Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 Watchdog resets - was: To Cambium With Love- Replace the bad ePMP units.

[Joe Falaschi]

We have some APs that have uptime over 60 days but many reboot every 1-3 weeks. 
 This is definitely an outlier.  We've been in contact with Cambium on this via 
an open ticket and sending them all of the information they request and nobody 
has said oh gosh that is bad hardware RMA it.  So, we're just going around and 
around.  We'll end up just replacing it and hoping they will take it back 
because obviously this is bad.  We are running 14.x per their request.  We saw 
this on 13.x as well.

Joe


On Jan 21, 2016, at 12:05 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

> Joe, that is seriously bad.  I see watchdog resets and a few stack dumps, but 
> uptime on 450 APs is typically 2-4 weeks, despite the recent cold weather, in 
> fact I don’t think it has been more common than it was last summer.  I have 
> not gone to 14.x though, everything is still on 13.2.
>  
> So either you have a bad unit, or 14.x is making it much worse.  If everyone 
> was seeing resets every few minutes or hours, I think there would be 
> villagers with torches and pitchforks outside Cambium HQ.
>  
> Brian from FVI does have a thread on the Cambium Community about this.
>  
> FWIW, I have one 450i 900 MHz which necessarily is on 14.1, and it does not 
> appear to be having watchdog resets.  Lightly loaded however, just 2 subs.
>  
>  
> From: Joe Falaschi
> Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2016 11:34 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 Watchdog resets - was: To Cambium With Love- 
> Replace the bad ePMP units.
>  
> We see a ton of reboots on the 450 platform as well.  It's getting pretty 
> frustrating simply because this is such a long term issue.  One of my APs has 
> rebooted 195 times (now running 14.1.2).  They are saying we should replace 
> the AP but it is unclear if we can RMA it or not.  We do have an open ticket.
>  
> Joe Falaschi
> e-vergent
>  
>  
>  
> 
> On Jan 20, 2016, at 9:26 PM, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
> 
>> Hum…  sounds very similar.   It’s temperature sensitive as well - gets far 
>> worse with low temperatures, and we are having pretty cold temps this week.  
>>  
>> Extremely frustrating and causing real customer complaints.
>>  
>> Mark
>>  
>>> On Jan 20, 2016, at 9:28 PM, Tushar Patel  wrote:
>>>  
>>> Over two years we have been seeing random reboot. We were told over and 
>>> over again you are the only one.  Then few people started reporting.
>>>  
>>> But cambium never could get bottom of the problems for two years so, I gave 
>>> up on cambium fixing this random reboot.  We stop calling them about it.
>>>  
>>> As the new versions of the software has come out over two years we have see 
>>> the frequency of the problem reduce but not gone away.
>>> 
>>> Tushar
>>>  
>>> 
>>> On Jan 20, 2016, at 6:25 PM, Mark Radabaugh  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Tushar,
>>>>  
>>>> What did you give up on?   Or do?
>>>>  
>>>> Please note the mailing and shipping address change below:
>>>>  
>>>> Mark Radabaugh
>>>> Amplex
>>>> 22690 Pemberville Rd
>>>> Luckey, OH 43443
>>>> 419-837-5015 x1021
>>>> m...@amplex.net
>>>>  
>>>>> On Jan 20, 2016, at 4:49 PM, Tushar Patel  wrote:
>>>>>  
>>>>> That's what they used to tell us too.  We have given up on the subject 
>>>>> now. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Tushar
>>>>>  
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 20, 2016, at 1:09 PM, Mark Radabaugh  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Wait - they keep telling us we are the only ones that this happens to 
>>>>>> with 450?
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> So who else is having reboot-o-rama with 450’s?
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>  
>>>>>>> On Jan 20, 2016, at 1:20 PM, Brian Sullivan  
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>  
>>>>>>> I wish they would fix/replace the bad 450 AP's that suffer from 
>>>>>>> Watchdog Resets.  
>>>>>>> Although replacing 100 450 AP's is cheaper than ePMP.  :-/
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On 1/20/2016 12:11 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>>>>>>> Why would making the memory faster degrade performance?
>>>>>>>>  
>>>>>>>>  
>>>>>>>> Josh Luthman
>>>>>>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>>

Re: [AFMUG] CCTV over Canopy 100 series

[Joe Falaschi]

Years ago we built a small little network to replace the 802.11b 2.4GHz network 
that was not performing due to noise in 2.4.  We used Canopy FSK 5.2GHz 
software scheduled AP/SMs.  I think there were 3 or 4 Axis cameras total on a 
handful of buildings in a downtown environment.  I think you'll be fine.  

Joe


On Feb 17, 2016, at 11:32 AM, Brian Sullivan wrote:

> We have a project coming up where we need a single ~3 Mbps UDP stream sent 
> wireless about 2000'.  Since we have a large supply of FSK P9 + P10 AP's and 
> SM's, is there any reason why we shouldn't use them?
> This is for a PTZ Axis camera.

[AFMUG] location based pricing on website

[Joe Falaschi]

Does anyone know of an elegant solution to display a pricing page based on a 
street address?  I want to create a few polygons and if the address is within 
polygon a, b, or c show a different pricing page.  We have a wordpress site.  
I've seen some google maps example that we can probably make work if done in an 
iframe.  Just curious if anyone has already done this and has any suggestions 
on word press plugins or google maps libraries.  Thanks!

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

Re: [AFMUG] location based pricing on website

[Joe Falaschi]

Thanks Simon.  This is one that I did not find myself.  I'll check it out!

Joe



On 2/18/16 8:17 PM, Simon Westlake wrote:
I don't know of anything prebaked, but I'd look at something like 
http://postgis.net/


On Thursday, February 18, 2016, Joe Falaschi  wrote:

Does anyone know of an elegant solution to display a pricing page
based on a street address?  I want to create a few polygons and
if the address is within polygon a, b, or c show a different
pricing page.  We have a wordpress site.  I've seen some google
maps example that we can probably make work if done in an
iframe.  Just curious if anyone has already done this and has any
suggestions on word press plugins or google maps libraries.  Thanks!

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent



--
Simon Westlake
Skype: Simon_Sonar
Email:simon@sonar.software
Phone: (702) 447-1247
---
Sonar Software Inc
The next generation of ISP billing and OSS
https://sonar.software

Re: [AFMUG] location based pricing on website

[Joe Falaschi]

Why bother?  To me there are a lot of reasons.

1. We cover a lot of ground with 120 towers in nine counties in two 
states.  We upgrade towers weekly but just can't keep up at times it's 
difficult to stay ahead of the demand for more speed.


2. Different towers are capable of different plans based on where we are 
at in the upgrade cycle.  I don't want to get into a situation where a 
lead thinks they can get one plan but we can only deliver a different 
set in that area.  Nothing will be perfect but general groupings of 
towers are usually similar vintage.


3. Costs are just different.  Some regions have fiber to them and others 
we have to back haul via 4 or 5 licensed microwave hops to get to the 
region that has fiber.  Some regions cost us 2k a month per tower and 
others are trade outs of an Internet account for grain elevator placement.


4. Customer makeup.  Some towers we can install DIA circuits on to help 
offset costs.  In rural areas we're not going to put a $1000/mo account 
on the tower.  In the urban or suburban areas we can blend day time and 
night time usage for more effective usage of the tower rent and back 
haul network even if the tower rent is more.


5. Some towers are just currently poorly performing and we have sunk 
costs that we need to recoup, these would be the promo type towers.


From time to time the word does get out that one area is different.  It 
is what it is.  We just tell them that is the case 80 miles away but not 
here.  The point of this whole thing is to at least not put it in their 
face though.


Joe



On 2/18/16 5:46 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Why bother???

Why not just price your service equal for everyone and average out 
your costs/income?  Although we certainly could get away with pricing 
rural users higher than city dwellers, I prefer to just average it out 
across our network.


I think a wiser move would be to equip your sales staff with a 
discount pro-mo if a client is really obtouse.


Is your price difference per area going to be greater than $10/mo?? 
For instance rural service is $59/mo but city service is $49/mo?


What happens when they have a friend in a different service area of 
yours that gets a different price?  They are gonna call and complain.


2 cents

-Sean

On Thursday, February 18, 2016, Joe Falaschi <mailto:listm...@wi.net>> wrote:


Does anyone know of an elegant solution to display a pricing page
based on a street address?  I want to create a few polygons and if
the address is within polygon a, b, or c show a different pricing
page.  We have a wordpress site.  I've seen some google maps
example that we can probably make work if done in an iframe. Just
curious if anyone has already done this and has any suggestions on
word press plugins or google maps libraries. Thanks!

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

Re: [AFMUG] location based pricing on website

[Joe Falaschi]

The one that always gets me is the fuel surcharge fees.  I haven't 
looked at the actual charges side by side from year to year but when gas 
is less than $2/gal it is just annoying to see.  I first though about 
doing it with zip codes. That would be a really easy query.  I just do 
not want to maintain the zip code database.


Joe


On 2/18/16 10:21 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
The big guys would probably do it with fees.  Like UPS has a 
residential address surcharge and a remote area surcharge, both of 
which apply to most of my customers.  But that doesn’t answer how to 
automate it.
The Rise Broadband website asks for your address before showing 
prices, but my impression is it goes by zipcode.

*From:* Joe Falaschi <mailto:listm...@wi.net>
*Sent:* Thursday, February 18, 2016 9:45 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] location based pricing on website
Why bother?  To me there are a lot of reasons.

1. We cover a lot of ground with 120 towers in nine counties in two 
states.  We upgrade towers weekly but just can't keep up at times it's 
difficult to stay ahead of the demand for more speed.


2. Different towers are capable of different plans based on where we 
are at in the upgrade cycle.  I don't want to get into a situation 
where a lead thinks they can get one plan but we can only deliver a 
different set in that area.  Nothing will be perfect but general 
groupings of towers are usually similar vintage.


3. Costs are just different.  Some regions have fiber to them and 
others we have to back haul via 4 or 5 licensed microwave hops to get 
to the region that has fiber.  Some regions cost us 2k a month per 
tower and others are trade outs of an Internet account for grain 
elevator placement.


4. Customer makeup.  Some towers we can install DIA circuits on to 
help offset costs.  In rural areas we're not going to put a $1000/mo 
account on the tower.  In the urban or suburban areas we can blend day 
time and night time usage for more effective usage of the tower rent 
and back haul network even if the tower rent is more.


5. Some towers are just currently poorly performing and we have sunk 
costs that we need to recoup, these would be the promo type towers.


From time to time the word does get out that one area is different.  
It is what it is.  We just tell them that is the case 80 miles away 
but not here.  The point of this whole thing is to at least not put it 
in their face though.


Joe



On 2/18/16 5:46 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Why bother???
Why not just price your service equal for everyone and average out 
your costs/income?  Although we certainly could get away with pricing 
rural users higher than city dwellers, I prefer to just average it 
out across our network.
I think a wiser move would be to equip your sales staff with a 
discount pro-mo if a client is really obtouse.
Is your price difference per area going to be greater than $10/mo?? 
For instance rural service is $59/mo but city service is $49/mo?
What happens when they have a friend in a different service area of 
yours that gets a different price?  They are gonna call and complain.

2 cents
-Sean

On Thursday, February 18, 2016, Joe Falaschi  wrote:

Does anyone know of an elegant solution to display a pricing page
based on a street address?  I want to create a few polygons and
if the address is within polygon a, b, or c show a different
pricing page.  We have a wordpress site.  I've seen some google
maps example that we can probably make work if done in an
iframe.  Just curious if anyone has already done this and has any
suggestions on word press plugins or google maps libraries.  Thanks!

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

Re: [AFMUG] location based pricing on website

[Joe Falaschi]

From what I remember it is a nice system, and does a lot more back end 
stuff, which would be nice but not necessary at this point.  I do 
remember them being a little expensive.  Thanks for the reminder, I'll 
check them out.


Joe


On 2/18/16 10:02 PM, can...@believewireless.net wrote:
With that many sites, you might want to check out COS Systems and 
their Service Zones program.


On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 10:45 PM, Joe Falaschi <mailto:listm...@wi.net>> wrote:


Why bother?  To me there are a lot of reasons.

1. We cover a lot of ground with 120 towers in nine counties in
two states.  We upgrade towers weekly but just can't keep up at
times it's difficult to stay ahead of the demand for more speed.

2. Different towers are capable of different plans based on where
we are at in the upgrade cycle.  I don't want to get into a
situation where a lead thinks they can get one plan but we can
only deliver a different set in that area.  Nothing will be
perfect but general groupings of towers are usually similar vintage.

3. Costs are just different.  Some regions have fiber to them and
others we have to back haul via 4 or 5 licensed microwave hops to
get to the region that has fiber. Some regions cost us 2k a month
per tower and others are trade outs of an Internet account for
grain elevator placement.

4. Customer makeup.  Some towers we can install DIA circuits on to
help offset costs.  In rural areas we're not going to put a
$1000/mo account on the tower.  In the urban or suburban areas we
can blend day time and night time usage for more effective usage
of the tower rent and back haul network even if the tower rent is
more.

5. Some towers are just currently poorly performing and we have
sunk costs that we need to recoup, these would be the promo type
towers.

From time to time the word does get out that one area is
different.  It is what it is.  We just tell them that is the case
80 miles away but not here.  The point of this whole thing is to
at least not put it in their face though.

Joe



On 2/18/16 5:46 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Why bother???

Why not just price your service equal for everyone and average
out your costs/income? Although we certainly could get away with
pricing rural users higher than city dwellers, I prefer to just
average it out across our network.

I think a wiser move would be to equip your sales staff with a
discount pro-mo if a client is really obtouse.

Is your price difference per area going to be greater than
$10/mo?? For instance rural service is $59/mo but city service is
$49/mo?

What happens when they have a friend in a different service
area of yours that gets a different price?  They are gonna call
and complain.

2 cents

-Sean

    On Thursday, February 18, 2016, Joe Falaschi mailto:listm...@wi.net>> wrote:

Does anyone know of an elegant solution to display a pricing
page based on a street address?  I want to create a few
polygons and if the address is within polygon a, b, or c show
a different pricing page. We have a wordpress site.  I've
seen some google maps example that we can probably make work
if done in an iframe.  Just curious if anyone has already
done this and has any suggestions on word press plugins or
    google maps libraries.  Thanks!

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

[AFMUG] kp performance two 5GHz H/V antennas in one radome - review/opinion

[Joe Falaschi]

Is anyone using this antenna: 
http://www.kpperformance.ca/two-5ghz-hv-antennas-in-one-radome?

Deployment wise I'm thinking one radio would be an existing UBNT Rocket M and 
the other could be a UBNT Rocket AC or EPMP.  It seems that is the intention of 
this product.  I'm just curious if others have implemented it with success.  
Also curious how much channel separation you used?  Did you plan any different 
considering it's the same antenna enclosure vs two separate antennas?  The 
specs say there is 40db of separation between the two radios.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

Re: [AFMUG] kp performance two 5GHz H/V antennas in one radome - review/opinion

[Joe Falaschi]

Darin, that is a good point and one I overlooked.  In this particular situation 
it might actually not be the worst thing though.  I'll have to look at the 
customer locations a little more carefully.  I want to add a single high 
bandwidth customer on a dedicated AP but not increase antenna count on the 
tower.

