Re: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Japan, China, and the UK are the top 3 foreign holders of US Treasury securities. Japan invests in the US because their interest rates are nearly zero and they have plenty of Dollars from exports. China has lots of Dollars and buys Treasuries to avoid having to convert to their currency, which would weaken it. I don't see them stopping any time soon, but if they did stop we would end up with higher interest rates, inflation, and a weaker Dollar to counter it. At 12:15 PM 11/23/2005, Clint Hooper wrote: You obviously have a good handle on economics,Matt. I'll concede your points. What countries do you think are funding the largest part of our foreign investment? What would happen if they decide to stop? Seems I remember an Asian nation starting WWII because we tried to strangle them,economically. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Like I said, if the media tells people an economic indicator came in "worse than expected" it's perceived as bad. Even if an indicator may be trending downward, it still can be very strong. GDP has been clipping along at above 3% for several quarters in a row & unemployment is low at 5%. If the economics of the US are so bad, why would the FED continue to raise interest rates? Fact is the economy is doing well, so they are raising interest rates to prevent inflation. Believe it or not, the post-Katrina effect is going to be positive for the economy. Construction, building materials, etc. Of course, all this building is being fueled by government spending. The negative effect of Katrina will be inflation which the FED hopes to prevent and higher deficits. The deficit is being funded by foreign investment at a pace of $100 Billion a Month. So, the US is screwed when other countries won't fund our spending.
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
True that!-Original Message- From: Craig Ellis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 23, 2005 4:28 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The media people didn't understand it so they never attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media people can't figure out whether they should lease their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither can anyone else because they don't teach the concept in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance and Ebonics. Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" is putting the second round through the same hole as the first. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and charged with sedition. The old saying "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" exists not because rich people screw poor people but because the government screws poor people. They do this because they can - you see, the rich people "get it". They understand how the tax system works and how to circumvent the system. Poor people don't have the knowledge so they get screwed. It isn't a big conspiracy, it is your elected representatives creating a tax system that enables them to tax the people with the smallest voice - and that is you and me. Finally, permit me to say that, I can teach ANYONE who graduated from high school these two ideas and the fact that our high schools do NOT teach these things is, IMHO, nearly criminal. I was taught these ideas in the first accounting class I took to become a CPA. Every CPA understands this stuff which is why all CPAs hate taxes. But that doesn't mean only CPAs "get it". This stuff is pretty easy when it is taught properly. - Original Message - From: Matthew Post To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Like I said, if the media tells people a
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? {public apology}
hey Mike no need to apologize thank you! Bill - Original Message - From: "mike f" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "The Chevelle Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 6:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? {public apology} I wrote a scathing email to the person or persons that went "political" in this last couple of threads. Well I was not happy for many reasons. Suffice to say, we all don't have the same recollections and some of us who invest heavily get very frustrated by J6P's version if events. When the list went with the thread and kept it going, I was the one who should have just deleted the messages and shut up. Please accept my apology, who ever you are, out there. mike --- gail <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: craig, i dont think anyone could have said it any better. - Original Message - From: Dan McIntosh To: Craig Ellis ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 5:04 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Teaching tolerance isnt a bad thing IMO, whether it be gay tolerance or race tolerance or anything else.. As long as were on the subject of firearms, I'll be taking my CCW class in the beginning of December. Dan McIntosh 1960 Impala Sport Coupe Street Metal Fabrications http://www.lowriderimpala.com - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The media people didn't understand it so they never attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media people can't figure out whether they should lease their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither can anyone else because they don't teach the concept in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance and Ebonics. Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" is putting the second round through the same hole as the first. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two thin
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
A-Men CLINT! - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The media people didn't understand it so they never attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media people can't figure out whether they should lease their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither can anyone else because they don't teach the concept in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance and Ebonics. Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" is putting the second round through the same hole as the first. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and charged with sedition. The old saying "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" exists not because rich people screw poor people but because the government screws poor people. They do this because they can - you see, the rich people "get it". They understand how the tax system works and how to circumvent the system. Poor people don't have the knowledge so they get screwed. It isn't a big conspiracy, it is your elected representatives creating a tax system that enables them to tax the people with the smallest voice - and that is you and me. Finally, permit me to say that, I can teach ANYONE who graduated from high school these two ideas and the fact that our high schools do NOT teach these things is, IMHO, nearly criminal. I was taught these ideas in the first accounting class I took to become a CPA. Every CPA understands this stuff which is why all CPAs hate taxes. But th
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? {public apology}
I wrote a scathing email to the person or persons that went "political" in this last couple of threads. Well I was not happy for many reasons. Suffice to say, we all don't have the same recollections and some of us who invest heavily get very frustrated by J6P's version if events. When the list went with the thread and kept it going, I was the one who should have just deleted the messages and shut up. Please accept my apology, who ever you are, out there. mike --- gail <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > craig, i dont think anyone could have said it any > better. > - Original Message - > From: Dan McIntosh > To: Craig Ellis ; The Chevelle Mailing List > Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 5:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > > Teaching tolerance isnt a bad thing IMO, whether > it be gay tolerance or race tolerance or anything > else.. > > As long as were on the subject of firearms, I'll > be taking my CCW class in the beginning of December. > > > Dan McIntosh > 1960 Impala Sport Coupe > Street Metal Fabrications > http://www.lowriderimpala.com > - Original Message - > From: Craig Ellis > To: The Chevelle Mailing List > Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:28 PM > Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > > Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once > announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The > media people didn't understand it so they never > attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media > people can't figure out whether they should lease > their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither > can anyone else because they don't teach the concept > in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance > and Ebonics. > > Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" > is putting the second round through the same hole as > the first. > > ----- Original Message - > From: Clint Hooper > To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM > Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > > Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government > takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." > Clint Hooper > H&H Custom,owner > 1969 El Camino ProTourer > 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger > > http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm > - Original Message - > From: Craig Ellis > > > Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed > raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS > wants them to, not because government wants them to. > 99.