Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Why is there differences between the players?
TiredLegs;641662 Wrote: Yeah, the Benchmark DAC in particular is essentially immune to any degree of jitter that a properly function source might create. The company even publishes jitter tolerance test charts right in its product manuals, including an extreme test injecting over 2000 picoseconds of jitter. See, for example, p.34-36 of this document: http://www.benchmarkmedia.com/sites/default/files/documents/DAC1_Manual_RevN.pdf Don't believe the hype. This is all marketing (which many have fallen for). -- slackhead slackhead's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13963 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88766 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] speaker advancements over 15 years?
Go Active (+ DSP). There's nothing like it. And although it's understood, it's a mystery why more people don't go Active - if you understand what I mean ! -- rolski rolski's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=23776 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88582 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
soundcheck;641549 Wrote: * I'm more than disappointed that when adding albumart or new albums I still have to run an annyoing complete database delete/rescan. (To others: Please, let me know if there is a solution to it) In my case the new albums are recognised without problem with a normal scan. Only the albumart is missing and needs a complete database delete/rescan. Temporary solution: Embed the coverart in the tags of the music-files. Then they also show up after a normal scan of the new files. I handle it this way until this problem gets fixed in 7.6. Not the top-solution, I know, but it's still better than doing a complete database delete/rescan every time. -- Soundman Soundman's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] speaker advancements over 15 years?
TiredLegs;641657 Wrote: The Seas coax's tweeter does have a bit of a flared throat on it that partially overlaps the midwoofer. Perhaps the movement of the midwoofer cone would be an issue at really high excursions, but at normal listening volumes, I did not notice any response problems, even when running it full range (i.e. without a subwoofer taking on the bass). And of course any non-coaxial design has inherent problems of its own. However, I'm not a professional speaker designer, so I defer to your expertise. It would manifest itself at high excursion. The best way to show it is to drive the woofer with a test signal that puts it under excursion and then take several tweeter measurements, with and without the midwoofer under stroke. How audible it is depends on the test signal and with a given song it may or may not present an audible issue. I love active designs but I also understand an audiophile longing to use a given amplifier. I have some 300Bs that are wonderful with the right loudspeaker and I know that they alter the signal but at the end of the day, I love how they sound. -- Kevin Haskins Kevin Haskins's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=30729 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88582 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
soundcheck;641549 Wrote: * I figured out that if leaving out the playlist scanning (leave playlist path blank), the full new scan becomes lighting fast. If you guys work without playlists give it a try. On 7.5.4 playlist scanner will verify every track location in every playlist and delete entries that no longer physically exist in the given path. Maybe 7.6 seeks for these files in the database before deleting the entries? That would be a better solution and could explain longer scan time. i.e. the playlist was generated when the USB drive was mapped as G: drive an now are located as F: In 7.5.4 simply delete these entryes in the SBS version of the playlist. I'm just speculating here as I have no hands on experience with 7.6. -- zzzap zzzap's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=31947 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
Next week I will do the s/pdif tests. cheers Phil http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=610116postcount=329 Did this happen? I've reread most of this thread but wasn't able to find it. I understand if it didn't made it to the publishing desk. But if it really happened I'll be sad if I missed it. thanks! -- zzzap zzzap's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=31947 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Why is there differences between the players?
slackhead;641842 Wrote: Don't believe the hype. This is all marketing (which many have fallen for). Hype is words without substance. I've never seen evidence for the view you share other than subjective sighted listening. On the other hand, Benchmark are one of the few good guys who publish very extensive measurements for their gear...corroborated by third parties on the net. (Yes I have tried it for myself. I've not heard differences between transports or interconnects...FWIW.) You may disagree with the measurements but I think talking about hype is an own-goal. Darren -- darrenyeats http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/richpub/listmania/byauthor/A3H57URKQB8AQO/ref=cm_pdp_content_listmania/203-7606506-5721503. SB3, SB Touch darrenyeats's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10799 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88766 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] speaker advancements over 15 years?