Joe


On Feb 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Darin Steffl wrote:

> Joe,
> 
> This is essentially a 130* antenna or two 65* patterns to make 130*. The 
> beams do not cover the same direction if that's what you're thinking. The PDF 
> below shows what these antennas do.
> 
> http://www.kpperformance.ca/product_documents/get/document/id/145/
> 
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2016 at 10:18 AM, Joe Falaschi  wrote:
> Is anyone using this antenna: 
> http://www.kpperformance.ca/two-5ghz-hv-antennas-in-one-radome?
> 
> Deployment wise I'm thinking one radio would be an existing UBNT Rocket M and 
> the other could be a UBNT Rocket AC or EPMP.  It seems that is the intention 
> of this product.  I'm just curious if others have implemented it with 
> success.  Also curious how much channel separation you used?  Did you plan 
> any different considering it's the same antenna enclosure vs two separate 
> antennas?  The specs say there is 40db of separation between the two radios.
> 
> Joe Falaschi
> e-vergent
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Darin Steffl
> Minnesota WiFi
> www.mnwifi.com
> 507-634-WiFi
>  Like us on Facebook

Re: [AFMUG] kp performance two 5GHz H/V antennas in one radome - review/opinion

[Joe Falaschi]

UBNT M is the legacy network.  We're mostly doing EPMP for new deployments.

In this case it would probably end up being a UBNT AC due to the connection 
speed we need to deploy for a single new customer though.  We're having mixed 
results with a mixed N and AC network on the beta firmware hence we're looking 
to deploy multiple APs and not mix them.

Joe



On Feb 19, 2016, at 10:20 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

> Why would you do an ePMP and Ubnt AP side by side???
> 
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Joe Falaschi  wrote:
> Is anyone using this antenna: 
> http://www.kpperformance.ca/two-5ghz-hv-antennas-in-one-radome?
> 
> Deployment wise I'm thinking one radio would be an existing UBNT Rocket M and 
> the other could be a UBNT Rocket AC or EPMP.  It seems that is the intention 
> of this product.  I'm just curious if others have implemented it with 
> success.  Also curious how much channel separation you used?  Did you plan 
> any different considering it's the same antenna enclosure vs two separate 
> antennas?  The specs say there is 40db of separation between the two radios.
> 
> Joe Falaschi
> e-vergent
> 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Apple

[Joe Falaschi]

I haven't been paying close attention to this but I thought I saw one TV report 
that said earlier versions of iOS could simply be unlocked.  Supposedly Apple 
has unlocked previous unencrypted phones.  That all changed with iOS 9 though 
because of encryption and that there is no simple unlock anymore.  That's how I 
understood it anyway.  Am I missing something?

Joe


On Feb 19, 2016, at 4:59 PM, Nate Burke wrote:

> But they're not actually asking for a back door, are they?� They're just 
> saying 'hey, we have this physical device, can we give it to you, and you get 
> us the data off of it'?� I've got to think that the Engineers at apple have 
> a way to do this thought up.� 
> 
> Although at the same time, If they're trying to unlock the phone, couldn't 
> the Gov't with it's vast resources, just simply make a bit by bit copy of the 
> flash chip in the phone and just go through and try every unlock code?
> 
> On 2/19/2016 4:54 PM, Josh Reynolds wrote:
>> Yup. Google agrees as well.
>> 
>> On Feb 19, 2016 4:52 PM, "Sam Lambie"  wrote:
>> Screw the govt. Apple is doing entirely doing the right thing. 
>> 
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2016 at 3:47 PM, Nate Burke  wrote:
>> My Boss and I just had a discussion about this, he think that Cook should be 
>> in Jail for failing to comply with the order.� 
>> 
>> On 2/19/2016 4:46 PM, Josh Reynolds wrote:
>>> ... What?
>>> 
>>> Seriously?
>>> 
>>> On Feb 19, 2016 4:44 PM,  wrote:
>>> Treason?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> -- 
>> Sam Lambie
>> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
>> 575-758-7598 Office
>> www.Taosnet.com
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Selling Redudant or Backup (Failover) connections

[Joe Falaschi]

Maybe a cheap plan with usage based billing is the way to hedge against that 
for plans sold as backup only.  We're considering doing something along those 
lines anyway.

Joe



On Feb 22, 2016, at 2:37 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

> Charge a normal rate, maybe a bit less to compete.  Imagine if you make it 
> cheap and they use you primarily all day.
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Feb 22, 2016 3:28 PM, "Paul McCall"  wrote:
> Does anyone here market a specific “backup connection” to small businesses 
> (non-BGP)?  Here, Comcast has a strong foothold on business connections, but 
> they go down occasionally (like anyone else would), so there is an 
> opportunity there.  With Cloud based solutions, VoIP solutions, redundancy 
> for a business would make sense. 
> 
>  
> 
> So the questions would be, what do you charge relative to your normal rate 
> for a backup (failover) connection only? 
> 
>  
> 
> Paul
> 
>  
> 
> Paul McCall, Pres.
> 
> PDMNet / Florida Broadband
> 
> 658 Old Dixie Highway
> 
> Vero Beach, FL 32962
> 
> 772-564-6800 office
> 
> 772-473-0352 cell
> 
> www.pdmnet.com
> 
> pa...@pdmnet.net
> 
>  
> 

Re: [AFMUG] MDU deployments. Can you make any money on them?

[Joe Falaschi]

We use Planet VDSL in business buildings where it's not economical to run 
ethernet and want to use twisted pair.

We use C9 Networks CMTS systems when we want to ride coax.  They have a DOCSIS 
3.0 system but ours is pretty old and is a 1.0 box.  We've been running it for 
years and it's very reliable.  http://www.c9networks.com/

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On Dec 16, 2015, at 9:21 PM, Keefe John wrote:

> What equipment are you using on the coax?
> 
> On 12/16/2015 7:12 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>> Yes, most of the time it is in use. Let me rephrase drop ownership. Even if 
>> we (or anyone else for that matter) put in new drops, the building owns it. 
>> Period. That's the law.
>> 
>> You can put diplexers on the drops to isolate services. This usually ends up 
>> in a fight with the cable company. And they lose, every time. I have many 
>> stories, but I'm not going to talk about that on a public list.
>> 
>> On 12/16/2015 5:18 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>>> Was the existing coax not in use at the time?
>>> 
>>> George Skorup wrote:
>>>> We have done a bunch using the existing coax in the building. Usually the 
>>>> property owns the drops to the units. It's nice when all of the customers 
>>>> are in one place. :) I will say this though, stay away from low income 
>>>> housing. Leave those for the telco and cable.
>>>> 
>>>> You will be disappointed trying wireless in a brick building.
>>>> 
>>>> On 12/16/2015 2:20 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>>>>> MDUs are an example of how not to make money?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Gino Villarini wrote:
>>>>>> how not to make money?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 3:24 PM, Jay Weekley >>>>> <mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>Is there really any money in MDU deployments?   If so, are you
>>>>>>doing WiFi or wired to the end user?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Mike Hammett needs help.

[Joe Falaschi]

Mike if you still need any, we have a link in stock in Racine.

Joe


On 1/11/16 8:19 AM, Super WISP wrote:


We have not received our stock yet.

*/Mark Chamerlik/*

Strategic Account Manager-East Coast

cid:image001.jpg@01D14A33.56536AF0

630-818-1004

815-822-4490

ma...@wavonline.com 

www.wavonline.com 

For additional assistance: email tea...@wavonline.com 



*/NEW/*: 2016 IMPROVEMENTS TO WAV’S BUSINESS MANAGEMENT 



Description: twitter-logo-100x100.png 
Description: fb-logo-100x100.png 



*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jeff Broadwick 
- Lists

*Sent:* Sunday, January 10, 2016 10:11 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Mike Hammett needs help.

Mike reached out to me already.  We currently resell those and don't 
stock.  WAV might have some.  I don't know.


Jeff Broadwick

ConVergence Technologies, Inc.

312-205-2519 Office

574-220-7826 Cell

jbroadw...@converge-tech.com 


On Jan 10, 2016, at 11:01 AM, Josh Luthman 
mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote:


If anyone knows someone at Baltic, they have it on their website:


http://www.balticnetworks.com/mimosa-connectorized-radio-4900-6000mhz-1gbps-802-11ac-mimo-4x4-4.html

Rocnoc doesn't have them.

CTI might have them, not sure if Jeff can get someone in the
warehouse to go in today?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Jerry Head
mailto:li...@blountbroadband.com>> wrote:

Mike Hammett just posted to Facebook the he is in dire need of a
Mimosa B5c near Chicago.
He also states that his mailserver is down and requested someone
post to the list on his behalf so here it is.

This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which
it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and
exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is
not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivery of
the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly
prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us
immediately by telephone at 630-818-1000.

Re: [AFMUG] OT Space X

[Joe Falaschi]

Humans think negative more than positive.  I saw this yesterday:

http://blog.eosworldwide.com/blog/180-rule-creative-problem-solving#axzz3xhrPypBF

and it seems to fit...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wired-success/201406/are-we-hardwired-be-positive-or-negative


On Jan 19, 2016, at 9:30 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

> It does seem to me that people started out focusing on the successes at NASA 
> and ended up focusing only on the failures, now the cycle is starting over 
> with private enterprise.
>  
> I don’t like the way people universally started to talk about the Space 
> Shuttle like some enormous failure to be mocked.  NASA and their contractors 
> were told to build a reusable space truck for delivering stuff to orbit, and 
> that’s what they built.  At the beginning people ignored the risks and 
> marveled at the successes.  Then there were some failures, and eventually no 
> one cared about the successes, it wasn’t new and shiny.
>  
>  
> From: That One Guy /sarcasm
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 8:53 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Space X
>  
> I still think NASA should have been revamped. Private entities should foot 
> the bill for all failures, paid only upon success.
>  
> On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 7:06 PM, Lewis Bergman  
> wrote:
> Agreed, I am still amazed they can hit the damn ship without crashing it into 
> it.
> 
> 
> On Mon, Jan 18, 2016, 10:34 AM Josh Reynolds  wrote:
> The speed at which they are progressing is astounding. They are doing
> some truly amazing things.
> 
> On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 10:32 AM, Jason McKemie
>  wrote:
> > Yeah, I was watching that live. They lost satellite uplink to the ship right
> > before they landed it unfortunately. Disappointing to see they had more
> > problems. The seas were apparently pretty rough and they mentioned that ice
> > on the pad could have been a factor. Still, a pretty amazing feat.
> >
> >
> > On Monday, January 18, 2016, Chuck McCown  wrote:
> >>
> >> He stuck the landing, but only to have a latch on a leg fail arrgh..
> >> Look at how close it is to the center of the target:
> >>
> >> http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/01/18/elon_musk_spacex_rocket_explodes_during_attempted_sea_landing.html
> 
> 
>  
> -- 
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450i

[Joe Falaschi]

+1 on the dynamic filtering.  We have yet to really realize how helpful it is 
or not but from what we're told it should help tremendously on the upload if 
the AP is in a high noise environment.

Joe


On Oct 6, 2015, at 1:48 PM, Daniel White wrote:

> Exactly.
>  
> At some point I’m sure the 450i will be required to take advantage of 
> additional features… right now to me the major benefit is the dynamic 
> filtering and expanded frequency range.
>  
> Thank you,
>  
> Daniel White
> afmu...@gmail.com
> Cell: +1 (303) 746-3590
> Skype: danieldwhite
> Social: LinkedIn: Twitter
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Tuesday, October 6, 2015 2:12 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450i
>  
> Just going off what the webinar/demo customer said the 450i AP simply 
> improves things as a drop in replacement.  For newer AP it makes sense, for 
> replacing and APs he did it with great improvements - but it doesn't sound 
> like a good business case if the device is already generating revenue and 
> working.
> 
>  
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>  
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 1:52 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> Are people intending to deploy the 450i for the additional frequencies, or 
> other reasons?  What about the 450D, what itch does that scratch for you, or 
> do you just dislike reflector dishes?
>  
> Before stocking 2 more types of equipment, I’m looking for ideas what other 
> people are using these for.  Like that tool you see in a catalog and wonder 
> what it’s good for until you see someone else using it for something and go 
> wow, I’ve got to get me one of those.
>  
>  
> From: Josh Luthman
> Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:27 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450i
>  
> Some people have.  Not me personally.  Did you see the webinar?
>  
>  
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>  
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 1:25 PM, Matt  wrote:
> Anyone deployed any 450i AP's yet?
>  
>  
> 
> 
>   
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. 
> www.avast.com
> 

Re: [AFMUG] $117,000 to install cable internet

[Joe Falaschi]

We've been doing some pretty creative and some pretty expensive installations 
with Clear's service shutting down.  We have had a few people willing to spend 
5k to get installations done.  One has built a tower.  Another one is $900 to 
create a very unique PTP from a new microsite.  It's amazing what SOME people 
will do to get internet but I know that is not the norm - most just expect 50M 
for 19.95 and free install...

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On Oct 15, 2015, at 11:31 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

> Yes, Steve's comments were excellent.
> 
> To summarize the whole thing, a couple of us can almost get to him, but not 
> quite - and nobody wants to. It turned out he actually had called us earlier 
> this year.
> 
> On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 11:20 AM, Josh Luthman  
> wrote:
> Steve has some fantastic comments.
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Oct 15, 2015 9:17 AM, "Ty Featherling"  wrote:
> Oh well fine then. Be that way. :P
> 
> -Ty
> 
> 
> 
> -Ty
> 
> On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 11:16 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
> This guy was discussed at length in a previous thread.
> 
> 
> 
> On 10/15/2015 12:15 PM, Ty Featherling wrote:
> Anyone know if a WISP around Wisconsin that might be able to help this guy? I 
> feel for him, he took all the right steps before he bought/built. Then finds 
> out he's screwed.
> 
> 
> http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/09/man-builds-house-then-finds-out-cable-internet-will-cost-117000/?mbid=synd_moz_technews6
> 
> -Ty
> 
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] DC Power for Cisco Switch

[Joe Falaschi]

We just deployed one of these.  We plan to convert the whole site to DC but 
we're not there yet.  To get things rolling we just used a 48v power supply we 
had laying around.  I'm not 100% sure if it was an old Dragonwave ps or not.  
Bayan would have more details.