% of the people in the world do not know that > inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians > and media because a) it is over the head of most > media people and b) it is over the head of nearly > all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. > > > Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a > currency. When you see the "national debt" number, > what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. > The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to > American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and > 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes > and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings > Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, > people or countries or companies who owe more money > in debt than is owed to them by others. The > government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic > margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because > it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that > have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less > than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the > bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. > > All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might > remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the > national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could > not pay it off so the government, then under Richard > Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And > this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from > 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. > Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you > might also remember stories about the inflation rate > in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. > That, too, is just the government in power > "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the > world, all the time. > > If you really want to see true change in > this country, demand that your schools teach people > two things: Th
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
craig, i dont think anyone could have said it any better. - Original Message - From: Dan McIntosh To: Craig Ellis ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 5:04 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Teaching tolerance isnt a bad thing IMO, whether it be gay tolerance or race tolerance or anything else.. As long as were on the subject of firearms, I'll be taking my CCW class in the beginning of December. Dan McIntosh1960 Impala Sport CoupeStreet Metal Fabricationshttp://www.lowriderimpala.com - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The media people didn't understand it so they never attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media people can't figure out whether they should lease their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither can anyone else because they don't teach the concept in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance and Ebonics. Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" is putting the second round through the same hole as the first. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and ch
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Teaching tolerance isnt a bad thing IMO, whether it be gay tolerance or race tolerance or anything else.. As long as were on the subject of firearms, I'll be taking my CCW class in the beginning of December. Dan McIntosh1960 Impala Sport CoupeStreet Metal Fabricationshttp://www.lowriderimpala.com - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The media people didn't understand it so they never attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media people can't figure out whether they should lease their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither can anyone else because they don't teach the concept in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance and Ebonics. Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" is putting the second round through the same hole as the first. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and charged with sedition. The old saying "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" exists not because rich people screw poor people but because the government screws poor people. They do this because they can - you see, the rich people "get it". They understand how the tax system works and how to circumvent the system. Poor people don't have the knowledge so they get screwed. It isn't a big conspiracy, it is your elected representatives creating a tax system that enables them to tax the people with the smallest voice - and that is you and me. Finally, permit me to say that, I can teach ANYONE who g
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Aint it the truth, Clint. Reagan once announced in a speech that "inflation is tax". The media people didn't understand it so they never attacked him for it. Lucky for Reagan, most media people can't figure out whether they should lease their new Chevy or buy it. For that matter, neither can anyone else because they don't teach the concept in school...they're too busy teaching gay tolerance and Ebonics. Just for the record, my idea of "gun control" is putting the second round through the same hole as the first. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and charged with sedition. The old saying "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" exists not because rich people screw poor people but because the government screws poor people. They do this because they can - you see, the rich people "get it". They understand how the tax system works and how to circumvent the system. Poor people don't have the knowledge so they get screwed. It isn't a big conspiracy, it is your elected representatives creating a tax system that enables them to tax the people with the smallest voice - and that is you and me. Finally, permit me to say that, I can teach ANYONE who graduated from high school these two ideas and the fact that our high schools do NOT teach these things is, IMHO, nearly criminal. I was taught these ideas in the first accounting class I took to become a CPA. Every CPA understands this stuff which is why all CPAs hate taxes. But that doesn't mean only CPAs "get it". This stuff is pretty easy when it is taught properly. - Original Message ----- From: Matthew Post To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I'm going to ha
Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Yep,Ronald Reagan said it best. "Government takes from the needy and gives to the greedy." Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and charged with sedition. The old saying "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" exists not because rich people screw poor people but because the government screws poor people. They do this because they can - you see, the rich people "get it". They understand how the tax system works and how to circumvent the system. Poor people don't have the knowledge so they get screwed. It isn't a big conspiracy, it is your elected representatives creating a tax system that enables them to tax the people with the smallest voice - and that is you and me. Finally, permit me to say that, I can teach ANYONE who graduated from high school these two ideas and the fact that our high schools do NOT teach these things is, IMHO, nearly criminal. I was taught these ideas in the first accounting class I took to become a CPA. Every CPA understands this stuff which is why all CPAs hate taxes. But that doesn't mean only CPAs "get it". This stuff is pretty easy when it is taught properly. - Original Message - From: Matthew Post To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Like I said, if the media tells people an economic indicator came in "worse than expected" it's perceived as bad. Even if an indicator may be trending downward, it still can be very strong. GDP has been clipping along at above 3% for several quarters in a row & unemployment is low at 5%. If the economics of the US are so bad, why would the FED continue to raise interest rates? Fact is the economy is doing well, so they are raising interest rates to prevent inflation. Believe it or not, the post-Katrina effect is going to be positive for the economy. Construction, building materials, etc. Of course, all this building is being fueled by government spending. The negative effect of Katrina will be inflation which the FED hopes to prevent and higher deficits. The deficit is being funded by foreign investment
