Re: Stus-List Also looking at a C 36 - engine at an angle?

[William Walker via CnC-List]

Bruce,
  Have owned my 36 for five years.  Love it.  Yes, the engine is mounted at 
slight angle.  As earlier respnse said, allows removal of shaft without 
dropping rudder.  Once you get used to it, it is a great advantage docking, as 
you can pull/push the stern a little with short bursts of power.  Not a 
problem.  When motoring, does require a slight port steer to keep going 
striaght, maybe an inch or two off dead center.  
  I love my boat.
Bill Walker
1981 CnC 36
Evening Star
Pentwater, Mi.



-Original Message-
From: Bruce via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: biz 
Sent: Sat, Sep 19, 2015 2:22 pm
Subject: Stus-List Also looking at a C 36 - engine at an angle?




Yeah, so... in my quest to find my next boat,
looking at a variety of
32-36' C
 
I looked at a C yesterday, the
first 36 I've inspected.  Was
surprised to note that, both from the
companionway access and the
lazarette access, it looked like the engine was
mounted offset - it
appeared to be angled maybe 3-4 degrees off centerline -
the forward end
on centerline, the aft end of it offset to port.
 
I wasn't
smart enough to look at the shaft (I only had a half hour on
the boat, broker
had another appoinment), but it got me to wondering -
is the shaft offset on
the 36 (to counteract prop-walking or something)?
 Or does this boat have a
major problem?


Thx
Bruce

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Stus-List C 30 main halyard size

[Scott via CnC-List]

This fall one of my projects will be to replace worn out sheaves at the base of 
the mast ,
Pull the upper pulley at the masthead and machine in a bronze bushing. It still 
has wire to rope halyard and am either going to replace with a new one or 
change out to all rope. My question is what size has anyone used on a c 30 
mki (1972). I know all rope is the go to choice nowadays but I like the feel of 
the larger diameter rope end of the wire to rope. Thanks in advance for any 
insight or experience , Scott


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Re: Stus-List C 30 main halyard size

[Gary Nylander via CnC-List]

I didn't change the upper pullies, and am using 7/16 or the metric 
equivalent (10mm, 11mm) for my halyards. I have three, one genoa is 11mm 
VPC, the other is 7/16 Sta-set plus and the main is 7/16 T-900. I replaced 
the blocks at the base and put in line organizers and run everything back to 
rope clutches near the companionway. My spin halyard is external and is too 
fat - 1/2 inch. We race, but are not over the top about weight, just want 
reasonable cost and stretch. Having it comfortable to the hand and workable 
in the clutches is important. The boat is so stiff, and we race in primarily 
light air for short distances, we don't worry about extra weight up top.


Gary
#593
- Original Message - 
From: "Scott via CnC-List" 

To: 
Cc: "Scott" 
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2015 3:08 PM
Subject: Stus-List C 30 main halyard size


This fall one of my projects will be to replace worn out sheaves at the 
base of the mast ,
Pull the upper pulley at the masthead and machine in a bronze bushing. It 
still has wire to rope halyard and am either going to replace with a new 
one or change out to all rope. My question is what size has anyone used on 
a c 30 mki (1972). I know all rope is the go to choice nowadays but I 
like the feel of the larger diameter rope end of the wire to rope. Thanks 
in advance for any insight or experience , Scott



Sent from my iPad
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Stus-List Bronze Steering Quadrant

[Knowles Rich via CnC-List]

During the fall cleanup at work, we have unearthed a brand new 10” radius 
bronze steering quadrant machined with keyway to fit a 2 ½” rudder post. It is 
similar in appearance to that shown at 
http://www.edsonmarine.com/ecatalogs/sail/00024.htm. It is not an Edson. It had 
“C 41” written in felt marker on it and I presume someone ordered it some 
time ago and failed to pick it up. If it’s of any use to someone, any offer 
over $200 plus shipping will get it. A bit of work with a saw would turn it 
into a very nice steering arm for a below decks autopilot ram.

Pictures available upon request

Rich Knowles
Nanaimo, BC
Still Boatless!









Rich Knowles
Nanaimo, BC
Boatless!





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Re: Stus-List Bronze Steering Quadrant

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Hi Rich,

I'll check Salerosa's r/stock diameter tomorrow and let you know.