Joe


On Nov 12, 2015, at 12:47 PM, Keefe John wrote:

> What's the most cost effective way to power a single DC Cisco Switch like 
> this?
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/CISCO-ME3400G-12CS-D-Ethernet-Access-Switch-12-ports-/361407262406?hash=item54258d2ec6:g:08kAAOSwLqFV7xS0
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Keefe

Re: [AFMUG] level 1 telco training

[Joe Falaschi]

Elevate the front line of every position.  It's hard for us to have a level 1, 
2, 3 when we only have four people total doing installs.  All of them need to 
be at a certain minimum and we need to keep increasing that minimum level of 
knowledge.  Training is easier said than done though.  Also, I know that my 
system admin doesn't really like to teach, but he has to do it one way or 
another and he really isn't that bad at it.  Opinions aside, I think we're 
going to require our "tier 1" support guys to pass a Net+ cert at a minimum, 
and possibly get into Mikrotik certs and that as well.  The same goes for our 
field techs.  Previously everything we've done was internal training but we're 
busy too.  Within reason, as the company grows, what our system admin did 5 
years ago, our front line guys need to at least be familiar with now because 
the system admin is working on much more complex stuff these days.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On Mar 17, 2015, at 10:13 AM, That One Guy wrote:

> So the boss wants me to provide training to the mopes for "level 1" techs 
> dealing with telco stuff. Primarily for when replacing existing PBX systems 
> with VOIP systems and still using POTS
> 
> to me, "level 1" is a mope connecting a phone to a prewired jack. If the jack 
> isnt working and you expect a mope to be the definition of "level 1" then its 
> not a "level 1" issue at that point.
> 
> So I provided some wikipedia articles on POTS and Punchdowns
> 
> I feel kind of like a dick, but it seems to me using mopes is a recipe for 
> disaster I dont want to be a part of.
> 
> any better resources out there?
> 
> -- 
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] level 1 telco training

[Joe Falaschi]

That's a lot more difficult to fix and I've heard you talk about it before.  No 
easy answer and sometimes people are not the best fit and it's time for new 
staff members if they truly do not fit.  Every manager has complaints about 
their staff at times.  I had no formal management training but have read pretty 
much every Patrick Lencioni book out there and I think it was helpful in 
starting to turn things around.  Since, I've read a bunch of other books as 
well.  My neighbor is a Fire Fighter / EMT for a Chicago suburb and was taking 
his Lieutenant test earlier this month and said part of the required reading 
was the book, It's Your Ship.  I haven't read it, yet, but he said it was good 
stuff.  I guess you can only do so much, but people can turn around with the 
right encouragement, engagement, and leadership.  I don't know anything about 
your specific situation but those books helped me get more out of my staff 
anyway.  As Keefe just said, we are now using Top Grading as well since Nathan 
recommended it a few shows ago.  Also Traction is good stuff as well.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent



On Mar 17, 2015, at 10:27 AM, That One Guy wrote:

> sadly, it is what it is. Unmotivated techs and no accountability breeds 
> mopes. 
> I should probably alter my training style, starting the process with "Listen 
> here you stupid fucker.." seems to be un productive. Maybe if I wore a fedora 
> it would make the environment more conducive to learning?
> 
> On Tue, Mar 17, 2015 at 10:21 AM, Jaime Solorza  
> wrote:
> Pretty strong word ..mope...doesn't sound like you will be getting an apple 
> or teacher of the day award
> 
> Jaime Solorza
> 
> On Mar 17, 2015 9:13 AM, "That One Guy"  wrote:
> So the boss wants me to provide training to the mopes for "level 1" techs 
> dealing with telco stuff. Primarily for when replacing existing PBX systems 
> with VOIP systems and still using POTS
> 
> to me, "level 1" is a mope connecting a phone to a prewired jack. If the jack 
> isnt working and you expect a mope to be the definition of "level 1" then its 
> not a "level 1" issue at that point.
> 
> So I provided some wikipedia articles on POTS and Punchdowns
> 
> I feel kind of like a dick, but it seems to me using mopes is a recipe for 
> disaster I dont want to be a part of.
> 
> any better resources out there?
> 
> -- 
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] Cheapest J Arm Source

[Joe Falaschi]

We started out buying a pallet (100 units) from 
http://securalign.com/product/mounting-arms/


At the time it was around $6.50 per unit, but now it looks like it might 
be a little more.  We negotiated a similar deal with Skywalker but for a 
lower quantity.  We just pickup from their Wisconsin location and dealt 
with the guys in person though.


Joe



On 3/28/15 7:28 PM, Jason McKemie wrote:

I've used Skywalker previously, but this is a bit cheaper...

On Saturday, March 28, 2015, Mathew Howard > wrote:


These are the cheapest I've been able to find.

http://www.mowinet.com/shop/?main_page=product_info&products_id=30


On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 7:09 PM, John Woodfield
> wrote:

Thoughts? We used to  buy them from the local DirecTV
installer but he isn't working there anymore...

John Woodfield, President

Delmarva WiFi Inc.

410-870-WiFi

Re: [AFMUG] VoIP

[Joe Falaschi]

We are a wholesale customer of someone using the Netsapiens platform.  
It works well but we're not large enough to venture off on our own due 
to the startup costs of the platform.  Our provider said their mission 
is to drive enough volume to not make it worth our time to deploy our 
own hardware. So far that has proven true.  The Netsapiens platform has 
been pretty nice though.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On 4/6/15 8:17 PM, Keefe John wrote:

What are people using for their multi-tenant voip platform?

On 4/6/2015 6:12 PM, Bruce Robertson wrote:

I use voip.ms.  Love 'em.

On 04/06/2015 03:55 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
Why not get SIP trunk, origination, termination, and DIDs from 
voip.ms or similar?  We use VoIP Innovations but they have a $200/mo 
minimum.  It looks like voip.ms has no monthly minimum, there is a 
$25 deposit which you replenish when you use it up.
Assuming you have existing numbers you want to port, you also need 
backoffice support for the LNP process, and you need a relationship 
with a CLEC that can provide origination (incoming calls) for the 
NPA/NXX of that DID.  A VoIP wholesaler like VI or voip.ms has a 
bunch of CLECs they use for various DIDs.

*From:* James Howard <mailto:ja...@litewire.net>
*Sent:* Monday, April 06, 2015 5:31 PM
*To:* mailto:af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] VoIP

Will you sell SIP trunks to anyone?  What do you charge for them?

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Monday, April 6, 2015 5:11 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] VoIP

I don’t know about most, but we will.

*From:*Lewis Bergman <mailto:lewis.berg...@gmail.com>

*Sent:*Monday, April 06, 2015 3:56 PM

*To:*af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] VoIP

I had no idea that most phone companies would sell you a SIP trunk. 
nifty.


On Mon, Apr 6, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Chuck McCown <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:


You call up you local telephone company and ask for a sip trunk...

-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 12:30 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] VoIP



I expect there to be some cost, but these companies that want a
fortune for a small amount of minutes are ridiculous. I'm okay
with paying some amount for unlimited, but not a small amount
per minute.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

On Apr 6, 2015, at 1:26 PM, Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:

If you want to place calls to/from the PSTN and not pay a
dime, you're dreaming.

-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 1:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] VoIP

I've played a bit with asterisk in the past along with
similar products. I'm not really all that familiar with VoIP
solutions or configuration, but if like to be. I want to
start playing around with something to really familiarize
myself with it.

The problem is that all I've seen is solutions where I'd
have to pay for my SIP trunk or for some kind of service. Is
it possible to get a fully functional VoIP solution using
basic hardware for nothing? I can host my own SIP trunk I'm
sure, but how do I get my phones to route to other phones
and my number coming in to route to my phone system? Am I in
a dream world, or is this actually possible?

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield



*Total Control Panel*



Login <https://asp.reflexion.net/login?domain=litewire.net>

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Re: [AFMUG] VoIP

[Joe Falaschi]

Yea I told the ipifony guys that we cannot charge what their payback 
model said to for business lines - something like $35 per handset.  We 
just couldn't pay back their system with the rates we have to charge.  
We still charge per handset, but more around $18 each with all 
features.  We definitely think it's worth doing VoIP though.  It makes 
selling business Internet much easier for us to be able to offer a 
package.  Even as you say 10 extensions at $18 per, $180 plus the 
Internet.  Maybe it's more than Comcast when you add the Internet but 
it's much more in the ballpark than if the handsets were double.  We're 
just starting to keep better track of stuff like this but we're at about 
50% of business accounts wanting bundled voice and the competition's 
quote has it so ours has to as well.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On 4/6/15 10:31 PM, George Skorup (Cyber Broadcasting) wrote:
The per extension model doesn't work anymore, as far as business 
customers. Say they have 10 phones/extensions at $35/mo each. Comcast 
or AT&T can come in and blow that away with $200/mo business service. 
Been there, done that, cannot do that anymore.


Don't think you can just jump into doing voice. IMO, it's not worth it 
at all. Too many headaches. For your own business, sure, have at it.


On 4/6/2015 9:33 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
You’ve got to charge for something.  It has become standard practice 
not to charge for minutes, even though you get charged for minutes.  
So some combination of $X per DID and $Y per extension.  Especially 
when you are talking to businesses, they are used to paying per 
“line”, where if they want to be able to have Z simultaneous incoming 
or outgoing calls, they need Z lines, usually each with its own DID 
but configured as a rollover or hunt group to the main number.  But 
with VoIP you can have as many calls as you want with just one 
“line”, so you need a different model.  Also, features like voicemail 
and call waiting and caller ID that used to bring in tons of money 
for the phone companies are now expected free as part of standard 
service.  So you need to charge for something. Otherwise you end up 
supporting 20 or 100 handsets with unlimited local and long distance 
for a total of $20 per month and you go broke.  I think the idea is 
that an extension is a placeholder for a bucket of minutes, if a 
business or MDU has 100 extensions, they will likely make 100 times 
as many calls as someone with one extension.  On the other hand, a 
business with 1 DID and 100 extensions probably shouldn’t pay as much 
as 100 individual customers each with an extensions and a DID, 
especially since you will probably pay some small amount per month 
per DID for origination.

Re: [AFMUG] Odd looking tower

[Joe Falaschi]

Is it sitting in a culvert?  That doesn't seem ideal.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On May 13, 2015, at 2:11 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

> There's a little national weather service tower near my old office that's 
> about that sizesome of the instruments look the same too.  
> but the weather service one doesn't have cameras.
> 
>> Genoa, IL.  I saw this along the road about a mile from one of our towers.
>> Anyone know what it's for?
>> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] vivint

[Joe Falaschi]

I heard they were using this in 28GHz for BH to their micro sites:

http://cbnl.com/vectastar-gigabit-highlights


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent



On May 21, 2015, at 1:29 PM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:

> I think they are sometimes 5Ghz and sometimes something else on the houses.
> The backhauls appear to be the unlicensed SAF 20+GHZ stuff to nearby drops.
>  
> Most of those in Saratoga Springs are connected to CentraCom Fiber at the 
> schools etc.
>  
> And they are doing 50Mbps for $50 or $60 depending on who you talk to.
>  
> So maybe they outperform DirectCom now, but when you guys get more fiber and 
> for a better price they will switch.
>  
> We took over quite a few in some neighborhoods already.
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
> Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 12:20 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] vivint
>  
> Anyone know if the APs are 5.8 GHz?  I saw one going in today.  Fed with a 
> backhaul with a 2 foot dish.  Couldn’t get close enough to see if it was 
> licensed or not.  The AP antennas look like little whips.  At roof top.  In a 
> very heavy tree’d neighborhood.  With trees taller than the houses.  With a 
> bunch of other WISPs in the area...  And I just rolled fiber down that street.
>  
> Wonder who will win in the end?

Re: [AFMUG] ePMP beam forming antenna

[Joe Falaschi]

We have maybe about 8 EPMP 2000 radios deployed.  I think only three have the 
beam steer antenna on them.  All new deployments that would have been 1000 are 
now 2000 because of the filtering and the ability to bolt on the beam steer 
antenna if needed later.  Between elevation and azimuth, I think the system can 
choose from 1 out of 256 ways to form a beam at each time slot.  I could have 
that wrong but I remember it being a larger number than I was expecting.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


> On Aug 8, 2016, at 2:58 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> Worst case you deploy the ePMP 2000 radio on the new sector and then you add 
> the receive beamforming antenna when you're ready to take a drink. The better 
> antenna and radio is ~$100 more than the existing setup.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> 
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> 
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> 
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> 
> 
>  <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> From: "That One Guy /sarcasm"  <mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 2:44:34 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP beam forming antenna
> 
> has anyone actually deployed these? we ended up opting to not go with them 
> for this round of EPMP deployments because it sounds too much like unicorns 
> farting butterflies
> 
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 11:28 AM, Josh Luthman  <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote:
> The 90*?  It's been posted a bunch of times.  There's really no other 
> possibility for that product anyway - 120 can't (won't?) do frequency reuse.
> 
> I'm not 100% on the number of beams.
> 
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 
> Direct: 937-552-2343 
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 12:25 PM, Adam Moffett  <mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> That's the same spec sheet I was just looking at.  No gain or beamwidth on 
> there.  Did you hear your info verbally perhaps?
>  
>  
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Luthman"  <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>>
> To: "af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
> Sent: 8/8/2016 12:23:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP beam forming antenna
>  
> 90* overall and I think 7x 13* individual? 
> 
> Dimensions are here 
> http://www.doubleradius.com/site/stores/cambium/Cambium-ePMP-2000-Smart-Antenna-datasheet.pdf
>  
> <http://www.doubleradius.com/site/stores/cambium/Cambium-ePMP-2000-Smart-Antenna-datasheet.pdf>
> 
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 
> Direct: 937-552-2343 
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 12:19 PM, Adam Moffett  <mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> I was noticing the spec sheet for the new ePMP 2000 beam forming antenna does 
> not mention gain, nor does it mention beamwidth.  What's the deal with that?
>  
> Wind load is also not on the spec sheet, nor the polar plot of radiation 
> pattern, but nominal gain and beamwidth would be a good place to start.
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] ePMP beam forming antenna

[Joe Falaschi]

Oh yea, we were having GPS issues as well the 1000 that the 2000 fixed, thanks 
for reminding me George.

Mike, we have the BSA deployed in Lake In The Hills and Carpentersville 
Illinois.  I’ll send you a private email tomorrow when I have more time.  But, 
in short I’d say deploy them if you need to get higher modulations on your 
uplink.  We were having difficulty doing 5Mbps uplinks before 2000.

Joe


> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:13 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> Joe's network is the case study Cambium has put out.
> 
> Do you have ones without the receive antenna in the more suburban parts of 
> your network? Okay without or does it need it? I'm looking to add some 
> sectors to that Oswego tower that we shared and contemplating the base setup 
> or going all out. If you don't remember, the interference at that site is -70 
> to -75.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> 
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> 
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> 
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> 
> 
>  <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> From: "Joe Falaschi" mailto:listm...@wi.net>>
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 5:49:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP beam forming antenna
> 
> We have maybe about 8 EPMP 2000 radios deployed.  I think only three have the 
> beam steer antenna on them.  All new deployments that would have been 1000 
> are now 2000 because of the filtering and the ability to bolt on the beam 
> steer antenna if needed later.  Between elevation and azimuth, I think the 
> system can choose from 1 out of 256 ways to form a beam at each time slot.  I 
> could have that wrong but I remember it being a larger number than I was 
> expecting.
> 
> Joe Falaschi
> e-vergent
> 
> 
> On Aug 8, 2016, at 2:58 PM, Mike Hammett  <mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
> 
> Worst case you deploy the ePMP 2000 radio on the new sector and then you add 
> the receive beamforming antenna when you're ready to take a drink. The better 
> antenna and radio is ~$100 more than the existing setup.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> 
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> 
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> 
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> 
> 
>  <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> From: "That One Guy /sarcasm"  <mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 2:44:34 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP beam forming antenna
> 
> has anyone actually deployed these? we ended up opting to not go with them 
> for this round of EPMP deployments because it sounds too much like unicorns 
> farting butterflies
> 
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 11:28 AM, Josh Luthman  <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote:
> The 90*?  It's been posted a bunch of times.  There's really no other 
> possibility for that product anyway - 120 can't (won't?) do frequency reuse.
> 
> I'm not 100% on the number of beams.
> 
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 
> Direct: 937-552-2343 
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 12:25 PM, Adam Moffett  <mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> That's the same spec sheet I was just looking at.  No gain or beamwidth on 
> there.  Did you hear your info verbally perhaps?
>  
>  
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Luthman"  <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>>
> To: "af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
> Sent: 8/8/2016 12:23:18 PM
> Subjec

[AFMUG] Trango Licensed Link port cover

[Joe Falaschi]

Does anyone have one of these port covers I can buy?  Supposedly Trango doesn’t 
have these or make them anymore and of course we lost one.  This is the square 
edge version not the curved one.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

Re: [AFMUG] Trango Licensed Link port cover

[Joe Falaschi]

We’re actually trying to sell the radio.  This came to us via acquisition and 
we have no other Trango in the network.  If it was staying with us, it probably 
never would have made it to me and the guys would have just made one out of 
butyl and called it a day…  I’ll ask the local fab shop and see what they would 
charge to clone one if I can’t find one from someone else.