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Again, I hate to interject here but the Fed raises rates to check inflation because BUSINESS wants them to, not because government wants them to. 99.% of the people in the world do not know that inflation is TAX. It is not discussed by politicians and media because a) it is over the head of most media people and b) it is over the head of nearly all attorneys and our politicians are all attorneys. Inflation is the systematic devaluation of a currency. When you see the "national debt" number, what is not discussed is to whom that debt is owed. The fact is, the debt is owed almost entirely to American citizens (and their pension plans, IRAs and 401ks) in the form of US Treasury bills and notes and bonds (among which is the ubiquitous Savings Bond). Inflation benefits "net debtors", that is, people or countries or companies who owe more money in debt than is owed to them by others. The government is the biggest "net debtor" by a gigantic margin. Thus, inflation HELPS the government because it allows them to pay YOU back with dollars that have been "devalued"...that is, they are worth less than the dollars you loaned them when you bought the bond, T-bill, T-note, etc. All you Vietnam era vets and citizens might remember that at the end of the Vietnam War the national debt was staggering. In fact, the US could not pay it off so the government, then under Richard Nixon, devalued the currency 25% in one day. And this was on top of inflation rates that ranged from 12% to 20% over the preceeding three or four years. Folks, this is "inflation" gone mad. Some of you might also remember stories about the inflation rate in Brazil being 100% per month and things like that. That, too, is just the government in power "devaluing" the currency. It happens all over the world, all the time. If you really want to see true change in this country, demand that your schools teach people two things: The "time value of money" (also called "discounted cash flow" and how to figure it out) and the difference between "progressive" and "regressive" tax systems. If ordinary people understood these two things, every politician in office would be thrown out on his or her fat behind - Repulicans and Democrats alike. In fact, I'll go farther than that - if people understood the concept of regressive taxes alone every politician in office would be arrested and charged with sedition. The old saying "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" exists not because rich people screw poor people but because the government screws poor people. They do this because they can - you see, the rich people "get it". They understand how the tax system works and how to circumvent the system. Poor people don't have the knowledge so they get screwed. It isn't a big conspiracy, it is your elected representatives creating a tax system that enables them to tax the people with the smallest voice - and that is you and me. Finally, permit me to say that, I can teach ANYONE who graduated from high school these two ideas and the fact that our high schools do NOT teach these things is, IMHO, nearly criminal. I was taught these ideas in the first accounting class I took to become a CPA. Every CPA understands this stuff which is why all CPAs hate taxes. But that doesn't mean only CPAs "get it". This stuff is pretty easy when it is taught properly. - Original Message - From: Matthew Post To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Like I said, if the media tells people an economic indicator came in "worse than expected" it's perceived as bad. Even if an indicator may be trending downward, it still can be very strong. GDP has been clipping along at above 3% for several quarters in a row & unemployment is low at 5%. If the economics of the US are so bad, why would the FED continue to raise interest rates? Fact is the economy is doing well, so they are raising interest rates to prevent inflation. Believe it or not, the post-Katrina effect is going to be positive for the economy. Construction, building materials, etc. Of course, all this building is being fueled by government spending. The negative effect of Katrina will be inflation which the FED hopes to prevent and higher deficits. The deficit is being funded by foreign investment at a pace of $100 Billion a Month. So, the US is screwed when other countries won't fund our spending.At 04:54 PM 11/22/2005, Clint Hooper wrote: Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's
Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
You obviously have a good handle on economics,Matt. I'll concede your points. What countries do you think are funding the largest part of our foreign investment? What would happen if they decide to stop? Seems I remember an Asian nation starting WWII because we tried to strangle them,economically. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Like I said, if the media tells people an economic indicator came in "worse than expected" it's perceived as bad. Even if an indicator may be trending downward, it still can be very strong. GDP has been clipping along at above 3% for several quarters in a row & unemployment is low at 5%. If the economics of the US are so bad, why would the FED continue to raise interest rates? Fact is the economy is doing well, so they are raising interest rates to prevent inflation. Believe it or not, the post-Katrina effect is going to be positive for the economy. Construction, building materials, etc. Of course, all this building is being fueled by government spending. The negative effect of Katrina will be inflation which the FED hopes to prevent and higher deficits. The deficit is being funded by foreign investment at a pace of $100 Billion a Month. So, the US is screwed when other countries won't fund our spending.
Fw: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I understand the frustration,Mike. However,there are more buying options than you think. Isn't it ironic that we give our enemy China the money to eventually take us on in a war (give it less than ten years) when we would give to an ally (Mexico)? Trading with our southern neighbors would seem to cure two problems; one being the illegal immigration and the other would be the upgraded standard of living would tend to hurt all the insurgencies they have down there. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Mike Holleman Craig, The only trouble with this logic is we will then be WALKING around NAKED without anything the PLAY with. It really has gotten to this point because China has become our new cheap labor market. I don't like it either but I'm not sure it is within our ability to change it. Mike Holleman - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis In my opinion, buy NOTHING made in China...not clothes, not toys, not car parts, nothing. It is the only message you can send.
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
well said bill! - Original Message - From: Bill Bradley To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:39 AM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok, i guess its time for me to toss in my 2 cents.I'm an american. i could care less where your (or my ) ancestors came from .i drive what i can afford and what i like. i buy american. if i buy a foreign vehicle its used, i know where my money goes (to an american). and since tomorrow is Thanksgiving in the United States i just thought i'd mention how thankful i am that i can buy what i want , from whoever i want, and can bitch about whatever i want when i want. and i know each and every one of you are thankful you have the right to hear me bitch on any subject i please. the bitching stops when i'm 6 foot under. thanks for your tollerance, feel FREE to bitch. Bill Bradley Edmond Oklahoma Marine combat vet Chevelle owner spoiled American and proud of it - Original Message - From: Larry Shouse To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:05 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Now maybe we're getting somewhere... Maybe not buying Japanese is a bit more personal for you than unfair trade practices. Sorry to hear about your grandfather James. Having said that, I will also tell you that I am half Japanese, was born an American, I served my country, and I fly Old Glory WITH PRIDE every day. Even though I am half Japanese, it's something I usually don't even think about, unless I run across someone wanting to blame me for something done by someone else generations ago. This being America, you're certainly within your right to think and spend your money as you see fit. As for me, I buy things because it meets my needs or fancy, not necessarily where it's made. All else being equal - or close, I will try to buy American. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:02 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same op
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