Back in Nanaimo after our too long road trip.

Cheers, Russ

At 05:50 PM 19/09/2015, you wrote:
During the fall cleanup at work, we have 
unearthed a brand new 10” radius bronze 
steering quadrant machined with keyway to fit a 
2 ½” rudder post. It is similar in appearance 
to that shown at 
http://www.edsonmarine.com/ecatalogs/sail/00024.htm. 
It is not an Edson. It had “C 41” written 
in felt marker on it and I presume someone 
ordered it some time ago and failed to pick it 
up. If it’s of any use to someone, any offer 
over $200 plus shipping will get it. A bit of 
work with a saw would turn it into a very nice 
steering arm for a below decks autopilot ram.


Pictures available upon request

Rich Knowles
Nanaimo, BC
Still Boatless!









Rich Knowles
Nanaimo, BC
Boatless!





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Stus-List Also looking at a C 36 - engine at an angle?

[Bruce via CnC-List]

Yeah, so... in my quest to find my next boat, looking at a variety of 32-36' C
 
I looked at a C yesterday, the first 36 I've inspected.  Was surprised to note that, both from the companionway access and the lazarette access, it looked like the engine was mounted offset - it appeared to be angled maybe 3-4 degrees off centerline - the forward end on centerline, the aft end of it offset to port.
 
I wasn't smart enough to look at the shaft (I only had a half hour on the boat, broker had another appoinment), but it got me to wondering - is the shaft offset on the 36 (to counteract prop-walking or something)?  Or does this boat have a major problem?
 
Thx
Bruce

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Re: Stus-List Looking at a C 33-2.... known issues?

[Bruce via CnC-List]

Thanks for all the great info!
 
I've looked under the settees and v-berth; it all looks clean and dry, no signs of rot, hoses and fittings all look "recent" (actually, throughout the boat, plumbing looks to be in very good shape)
 
All the tabbing that I can get to without tools looks great.  If I go forward with this boat, it'll get a full survey and the tabbing, keel-hull joint and through-hulls are high on the list of things I'll want the surveyor to inspect.  
 
It sounds like the only core in the hull is above the waterline.  If so, that's good news.  I had read (somewhere? maybe an owner's manual?) that C recommends removing the core for an inch around the hole and filling with epoxy putty when installing a thru-hull, so I presumed that the core was in place throughout the hull.  Which wouldn't be uncommon in a late-70s/early-80s build.  I'll find out for-sure when out of the water.
 
I think my two "big" concerns are the mast base and mast step, and some of the deck fittings.  There's corrosion at the bottom of the mast, and if it is simply surface corrosion that's no big deal.   If it can be remediated by pulling the rig and cutting off the bottom 1/4" of the extrusion, that's probably OK.  If it extends farther up and/or has the potential to compromise the rig, that's a deal-breaker.
 
And... previous owner sorta got "creative" with some deck hardware.  Installed a solent-stay that dead-ends in a pad-eye just behind the aft edge of the anchor locker.  It does not appear to have a backing plate, and I don't have a diagram that shows where the solid/reinforced areas of the deck are, so I'm very curious about how strong/well-installed that pad-eye is.  Similarly, there's a windlass mounted on deck just aft of the anchor-locker, and reinforced on the underside with simple flat-washers rather than a backing plate.  Again, curious about whether it is a reinforced area of the deck, or potentially doing damage to the core.
 
Engine has ~3200 hours on it, maintenance records seem to indicate it has been thoughtfully maintained, and the [original] engine mounts seem to be okay - didn't note any vibration or hopping while at idle.
 
Much to think about - thanks for all the great insights!
Bruce
 

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Stus-List Also looking at a C 36 - engine at an angle?

[Bruce via CnC-List]

Yeah, so... in my quest to find my next boat, looking at a variety of
32-36' C
 
I looked at a C yesterday, the first 36 I've inspected.  Was
surprised to note that, both from the companionway access and the
lazarette access, it looked like the engine was mounted offset - it
appeared to be angled maybe 3-4 degrees off centerline - the forward end
on centerline, the aft end of it offset to port.
 
I wasn't smart enough to look at the shaft (I only had a half hour on
the boat, broker had another appoinment), but it got me to wondering -
is the shaft offset on the 36 (to counteract prop-walking or something)?
 Or does this boat have a major problem?
 