Joe


> On Sep 30, 2016, at 1:24 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
> 
> A good idea.  It doesn't have to be the same shape as long as it screws on 
> and has the 1" female conduit thread.  Might cost a few hundred bucks between 
> design and building.
>  
>  
> -- Original Message --
> From: "That One Guy /sarcasm"  <mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
> To: "af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
> Sent: 9/30/2016 1:44:35 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Trango Licensed Link port cover
>  
>> if you have another one, take it to a local machine shop, they will get you 
>> something made
>> 
>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 12:41 PM, Bill Prince > <mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> Eye Yi Yi.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> bp
>> 
>> 
>> On 9/30/2016 10:37 AM, Joe Falaschi wrote:
>>> Does anyone have one of these port covers I can buy?  Supposedly Trango 
>>> doesn’t have these or make them anymore and of course we lost one.  This is 
>>> the square edge version not the curved one.
>>> 
>>> Joe Falaschi
>>> e-vergent
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
>> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] Trango Licensed Link port cover

[Joe Falaschi]

I’m really not familiar with all of the iterations and such.  Erich hooked me 
up.  Thanks guys!

Joe



> On Sep 30, 2016, at 4:35 PM, George Skorup  wrote:
> 
> Straight edge on the new style OMU would probably work since the silicone 
> gasket should allow it to seal. But not the other way around. Rounded cover 
> on a straight edge OMU interface just won't fit.
> 
> On 9/30/2016 4:25 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> The new style doesn’t work?  I thought it was just roomier to accommodate 
>> SFP and fiber better, you  can’t put the new cover on an old radio?
>>   <>
>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
>> Behalf Of George Skorup
>> Sent: Friday, September 30, 2016 4:10 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Trango Licensed Link port cover
>>  
>> I ordered 5 of them a couple months ago. Sorry, they're all used now. Guess 
>> it was a good thing we got them when we did.
>> 
>> I know that style isn't produced anymore. You could beg them to find one 
>> floating around the lab or something. Or maybe Erich Kaiser has one. If not, 
>> then I don't have a clue who else might.
>> 
>> On 9/30/2016 12:37 PM, Joe Falaschi wrote:
>> Does anyone have one of these port covers I can buy?  Supposedly Trango 
>> doesn’t have these or make them anymore and of course we lost one.  This is 
>> the square edge version not the curved one.
>>  
>> Joe Falaschi
>> e-vergent
>>  
>>  
>> 
>>  
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Suggestions for work vans

[Joe Falaschi]

We like the dual sliding doors.  We install shelving on the driver side door 
entry way for easy access to tools.  The Transit connects are decent.  The full 
size transits are too large for us - mileage is too big of a hit.  I’m sure 
they will last longer but by the time they are 5 or 6 years old the wrap is 
tired and it’s worth nothing, new stuff is out, might as well just plan on a 4 
year replacement cycle and have something that always works.  We’ve had some 
issues with the older transit connects as they get into the 100k mileage range. 
 Our new vans are Promaster Cities.  They get better mileage than our Transit 
Connects and are hopefully a little tougher.  There are some great incentives 
on the Ram Promaster City vans right now.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent



> On Oct 4, 2016, at 11:32 AM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> I am also looking at Ford Transit, medium roof 130” wheelbase 3.5L Ecoboost.  
> Trying to decide if the dual sliding doors option is brilliant or stupid.
>  
> A dealer near me bought up a bunch of 2016 Transits with hail damage, I 
> decided to pass on that.  I think that means a salvage title.
>  
>   <>
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
> Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Tuesday, October 4, 2016 11:10 AM
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Subject: [AFMUG] Suggestions for work vans
>  
> I already have a Tacoma which is great, but I'm looking for a second vehicle 
> for a second driver.  I'd like to try a work van to keep everything inside.  
> Maybe even warm parts for the winter.
>  
> I'm looking at the Ford Transit and would love to hear of any additional 
> suggestions/experiences.
>  
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 vs. ePMP

[Joe Falaschi]

We also do not have much 2.4GHz and attempt to install very few non line of 
sight links.  In cases where we have done a few non ideal installs, we have not 
done it with 2.4GHz but 3.65GHz.

That said, for your dense urban area, you will be very happy with the new EPMP 
2k.  We have not done a direct comparison between EPMP 1k, 2k and PMP450 
though.  The 450i has intelligent filtering, as does the EPMP2k.  I think the 
EPMP has a slight leg up at this moment in time due to the beam steering.  
PMP450m will probably tip the scales again.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent



> On Jun 3, 2016, at 9:17 AM, David  wrote:
> 
> We have removed ANY 2.4 on our network and let it be the indoor useful IOT 
> access for all.
> Urban areas is just to high for 2.4 in general. 
> 3.65 pmp450 has brought us mucho success in this area and the newest 900 450i 
> rocks. I just need those KP higher gain cpe Ant to get a little deeper 
> distance from the tower.
> 
> We  have a few customers on new 900 running 17-20 Mbs through the thickest 
> crap around 3 mile out some less than this but with a little more cpe gain we 
> will get this.
> 
> With the dense urban area we have there is no way I could use epmp at my 
> dense tower locations or ubnt for that matter. I do however have about 15 
> subs on a single epmp AP in an area that does fine with 10Mbx10Mb service 
> rate.
> The coolest thing about that site is that it has 2 epmp panels back to back 
> on same channel using the gps sync working great.
> 
> 
> 
> On 06/02/2016 05:05 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>> I can only warn you that you'll have a very angry set of customers.
>> 
>> 
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>> On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 6:03 PM, Mathew Howard > <mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> I've been meaning to do a direct comparison between the two, by swapping one 
>> of our UBNT 2.4ghz APs to an ePMP and keeping the exact same antennas and 
>> everything else... I just need to figure out where I can do it that's going 
>> to give me some useful information and not make too many customers angry.
>> 
>> On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 4:49 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller > <mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>> wrote:
>>  
>> I do not believe we have had both on the same tower.  We had diverted to 
>> doing epmp 2.4 not long after it came out   as we 
>> had lots of problems with ESD on ubnt 2.4 rockets.  Changed some things and 
>> they are surviving storms much better.
>>  
>> Tests near EPMP vs. tests on other towers (3 miles away? - totally same 
>> environment) just revealed in dramatically different results. Not as much 
>> speed, maybe, but at least we're getting a usable signal up to a mile or two 
>> away.  With epmp we're lucky to get a mile way.
>>  
>> Understand we are in THICK tree country.  900 is still our primary product
>>  
>> - Original Message -
>> From: Mathew Howard <mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>
>> To: af <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2016 4:31 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 vs. ePMP
>> 
>> But does it actually perform worse that UBNT 2.4ghz on the same link, or is 
>> it maybe just differences in how they calculate signal levels? It doesn't 
>> make any sense that two different radios running on the same frequency 
>> putting the same amount of power into the same antennas would give 
>> significantly different signal levels...
>> 
>> The closest thing I've done to a comparison was playing with a Force 200 
>> 2.4ghz in wifi mode... there didn't seem to be a significant difference 
>> between it and a PowerBeam connecting to the same AP.
>> 
>> On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Josh Luthman > <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote:
>> And I've tried IT Elite dual pol panels, Force 200 2.4, integrated + 
>> reflector for CPEs.  Continues to suck.
>> 
>> 
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>> On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 5:08 PM, Ken Hohhof > <mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
>> I’m thinking more the CPE antennas.
>>  
>> From: CBB - Jay Fuller <mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>
>> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2016 3:59 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 vs. ePMP
>>  
>>  
>> hmm, i will check into that. Pretty sure with ubnt we&#

Re: [AFMUG] hello cambium

[Joe Falaschi]

I wouldn't call 35Mbps, just a little more upload speed, when we're 
looking at a scale of 5M or 40M. Don't get me wrong, I wish the product 
was an AC MU-MIMO product but I have to believe we are on a path to 
getting there and at least we can take advantage of their intermediate 
milestones along the way to solve real issues we're having vs having the 
developments sit in a lab until the dream system is ready.  I have no 
knowledge of said dream system, just hoping.


From a marketing perspective, I'm not sure why they didn't run this 
test on a 40MHz channel because the numbers would have looked more 
impressive.  I don't know about you but we don't run many 40MHz links 
though.  If the uplink is slammed and can't send tcp acks back, then it 
will affect downlink performance.  Plus this will help us deliver 
symmetrical service to businesses without having to install 2' dishes on 
the tower to each business which will allow us to save on tower rent.


Is this everything to everyone, obviously not.  Right now it's still 
tough to compete with residential cable.  All said it's an exciting time 
to be in the WISP industry because so much is happening from all of the 
vendors even if it's not at the pace we'd all wish for.  In full 
disclosure, we were a beta tester of E2k and are very happy with it's 
performance so far.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On 6/7/16 10:51 AM, Keefe John wrote:


That doesn't seem like that great of an improvement.� Just a little 
more upload speed?



On 6/7/2016 10:32 AM, CBB - Jay Fuller wrote:

�
I see this a lot on my stream
�
�
�
welcome beam forming?�� I'll watch the whole thing later tonight
�
�

Re: [AFMUG] Short fiber trench

[Joe Falaschi]

We’ve used Toro Dingos with the vibratory plow for small projects like this.  
It was pretty easy and inexpensive to rent.

Joe



> On Jul 22, 2016, at 8:02 PM, Jason McKemie  
> wrote:
> 
> Just trench it yourself if none of the property owners have an issue with it. 
>  Do yourself a favor and get a trencher with a back-fill blade though.
> 
> On Fri, Jul 22, 2016 at 6:36 PM, Aaron Fitzgerald  > wrote:
> Hey guys --
> 
> I'd been talking with a local data center and fiber contractor in town about 
> running dark fiber from the data center to a cell tower that is about 600ft 
> from the exterior pull boxes. Both the fiber carrier I have been talking to 
> and the data center have their own pull box. The fiber company wants around 
> $100k in total for NRC + 5 yr MRC. Seems way too expensive.
> 
> The data center owner asked a fairly obvious question: the run is short, why 
> not do it yourself? To be honest it's not something Id' ever considered. The 
> data center is willing to let me pay for a cross to the carrier hotel, pull 
> fiber to his outside pullbox and connect to the outside world from there. The 
> land owner where the cell tower sits would be game as well -- I'd be paying 
> him rent for usage of the tower afterall.
> 
> How would one even get started with this? Ease and pros/cons of boring vs 
> trenching? I don't imagine I would need to worry about any protection from 
> conduit on a run this short 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> /Fiber newb
> 
> -- 
> 
> 
> Aaron Fitzgerald - CEO/CIO
> wiFitz Network Services
> Serving NE Iowa's Creative Corridor
> Phone: 319/540-8999 
> Web: http://www.wifitz.net 
> 
> wiFitz is a service of Fitzgerald Embedded, LLC
> 

Re: [AFMUG] ePMP and/or 50kw FM stations

[Joe Falaschi]

We have 450 APs at 410 feet with a 50k station just above it, something 
like 440 to 500 feet or something.  We see some minor CRC errors on the 
450 and more so on the FSK and that is with fiber up the tower.  We 
tried an EPMP at the same elevation and we couldn't connect an SM to the 
AP much less even get into the AP's management page.  This seems like it 
was over a year ago.  We didn't do a whole lot of investigation. We like 
EPMP a lot but it didn't work for us on a high power FM site when the 
two units were close.


That said we have an EPMP on the same tower at 120 feet that we are 
using as a BH to another site and it is working great.  So, your 
situation may work out ok.


FYI, we have the radio station turn the transmit power down each time we 
climb.  They don't like to do that during the morning and evening drive 
time.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On 7/22/15 6:15 PM, George Skorup wrote:
I have a connectorized ePMP on a 2' dish at 125 feet on a 50kW FM 
site. The bays start at 420 feet though. And it's 50kW EIRP. Something 
like 15-16kW actually on the transmission line. There's also a low 
power station at 250 feet, but it's under 3kW I think. The 450 AP at 
225 feet sees some CRC errors sometimes. The ePMP radio doesn't have 
any problems though. The guys didn't listen to me and ran our cat5 
bundle right next to the high power transmission line. "But there were 
waveguide brackets there, it was so easy!" I smash your face now.


On 7/22/2015 4:00 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
Has anyone had good luck on FM stations recently? I would *LOVE* for 
the radios to have an SFP, but it seems that's just not available.  
I'm wonder if fiber up ~250' and then 10-20 foot shielded cat5 would 
be sufficient to protect the ethernet ports from such high power.


I'm also weary about getting on the tower for having such high power 
250 feet away, but that's a secondary issue.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] Canopy 13.4 Watchdog Reset

[Joe Falaschi]

All of our 450 APs running 13.2 are rebooting themselves with watchdog 
exceptions.  We do not have a 450 AP with uptime of more than 22 days.  
We haven't opened a support ticket with Cambium.  I guess if we all 
don't do that it won't get fixed.  Are they saying if the APs are not 
synced they won't reboot?  We are using CMM Micros.  Agreed that isn't 
helpful just curious.


We tried upgrading to 13.4 but had trouble with the upgrade.  We ended 
up stranding a few SMs and needing to roll a truck to a handful of 
customers.  We're back to 13.2 now.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On 8/28/15 9:54 PM, Mark Radabaugh wrote:

We have been seeing this across 200+ AP's

It's getting truly annoying.   Cambium tech support has helpful suggestions 
like'just put them in free run'.   Um Thanks for the help, but no.

Mark Radabaugh
Amplex
27800 Lemoyne, Ste F
Millbury, OH 43447
419-261-5996


On Aug 28, 2015, at 4:56 PM, Brian Sullivan  wrote:

Last week we rolled out 13.4 to 450 AP's after testing in-house for a while.  
While running 13.2 we would see an AP here or there reboot on occasion by 
itself.  The only message in the Event Log mentions Watchdog Reset.  This is 
one of the bugs that Cambium noted was fixed in the 13.4 release notes.

Since we upgraded the network to 13.4 we are now seeing at least 4 AP's out 
there rebooting several times per day.  On one of these AP's we are also seeing 
SM's (all 17 registered) reboot along with the AP.  The site has UPS backup so 
I know it's not a power grid problem.  I am planning to roll the affected AP's 
back to 13.2 this evening.

Anyone else having Watchdog issues with the 13.4 release?

**System Startup**
System Reset Exception -- Watchdog Reset
Software Version : CANOPY 13.4 AP-DES
Board Type : P12
Device Setting : 5.7GHz MIMO OFDM - Access Point - 0a-00-3e-a0-08-e5 - 5760.0 
MHz - 20.0 MHz - 1/16 - CC 85 - 2.5 ms
FPGA Version : 040715
FPGA Features : DES, Sched, US/ETSI;
08/28/2015 : 14:11:42 CST : :Time Set
08/28/2015 : 14:11:58 CST : Acquired sync pulse from Power Port.

Re: [AFMUG] Ridiculous SLA request

[Joe Falaschi]

They probably are sick of their current service performing badly, have 
no real faith in us WISPs if the phone company can't do it, and realize 
that most SLAs end up meaning very little unfortunately.  Some of their 
points might be a little extreme and like someone else said don't agree 
to something you can't back up.  That said it's kind of treat others how 
you want to be treated.  Maybe some items can be negotiated like the 
no/late payment terms and if the service fails x number of times in a 
one year period they can cancel vs one 4 hour nightmare.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent


On 8/28/15 5:55 PM, TJ Trout wrote:
I wish more of the world would do business Chuck's way. The world 
might be a better place.