haha james, i'll keep that in mind. - Original Message - From: Rozanski Joe (AP/EDC) To: Craig Ellis ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 9:00 AM Subject: RE: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? to bitch on the other foot, the american auto companies are sending the work and product overseas because it is cheaper for labor and product.So the cost is cheaper but we don't see the cost of cars going down. just the profit going up. so who is screwing who?they are closing plants and technology down here, so who is going to cars in the u.s. without a job or money and we can only export so much. but with todays economy you have to think about better bang for the buck, which would be foreign vehicles.but for me as a auto worker RACE CHEVYS and TOW THEM WITH FORDS. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Craig EllisSent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:41 AMTo: The Chevelle Mailing ListSubject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? By the way, I just wrote a note to the LIST about profits and whatnot - I inadvertently wrote that note in a "reply" to a posted note by Clint Hooper but it was NOT intended to go to Clint. I just didn't think to create a new message for my little rant. So, I hope no one thought I was cranked up a Clint. Just for the record, I wouldn't buy a Japanese car unless you had a gun pointed at me and I was pretty sure you'd pull the trigger. These days I am a recruiter in the automotive industry and recruit plant operations, engineering, and management people all over the country and mostly for domestic OEM suppliers. I know a lot about the business and Clint is exactly right: Unfair trade with China and other countries is killing us. What is even more apalling is that we are not only hiring the Chinese to make the parts, we are giving them the technology and education to do it. It is madness. In my opinion, buy NOTHING made in China...not clothes, not toys, not car parts, nothing. It is the only message you can send. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for ou
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Craig, The only trouble with this logic is we will then be WALKING around NAKED without anything the PLAY with. It really has gotten to this point because China has become our new cheap labor market. I don't like it either but I'm not sure it is within our ability to change it. Mike Holleman - Original Message - From: Craig Ellis To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:41 AM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? By the way, I just wrote a note to the LIST about profits and whatnot - I inadvertently wrote that note in a "reply" to a posted note by Clint Hooper but it was NOT intended to go to Clint. I just didn't think to create a new message for my little rant. So, I hope no one thought I was cranked up a Clint. Just for the record, I wouldn't buy a Japanese car unless you had a gun pointed at me and I was pretty sure you'd pull the trigger. These days I am a recruiter in the automotive industry and recruit plant operations, engineering, and management people all over the country and mostly for domestic OEM suppliers. I know a lot about the business and Clint is exactly right: Unfair trade with China and other countries is killing us. What is even more apalling is that we are not only hiring the Chinese to make the parts, we are giving them the technology and education to do it. It is madness. In my opinion, buy NOTHING made in China...not clothes, not toys, not car parts, nothing. It is the only message you can send. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Origin
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Like I said, if the media tells people an economic indicator came in "worse than expected" it's perceived as bad. Even if an indicator may be trending downward, it still can be very strong. GDP has been clipping along at above 3% for several quarters in a row & unemployment is low at 5%. If the economics of the US are so bad, why would the FED continue to raise interest rates? Fact is the economy is doing well, so they are raising interest rates to prevent inflation. Believe it or not, the post-Katrina effect is going to be positive for the economy. Construction, building materials, etc. Of course, all this building is being fueled by government spending. The negative effect of Katrina will be inflation which the FED hopes to prevent and higher deficits. The deficit is being funded by foreign investment at a pace of $100 Billion a Month. So, the US is screwed when other countries won't fund our spending. At 04:54 PM 11/22/2005, Clint Hooper wrote: Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's certainly not us kicking their butts. As for France,who the heck cares? I'm an optimist but the US economy isn't doing that well,Matt. Most of the economic indicators are trending downward. However,disasters like Katrina sure haven't done us any favors. Even though I support what we're doing in Iraq and Afghanistan,the cost is hurting us,bigtime. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief. At 04:28 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich -Original Message-
RE: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
to bitch on the other foot, the american auto companies are sending the work and product overseas because it is cheaper for labor and product.So the cost is cheaper but we don't see the cost of cars going down. just the profit going up. so who is screwing who?they are closing plants and technology down here, so who is going to cars in the u.s. without a job or money and we can only export so much. but with todays economy you have to think about better bang for the buck, which would be foreign vehicles.but for me as a auto worker RACE CHEVYS and TOW THEM WITH FORDS. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Craig EllisSent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:41 AMTo: The Chevelle Mailing ListSubject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? By the way, I just wrote a note to the LIST about profits and whatnot - I inadvertently wrote that note in a "reply" to a posted note by Clint Hooper but it was NOT intended to go to Clint. I just didn't think to create a new message for my little rant. So, I hope no one thought I was cranked up a Clint. Just for the record, I wouldn't buy a Japanese car unless you had a gun pointed at me and I was pretty sure you'd pull the trigger. These days I am a recruiter in the automotive industry and recruit plant operations, engineering, and management people all over the country and mostly for domestic OEM suppliers. I know a lot about the business and Clint is exactly right: Unfair trade with China and other countries is killing us. What is even more apalling is that we are not only hiring the Chinese to make the parts, we are giving them the technology and education to do it. It is madness. In my opinion, buy NOTHING made in China...not clothes, not toys, not car parts, nothing. It is the only message you can send. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and lay
RE: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
amen Craig! And i think that should go for India also. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Craig EllisSent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 8:41 AMTo: The Chevelle Mailing ListSubject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? By the way, I just wrote a note to the LIST about profits and whatnot - I inadvertently wrote that note in a "reply" to a posted note by Clint Hooper but it was NOT intended to go to Clint. I just didn't think to create a new message for my little rant. So, I hope no one thought I was cranked up a Clint. Just for the record, I wouldn't buy a Japanese car unless you had a gun pointed at me and I was pretty sure you'd pull the trigger. These days I am a recruiter in the automotive industry and recruit plant operations, engineering, and management people all over the country and mostly for domestic OEM suppliers. I know a lot about the business and Clint is exactly right: Unfair trade with China and other countries is killing us. What is even more apalling is that we are not only hiring the Chinese to make the parts, we are giving them the technology and education to do it. It is madness. In my opinion, buy NOTHING made in China...not clothes, not toys, not car parts, nothing. It is the only message you can send. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
By the way, I just wrote a note to the LIST about profits and whatnot - I inadvertently wrote that note in a "reply" to a posted note by Clint Hooper but it was NOT intended to go to Clint. I just didn't think to create a new message for my little rant. So, I hope no one thought I was cranked up a Clint. Just for the record, I wouldn't buy a Japanese car unless you had a gun pointed at me and I was pretty sure you'd pull the trigger. These days I am a recruiter in the automotive industry and recruit plant operations, engineering, and management people all over the country and mostly for domestic OEM suppliers. I know a lot about the business and Clint is exactly right: Unfair trade with China and other countries is killing us. What is even more apalling is that we are not only hiring the Chinese to make the parts, we are giving them the technology and education to do it. It is madness. In my opinion, buy NOTHING made in China...not clothes, not toys, not car parts, nothing. It is the only message you can send. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are ver
