McCown 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Theodolite will.

*From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 1:37 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

LOL, definitely not in LOS territory.  90% of our rural stuff won’t 
see the towers.


We use tower coverage as well, but it doesn’t show the angle (degrees) 
to the tower.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:53 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

When an account (in Powercode) is made through Towercoverage API, 
it'll add the estimated signals to the tower starting with the closest 
ones.  That ticket could always be pulled up.


As far as alignment, I would think you're in LOS territory with 5 GHz 
so once you know where the tower is, you can aim for it by eyeball 
instead of app.


Josh Luthman
24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:44 PM Paul McCall  wrote:

We have that… looking for more of a compass time app that will
point him to a tower, based on stored LAT / LONG

*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
via AF
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:15 PM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
*Cc:* Chuck McCown 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Google Earth

*From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Paul McCall
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 2, 2020 10:07 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* [AFMUG] Favorite AP for tower locating for techs

Anyone have a favorite app??  (android or iPhone) for putting in
the LAT/LONG of all the towers, so that the newbies have a general
direction to a tower from their location.

Looking to import (or type them) in all the towers..

Thanks!

*Paul McCall, President *

*Florida Broadband / PDMNet*

*658 Old Dixie Highway*

*Vero Beach, FL 32962*

*772-564-6800*

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Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?

[Adam Moffett]

If you've already got hardened connectors in the field then maybe this 
opinion is irrelevant, but look at Commscope OFDC drop closures in the 
future.


They use standard connectors, so you can put an SOC on a tight buffered 
drop fiber like Corning ROC-drop or similar.  And there never seems to 
be a shortage of non-hardened connectors.



On 12/2/2020 4:20 PM, Paul McCall wrote:


Order placed months ago with Commscope (through a distributor) and 
Commscope has pushed back expected delivery until February


FXDXK1A0010F Cable, Drop, Flat, Dielectric

DLX, 10 ft. - MINI DLX CABLE to connect

Mini-MST DLX to LC-UPC

Need 25 to 50 of these  (they are custom as normally they don’t make 
them with an LC-UPC end)


*Paul McCall, President *

*Florida Broadband / PDMNet*

*658 Old Dixie Highway*

*Vero Beach, FL 32962*

*772-564-6800*


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Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?

[Adam Moffett]

"polish connector"

"ultra polish connector"

"angled polish connector"

polish is a rare word because the meaning changes when you capitalize it.

On 12/3/2020 10:53 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

Don't know what PC is.  LC is the teeny thing that goes in an SFP.

UPC is uniform blue

APC is angled green

Josh Luthman
24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Thu, Dec 3, 2020 at 10:41 AM Ken Hohhof > wrote:


Not being a fiber guy, I didn’t know the difference between PC,
UPC and APC, so I had to look it up:


https://community.fs.com/blog/pc-vs-upc-vs-apc-connector-selecting-the-right-fiber-connector-type.html



*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Thursday, December 3, 2020 9:25 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Can anybody make these ?

They screwed us on our optitap premade as well.  See if you can
find a DLX field install kit for ~$10.  We got field install
optitap for $10 and will splice SC/APC on the other end (in which
case you'd splice LC-UPC).

For the record drop cables with LC is pretty weird and UPC is
really really weird.

Don't expect Commscope to get any better on lead times or accurate
ship dates.

Josh Luthman
24/7 Help Desk: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 4:21 PM Paul McCall mailto:pa...@pdmnet.net>> wrote:

Order placed months ago with Commscope (through a distributor)
and Commscope has pushed back expected delivery until February

FXDXK1A0010F Cable, Drop, Flat, Dielectric

DLX, 10 ft. - MINI DLX CABLE to connect

Mini-MST DLX to LC-UPC

Need 25 to 50 of these  (they are custom as normally they
don’t make them with an LC-UPC end)

*Paul McCall, President *

*Florida Broadband / PDMNet*

*658 Old Dixie Highway*

*Vero Beach, FL 32962*

*772-564-6800*

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