I was reading the netonix forum the other day and read about a guy who 
had a bad fan on his switch, and the customer just wanted a new fan so 
he didn't have to remove the switch from service, the companies reply? 
We'll sell you one. ($2-5 fan on a $500+ product that just came out a 
few months prior so it couldn't have been out of warranty!).. Made me 
appreciate Chuck just a little bit more


On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 3:24 PM, <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:


I never turned one of these down.  It is the drug dealer model. 
Once they are hooked, they are hooked.  They need you so bad they

will behave when the times comes, if it comes.  Treat them right,
be courteous when they do have problems, apologize profusely and
keep them informed as to the nature of the problem and they are
generally pretty reasonable.  I never had an onerous SLA ever
actually call upon the terms, they just wanted things fixed.  Of
course I always prorated the outage plus a bit extra.
*From:* Mike Hammett <mailto:af...@ics-il.net>
*Sent:* Friday, August 28, 2015 4:14 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Ridiculous SLA request
Oh, I missed the non-payment stuff. Yeah, efff off.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


*From: *"That One Guy /sarcasm" mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
*To: *af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent: *Friday, August 28, 2015 3:05:52 PM
*Subject: *[AFMUG] Ridiculous SLA request

(hypotheticals in case on top of the following in case we had to
sign an NDA before giving them service)
so if we were  looking at doing a connection in an area to a
customer who currently is suffering DSL woes. And say we put up an
AP for them so we could confirm the ability to connect them, its
on the far end of our network, traversing some small backhauls
because of the few customers, and say we would have to upgrade a
minimum of two backhauls to deliver a WISP reliable service/
And if we quoted them something like 350 a month for the
connection, just recouping the buildout on this would take some
time as it wasnt really an area of the network we forecast any
growth on.
Remember we are a sub 1k subscriber network, with in the scheme of
ISP offerings cover a small footprint.
So they were to come back with a change to the contract (note this
was not an SLA, its a DIA, which to us is the same as an SLA to
some degree, without the strict requirements or guarantees)
First, maintaining the 350 dollar a month cost
Change the Terms to SLA
Syncronous connectivity (whatever this means in their heads),
apparently we might need to run fiber to every end point on the
planet to ensure this)
99.5% uptime and full capacity bandwidth guarantee
24/7/365 tech support
one hour maximumum call back time
4 hour on site guarantee 24/7/365
4 hour resolution guarantee or they can terminate the contract on
the spot
remove invoice payment terms, no disconnection for non payment
If our access site goes down we are required to seek a replacement
site(not sure what the expectation here is)
-- 
If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see

your team as part of yourself you have already failed as part of
the team.

Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People

[Joe Falaschi]

Others have already given you some good points.  Getting partners in any 
definition of the term, IT consultants, building managers, PBX installers, etc 
is probably a good intermediate step.

If you get to the point where you need an employee to be on the payroll, I 
think you’re going to need to go the route of base pay plus commission.  That 
is what we do anyway.  Commissions do not start until you sell $1500/month and 
after that it is a one time payment of 1x the MRR and as the sales go higher in 
the month the multiplier goes higher.  There are no residuals because we need 
the person to keep making sales.

We are near enough Chicago that the range in pay is huge.  You can find people 
selling business services with base pay over 100k.  I think your current job 
description is tough.  I mean you’re asking a lot from someone without much 
initial compensation.  To some extent you’re almost in startup mode as far as 
the sales person is concerned.  Since you do not have a system to drop them 
into with a proven success of sales, they have a safer personal financial 
future if they work at a fast food restaurant.  Risk / reward, right - but they 
need to have confidence this could work for them.  The base pay is what does 
that in my opinion.  Everyone we have brought in has taken some time to ramp up 
- months.  It’s a long term approach.

I haven’t done this yet but sometimes I talk to someone at the cell phone store 
or the fast food drive through at 6AM that is just so darn energetic and happy. 
 I wonder if I should give them a business card and tell them to call me about 
a job.

If you can’t swing a direct hire, that’s fine.  I think then you need to go the 
route of attempting to make connections with people who have a network of 
people who can do the selling for you.  Or, you do marketing to get the calls 
coming it for you to answer.  We’ve had better success converting sales via 
advertising to residential customers than business customers though.

Joe



> On Oct 28, 2016, at 10:42 AM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> You might just have to accept that an ant can't move a rubber tree plant.
> 
> Before getting into wireless, my ISP sold T1 and ISDN to small businesses 
> primarily in office parks.  Like you, I came up via the technical side, and 
> am not a born salesman.  I tried direct sales, and had no success until I 
> started working with the management companies at the office parks.  Most of 
> my business came from new tenants.  There is usually an information packet 
> for new tenants with a list of approved contractors and local providers.  
> They usually want to minimize who is working in their wiring closets and 
> there might be some hoops to jump through to get on the list of approved 
> contractors.  At one office complex, I had master keys to the mechanical 
> rooms which even the AT&T techs didn't have.  One building (one of those with 
> single person offices and a shared receptionist and conference room), the 
> deal involved me wiring each new office they rented with Cat5 drops for free, 
> I think they were taking advantage of me to their building wired for free.
> 
> You want to be on that approved contractor list or have your brochure 
> included in the new tenant packet.  They also sometimes have monthly 
> newsletters for tenants and are willing to include a one-pager or trifold 
> brochure for you.  Figure out what it takes to be the preferred provider for 
> the management company.  (Hint: it usually includes giving them free 
> Internet.)  They will sell for you.  As long as you don't screw up.  Also, 
> some may want a piece of the action, not in my experience though.  I was in 
> buildings with a lot of churn and the property manager wanted to lease space, 
> and was interested in anything that helped them do that.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 10:24 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> One man show.  :-)
> 
> -Mike HammettIntelligent Computing SolutionsMidwest Internet ExchangeThe 
> Brothers WISP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: That One Guy /sarcasm 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 09:55:26 -0500 (CDT)
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> you also might look a little closer to home, do you have an exceptional tech 
> who is aware of the operation, and driven? you might already have what youre 
> looking for in house, you might lose a solid tech, but customers love sales 
> folks who actually know what theyre talking about
> 
> On Fri, Oct 28, 2016 at 9:50 AM, That One Guy /sarcasm < 
> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> our partner company got one of the sales guys from on of the vendors 
>> to come over to him, if you can snatch up a vendor rep (a good rep) 
>> youll be golden
>> 
>> On Fri, Oct 28, 2016 at 6:45 AM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>> 
>>> What's the best way to get a B

Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People

[Joe Falaschi]

Two other things:

You/someone should figure out your buyer personas.  For us we sell very little 
Internet Service to retail organizations - especially directly.  They all seem 
to have corporate policies and decisions.  The vast majority of our retail 
sales come in via the CCRs of the world.

We stopped going to the Chamber of Commerce events.  We left at least three of 
them in the area.  It just seemed like everyone attending events was either 
another sales person or not fitting into our buyer personas.  We looked at who 
our best customers were and who was attending the events and the positions and 
companies were not matching up.  Generally the CFOs and IT directors are not 
going to the Chamber events.  A lot of small service businesses who wanted 
basic best effort internet service were attending.  If you have the time and 
want to be a part of that community - it might pay off in the end but it wasn’t 
for us.

Joe


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 9:27 AM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> Either approach. Sometimes the management company wants to be involved, 
> sometimes they don't. Sometimes the anchor stores are owned separately from 
> the rest.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>   
>  
>  
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>   
>  
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> From: "CBB - Jay Fuller"  >
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 8:06:09 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> 
>  
> I'd love to wire up whole strip malls to and have had this conversation with 
> a potential sales guy - but how do you get access? is there one management 
> company or one land owner you have to get through?  Once you wire the place 
> do you own your own infrastructure? ( no  ) ,  can you get a term-deal?  I'm 
> not sure, can you?
>  
> - Original Message - 
> From: Mike Hammett 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 7:58 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> I'm not in a position to offer a base pay that would do anything other than 
> offend. If they want to hook up everyone in a strip mall, paying $100 each, 
> I'm fine with that. Each deal is $100, but there's seven separate deals, 
> that's real money whereas if I discourage them from lower deals, they 
> wouldn't have chased that. If they want to work all day for a $30/month 
> account, that $3/month residual is all theirs. I'm not out much. Tying the 
> compensation to the value of the sale should incentivize most toward the 
> higher dollar accounts.
> 
> I figured the long term residual would be self-fulfilling. If I'm getting 
> paid forever from the customer, paying the sales guy forever really isn't an 
> issue. Once the ROI is done, I'm in an even better position. If the customer 
> stops paying me because the sales guys wasn't taking care of them properly, 
> I'm no longer paying the sales guy for that account. If he stops working 
> because he's collecting $10k/month for doing nothing, fine. I get a new sales 
> guy. If someone truly wants to do nothing, they'll do everything in their 
> power to do it.
> 
> 
> Then again, I'm not getting any bites, so maybe I have the wrong approach.
> 
> 
> 
> I have done regular LinkedIn posts and even shared those posts to the greater 
> Chicago area B2B and sales groups, but not a job position ad. I have a hard 
> time swallowing paying $400 without the guarantee of getting someone good (or 
> at all).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>   
>  
>  
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>   
>  
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> From: "Lewis Bergman"  >
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 7:45:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> First, I would focus on just business sales and raise the minimum package 
> value sold by thi

Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People

[Joe Falaschi]

Having a voice solution definitely helps - it is the reason we started offering 
voice.  It helps us close more of the sub $200/mo best effort accounts.  With 
the larger DIA circuits, the companies generally have an internal IT 
department, not managed service provider, and the voice solution is generally 
already taken care of in our experience.

Joe


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:57 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> Joe, would you agree that you must have a killer hosted PBX product in your 
> portfolio if you’re going to target businesses?
>  
> I find many small businesses want phone and Internet bundled, in fact saving 
> money on phone service or replacing an outdated phone system may actually be 
> what convinces them to switch from the LEC which is screwing them over with 
> business pricing for everything and crappy service.  Without a business phone 
> solution, in many cases I don’t think the Internet sale can be made.  Unless 
> you’re looking to be the backup connection.
>  
>   <>
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
> Behalf Of Joe Falaschi
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 12:38 PM
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
>  
> Two other things:
>  
> You/someone should figure out your buyer personas.  For us we sell very 
> little Internet Service to retail organizations - especially directly.  They 
> all seem to have corporate policies and decisions.  The vast majority of our 
> retail sales come in via the CCRs of the world.
>  
> We stopped going to the Chamber of Commerce events.  We left at least three 
> of them in the area.  It just seemed like everyone attending events was 
> either another sales person or not fitting into our buyer personas.  We 
> looked at who our best customers were and who was attending the events and 
> the positions and companies were not matching up.  Generally the CFOs and IT 
> directors are not going to the Chamber events.  A lot of small service 
> businesses who wanted basic best effort internet service were attending.  If 
> you have the time and want to be a part of that community - it might pay off 
> in the end but it wasn’t for us.
>  
> Joe
>  
>  
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 9:27 AM, Mike Hammett > <mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
>>  
>> Either approach. Sometimes the management company wants to be involved, 
>> sometimes they don't. Sometimes the anchor stores are owned separately from 
>> the rest.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>>  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> 
>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> 
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> 
>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>>  <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> 
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> 
>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>>  <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>> 
>> 
>>  <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
>> From: "CBB - Jay Fuller" > <mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>>
>> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 8:06:09 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> I'd love to wire up whole strip malls to and have had this conversation with 
>> a potential sales guy - but how do you get access? is there one management 
>> company or one land owner you have to get through?  Once you wire the place 
>> do you own your own infrastructure? ( no  ) ,  can you get a term-deal?  I'm 
>> not sure, can you?
>>  
>>> - Original Message - 
>>> From: Mike Hammett <mailto:af...@ics-il.net>
>>> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>>> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 7:58 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
>>>  
>>> I'm not in a position to offer a base pay that would do anything other than 
>>> offend. If they want to hook up everyone in a strip mall, paying $100 each, 
>>> I'm fine with that. Each deal is $100, but there's seven separate deals, 
>>> that's real money whereas if I discourage them from lower deals, they 
>>> wouldn't have chased that. If they want to work all day for a $30/month 
>>> account, that $3/month residual is all t

Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People

[Joe Falaschi]

The technical aspect of providing voice isn’t difficult.  The regulatory aspect 
of voice is no joke though.  I wouldn’t do it unless I thought I could do at 
least 30k/year in voice revenue, or related Internet service deals lost because 
I didn’t offer it.

Joe



> On Oct 28, 2016, at 1:09 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> It certainly makes sense. It isn't overly difficult to do, either.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> 
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> 
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> 
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> 
> 
>  <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> From: "Ken Hohhof" mailto:af...@kwisp.com>>
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 12:57:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> Joe, would you agree that you must have a killer hosted PBX product in your 
> portfolio if you’re going to target businesses?
>  
> I find many small businesses want phone and Internet bundled, in fact saving 
> money on phone service or replacing an outdated phone system may actually be 
> what convinces them to switch from the LEC which is screwing them over with 
> business pricing for everything and crappy service.  Without a business phone 
> solution, in many cases I don’t think the Internet sale can be made.  Unless 
> you’re looking to be the backup connection.
>  
>   <>
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
> Behalf Of Joe Falaschi
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 12:38 PM
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
>  
> Two other things:
>  
> You/someone should figure out your buyer personas.  For us we sell very 
> little Internet Service to retail organizations - especially directly.  They 
> all seem to have corporate policies and decisions.  The vast majority of our 
> retail sales come in via the CCRs of the world.
>  
> We stopped going to the Chamber of Commerce events.  We left at least three 
> of them in the area.  It just seemed like everyone attending events was 
> either another sales person or not fitting into our buyer personas.  We 
> looked at who our best customers were and who was attending the events and 
> the positions and companies were not matching up.  Generally the CFOs and IT 
> directors are not going to the Chamber events.  A lot of small service 
> businesses who wanted basic best effort internet service were attending.  If 
> you have the time and want to be a part of that community - it might pay off 
> in the end but it wasn’t for us.
>  
> Joe
>  
>  
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 9:27 AM, Mike Hammett  <mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
>  
> Either approach. Sometimes the management company wants to be involved, 
> sometimes they don't. Sometimes the anchor stores are owned separately from 
> the rest.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> 
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> 
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> 
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> 
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>  <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> 
> 
>  <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> From: "CBB - Jay Fuller"  <mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>>
> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 8:06:09 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Finding Sales People
> 
> 
>  
> I'd love to wire up whole strip malls to and have had this conversation with 
> a potential sales guy - but how do you get access? is there one management 
> company or one land owner you have to get through?  Once you wire the place 
> do you own your own infrastructure? ( no  ) ,  can you get a term-deal?  I'm

Re: [AFMUG] Poor throughput on ePMP AP

[Joe Falaschi]

That is what I took from this post: 
http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?t=63372

We had tons of issues at a site.  Nothing made sense, CPU usage was in the 
teens, but we just saw terrible performance and packet loss at peak.  
Eventually we found out that we received more complaints on different APs and 
found the above post.  We were only using the tik as a switch at the top of the 
tower to terminate the fiber up the tower and connect the APs.  We replaced 
with a Netonix and all of our issues at this site went away.  I had no idea.  A 
warning label would have saved us months of issues trying to track it down.

Joe


On Mar 11, 2016, at 2:23 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

> Well that's news to me!  Holy crap. They should put a warning sticker on that.
> 
> On 3/11/2016 2:20 PM, Joe Falaschi wrote:
>> The other thing to keep in mind with the RB2011 is what port things are 
>> plugged into.  Ports 6-10 only have a 100M aggregate link to ports 1-5.  If 
>> the aggregate of ports 6-10 require more than 100M, you'll have issues there 
>> too.
>> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Double Stacking Licensed Radios

[Joe Falaschi]

We have a few links like this.  We just equal cost OSPF the two 
radios/interfaces.

Joe



On Mar 31, 2016, at 12:32 PM, Nate Burke wrote:

> I know it's been covered before, but I can't seem to find it in the archive.  
> When you double stack licensed radios that don't have fancy tech built in to 
> do it for you.  Can you bond the Ethernet interfaces in your routers to 
> create one big pipe, or do you treat it as 2 separate equal cost paths, or is 
> there another way to do it?