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
ok, i guess its time for me to toss in my 2 cents.I'm an american. i could care less where your (or my ) ancestors came from .i drive what i can afford and what i like. i buy american. if i buy a foreign vehicle its used, i know where my money goes (to an american). and since tomorrow is Thanksgiving in the United States i just thought i'd mention how thankful i am that i can buy what i want , from whoever i want, and can bitch about whatever i want when i want. and i know each and every one of you are thankful you have the right to hear me bitch on any subject i please. the bitching stops when i'm 6 foot under. thanks for your tollerance, feel FREE to bitch. Bill Bradley Edmond Oklahoma Marine combat vet Chevelle owner spoiled American and proud of it - Original Message - From: Larry Shouse To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:05 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Now maybe we're getting somewhere... Maybe not buying Japanese is a bit more personal for you than unfair trade practices. Sorry to hear about your grandfather James. Having said that, I will also tell you that I am half Japanese, was born an American, I served my country, and I fly Old Glory WITH PRIDE every day. Even though I am half Japanese, it's something I usually don't even think about, unless I run across someone wanting to blame me for something done by someone else generations ago. This being America, you're certainly within your right to think and spend your money as you see fit. As for me, I buy things because it meets my needs or fancy, not necessarily where it's made. All else being equal - or close, I will try to buy American. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:02 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt i
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Just to get things clarified here. One, "profits" go to the OWNERS, be they Japanese, Russian, American, or whatever. That is the way is should be, unless you believe that companies should not make profits or that profits should go to the government. Two, auto manufacturers source components with three things in mind: Price, quality, location, in that order. If you will build a transmission in Ohio for the same price and at the same quality of one built in British Columbia, chances are pretty good that the plant in Ohio will supply the OEM assembly plant in Ohio. There is nothing nefarious going on in the car business any more than there is in the oil business or the lumber business or the pharmaceutical business. Do the people in power at those companies look out for themselves? You bet they do. But remember that ALL people in ALL companies in ALL countries and in ALL industries do exactly the same thing - it is human nature. I was (and still am) a CPA and audited internal controls for years at companies like GM and Mayo Clinic. I know whereof I speak. Business managers have a responsibility to the owners of the company to make money for them. They have a responsibility to do everything in their power to accomplish that goal short of breaking the law. It's their job. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:15 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are the US-made Toyotas made in the USA or assembled in the USA? Are their engines and transmissions made here? I know their electronics are not made here. Neither are their rolling stock and suspension components. If the companies are Japanese-owned,most of their profits don't stay in America. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post That's very interesting. So, it makes me wonder if that makes it an American car? Guess it depends on how you look at it. Either by where and by who it's made or who ultimately owns the company.At 03:32 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: I am one of those silent people learning from eveyone else. First, I am the proud owner of a '65 Chevelle SS. Secondly, I work for a Japanese transplant parts suppliers in Missouri. I can't say for all parts but I do know most of the parts on American made Toyota's are made in the USA. From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: The Chevelle Mailing List To: The Chevelle Mailing List ,"The Chevelle Mailing List" Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 13:12:18 -0800 Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've
RE: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Clint, I don’t care what party you voted for….ask yourself, by the time they take all the contributions from all the special interests, where does that leave John Q Public….in the hole!! Notice that many companies go either way to cover their bets! Enough pissing and moaning….I ordered the GW setup. I know there is better, but they gave me a $600 discount..I have checked into the ATX spindles, but they are not ready for sale, and..I would have to upgrade my mags. Too much for one time! I’m not quite as rich as you are Clint..GRIN. The ATX spindles will run close to $800 a piece, plus I would still need to upgrade the A arms! Oh well…I can cry later. I also found out I need to upgrade to a 12:1 steering box. Any suggestions on who to get it from or get my old one reworked. Plus some mods on my rear axle for the upgraded Wilwood rear brakes. You were correct, about their being some sharp folks on Lateral G. Thanks for the recommendation. Dan From: Clint Hooper [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:25 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I agree 100%,Dan. The chips are lining up and I'm very concerned we're going to see them domino,,soon. Our government,both GOP and DNC,is not learning from the past. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Dan Mascheck I work in the ag sector and with all the smaller farms we have…I’m seeing them go south for the winter. With recent fuel prices being so high even with the recent drop, fertilizer is astronomical, and the price they receive is so low. It’s impossible to pencil a cash flow. Only if you’re a huge corporate farm can you maybe make it! My son served two terms in Iraq. Thank God he’s alive and well! We’ll be paying the cost for years. I some time wonder if the Iraqi’s really appreciate the sacrifice? Add fuel, Katrina, and all the other negative things going on, I feel like we are getting ready to hit a brick wall on the economy! I pray I’m wrong!! From: Clint Hooper [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 6:55 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's certainly not us kicking their butts. As for France,who the heck cares? I'm an optimist but the US economy isn't doing that well,Matt. Most of the economic indicators are trending downward. However,disasters like Katrina sure haven't done us any favors. Even though I support what we're doing in Iraq and Afghanistan,the cost is hurting us,bigtime. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief. At 04:28 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been &qu
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Some good insight to the urban sprawl, ag system and the demise of our culture is in Fast Food Nation. I highly recommend reading it. Mark On Nov 22, 2005, at 6:24 PM, Clint Hooper wrote: I agree 100%,Dan. The chips are lining up and I'm very concerned we're going to see them domino,,soon. Our government,both GOP and DNC,is not learning from the past. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Dan Mascheck I work in the ag sector and with all the smaller farms we have…I’m seeing them go south for the winter. With recent fuel prices being so high even with the recent drop, fertilizer is astronomical, and the price they receive is so low. It’s impossible to pencil a cash flow. Only if you’re a huge corporate farm can you maybe make it! My son served two terms in Iraq. Thank God he’s alive and well! We’ll be paying the cost for years. I some time wonder if the Iraqi’s really appreciate the sacrifice? Add fuel, Katrina, and all the other negative things going on, I feel like we are getting ready to hit a brick wall on the economy! I pray I’m wrong!! From: Clint Hooper [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 6:55 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's certainly not us kicking their butts. As for France,who the heck cares? I'm an optimist but the US economy isn't doing that well,Matt. Most of the economic indicators are trending downward. However,disasters like Katrina sure haven't done us any favors. Even though I support what we're doing in Iraq and Afghanistan,the cost is hurting us,bigtime. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief.