rolski;641852 Wrote: Go Active (+ DSP). There's nothing like it. And although it's understood, it's a mystery why more people don't go Active - if you understand what I mean ! Well, I have gone active as you put it! +1 on that. As a long-time Inguz user until this year, I don't believe DSP can fix everything. It's a valid solution in some circumstances - I don't see it as black and white - but I believe it should be the last resort. Of course, domestic factors are real so DSP can help. But I think it won't provide all the benefits of appropriate room treatment. Darren -- darrenyeats http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/richpub/listmania/byauthor/A3H57URKQB8AQO/ref=cm_pdp_content_listmania/203-7606506-5721503. SB3, SB Touch darrenyeats's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10799 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88582 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Logitech Transporter for sale
Sold ! -- gizek SB Touch modded NorthStar 192 DAC Electrocompaniet ECI-1 Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor M gizek's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=34337 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88844 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
zzzap;641898 Wrote: Next week I will do the s/pdif tests. cheers Phil http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=610116postcount=329 Did this happen? I've reread most of this thread but wasn't able to find it. I understand if it didn't made it to the publishing desk. But if it really happened I'll be sad if I missed it. thanks! No it didn't happen due to personal circumstances. I am hoping to attempt it later in the year (earliest possible date = September) regards Phil -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... Touch(wired/XP) - Audiolense 3.3/2.0+INGUZ DRC - MF M1 DAC - Linn 5103 - full Aktiv 5.1 system (6x LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Belden Digital,Kimber 8TC Speaker Chord Signature Plus Interconnect cables Stax4070+SRM7/II phones Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything. Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] speaker advancements over 15 years?
darrenyeats;641911 Wrote: Well, I have gone active as you put it! +1 on that. As a long-time Inguz user until this year, I don't believe DSP can fix everything. It's a valid solution in some circumstances - I don't see it as black and white - but I believe it should be the last resort. Of course, domestic factors are real so DSP can help. But I think it won't provide all the benefits of appropriate room treatment. Darren Inguz is not the issue - it's only the convolver which is a pure maths function. The art is in defining the convolution curve nicely and in measuring the stuff accurately in the first place. Using Audiolense and a very good mic and ADC to capture (and using Inguz only as the convolver) is a very different solution that IME is ahead of (say) TACT et al. As someone who (in their time) has spent thousands on room treatments in several rooms, I'm happy to say that I know DSP is more capable than Helmholz resonators, bass traps, wave diffractors and other bits of foam at taming the sound of speakers in a room. YMMV of course. In either case, the real trick is to start with a room that needs as little correction of any sort as possible (e.g. good dimensions and materials and layout). Then the correction can mostly just deal with the peculiarities of the speakers (in the room). -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... Touch(wired/XP) - Audiolense 3.3/2.0+INGUZ DRC - MF M1 DAC - Linn 5103 - full Aktiv 5.1 system (6x LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Belden Digital,Kimber 8TC Speaker Chord Signature Plus Interconnect cables Stax4070+SRM7/II phones Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything. Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88582 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Logitech Transporter for sale
Replaced with? -- audiomuze *'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger' (http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html): 'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* audiomuze's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=33613 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88844 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
First, forgive my inability to understand one aspect of your measurements back in February. I have read many of the surrounding posts but haven't found an answer I understand. I also couldn't find it in the ADM documents I browsed. You say 'Remember: bigger number = smaller difference'. To me that means that the mods introduce greater differences, since the numbers after they are introduced are smaller. Is this what you mean? I'm sure I'm being really thick, but can you clarify this for me? Also, did you postulate any reason for a reduction in 'broadband noise'. More work for the electronics means more noise on the analogue side? -- PasTim PasTim's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=41642 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] speaker advancements over 15 years?