Re: [AFMUG] EPMP Logging

[Joe Falaschi]

Hi Nate.  I don’t know the answer to your question, but we have been having GPS 
issues as well though.  We’ve been working with cambium on a few items, I’ll 
email you privately.  We have set the hold over time to 60 minutes and that has 
mostly masked the issues for us.

Has anyone setup EPMP to log to a syslog server?  We currently do not operate 
one but are thinking that is what we need to do.  That way we’ll be able to get 
a better picture of what all of our APs are doing from one central location.

Joe



> On Apr 8, 2016, at 4:05 PM, Nate Burke  wrote:
> 
> Is there a way to increase the size of the system log in the EPMP Radios?  I 
> have one that is having GPS sync Problems, but the Event log is only going 
> back 24 hours so I can't get a good feel for how often it's bouncing.
> 
> The log is  76 lines long, but only 12 of those are GPS Messages, the rest 
> are all CNMaestro logging.
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] 9 sectors @ 40*

[Joe Falaschi]

Have they said when the larger channel sizes are being released?

Joe



> On Apr 6, 2016, at 6:30 PM, Craig Schmaderer  wrote:
> 
> I was thinking of stacking 12 450i aps with 6 60degree abcabc than 6 more 
> right on top at defdef so example a would be on top of d giving it 40mhz 
> gaurd band. With the new 30mhz and maybe 40mhz channel sizes cuming this 
> might not be necessary but my idea would allow me to keep 4x and under 
> clients on a radio and really push 8x on the other maybe this would all just 
> average out and not matter unless you got those pesky 2x's streaming all day. 
> Do you think this channel plan would work?
> 
> Craig schmaderer
> Skywave Wireless, Inc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 4:08 PM -0700, "Scott Vander Dussen" 
> mailto:sc...@velociter.net>> wrote:
> 
> Awesome, thanks!
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On 
> Behalf Of Craig House
> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 3:38 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 9 sectors @ 40*
> 
> We have done it and we actually did it with 60° sectors allowing for a bit of 
> overlap on each sector about 10° on each edge still seem to work fine
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> > On Apr 6, 2016, at 17:20, Scott Vander Dussen  wrote:
> > 
> > 450 APs, 9x 40* sectors.  Is ABCABCABC channel reuse realistic?
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > Scott

Re: [AFMUG] Siklu Multihaul PTMP 60 ghz

[Joe Falaschi]

So what did they say?  Shipping when?  Pricing?

Joe



> On Feb 24, 2017, at 8:45 AM, Dennis Burgess  wrote:
> 
> Yep just had our sales meeting with them  <>J 
>  
>  
> Dennis Burgess – Network Solution Engineer – Consultant
> MikroTik Certified Trainer/Consultant 
>  – MTCNA, 
> MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE
>  
> For Wireless Hardware/Routers visit www.linktechs.net 
> 
> Radio Frequiency Coverages: www.towercoverage.com 
> 
> Office: 314-735-0270
> E-Mail: dmburg...@linktechs.net 
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On 
> Behalf Of Gino Villarini
> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2017 8:52 AM
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: [AFMUG] Siklu Multihaul PTMP 60 ghz
>  
> https://www.siklu.com/portfolio-posts/multihaul-point-to-multi-point/ 
> 
>  
>  
> 
> Gino Villarini
> 
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] It's heeeeere.... well amost.

[Joe Falaschi]

They had to change the sync over power method because the old method would not 
work with the 450m’s much larger power draw and the necessity of gigabit 
ethernet data rates.

Joe



> On Mar 1, 2017, at 9:55 AM, Josh Luthman  wrote:
> 
> Why in the piss did they change sync for the 450m??  There's already 2 
> methods *FROM CAMBIUM*!
> 
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> On Wed, Mar 1, 2017 at 1:17 AM, Colin Stanners  > wrote:
> MSPGGA!
> 
> Make Sync Product GUIs Great Again!.
> 
> On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 11:02 PM, Forrest Christian (List Account) 
> mailto:li...@packetflux.com>> wrote:
> http://store.packetflux.com/packetflux-rackinjector/ 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.
> Tel: 406-449-3345 <> | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
> forre...@imach.com  | http://www.packetflux.com 
> 
>      
> 
> 
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Preseem

[Joe Falaschi]

It does seem pretty interesting.  We should know more very soon.  In my 
experience, Gerritt and his team have been very responsive.

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent



> On Apr 19, 2017, at 12:24 PM, Jerry Head  wrote:
> 
> I talked with Gerritt from there yesterday.
> It is an interesting sounding product and pricing is not too terrible.
> 
> On 4/19/2017 11:37 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>> Has anyone used this?  I've been getting emails from them.
>> 
>> www.preseem.com <http://www.preseem.com/>

Re: [AFMUG] 450 AP discontinued?

[Joe Falaschi]

Your second paragraph, that would be awesome.

Joe



> On May 3, 2017, at 1:39 PM, George Skorup  wrote:
> 
> Yes, that's frustrating. ePMP only supports 2.5ms @ 20MHz for timing with 
> FSK. It's obvious that they don't want to hurt 450 sales, especially now with 
> the ePMP 2k closing the performance gap. I don't want ePMP-450 sync to 
> co-locate them. I want it to be able to sync nearby ePMP APs at micro-POPs, 
> where I typically run a 10MHz, with larger sites that have 450 clusters. 
> We're already running into this.
> 
> I've often wondered if they could make their new 5GHz wideband SoC-based SMs 
> speak ePMP TDD in addition to the regular 450 OFDM. Imagine being able to 
> upgrade a site from ePMP to 450i or 450m and never have to touch the SMs. I 
> often dream of parallel universes where these things are possible. And then I 
> wake up. :(
> 
> On 5/3/2017 8:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
>> I can't use EPMP for microsites because  it won't sync with my 450 network. 
>> Plus I don't want a mixed and matched network. The 450 interface is better, 
>> has a lot of features I am using such as AP downlink utilization %. Epmp 
>> just isn't for me.
>> 
>> On Tue, May 2, 2017 at 9:13 PM, David Milholen > > wrote:
>> Why not just go EPMP for the light or small cell startup? Thats what 
>> application I would use it for. I know that it only comes in 2 flavors of 
>> band but thats where planning and design comes in.
>> Everything Else deserves scale ability and high capacity for denser and 
>> larger area of coverage. (450i/M)
>> 
>> Price point is great on the EPMP line also. Lovin the E500/E400 series for 
>> high capacity indoor solutions. The E500 make a great 
>> outdoor market coverage AP. For example we deploy these at out Farmers 
>> Market and I  only used one AP and a 450 sub to bring the 40Mb connection to 
>> it.
>> 
>> The vendors use it for their Square and simple wifi offload.  We have 2 at 
>> the Arena at our local Fairgrounds and the vendors for the Rodeo absolutely 
>> loved it and asked how
>> 
>> they get such great service at their house LOL.  The coolest part is that 
>> the APs are at opposite ends of the arena and use mesh to connect. They are 
>> positioned so they look under the bleachers 
>> where the vendors are. We kill 2 birds with one stone because folks in the 
>> bleachers can connect with limited guest access. Which we got about 25 new 
>> customers off that one event..
>> 
>> LOVE IT
>> 
>> 
>> On 5/2/2017 4:59 PM, Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
>>> I second that! with no 450L right now this is a huge problem on justifying 
>>> smaller sites...
>>> 
>>> On Tue, May 2, 2017 at 2:36 PM, George Skorup >> > wrote:
>>> Dear Matt, we need a 450i Lite AP.
>>> 
>>> On 5/2/2017 10:04 AM, Matt Mangriotis wrote:
 Regarding the timing port, it’s just a wiring change to the RJ-45 
 connector.
 
  
 You can see this explained here: 
 http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PMP-FAQ/Cable-Diagram-for-450i-and-450m-to-UGPS/m-p/52198#U52198
  
 
  
 Matt
 
   <>
 From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On 
 Behalf Of Mathew Howard
 Sent: Tuesday, May 2, 2017 9:45 AM
 To: af  
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450 AP discontinued?
 
  
 Yeah, 48v instead of 24v... 450i still uses the normal sync over power 
 (it's the 450m that changed that), but they did replace the old timing 
 port with the rj45 aux port, so I'm not sure what needs to be done to make 
 timing port stuff work.
 
  
 On Tue, May 2, 2017 at 9:40 AM, Steve Jones >>> > wrote:
 
 the i series has a different power plant and sync mechanism doesnt it?
 
  
 On Tue, May 2, 2017 at 9:01 AM, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
 wrote:
 
 I wonder when this will happen.  Like to schedule the 450 stinger to be 
 discontinued at the same time. 
 
  
 From: David Milholen
 
 Sent: Tuesday, May 2, 2017 6:16 AM
 
 To: af@afmug.com 
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450 AP discontinued?
 
  
 replace your 450s with 450i or m.. 450i Is approx same price point as 450 
 in AP world
 
  
  
 On 5/1/2017 12:01 PM, George Skorup wrote:
 
 FYI, I heard today that the regular 450 APs are no longer available, at 
 least in 5GHz. So be prepared. We lost some 450 and 450i APs over the nice 
 stormy weekend. I hate my life.
 
  
 -- 
 
 
  
  
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap

[Joe Falaschi]

What Chris said.

Our 450Ms have been a huge game changer for us.  We have a tower with 300 
people on it, pretty much all on one side (180 degrees is busy and the other 
180 degrees is pretty silent).  In the past we’d add an AP to offload capacity 
and that AP was used up day one.  There just wasn’t a path to catch up with 
demand much less start to offer faster speeds.  If there is any kind of 
density, greater than 100+ clients on the tower, I’m not sure how you use 
anything other than 450m at this point.

Joe


> On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:54 AM, Chris Wright  wrote:
> 
> ePMP might make sense to build in a new area, but when you have 100+ clients 
> in a single 90 degree sector, replacing your triple-stacked PMP450 APs with a 
> single 450M, saving 40MHz of spectrum, offering faster speeds, AND not having 
> to swap 100+ radios feels mighty nice.
>  
> Chris Wright
> Network Administrator
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On 
> Behalf Of Adam Moffett
> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 8:58 AM
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap
>  
> I've had ePMP's do some weird things here and there, like refusing to reboot 
> or accept config changes.  Nothing a power cycle didn't fix.
> I've had to power cycle a PMP100 or 450 to fix a problem approximately zero 
> times.
>  
> I know a neighbor who had a tower hit by lightning an ePMP and a Ubiquiti 
> Rocket died while the PMP100 and 430 stuff kept on chugging (he didn't have 
> 450 there yet).
>  
> 450 has a few management conveniences like remote spectrum analyzer, RF 
> private IP, and SM proxy access via AP.
>  
> So overall my experiences say the 450 is better than the ePMP, but I still 
> use a lot of ePMP for all the reasons others have stated.  ePMP is good bang 
> for the buck.
>  
> -Adam
>  
>  
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Mathew Howard" mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>>
> To: "af" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
> Sent: 7/18/2017 10:23:17 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap
>  
>> It seems to me (as someone who hasn't actually used PMP450 to speak of, 
>> other than 900mhz), that PMP450 has some advantages for high density 
>> deployments... particularly if you're talking 450m, or even the ability to 
>> easily upgrade to 450m. But in a network like ours, where the average SMs 
>> per AP is somewhere around 15, I just can't see any way that it could 
>> possibly be worth going with 450 over ePMP. 
>>  
>> On Tue, Jul 18, 2017 at 8:52 AM, Bill Prince > > wrote:
>> The PMP450M can make ~~ 12° sectors. On a busy tower, and surrounded by 
>> noisy neighbors, we're often seeing 30 dBm SNR. Nothing else comes close.
>> 
>> bp
>> 
>>  
>> On 7/17/2017 10:10 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>>> Serious question, not my usual sarcasm, how are you 450 folks justifying 
>>> the substantial proce difference between 450 and epmp, seriously, if you 
>>> dont freeze in the winter, i couldnt justify it. Granted we dont sellbover 
>>> 12\2 and we dont have more than 40 per ap, i just dont see the value, they 
>>> did too good a job on epmp
>>>  
>>> On Jul 3, 2017 12:10 PM, "Craig Schmaderer" >> > wrote:
>>> I have never seen more than around 55mbps on 450sm in bridge mode with any 
>>> firmware.  Maybe I missed a 14.x that it did, but I haven't seen more than 
>>> 55mbps on any 15.x firmware. I am working on a bug with then on 15.1 where 
>>> it looks like the qos speed limiters are not enforcing speed settings.  I 
>>> have never tried a 450i sm but I would assume those work fine, I have many 
>>> 450i PTP that work great. 
>>>  
>>> From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of 
>>> Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com>>
>>> Sent: Monday, July 3, 2017 8:38:49 AM 
>>> 
>>> To: af@afmug.com 
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap
>>>  
>>> The original 450 hardware will max out at around 70mbps TCP. Even if you 
>>> have no traffic on it that is the limitation. I don't remember which 
>>> firmware it was but the 14.0 something sounds right and I have personally 
>>> gotten the 70mbps to a SM on a AP with 3 clients. 
>>>  
>>> Now the 450i AP basically the 70mbps cap is gone and you can get whatever 
>>> the link tests show (as long as your testing to an 450i SM). I have two 
>>> customers with 450i SM on a 450i AP and have seen well over 125mbps TCP 
>>> easy. Now that same AP talking to older 450SM's those SM's can still only 
>>> get 70mbps max.
>>>  
>>> So basically what you need to do is put the 450i AP up where you need to 
>>> total AP capacity of more than 50-60mbps and then only use the 450i SM on 
>>> the clients that need more than the 50-70mbps. 
>>>  
>>> I have not tested speeds since I upgraded firmware to 15.1 so if a bug was 
>>> recently introduced I know nothing of it.
>>>  
>>> On Sat, Jul 1, 2017 at 7:51 PM, George Skorup >> > wrot

Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap

[Joe Falaschi]

We’ll see 30M speedtests to individual CPE and 140Mbps aggregate AP throughput 
at peak.  All of our plans are less than 15Mbps at the moment with many 
customers on 6M plans, but we plan to change that soon.  For us at the moment 
it’s not so much about showing a 100+ meg speed test to one client using an 
80MHz channel but delivering lots of 25M or less plans to clients.  Larger 
channels later in the year should help add capacity as well as raw speed.