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I agree 100%,Dan. The chips are lining up and I'm very concerned we're going to see them domino,,soon. Our government,both GOP and DNC,is not learning from the past. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Dan Mascheck I work in the ag sector and with all the smaller farms we have Im seeing them go south for the winter. With recent fuel prices being so high even with the recent drop, fertilizer is astronomical, and the price they receive is so low. Its impossible to pencil a cash flow. Only if youre a huge corporate farm can you maybe make it! My son served two terms in Iraq. Thank God hes alive and well! Well be paying the cost for years. I some time wonder if the Iraqis really appreciate the sacrifice? Add fuel, Katrina, and all the other negative things going on, I feel like we are getting ready to hit a brick wall on the economy! I pray Im wrong!! From: Clint Hooper [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 6:55 PMTo: The Chevelle Mailing ListSubject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's certainly not us kicking their butts. As for France,who the heck cares? I'm an optimist but the US economy isn't doing that well,Matt. Most of the economic indicators are trending downward. However,disasters like Katrina sure haven't done us any favors. Even though I support what we're doing in Iraq and Afghanistan,the cost is hurting us,bigtime. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief.At 04:28 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson.However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success.Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. &g
RE: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I work in the ag sector and with all the smaller farms we have…I’m seeing them go south for the winter. With recent fuel prices being so high even with the recent drop, fertilizer is astronomical, and the price they receive is so low. It’s impossible to pencil a cash flow. Only if you’re a huge corporate farm can you maybe make it! My son served two terms in Iraq. Thank God he’s alive and well! We’ll be paying the cost for years. I some time wonder if the Iraqi’s really appreciate the sacrifice? Add fuel, Katrina, and all the other negative things going on, I feel like we are getting ready to hit a brick wall on the economy! I pray I’m wrong!! From: Clint Hooper [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 6:55 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's certainly not us kicking their butts. As for France,who the heck cares? I'm an optimist but the US economy isn't doing that well,Matt. Most of the economic indicators are trending downward. However,disasters like Katrina sure haven't done us any favors. Even though I support what we're doing in Iraq and Afghanistan,the cost is hurting us,bigtime. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief. At 04:28 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich -Original Message- From: Matthew Post Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehi
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Nahh,just trying to liven up a boring day,Mike. Looks like it worked,too. Now,back to our regularly scheduled programming! Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: "mike f" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Is this a Geo-political Forum now? > Mike
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Personally, I consider the folks on this list family. Sometimes we like to get each others opinions/feelings because for the most part we respect and trust each other. Brian From: mike f <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: The Chevelle Mailing List To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 17:57:29 -0800 (PST) Is this a Geo-political Forum now? Mike --- Clint Hooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's > your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one > Harley Davidson. > However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's > killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's > success. > Clint Hooper > H&H Custom,owner > 1969 El Camino ProTourer > 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger > http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm > - Original Message - > From: James Strunk > > > my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese > product,even if it's your rightyou ARE > supporting a country that attacked and brutally > killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, > that refuses to allow our products to be sold in > their country,,,that's right,,exercise your > right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US > - Original Message - > From: Marlon Hanson > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing > List > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM > Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > > I think the big picture is that too many of us > our looking at our own short term benefit, just as > GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the > Japanese take over the auto market. They went for > short term quarter to quarter gains profits so > everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses > and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense > been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to > be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out > of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be > a significant problem for our grandchildren. We > can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the > brutality of every country we now buy from during > past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing > compared to what was done to our soldiers who were > captured were subjected to in World War II and > since. And... Now that our funds are gradually > funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we > know what their attitude toward personal liberties > are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... > good for us today. For our children? for our > grandchildren? > I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at > what I'm buying and try to stay as American as > possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is > getting harder and harder. > Marlon. > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I agree with all of you; but you're missing > the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not > open their trading borders, not just for Autos but > all products, with the same open arms that we do. > Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit > dollars really go after the cars are built in > America? > > BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and > laying off some 30,000 employees. > > Rich > > > -Original Message- > From: Matthew Post > Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM > To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle > Mailing List > Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY > American built anymore? And by that I mean without > Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt > it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those > Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly > Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid > the customs duties associated with finished goods, > but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. > > I guess my point is that the lines are very > blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all > for it, but you have to wonder how much of the > product is really American. Besides, the Japanese > automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their > ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford. > > Matt > > At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: > > I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese > vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as > an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit > and value for our given situation. Besides, many > "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the > United States, while many of our American vehicles > are assem
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Now maybe we're getting somewhere... Maybe not buying Japanese is a bit more personal for you than unfair trade practices. Sorry to hear about your grandfather James. Having said that, I will also tell you that I am half Japanese, was born an American, I served my country, and I fly Old Glory WITH PRIDE every day. Even though I am half Japanese, it's something I usually don't even think about, unless I run across someone wanting to blame me for something done by someone else generations ago. This being America, you're certainly within your right to think and spend your money as you see fit. As for me, I buy things because it meets my needs or fancy, not necessarily where it's made. All else being equal - or close, I will try to buy American. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:02 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? T
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I agree,Dan. I've built some serious Bugs and Ghias in my day. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Dan McIntosh Hey now, don't bash them V-Dubbs, I happen to own a 73 Beetle Dan McIntosh1960 Impala Sport CoupeStreet Metal Fabricationshttp://www.lowriderimpala.com - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? well i own my 72 ss chevelle conv. ,a 47 ford bus coupe (life long project) 67 harley chopper and a 93 harley lowrider ,but because of non drivin fools all over the road i also have a 95 jetta and a 91 camry...wifes car i wont let her near the chevelle ,but i cant afford to keep putting 1000.00 fenders on my chevelle cause aftermarket sux,and i am lucky to have the toys i have and enjoy driving them im not wealthy but i do have a garage and was lucky enuff to buy my son a 73 nova for us to work on my grandfather was a cmh as well as silver star and 3 purple hearts for his involvement in ww2 and i am so proud to be an american ,i paid veryu little for both of my imports and i drive them like i do my others fast and hard when they die they die and i go get another but that chevelle and the bikes well they have been there and until i die they will be there with my sons i cant afford to have my toys and have a disposable american car or truck so that's how i feel about it and i also rember my grandfather owning a 70 something vw hatchback so it didn't seem to hurt his pride just a car a cheap disposable car ...who cares if it gets hit or scratched or breaks down in some parking lot it is what it is Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Is this a Geo-political Forum now? Mike --- Clint Hooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's > your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one > Harley Davidson. > However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's > killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's > success. > Clint Hooper > H&H Custom,owner > 1969 El Camino ProTourer > 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger > http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm > - Original Message - > From: James Strunk > > > my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese > product,even if it's your rightyou ARE > supporting a country that attacked and brutally > killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, > that refuses to allow our products to be sold in > their country,,,that's right,,exercise your > right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US > - Original Message - > From: Marlon Hanson > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing > List > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM > Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > > I think the big picture is that too many of us > our looking at our own short term benefit, just as > GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the > Japanese take over the auto market. They went for > short term quarter to quarter gains profits so > everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses > and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense > been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to > be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out > of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be > a significant problem for our grandchildren. We > can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the > brutality of every country we now buy from during > past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing > compared to what was done to our soldiers who were > captured were subjected to in World War II and > since. And... Now that our funds are gradually > funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we > know what their attitude toward personal liberties > are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... > good for us today. For our children? for our > grandchildren? > I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at > what I'm buying and try to stay as American as > possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is > getting harder and harder. > Marlon. > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I agree with all of you; but you're missing > the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not > open their trading borders, not just for Autos but > all products, with the same open arms that we do. > Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit > dollars really go after the cars are built in > America? > > BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and > laying off some 30,000 employees. > > Rich > > > -Original Message- > From: Matthew Post > Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM > To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle > Mailing List > Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? > > Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY > American built anymore? And by that I mean without > Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt > it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those > Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly > Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid > the customs duties associated with finished goods, > but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. > > I guess my point is that the lines are very > blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all > for it, but you have to wonder how much of the > product is really American. Besides, the Japanese > automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their > ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford. > > Matt > > At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: > > I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese > vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as > an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit > and value for our given situation. Besides, many > "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the > United States, while many of our American vehicles > are assembled in other countries. Same goes for > parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's > your right and I will defend your right to do so, > but good luck accomplishing your goal. > > Larry Shouse > > - Original Message - > > From: James Strunk > >
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Hey now, don't bash them V-Dubbs, I happen to own a 73 Beetle Dan McIntosh1960 Impala Sport CoupeStreet Metal Fabricationshttp://www.lowriderimpala.com - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? well i own my 72 ss chevelle conv. ,a 47 ford bus coupe (life long project) 67 harley chopper and a 93 harley lowrider ,but because of non drivin fools all over the road i also have a 95 jetta and a 91 camry...wifes car i wont let her near the chevelle ,but i cant afford to keep putting 1000.00 fenders on my chevelle cause aftermarket sux,and i am lucky to have the toys i have and enjoy driving them im not wealthy but i do have a garage and was lucky enuff to buy my son a 73 nova for us to work on my grandfather was a cmh as well as silver star and 3 purple hearts for his involvement in ww2 and i am so proud to be an american ,i paid veryu little for both of my imports and i drive them like i do my others fast and hard when they die they die and i go get another but that chevelle and the bikes well they have been there and until i die they will be there with my sons i cant afford to have my toys and have a disposable american car or truck so that's how i feel about it and i also rember my grandfather owning a 70 something vw hatchback so it didn't seem to hurt his pride just a car a cheap disposable car ...who cares if it gets hit or scratched or breaks down in some parking lot it is what it is Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
well i own my 72 ss chevelle conv. ,a 47 ford bus coupe (life long project) 67 harley chopper and a 93 harley lowrider ,but because of non drivin fools all over the road i also have a 95 jetta and a 91 camry...wifes car i wont let her near the chevelle ,but i cant afford to keep putting 1000.00 fenders on my chevelle cause aftermarket sux,and i am lucky to have the toys i have and enjoy driving them im not wealthy but i do have a garage and was lucky enuff to buy my son a 73 nova for us to work on my grandfather was a cmh as well as silver star and 3 purple hearts for his involvement in ww2 and i am so proud to be an american ,i paid veryu little for both of my imports and i drive them like i do my others fast and hard when they die they die and i go get another but that chevelle and the bikes well they have been there and until i die they will be there with my sons i cant afford to have my toys and have a disposable american car or truck so that's how i feel about it and i also rember my grandfather owning a 70 something vw hatchback so it didn't seem to hurt his pride just a car a cheap disposable car ...who cares if it gets hit or scratched or breaks down in some parking lot it is what it is Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Only speaking for myself,I buy very little from Walmart even though we have a Supercenter located one mile from my house. Most of what I do buy from them are magazines and an occasional box of US amunition for my guns. Groceries too but they are obviously American-produced. Right? I've owned many foreign cars and a few trucks in the past. Never thought their quality was any better and the cost of repairs is a lot higher so,I quit buying them. My GM vehicles have always been more reliable,,for me anyway. I can't speak for others. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post You won't buy a Japanese car, but you probably shop at Wal-Mart.
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Germany's reunification with Combloc East Germany is the main reason for their struggles,at the moment. It's certainly not us kicking their butts. As for France,who the heck cares? I'm an optimist but the US economy isn't doing that well,Matt. Most of the economic indicators are trending downward. However,disasters like Katrina sure haven't done us any favors. Even though I support what we're doing in Iraq and Afghanistan,the cost is hurting us,bigtime. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief.At 04:28 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson.However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success.Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich -Original Message- From: Matthew Post Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
What people fail to see and what the media fails to report is how well our economy is actually doing. Europe and Asia cannot keep up. With the exception of China, who has to revert to unfair trade practices to succeed, we are doing better than anywhere else. Japan has been in a decade long depression (wonder it that's why they don't buy American products), Germany has been in a recession, unemployment is over 10% in France..We've become a country of pessimists and the media just fuels that belief. At 04:28 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich -Original Message- From: Matthew Post Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message ----- From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a sp
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
You won't buy a Japanese car, but you probably shop at Wal-Mart. At 04:02 PM 11/22/2005, James Strunk wrote: my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich -Original Message- From: Matthew Post Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
You guys can buy foreign cars all you want. It's your right to do so. I own two GM vehicles and one Harley Davidson. However,unfair trade with the Chinese is what's killing our economy. Just look at ChinaMart's success. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: James Strunk my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,,