Thx
Bruce

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Re: Stus-List Looking at a C 33-2.... known issues?

[Bruce via CnC-List]

Thanks for all the great info!
 
I've looked under the settees and v-berth; it all looks clean and dry,
no signs of rot, hoses and fittings all look "recent" (actually,
throughout the boat, plumbing looks to be in very good shape)
 
All the tabbing that I can get to without tools looks great.  If I go
forward with this boat, it'll get a full survey and the tabbing,
keel-hull joint and through-hulls are high on the list of things I'll
want the surveyor to inspect.  
 
It sounds like the only core in the hull is above the waterline.  If so,
that's good news.  I had read (somewhere? maybe an owner's manual?) that
C recommends removing the core for an inch around the hole and filling
with epoxy putty when installing a thru-hull, so I presumed that the
core was in place throughout the hull.  Which wouldn't be uncommon in a
late-70s/early-80s build.  I'll find out for-sure when out of the water.
 
I think my two "big" concerns are the mast base and mast step, and some
of the deck fittings.  There's corrosion at the bottom of the mast, and
if it is simply surface corrosion that's no big deal.   If it can be
remediated by pulling the rig and cutting off the bottom 1/4" of the
extrusion, that's probably OK.  If it extends farther up and/or has the
potential to compromise the rig, that's a deal-breaker.
 
And... previous owner sorta got "creative" with some deck hardware. 
Installed a solent-stay that dead-ends in a pad-eye just behind the aft
edge of the anchor locker.  It does not appear to have a backing plate,
and I don't have a diagram that shows where the solid/reinforced areas
of the deck are, so I'm very curious about how strong/well-installed
that pad-eye is.  Similarly, there's a windlass mounted on deck just aft
of the anchor-locker, and reinforced on the underside with simple
flat-washers rather than a backing plate.  Again, curious about whether
it is a reinforced area of the deck, or potentially doing damage to the
core.
 
Engine has ~3200 hours on it, maintenance records seem to indicate it
has been thoughtfully maintained, and the [original] engine mounts seem
to be okay - didn't note any vibration or hopping while at idle.
 
Much to think about - thanks for all the great insights!
Bruce

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Re: Stus-List Also looking at a C 36 - engine at an angle?

[S Thomas via CnC-List]

Helps with the prop walk and also makes it possible to remove the propeller 
shaft without removing the rudder. 

Steve Thomas
  - Original Message - 
  From: Bruce via CnC-List 
  To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
  Cc: b...@bgary.com 
  Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2015 14:02
  Subject: Stus-List Also looking at a C 36 - engine at an angle?


  Yeah, so... in my quest to find my next boat, looking at a variety of 32-36' 
C

  I looked at a C yesterday, the first 36 I've inspected.  Was surprised 
to note that, both from the companionway access and the lazarette access, it 
looked like the engine was mounted offset - it appeared to be angled maybe 3-4 
degrees off centerline - the forward end on centerline, the aft end of it 
offset to port.

  I wasn't smart enough to look at the shaft (I only had a half hour on the 
boat, broker had another appoinment), but it got me to wondering - is the shaft 
offset on the 36 (to counteract prop-walking or something)?  Or does this boat 
have a major problem?

  Thx
  Bruce


--


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Re: Stus-List Looking at a C 33-2.... known issues?

[Michael Crombie via CnC-List]

I bought a 33 mkii 3 years ago (my first boat!)

The main issue was the mast step...it needs to be re-inforced. One of the POs 
had a hard grounding and the weak mast step was a problem. I had part of the 
keel stub re-built and the mast step done at Bristol Marine last winter.

The engine access is a pain, but is fine for routine maintenance.

I can guess why the V-berth door has been shaved...I bang my head on it EVERY 
time!

I've had no issues with window leaks or soft deck.

I love the boat. It handles well and is well balanced. I can sail along for 
5-10 min on a near reach without touching the wheel.  And the size is perfect 
for single handing.

Mike
Atacama 33 mkii
Toronto 
Sent wirelessly from my BlackBerry device on the Bell network.
Envoyé sans fil par mon terminal mobile BlackBerry sur le réseau de Bell.
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Stus-List Looking at a C 33-2.