Joe


> On Jul 21, 2017, at 4:13 PM, Colin Stanners  wrote:
> 
> Joe, what throughput are you getting on those loaded 450M APs?
> 
> On Fri, Jul 21, 2017 at 4:02 PM, Joe Falaschi  <mailto:listm...@wi.net>> wrote:
> What Chris said.
> 
> Our 450Ms have been a huge game changer for us.  We have a tower with 300 
> people on it, pretty much all on one side (180 degrees is busy and the other 
> 180 degrees is pretty silent).  In the past we’d add an AP to offload 
> capacity and that AP was used up day one.  There just wasn’t a path to catch 
> up with demand much less start to offer faster speeds.  If there is any kind 
> of density, greater than 100+ clients on the tower, I’m not sure how you use 
> anything other than 450m at this point.
> 
> Joe
> 
> 
>> On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:54 AM, Chris Wright > <mailto:ch...@velociter.net>> wrote:
>> 
>> ePMP might make sense to build in a new area, but when you have 100+ clients 
>> in a single 90 degree sector, replacing your triple-stacked PMP450 APs with 
>> a single 450M, saving 40MHz of spectrum, offering faster speeds, AND not 
>> having to swap 100+ radios feels mighty nice.
>>  
>> Chris Wright
>> Network Administrator
>>  
>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
>> Behalf Of Adam Moffett
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 8:58 AM
>> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap
>>  
>> I've had ePMP's do some weird things here and there, like refusing to reboot 
>> or accept config changes.  Nothing a power cycle didn't fix.
>> I've had to power cycle a PMP100 or 450 to fix a problem approximately zero 
>> times.
>>  
>> I know a neighbor who had a tower hit by lightning an ePMP and a Ubiquiti 
>> Rocket died while the PMP100 and 430 stuff kept on chugging (he didn't have 
>> 450 there yet).
>>  
>> 450 has a few management conveniences like remote spectrum analyzer, RF 
>> private IP, and SM proxy access via AP.
>>  
>> So overall my experiences say the 450 is better than the ePMP, but I still 
>> use a lot of ePMP for all the reasons others have stated.  ePMP is good bang 
>> for the buck.
>>  
>> -Adam
>>  
>>  
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Mathew Howard" mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>>
>> To: "af" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
>> Sent: 7/18/2017 10:23:17 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PMP450 ~50mbps cap
>>  
>>> It seems to me (as someone who hasn't actually used PMP450 to speak of, 
>>> other than 900mhz), that PMP450 has some advantages for high density 
>>> deployments... particularly if you're talking 450m, or even the ability to 
>>> easily upgrade to 450m. But in a network like ours, where the average SMs 
>>> per AP is somewhere around 15, I just can't see any way that it could 
>>> possibly be worth going with 450 over ePMP. 
>>>  
>>> On Tue, Jul 18, 2017 at 8:52 AM, Bill Prince >> <mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> The PMP450M can make ~~ 12° sectors. On a busy tower, and surrounded by 
>>> noisy neighbors, we're often seeing 30 dBm SNR. Nothing else comes close.
>>> 
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>  
>>> On 7/17/2017 10:10 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>>>> Serious question, not my usual sarcasm, how are you 450 folks justifying 
>>>> the substantial proce difference between 450 and epmp, seriously, if you 
>>>> dont freeze in the winter, i couldnt justify it. Granted we dont sellbover 
>>>> 12\2 and we dont have more than 40 per ap, i just dont see the value, they 
>>>> did too good a job on epmp
>>>>  
>>>> On Jul 3, 2017 12:10 PM, "Craig Schmaderer" >>> <mailto:cr...@skywaveconnect.com>> wrote:
>>>> I have never seen more than around 55mbps on 450sm in bridge mode with any 
>>>> firmware.  Maybe I missed a 14.x that it did, but I haven't seen more than 
>>>> 55mbps on any 15.x firmware. I am working on a bug with then on 15.1 where 

Re: [AFMUG] Complaining Employees

[Joe Falaschi]

We had a guy like this - on paper the most willing to work and a company man 
through and through.  I feel like we were in your same situation though.  
Eventually he got in a situation where our hand was forced to let him go.  Now 
that it’s happened we have found employees who are much better all around.  
It’s kind of like his willingness to do whatever it takes was to cover up for 
the other issues.  Think about it but from someone who has let a fair share of 
people go through the years, I’ve never regretted it after it was done.  Some 
of our staff who still keeps in touch with him is like, whatever you do, don’t 
bring him back.  Or xyz strikes again.  It’s only after the fact that you fully 
realize the full extent of how bad things probably are.

Joe


> On Jul 23, 2017, at 6:27 AM, Matt Hoppes  
> wrote:
> 
> And this is where things get weird and why he's still around. 
> 
> The answer to these questions is - yes. 
> 
> He will respond to an outage regardless of where he is or what he's doing. 
> 
> He has responded to problems on days off. 
> 
> He honestly seems like he WANTS to do things. But possibly lacks the ability 
> to do things. 
> 
> Some things can be taught. Others can't. I'm just struggling to make sure I'm 
> making the right decision. 
> 
> On Jul 22, 2017, at 11:26 PM, Steve Jones  > wrote:
> 
>> In all seriousness, from a guy who takes his job way too serious... not only 
>> is a problematic employee an issue in the normal sense to the company, but 
>> he qill cost you good employees, the dedicated kind who will give you their 
>> blood in a pinch.
>> Do you think the problematic guy will leave his kids birthday party to come 
>> get ten of your customers up? . he wont
>> Do you think he will spend his spare time discussing industry issues, 
>> maintain a handful of social media sock account to ensure he has access to 
>> trending issues he wont
>> Will he work late on the day hes supposed to leave on a vacation to make 
>> sure everything is good while hes gone ... he wont.
>> Will he own issues and show up after hours to come fix them because its his 
>> fault... he wont
>> I know the guy youre talking about. Not by name, or face, but hes common, 
>> and he costs alot of companiea their growth. Do you think at the end of the 
>> day he cares he doesnt.
>> 
>> The point is, the guys who will do the above, unless theyre ignorant 
>> gluttons for punishment who dont have it in them to walk away, will walk 
>> away while youre cupping this guys balls seriously, dont cup the balls. 
>> This is how workplace shootings ignite. Grow your company cull the herd.
>> 
>> On Jul 22, 2017 9:59 PM, "Forrest Christian (List Account)" 
>> mailto:li...@packetflux.com>> wrote:
>> There was an fairly young employee at the wisp which was a general screw up. 
>>   After no end of second chances with no real change,  they finally canned 
>> him.  This was several years ago. 
>> 
>> One day a while back I was down at the wisp and this employee is working for 
>> the wisp again.   Apparently after getting fired,  he spent a couple years 
>> growing up.  I've even heard of him chastising another installer for some of 
>> the crap he used to pull.
>> 
>> My point is that sometimes getting fired is a better wake up call than 
>> giving an employee a second chance 
>> 
>> On Jul 22, 2017 8:16 PM, "Josh Reynolds" > > wrote:
>> How do you gain wisdom without failure?
>> 
>> We can try to learn from others, but those lessons are far less effective.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sat, Jul 22, 2017 at 8:01 PM, Matt Hoppes
>> > > wrote:
>> > So let me throw another question out.
>> >
>> > Say the guy does an OK job at installs, but he wants to do more.  But he
>> > completely screws up the "more" any time he's tried to do it.
>> >
>> > How do you handle that situation?  I'm willing to let my main issues slide
>> > on account of the Peter Principle if he can do OK installs.  But he says
>> > over and over he doesn't want to do installs forever.
>> >
>> > So will he be unhappy?  Demoralized?  Etc, if that's all I keep him on? I
>> > feel like yes.
>> >
>> > I'm in a really difficult position right now and need to figure out how to
>> > address it next week.. =\
>> >
>> > Yeah Employees!
>> 

[AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications

[Joe Falaschi]

We’re looking at some questions of why certain links are at certain modulations 
(uplink is better than downlink).  It’s explained by the spec sheet of the 
current equipment and RX sensitivity.  Basically the 450M AP can do more with 
less signal than the CPE can.  Specs below.  In any case we were then wondering 
what the new 450b RX sensitivity would be.  There is a spec sheet on the 
Cambium website but this isn’t listed.  Anyone have this information?

450M AP RX sensitivity
1x = - 93.5 dBm
2x = -88.6 dBm
4x = -81.5 dBm
6x = -75.9.0 dBm
8x = -67.8 dBm

450SM RX sensitivity
1x = -84 dBm
2x = -80.5 dBm
4x = -74 dBm
6x = -66.9 dBm
8x = -56 dBm

450i SM RX sensitivity
1x = -85.9 dBm
2x = -81.5 dBm
4x = -75.8 dBm
6x = -69.3 dBm
8x = -61.6 dBm

Joe Falaschi
e-vergent

Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications

[Joe Falaschi]

Sure it would.  We have some links reporting a SNR above 32db, enough to get 8x 
but are weaker than -56 signals.  So both matter.

Joe



> On Jul 28, 2017, at 11:44 AM, Chris Wright  wrote:
> 
> Wouldn't SNR play a bigger role than general signal level? What good is 
> -67.8dBm if the noise floor is -75dBm?
> 
> Chris Wright
> Network Administrator
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Joe Falaschi
> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2017 9:28 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications
> 
> We’re looking at some questions of why certain links are at certain 
> modulations (uplink is better than downlink).  It’s explained by the spec 
> sheet of the current equipment and RX sensitivity.  Basically the 450M AP can 
> do more with less signal than the CPE can.  Specs below.  In any case we were 
> then wondering what the new 450b RX sensitivity would be.  There is a spec 
> sheet on the Cambium website but this isn’t listed.  Anyone have this 
> information?
> 
> 450M AP RX sensitivity
> 1x = - 93.5 dBm
> 2x = -88.6 dBm
> 4x = -81.5 dBm
> 6x = -75.9.0 dBm
> 8x = -67.8 dBm
> 
> 450SM RX sensitivity
> 1x = -84 dBm
> 2x = -80.5 dBm
> 4x = -74 dBm
> 6x = -66.9 dBm
> 8x = -56 dBm
> 
> 450i SM RX sensitivity
> 1x = -85.9 dBm
> 2x = -81.5 dBm
> 4x = -75.8 dBm
> 6x = -69.3 dBm
> 8x = -61.6 dBm
> 
> Joe Falaschi
> e-vergent
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications

[Joe Falaschi]

The 450i SM and AP appear to be very close but @ 20MHz channels not exactly but 
again very close to equal.

450 AP @ 5.8 with 20MHz channel:
1x = -82 dBm, 2x = -82 dBm, 4x = -75 dBm, 6x = -69 dBm, 8x = -60 dBm 

450i AP @ 5.8 with 20MHz channel:
1x = -84.1 dBm, 2x = -80 dBm, 4x = -73 dBm, 6x = -66.5 dBm, 8x = -59.4 dBm 

450M AP @ 5.8 with 20MHz channel:
1x = - 93.5 dBm, 2x = -88.6 dBm, 4x = -81.5 dBm, 6x = -75.9.0 dBm, 8x = -67.8 
dBm 

So, you would see uplink improvements by moving from a 450 to 450i to 450M.  
Uplink improvement is great but the CPE side requiring a -54 on the downlink to 
be in 8x is pretty tough, hence why I’m asking about the new CPE and if it will 
be able to do better.  All our issues are downlink related.  If we could move 
all customers up a modulation level, that would be a pretty big deal for AP 
efficiency.

Joe




> On Jul 28, 2017, at 11:39 AM, Kurt Fankhauser  
> wrote:
> 
> Is RX sensitivity on the 450i AP the same as the 450i SM? Is it the same 
> hardware? Also what is original 450AP rx sensitivity as well? I noticed that 
> when I swapped out 450AP for 450iAP that I got better uplink speeds.
> 
> Also will 450b SM accept 48v on the POE?
> 
> On Fri, Jul 28, 2017 at 12:28 PM, Joe Falaschi  <mailto:listm...@wi.net>> wrote:
> We’re looking at some questions of why certain links are at certain 
> modulations (uplink is better than downlink).  It’s explained by the spec 
> sheet of the current equipment and RX sensitivity.  Basically the 450M AP can 
> do more with less signal than the CPE can.  Specs below.  In any case we were 
> then wondering what the new 450b RX sensitivity would be.  There is a spec 
> sheet on the Cambium website but this isn’t listed.  Anyone have this 
> information?
> 
> 450M AP RX sensitivity
> 1x = - 93.5 dBm
> 2x = -88.6 dBm
> 4x = -81.5 dBm
> 6x = -75.9.0 dBm
> 8x = -67.8 dBm
> 
> 450SM RX sensitivity
> 1x = -84 dBm
> 2x = -80.5 dBm
> 4x = -74 dBm
> 6x = -66.9 dBm
> 8x = -56 dBm
> 
> 450i SM RX sensitivity
> 1x = -85.9 dBm
> 2x = -81.5 dBm
> 4x = -75.8 dBm
> 6x = -69.3 dBm
> 8x = -61.6 dBm
> 
> Joe Falaschi
> e-vergent
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications

[Joe Falaschi]

New CPE: http://www.cambiumnetworks.com/resources/pmp-450b/ 
<http://www.cambiumnetworks.com/resources/pmp-450b/>



> On Jul 28, 2017, at 12:03 PM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
> 
> What is the 450b?
> 
> On 7/28/17, 12:55 PM, "Af on behalf of Matt Mangriotis"
> mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com> on behalf of 
> matt.mangrio...@cambiumnetworks.com 
> <mailto:matt.mangrio...@cambiumnetworks.com>>
> wrote:
> 
> >Joe - I just answered your forum post... but might as well repeat and add
> >to it here too.
> >
> >You guys are right in that the combination of the two factors are what
> >matters to the modulation that the radio will achieve.  You have to be
> >above a certain absolute power level (RSL), but ALSO have enough distance
> >(SNR) above the noise to decipher the bits.  That is, even if you're
> >receiving the intended signal at -55, but have noise at -70, the 15 dB
> >separation (i.e. SNR) isn't enough to allow for 256QAM modulation.
> >
> >Regarding sensitivity levels, the easiest place for me to find these is
> >in the Link Capacity Planner Tool:
> >https://support.cambiumnetworks.com/files/capacityplanner/ 
> ><https://support.cambiumnetworks.com/files/capacityplanner/>
> >
> >You can input the radios you're using and it'll spit those out.
> >
> >During final product testing, we've determined that the 450b is
> >equivalent to the 450i SM in these specifications, so until that tool
> >gets updated with official numbers (which may vary slightly), I would use
> >that.
> >
> >Hope this helps,
> >Matt
> >
> >
>  
> 
> Gino A. Villarini
> 
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> >From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
> >Behalf Of Joe Falaschi
> >Sent: Friday, July 28, 2017 11:49 AM
> >To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
> >Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications
> >
> >Sure it would.  We have some links reporting a SNR above 32db, enough to
> >get 8x but are weaker than -56 signals.  So both matter.
> >
> >Joe
> >
> >
> >
> >> On Jul 28, 2017, at 11:44 AM, Chris Wright  >> <mailto:ch...@velociter.net>> wrote:
> >>
> >> Wouldn't SNR play a bigger role than general signal level? What good is
> >>-67.8dBm if the noise floor is -75dBm?
> >>
> >> Chris Wright
> >> Network Administrator
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On 
> >> Behalf Of Joe Falaschi
> >> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2017 9:28 AM
> >> To: af@afmug.com
> >> Subject: [AFMUG] Cambium 450b specifications
> >>
> >> We¹re looking at some questions of why certain links are at certain
> >>modulations (uplink is better than downlink).  It¹s explained by the
> >>spec sheet of the current equipment and RX sensitivity.  Basically the
> >>450M AP can do more with less signal than the CPE can.  Specs below.  In
> >>any case we were then wondering what the new 450b RX sensitivity would
> >>be.  There is a spec sheet on the Cambium website but this isn¹t listed.
> >> Anyone have this information?
> >>
> >> 450M AP RX sensitivity
> >> 1x = - 93.5 dBm
> >> 2x = -88.6 dBm
> >> 4x = -81.5 dBm
> >> 6x = -75.9.0 dBm
> >> 8x = -67.8 dBm
> >>
> >> 450SM RX sensitivity
> >> 1x = -84 dBm
> >> 2x = -80.5 dBm
> >> 4x = -74 dBm
> >> 6x = -66.9 dBm
> >> 8x = -56 dBm
> >>
> >> 450i SM RX sensitivity
> >> 1x = -85.9 dBm
> >> 2x = -81.5 dBm
> >> 4x = -75.8 dBm
> >> 6x = -69.3 dBm
> >> 8x = -61.6 dBm
> >>
> >> Joe Falaschi
> >> e-vergent
> >>
> >

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Joe Falaschi]

We are currently staffed at 500:1.  I think a lot of it has to do with the age 
of your network (how many CPE conversions you have to do, removals from 
cancellations, etc) vs a newer company with all new gear and not as much chance 
for a customer base and equipment to age, move away etc.  Probably the biggest 
factor is how far out are you booked and is that timeline acceptable to you.