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Are the US-made Toyotas made in the USA or assembled in the USA? Are their engines and transmissions made here? I know their electronics are not made here. Neither are their rolling stock and suspension components. If the companies are Japanese-owned,most of their profits don't stay in America. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Matthew Post That's very interesting. So, it makes me wonder if that makes it an American car? Guess it depends on how you look at it. Either by where and by who it's made or who ultimately owns the company.At 03:32 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: I am one of those silent people learning from eveyone else. First, I am the proud owner of a '65 Chevelle SS. Secondly, I work for a Japanese transplant parts suppliers in Missouri. I can't say for all parts but I do know most of the parts on American made Toyota's are made in the USA. From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: The Chevelle Mailing List To: The Chevelle Mailing List ,"The Chevelle Mailing List" Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 13:12:18 -0800 Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
my bottom line,,,when ANYONE owns a japanese product,even if it's your rightyou ARE supporting a country that attacked and brutally killed american solders, such as my grandfather,,, that refuses to allow our products to be sold in their country,,,that's right,,exercise your right,,buy from a race that will not buy from US - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying Ame! rica ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their ca! rs here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
That's very interesting. So, it makes me wonder if that makes it an American car? Guess it depends on how you look at it. Either by where and by who it's made or who ultimately owns the company. At 03:32 PM 11/22/2005, you wrote: I am one of those silent people learning from eveyone else. First, I am the proud owner of a '65 Chevelle SS. Secondly, I work for a Japanense transplant parts suppliers in Missouri. I can't say for all parts but I do know most of the parts on American made Toyota's are made in the USA. From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: The Chevelle Mailing List To: The Chevelle Mailing List ,"The Chevelle Mailing List" Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 13:12:18 -0800 Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Very good points Marlon. The U.S. has become the caretaker of the world. We dump billions of dollars helping other countries economies and poverty levels. I can't remember the exact number but I believe the U.S. has 26 million people living below the poverty level. What happened to taking care of us? The cold war is over. There was a reason in the day to defend our borders. Japan owns a significant portion of U.S soil. How and why did we let that happen. They could own us someday. Ron M. - Original Message - From: Marlon Hanson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 4:20 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying America ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I am one of those silent people learning from eveyone else. First, I am the proud owner of a '65 Chevelle SS. Secondly, I work for a Japanense transplant parts suppliers in Missouri. I can't say for all parts but I do know most of the parts on American made Toyota's are made in the USA. From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Reply-To: The Chevelle Mailing List To: The Chevelle Mailing List ,"The Chevelle Mailing List" Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 13:12:18 -0800Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I think the big picture is that too many of us our looking at our own short term benefit, just as GM and Ford did in the 80s when they let the Japanese take over the auto market. They went for short term quarter to quarter gains profits so everyone in upper management could earn fat bonuses and and stock would go up. Now we have in essense been "taken over" and more ownership of what used to be OUR country is gradually slipping completely out of American hands. Long term, this COULD prove to be a significant problem for our grandchildren. We can't be sure, but I do seem to recall that the brutality of every country we now buy from during past wars. Our "prisoner abuses" are nothing compared to what was done to our soldiers who were captured were subjected to in World War II and since. And... Now that our funds are gradually funneling into the middle east for gas and oil we know what their attitude toward personal liberties are. All that money goes toward buying America ... good for us today. For our children? for our grandchildren? I am a bit obstinate, but I carefully look at what I'm buying and try to stay as American as possible. From Cars to Wal Mart, I must admit it is getting harder and harder. Marlon.[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Speaking for the telecom industry, the Europeans are far more guilty of blocking American products and technologies than the Japanese. Fact is, no one is as open to trade as we are. Playing devil's advocate, I would argue that since both GM and Toyota are public companies (and traded on the NYSE) that the ultimate beneficiaries of profits are the shareholders (both foreign and domestic). Japan, as a country, is also the biggest foreign investor in US assets. So, if you think of it that way, all those Japanese fat cats making huge profits selling their products in the US are investing most of those profitsyou guessed it, right here in the USA. It's a shame about the layoffs at GM. They've been headed in the wrong direction for a long time. Matt At 01:22 PM 11/22/2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich -Original Message- From: Matthew Post Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I agree with all of you; but you're missing the big picture. James is right. The Japanese do not open their trading borders, not just for Autos but all products, with the same open arms that we do. Bottom line; follow the money. Where do those profit dollars really go after the cars are built in America? BTW, GM is closing 9[i think] plants and laying off some 30,000 employees. Rich-Original Message- From: Matthew Post <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Nov 22, 2005 4:12 PM To: The Chevelle Mailing List , The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe.I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford.MattAt 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Are there any vehicles that are ENTIRELY American built anymore? And by that I mean without Canadian or Mexican parts/assembly etc.? I doubt it. Larry makes a good point, but I believe those Japanese cars assembled here are made with mostly Japanese parts. They are assembled here to avoid the customs duties associated with finished goods, but GM and Ford do the same thing in Europe. I guess my point is that the lines are very blurred. People can say "Buy American" and I'm all for it, but you have to wonder how much of the product is really American. Besides, the Japanese automaker pays taxes to Uncle Sam for selling their cars here, same as GM or Ford. Matt At 12:32 PM 11/22/2005, Larry Shouse wrote: I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I'm not ashamed of owning a Japanese vehicle. As far as I'm concerned it's our right as an American to buy what we feel to be the best fit and value for our given situation. Besides, many "Japanese" cars and trucks are assembled here in the United States, while many of our American vehicles are assembled in other countries. Same goes for parts. You want to buy strictly American? That's your right and I will defend your right to do so, but good luck accomplishing your goal. Larry Shouse - Original Message - From: James Strunk To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Maybe everyone is on vacation this week. Dennis McGillis '65 Malibu SS in process of getting a 350 - Original Message - From: "Clint Hooper" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 8:15 PM Subject: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Sure has been quiet today. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I have an idea,,no a suggestion,get rid of that japanese car,,anybody should be ashamed to own japanese cars,they restict owr big three automakers to a specific # of cars that can be sold in japan,, FAIR TRADE ??? I've said before,,If you see me in a japanese car or truck,,call the law,,I've been kidnapped ! - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I think I'm an expert sometimes. X, we know from Algebra is the unknown. And a spurt is nothing more than a drip under pressure! Happy Thanksgiving everyone. Rich-Original Message- From: Bill Bradley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Nov 22, 2005 8:41 AM To: The Chevelle Mailing List Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? i was once a "pert" , do i qualify? - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
i was once a "pert" , do i qualify? - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
ok ok somebody has got to step and be the expert ..somebody? anybody ? gez maybe all of us together are the experts lol Darin Bailey
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I don’t know anythingand I am an Engineer. LOL - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: The Chevelle Mailing List Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:22 PM Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Expert? I'm just a rank amateur. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Ron Malespin Im here Clint. I just sit an listen to you experts. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper Sure has been quiet today.Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Expert? I'm just a rank amateur. Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm - Original Message - From: Ron Malespin Im here Clint. I just sit an listen to you experts. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper Sure has been quiet today.Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm
RE: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
I was wondering if I was the only one. Brian From: "Clint Hooper" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: The Chevelle Mailing List To: Subject: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 22:15:08 -0600 Sure has been quiet today. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm _ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
Re: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Im here Clint. I just sit an listen to you experts. - Original Message - From: Clint Hooper To: chevelle-list@chevelles.net Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:15 PM Subject: [Chevelle-list] Anyone home? Sure has been quiet today.Clint HooperH&H Custom,owner1969 El Camino ProTourer2001 H-D FLHR custom baggerhttp://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm
[Chevelle-list] Anyone home?
Sure has been quiet today. Clint Hooper H&H Custom,owner 1969 El Camino ProTourer 2001 H-D FLHR custom bagger http://dalesplace.com/misc/friends/clint/clint_hooper.htm