[Brad Lumgair via CnC-List]

Bought a c 33-2 this year, replaced all electronics, not a boat problem,
one thing I haven't seen mentioned is the stress cracks in the edges of the
transom. My mast step still looks good and the panel under the sink in the
galley is removable for access to the starboard side of the engine. The
surveyor said the rudder has a damp spot in it and theres a small damp spot
in the deck at the turnbuckles. As I understand it the hull is solid and the
deck/cabintop are cored. Don't know of any other issues on our boat but the
other one in the yacht club has leaky windows.

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Re: Stus-List Looking at a C 33-2.... known issues

[Dave via CnC-List]

33-2 - second season with one, was purchased in excellent original condition, 
have had the whole thing apart and am upgrading most systems.

I agree with Jim's  points below and would add as few:

Check the lead keel for hairline cracks and bulges at the lower end of the 
keelboats.   It seems that water seeps into voids around the bolt, settles 
around the cast-in head of the bolt, freezes and expands.   I notice one in our 
yard (whitby ON) last winter with a section of lead broken clear of the keel.  
I could have stuck a screwdriver in and levered it off.   I then toured the 
yard looking for C of a similar vintage, and noticed this problem in 6 of 8. 
  The other 2 had more recent shoal keels installed.  Mine is showing early 
onset.  This is a 5-7k repair.  *. My Single biggest caveat and not well 
understood by surveyors, probably a recent thing.  

Check the holding tank for cracks, and stink.  It may need to be replaced, 
about 600. You can remove the plywood atop the v-berth easily.  If original 
rubber hoses you will want to change.  Not fun

Look under the settee, port side, where the shower drain pump is.   Check the 
base of the bulkhead there for Rot or water damage.

With the boat out of the water, check the flat run of the keel where the keel 
stub begins.   This can be a flex point and may require some repair.   

Bring a power screwdriver and lift the floorboards and look for fractured 
tabbing where the hull and liner are bonded.  Especially forward of the 
maststep.  Not a huge deal but a handy negotiating point.   

Make sure the transmission works properly.  Older transmissions of this type 
have a problem with the bronze cone and its mating surface becoming glazed and 
slipping, in forward, and only when hot.Repair is easy for a shade tree 
mechanic but is often misdiagnosed by professionals and missed by surveyors.

Checks engine mounts.  If they have not been replaced, they will probably be 
tired.  Look at the engine at low idle.  How much is it hopping around?

The ventilation sucks on these boats.   Check for mold/mildew even in a well 
kept boat.

Check the engine insulation.  Probably crumbling and messy.   Hard to replace 
and as noted, engine access is a challenge unless you are built like Gollum.  
Basic service access is fine.

Check the stanchion bases for cracks.  $70CDN ea.

The gel coat cracks at the stern are not an issue.  It's a 30 year old boat.  

The only coring in the hull is in the flat, forward top sides, and the 
through-deck fittings are generally very well done.   If the boat has not been 
neglected, or butchered, chances are the deck will be dry.

It is well worth the cost of a lift to inspect the keel and hull as noted above.

While you are at it, check that the rudder is parallel to the keel.  I have 
seen this in other C, bent, missed by surveyors.  In reverse, the big, 
unsupported rudder  is quite vulnerable.

Look down the top sides, in the area of the chain plates,  (Or equivalent) 
especially if the boat has a hydraulic back stay adjuster.  In several earlier 
C I looked at, the top sides were buckled, as if the bow and stern had been 
raised.  Many were like this, never saw it on a survey.

Ok, that's a ton, but looked very closely at a LOT of boats

All that said I really like the 33-2, though I have 8-footitis already.   I 
think it stands up well, and avoids many of the problems common to older 
generations.   The 33-2 is great if you want a day sailer/weekender that is 
comfortable for two, and sails like a demon.   Rarely do I not outrun other 
boats, and never yet by any thing smaller or the same size.  When I take other 
boat owners out, especially in light air, they are amazed, and I am not a 
particularly skilled sailor.   RACER/cruiser for sure.   Crack the sheets a bit 
in heavy air for the first time and be prepared...  Wow.  Maybe that's the 
"death-trap" part.  Lol

You will want a spinnaker...  Yeee haw! ;-)

I hope that helps, good luck.

Dave.













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