Joe


> On Aug 3, 2017, at 3:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> 
> I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.  
>  
> From: Donnie McCorkle <>
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
> To:  <>af@afmug.com 
> Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?
>  
> This question was posed by one of my managers this week.
>  
> I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look…. 
>  
> Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or 
> has worked for you?
> Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?
>  
> We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
> hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] Pmp450 vs epmp pros vs cons

[Joe Falaschi via Af]

In parts of our suburban coverage NW of Chicago we cannot coordinate 
6GHz or 11GHz at some specific sites.  What does the picture look like 
in 10 years when we need to also feed hundreds and hundreds of 
micropops...  To some extent I'm not sure wireless will be a service for 
the masses.  How do you provide 50/10 service to all homes and 
businesses in a 3000 to 4000:1 population density area?  We are 100% 
wireless right now but it does seem like fiber is the way things are 
going.  Use the wireless to get a customer base to convert later and 
then keep wireless as a premium product where diversity is required.  
Until then we will continue to be a boutique player in these areas.  I 
am excited about the new tech coming out and I'm not trying to say we 
won't take any advance in technology.  It will help greatly in low 
density areas but will future wireless scale to a true high density area 
for someone who is going to take significant market share?


For example 14000 population in 4 miles, 50% take rate, 7000 customers.  
50Mbps service.  100:1 usage ratio.  Is that 3.5Gbps of usage using 
those assumptions?  Maybe, until you need to provide 100Mbps service 
much less 1Gbps.  I'd love for someone to make it possible without going 
down the fiber route but it doesn't seem obvious to me right now that 
100% wireless could take the place of Comcast's Internet product in 
urban and suburban areas.


Joe Falaschi
http://www.e-vergent.com


On 10/19/14, 11:09 PM, Tyler Treat via Af wrote:
What's your Backhaul strategy for having this many sites.  How many 
hops do you get from fiber?  With a ton of small sites, it seems like 
it would scale to an unmanageable level very quickly...?


___
Mangled by my iPhone.
___

Tyler Treat
Corn Belt Technologies, Inc.

tyler.tr...@cornbelttech.com <mailto:tyler.tr...@cornbelttech.com>
___


On Oct 19, 2014, at 10:52 PM, Rory Conaway via Af <mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:


+1. I’ve already hit CenturyLink’s fastest speeds with anemic little 
Rocket 5M’s and nothing special.  Imagine what happens when the 
Rocket AC or Mimosa come out with their products.


Those features target the urban market where which I’ve seen numbers 
like 84% of the population is and for the most part, WISPS aren’t.


Rory

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Josh Reynolds 
via Af

*Sent:* Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:39 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pmp450 vs epmp pros vs cons

Microcells normally have good SNR. Add 802.11AC into the mix and you 
have very good performance without the crappy latency hit.


Josh Reynolds, Chief Information Officer
SPITwSPOTS, www.spitwspots.com <http://www.spitwspots.com>

On 10/19/2014 05:27 PM, Mike Hammett via Af wrote:

Then you miss out on the best performance.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



*From: *"Rory Conaway via Af"  <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*To: *af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent: *Sunday, October 19, 2014 4:33:21 PM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Pmp450 vs epmp pros vs cons

Ahh, difference of philosophies.  I just don’t want my business
dependent on competitors or single suppliers.

Rory

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Gino
Villarini via Af
*Sent:* Sunday, October 19, 2014 2:27 PM
*To:*  <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pmp450 vs epmp pros vs cons

So it's Roy against the world of sync 

Gino A. Villarini

@gvillarini


On Oct 19, 2014, at 5:20 PM, Rory Conaway via Af mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

Yea, I covered that in one of my articles.  I just didn’t see
everyone sitting around the campfire singing Kumbya.  Another
reason I don’t worry about GPS.   My next article covers my
main reason.

Rory

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Josh
Reynolds via Af
*Sent:* Sunday, October 19, 2014 1:56 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pmp450 vs epmp pros vs cons

LOL :)

Josh Reynolds, Chief Information Officer
SPITwSPOTS, www.spitwspots.com <http://www.spitwspots.com>

On 10/19/2014 08:13 AM, Rory Conaway via Af wrote:

I’m assuming all 12 WISPs cooperate with each other?

Rory

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of
*Mike Hammett via Af
*Sent:* Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:33 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pmp450 vs epmp pros vs cons

Entirely not true spoken by a WISP tha

Re: [AFMUG] procera results

[Joe Falaschi via Af]

That is one of my concerns with this solution.  Google already encrypts 
a fair amount of traffic.  I think if you're logged in to your google 
account it is encrypted and you can no longer identify it.  They also 
block search terms from being reported for SEO if the end user is logged 
in but that's another issue.  In any case a good portion of that SSL 
could be google video.  At the moment it's not a big deal but in the 
future it could be if others start doing the same thing.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent.com, LLC.

On 11/12/14, 7:43 AM, Ken Hohhof via Af wrote:

That’s a lot of SSLv3 considering the POODLE bug.
*From:* Brian Meredith via Af <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, November 12, 2014 1:14 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] procera results
Here's our inbound traffic for last month.
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 9:48 PM, Bill Prince via Af <mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:


That's a record in my book.  We have a new sub doing a 1/2 TB a
week (2 TB per month), and that is a high for us.

bp


On 11/11/2014 8:57 PM, Ken Hohhof via Af wrote:

Yeah, I have a new customer like that.  He was heading toward 3
TB/mo usage and was complaining because he couldn’t stream
Netflix and Youtube at 1080p while maxing out his connection with
10 NNTPS connections.  I think I’ve convinced him he needs to
shut it off when he’s streaming.  Not sure why he can’t schedule
on and off times or limit the bandwidth.  I think these people
are video horders.  When you are downloading over 100 GB per day,
when will you watch it all?  Unless this is 4K quality.
*From:* Mike Hammett via Af <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent:* Tuesday, November 11, 2014 10:41 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] procera results
Quality of torrents is an issue. That's why the serious guys have
gone back to UseNet. Automation is great.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL><https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb><https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions><https://twitter.com/ICSIL>


*From: *"That One Guy via Af" mailto:af@afmug.com
*To: *af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent: *Tuesday, November 11, 2014 8:53:12 PM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] procera results

when we audit through various means, we dont see much torrenting
anymore, I think its gone out of style with youngsters with
pandora and the like with cellular audio, less care about stored
mp3, every video is available in real time now, so why bother
torrenting a movie you cant verify the quality of beforehand
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 8:05 PM, Rory Conaway via Af
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

This is amazing.  Thanks. What’s interesting to me is how
little bandwidth torrents are using.  I can put up 10 people
and 2 of them are using torrents almost immediately.

Rory

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
via Af
*Sent:* Tuesday, November 11, 2014 10:10 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] procera results

i am not blocking/shaping anything right now, that bar graph
is only showing the top 10 results right now

Sent from my iPhone

Kurt Fankhauser

Wavelinc Communications

P.O. Box 126

Bucyrus, OH 44820

http://www.wavelinc.com

tel. 419-562-6405 

fax. 419-617-0110 


On Nov 11, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Rory Conaway via Af
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

Kurt, are you blocking or shaping any torrents?  I don’t
see that in your chart.

Rory

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of
*Kurt Fankhauser via Af
*Sent:* Tuesday, November 11, 2014 8:23 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* [AFMUG] procera results

Havn't shaped any traffic yet with this procera box. But
here is a graph of what kind of traffic the clients are
using as a whole in one days time. Of course Netflix is
at top. But i am surprised at how close behind that
youtube is (shows up as http media stream) Usually at any
given time the Netflix/Youtube accounts for 50-75% of all
traffic running through this box.

Kurt Fankhauser

Wavelinc Communications

P.O. Box 126

Bucyrus, OH 44820

http://www.

Re: [AFMUG] procera results

[Joe Falaschi via Af]

Look at the live view detail of the SSL category and you'll see what the 
traffic make up is in real time.

Joe



On Nov 12, 2014, at 9:17 AM, Kurt Fankhauser via Af wrote:

> so if someone is logged into google and watched a youtube video it shows as 
> SSL ?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> Kurt Fankhauser
> Wavelinc Communications
> P.O. Box 126
> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> http://www.wavelinc.com
> tel. 419-562-6405
> fax. 419-617-0110
> 
> On Nov 12, 2014, at 9:28 AM, Joe Falaschi via Af  wrote:
> 
>> That is one of my concerns with this solution.  Google already encrypts a 
>> fair amount of traffic.  I think if you're logged in to your google account 
>> it is encrypted and you can no longer identify it.  They also block search 
>> terms from being reported for SEO if the end user is logged in but that's 
>> another issue.  In any case a good portion of that SSL could be google 
>> video.  At the moment it's not a big deal but in the future it could be if 
>> others start doing the same thing.
>> 
>> Joe Falaschi
>> e-vergent.com, LLC.
>> 
>> On 11/12/14, 7:43 AM, Ken Hohhof via Af wrote:
>>> That’s a lot of SSLv3 considering the POODLE bug.
>>>  
>>> From: Brian Meredith via Af
>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2014 1:14 AM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] procera results
>>>  
>>> Here's our inbound traffic for last month.
>>>  
>>> On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 9:48 PM, Bill Prince via Af  wrote:
>>> That's a record in my book.  We have a new sub doing a 1/2 TB a week (2 TB 
>>> per month), and that is a high for us.
>>> bp
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 11/11/2014 8:57 PM, Ken Hohhof via Af wrote:
>>>> Yeah, I have a new customer like that.  He was heading toward 3 TB/mo 
>>>> usage and was complaining because he couldn’t stream Netflix and Youtube 
>>>> at 1080p while maxing out his connection with 10 NNTPS connections.  I 
>>>> think I’ve convinced him he needs to shut it off when he’s streaming.  Not 
>>>> sure why he can’t schedule on and off times or limit the bandwidth.  I 
>>>> think these people are video horders.  When you are downloading over 100 
>>>> GB per day, when will you watch it all?  Unless this is 4K quality.
>>>>  
>>>>  
>>>> From: Mike Hammett via Af
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 10:41 PM
>>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] procera results
>>>>  
>>>> Quality of torrents is an issue. That's why the serious guys have gone 
>>>> back to UseNet. Automation is great.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -
>>>> Mike Hammett
>>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>>>> http://www.ics-il.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> From: "That One Guy via Af" mailto:af@afmug.com
>>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 8:53:12 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] procera results
>>>> 
>>>> when we audit through various means, we dont see much torrenting anymore, 
>>>> I think its gone out of style with youngsters with pandora and the like 
>>>> with cellular audio, less care about stored mp3, every video is available 
>>>> in real time now, so why bother torrenting a movie you cant verify the 
>>>> quality of beforehand
>>>>  
>>>> On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 8:05 PM, Rory Conaway via Af  wrote:
>>>> This is amazing.  Thanks.  What’s interesting to me is how little 
>>>> bandwidth torrents are using.  I can put up 10 people and 2 of them are 
>>>> using torrents almost immediately.
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>> Rory
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser via Af
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2014 10:10 AM
>>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] procera results
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>> i am not blocking/shaping anything right now, that bar graph is only 
>>>> showing the top 10 results right now
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>> Kurt Fankhauser
>>>> 
>>>> Wavelinc Communications
>>>> 
>>>> P.O. Box 126
>>>> 
>>>> Bucyrus, OH 44820
>>>> 
&

Re: [AFMUG] Balting Networks selling AF5 for $850

[Joe Falaschi via Af]

How many come on a pallet?  We just bought two AF5's from Baltic.  The 
boxes were large enough for one of our guys to get into and pop out of 
when an unsuspecting co-worker walked past.  We are going to try them on 
a six mile link and we'll see what happens.  I'm planning on getting 
more bandwidth out of them then the Rocket we currently have deployed 
but I'm not holding my breath for full modulation.  Why do you say 
you're looking for FW to make them useful?  What do we need to be aware of?


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent broadband


On 12/24/14, 3:08 PM, cjwstudios via Af wrote:
I bought a pallet of AF5's...still waiting to see if a FW version 
comes out that makes them useful.  I'm not too impressed.


On Mon, Dec 22, 2014 at 8:52 AM, Mike Hammett via Af <mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:


The antennas are too small to be useful in most places.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL><https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb><https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions><https://twitter.com/ICSIL>


*From: *"Carl Peterson via Af" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
*To: *af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent: *Monday, December 22, 2014 9:49:02 AM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Balting Networks selling AF5 for $850


I get the feeling that AF5s aren't selling too well and there is a
bunch of old inventory they are trying to move.  AF24s are still
selling well.

On Dec 22, 2014, at 8:44 AM, Keefe John via Af mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

It'd be nice to see the AF24 @ $850 too.


On 12/22/2014 8:38 AM, Eric Kuhnke via Af wrote:

Well crap, that was not supposed to happen. Baltic is
selling the AF5 for $850. Is this the new normal, not
$995?  150 bucks off makes it somewhat more attractive
versus some other options, if I can use it for short
distance FDD-like links and keep it in 1024QAM mode.

On Mon, Dec 22, 2014 at 2:36 PM, Eric Kuhnke via Af
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

Re: [AFMUG] cheap computer phone support

[Joe Falaschi via Af]

Is that other company http://pccaresupport.com?

I remember talking to someone from PC Care Support a few years ago at a 
WISPA show.  We never signed with them.  We use server plus for after 
hours and holidays and honestly do not know where they draw the line but 
I can obviously ask.  I believe they make a best effort to help the 
customer.  I do not know about them handing calls over to another 
company though.  Do you pay more for that additional level of service?  
Nobody has tried to up sell me.


Joe Falaschi
e-vergent broadband


On 12/24/14, 3:23 PM, Mike Hammett via Af wrote:
They spin out more of the consumer electronics and home PC stuff to 
another company that charges a monthly fee for the service. Not sure 
if they'll do ICB.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL><https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb><https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions><https://twitter.com/ICSIL>


*From: *"Ken Hohhof via Af" 
*To: *af@afmug.com
*Sent: *Wednesday, December 24, 2014 3:19:27 PM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] cheap computer phone support

I wonder at what point does ServerPlus say we are not here to help you 
hook up your Samsung Smart TV to your Linksys router.  Or we need to 
charge you for it.

*From:* joseph marsh via Af <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, December 24, 2014 2:54 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] cheap computer phone support

Server plus does to a extent. They will be doing my tech support

On Dec 24, 2014 2:51 PM, "Jay Weekley via Af" <mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:


Maybe ServerPlus does that.

Ken Hohhof via Af wrote:

Is there a service out there?  For stuff that's clearly not
our problem?

I'm trying to take a firmer stance about not spending an hour
on the phone walking someone through fixing their computer or
router, because they are too lazy to Google it or use the
manufacturer's website, or haven't a clue when it comes to
computers.

I give them the number for a computer shop, but often they say
I can't pay $100 to have someone fix my computer or router or
printer or smart TV. My business is at the size where I'm not
big enough to make computer repair a profit center, but if I
keep doing this stuff for free, I'm going to have to hire
someone to do it, and that's not a cost I can absorb.

Is there a place maybe with call centers in India that will do
this for less?  I know the telcos offer this service for a
monthly fee, and I assume they are outsourcing it.  Note that
I'm not talking about phone support for Internet problems.

Oh, and kudos to Apple for fixing the NTP vulnerability
without asking permission.  I can't believe the media is
portraying this in a negative light.  I'm tired of people who
don't keep their computers and routers and other devices
updated. Do people drive their cars until the engine freezes
up because they are too lazy or cheap or clueless to get the
oil changed?  I suppose some do. Maybe we need the government
to come do all these things for us.