Phil Leigh;641921 Wrote: Inguz is not the issue - it's only the convolver which is a pure maths function. The art is in defining the convolution curve nicely and in measuring the stuff accurately in the first place. Using Audiolense and a very good mic and ADC to capture (and using Inguz only as the convolver) is a very different solution that IME is ahead of (say) TACT et al. As someone who (in their time) has spent thousands on room treatments in several rooms, I'm happy to say that I know DSP is more capable than Helmholz resonators, bass traps, wave diffractors and other bits of foam at taming the sound of speakers in a room. YMMV of course. In either case, the real trick is to start with a room that needs as little correction of any sort as possible (e.g. good dimensions and materials and layout). Then the correction can mostly just deal with the peculiarities of the speakers (in the room). Actually getting an even RT60 for a fair part of the frequency band is feasible with room treatments. This is very beneficial. Bass is trickier in smaller rooms like mine - the physical size of the treatments required get impractical. But I believe it's worth trying because reducing discontinuous resonances (biggest candidates usually being room modes) is very important to sound quality. Darren -- darrenyeats http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/richpub/listmania/byauthor/A3H57URKQB8AQO/ref=cm_pdp_content_listmania/203-7606506-5721503. SB3, SB Touch darrenyeats's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10799 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=88582 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
PasTim;641942 Wrote: First, forgive my inability to understand one aspect of your measurements back in February. I have read many of the surrounding posts but haven't found an answer I understand. I also couldn't find it in the ADM documents I browsed. You say 'Remember: bigger number = smaller difference'. To me that means that the mods introduce greater differences, since the numbers after they are introduced are smaller. Is this what you mean? I'm sure I'm being really thick, but can you clarify this for me? Also, did you postulate any reason for a reduction in 'broadband noise'. More work for the electronics means more noise on the analogue side? It's like this; ADM measures differences. The scale of measurement is in dB and is inverted (what it is showing you is actually an inverse correlation), so 0dB = massive difference and -144dB (24-bit signal) = identical/no difference. So as I said, bigger number = smaller difference (or greater similarity). This won't make any sense unless you are familiar with working in dB's and/or have actually used ADM. I don't think I'd like to speculate on the cause of the change beyond saying that the analogue circuits of the Touch (and SB3) are inevitably susceptible to low-level interference from the other digital/control circuitry. -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... Touch(wired/XP) - Audiolense 3.3/2.0+INGUZ DRC - MF M1 DAC - Linn 5103 - full Aktiv 5.1 system (6x LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Belden Digital,Kimber 8TC Speaker Chord Signature Plus Interconnect cables Stax4070+SRM7/II phones Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything. Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
Phil Leigh;641972 Wrote: It's like this; ADM measures differences. The scale of measurement is in dB and is inverted (what it is showing you is actually an inverse correlation), so 0dB = massive difference and -144dB (24-bit signal) = identical/no difference. So as I said, bigger number = smaller difference (or greater similarity). This won't make any sense unless you are familiar with working in dB's and/or have actually used ADM. I don't think I'd like to speculate on the cause of the change beyond saying that the analogue circuits of the Touch (and SB3) are inevitably susceptible to low-level interference from the other digital/control circuitry. Sorry. Head bashed against wall. No clearer. I see from your results that 96.96, unmodified, is greater than 84.49 modified. So a Touch with no changes has a greater similarity with the original. Which is not what I understand from your description. I know roughly what a dB is, and can fully understand that 0dB similarity is a disaster and -144 is great. The question must be how does dB similarity relate to the scores quoted? I can't find an answer on the ADM site or in their main document on the topic. Am I really being that daft? -- PasTim PasTim's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=41642 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] soundcheck's Touch Toolbox 2.0
PasTim;641981 Wrote: Sorry. Head bashed against wall. No clearer. I see from your results that 96.96, unmodified, is greater than 84.49 modified. So a Touch with no changes has a greater similarity with the original. Which is not what I understand from your description. I know roughly what a dB is, and can fully understand that 0dB similarity is a disaster and -144 is great. The question must be how does dB similarity relate to the scores quoted? I can't find an answer on the ADM site or in their main document on the topic. Am I really being that daft? yes :-) You are completely misinterpreting the results. The tests show that as mods are stacked up, the numbers get smaller ie the differences get bigger. IF the mods were having no effect the numbers would not get smaller. You can see that some mods have very little effect... others have a bigger impact. In the first test (96.6) the unmodded Touch COMPARED AGAINST ITSELF establishes the baseline - obviously one would expect virtually no difference and that's what you get. As mods are made the numbers get smaller because the differences get bigger. Conclusion: (some of) the mods impact the sound. I really can't put it any more clearly :-) -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... Touch(wired/XP) - Audiolense 3.3/2.0+INGUZ DRC - MF M1 DAC - Linn 5103 - full Aktiv 5.1 system (6x LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Belden Digital,Kimber 8TC Speaker Chord Signature Plus Interconnect cables Stax4070+SRM7/II phones Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything. Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
