Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: what's different's ? OpenSource no ? -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Vadim Plessky am Sat, Nov 11, 2000 at 05:11:03AM +0300: 1) Konqueror 2.1 Against. It takes ages to start it, and when you want another window, it again takes quite some time to start that window. I'm not using KDE btw. Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
1) Konqueror 2.1 and, may be, if there is so strong demand from -wide masses_, 2) - netscape-old (4.76) 3) - netscape (6.0) 4) - netscape-hack (Mozilla) I'm also think that is a good idea to put all of them Konqueror, as the fastest one at a moment. but it's buggy;-) I believe that Mandrake can also include on Commercial CD (like Guillaume wrote about NVidia binary drivers) for LM 8.0 - Microsoft IE for Linux. If we speak about freedom of choice, this option should also be considered. Look at work which Mainsoft does for MS (www.mainsoft.com). Win32 API is ported to UNIX, they are cleaning up some particular platform compatibility. Estimated time of this wonder to arrive - Q1'2000. So let's say realisticaly speaking April or May 2000. I doesn't know if it's a good idea but in commercial CD you could put ever what you want;-) Key priority for MS now - Media Player (as part of MS IE6) on all platforms. It will answer somebody's request on this list - how to listen/view Windows Media on Linux... It won't answer my request since it's better to put support for windows codec than install things that depend on mainsoft lib's . You will not support a lot of codec by doing this . example : I want to play divx windows media does not support divx so it's better to put support for windows codecs since it's an open source solution. like for the ttf font /and I don't mind this effort from MS side - RealAudio/Video is also closed standard... may be this move will awake Real and they will open-source their standards...And Apple's QuickTime is pretty closed as well./ Don't be offended by quoting this info here, I think it's better to know what MS is preparing... I know what they want to do but linux philo. is to made available all things under opensources licences not closed one.
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
On Saturday 11 November 2000 01:07, you wrote: Sam [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So sprach Chmouel Boudjnah am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 06:56:46AM -0800: do you thing that a distribution of 1,2Gb is not enough ? Well, if you include powertools, redhat is at almost 2 Gig. So why not? Although slackware is only 1.5 CD's in size, they have a contributions iso image as the smaller one. Food for thought? let see : (chmou@kenobi)[dis/cooker]-% du -sh contrib/RPMS cooker 502Mcontrib/RPMS 1.3Gcooker you count also source i count only the binary, with source we have : (chmou@kenobi)[dis/cooker]-% du -sh contrib/RPMS cooker/ SRPMS/ contrib/SRPMS/ 502Mcontrib/RPMS 1.3Gcooker 1.2GSRPMS 518Mcontrib/SRPMS for me it's too much Isn't too much since you've install cd , ext cd contrib cd , source cd people that want could only download 1-2 or 3 cd ... so isn't too much chmouel;-) you distrib is the greatest ;-) but my 7.2 is buggy so I will install the 8alph when it will be more stable;-)
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Isn't too much since you've install cd , ext cd contrib cd , source cd people that want could only download 1-2 or 3 cd ... so isn't too much chmouel;-) ever heard about mirror, production cd for boxes, etc.. ? you distrib is the greatest ;-) but my 7.2 is buggy so I will install the 8alph when it will be more stable;-) definition of buggy is... ? -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
On Saturday 11 November 2000 20:25, you wrote: Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Isn't too much since you've install cd , ext cd contrib cd , source cd people that want could only download 1-2 or 3 cd ... so isn't too much chmouel;-) ever heard about mirror, production cd for boxes, etc.. ? Oh yep , sorry , sorry but in the next will be also the option of installing the 3.3.6 (3.3.7?) or only the 4.0.2(since the big drivers updates that have been done(or not yet :( )) if some things will be removed like 2.2.x kernels and old Xfree it will made more space for other comings features ;-) but we have to hopes that new things will be totaly finished before the next release ;-) you distrib is the greatest ;-) but my 7.2 is buggy so I will install the 8alph when it will be more stable;-) definition of buggy is... ? X crash after some minutes of use , don't know why :-( I've also tryed the 3.3.6 server no changes so come back to the 4.0.1 with acceleration. but there was a successfull session of one weeks the last week . I've reinstalled 3 times the distrib . so I want to try the 8 (I like trying newest things) . thabnks a lot ;-)
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh yep , sorry , sorry but in the next will be also the option of installing the 3.3.6 (3.3.7?) or only the 4.0.2(since the big drivers updates that have been done(or not yet :( )) depending if it support cards as 3.3.6 if some things will be removed like 2.2.x kernels and old Xfree it will made more space for other comings features ;-) 2.2.x kernel i doubt, we'll keep for sur a kernel22- compat. but we have to hopes that new things will be totaly finished before the next release ;-) no kidding :p X crash after some minutes of use , don't know why :-( I've also tryed the 3.3.6 server no changes so come back to the 4.0.1 with acceleration. but there was a successfull session of one weeks the last week . I've reinstalled 3 times the distrib . so I want to try the 8 (I like trying newest things) . DRI loaded ? -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . isn't that better to switch to mozilla instead ? fcrozat ? Yes. -- "My enthusiam for this meal can't even be described by a scalar." -- Dan Eisenbud, Swarthmore '98, at Sharples
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Submitted 11-Nov-00 by Alexander Skwar: Against. It takes ages to start it, and when you want another window, it again takes quite some time to start that window. I'm not using KDE btw. I agree with Alexander here. Those of us that don't use KDE find it takes an inordinate amount of time to open KDE-specific apps like Konqueror.. -- Anton GrahamGPG ID: 0x18F78541 [EMAIL PROTECTED] RSA key available upon request Don't try to outweird me, three-eyes. I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal." -- Zaphod Beeblebrox [Douglas Adams, "Hithiker's Guide to the Galaxy"]
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
I've not been able to make java work with any of the daily mozilla builds for a couple of weeks now, neither with Mandrake 7.1 nore 7.2. Cliock on a java url, click on download the java plugin, wait a couple of forevers for jre.xpi to download from netscape.com, restart mozilla, click on a java url, get prompted to download the java plugin again. Broken. --Doug On Friday 10 November 2000 07:30, you wrote: So sprach Matthew Brealey am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 02:01:50PM -: Netscape does have things like Java, etc., so it would be nice to have You can include the Java implementation for NS6 in Mozilla. Works fine, but takes ages to start up - it's even worse than the start up time for Java in NS 4.x. Alexander Skwar -- Douglas Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . isn't that better to switch to mozilla instead ? fcrozat ? -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Question- 1. Where is NS8, it's not on the netscape website or any download centers. Original Message On 11/10/00, 6:37:32 AM, Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote regarding [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker: Hi all , First I wanna to tell you thanks for your greatincroyable works on the cooker devlopment Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . thanks a lot ?))
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
On Friday 10 November 2000 15:42, you wrote: Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . isn't that better to switch to mozilla instead ? fcrozat ? what's different's ? need a good browers , they do not deal corectly with langages, javascript , java (it's better than before but worse than IE ) AFAIK , linux have a lot of work to do with media support , browers... a lot of do with all this ... after that , I hopes micro$oft will be only mentioned on scool books ;-)
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
not 9 --6 ;-) r8 =right ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/netscape6 On Friday 10 November 2000 15:51, you wrote: Question- 1. Where is NS8, it's not on the netscape website or any download centers. Original Message On 11/10/00, 6:37:32 AM, Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote regarding [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker: Hi all , First I wanna to tell you thanks for your greatincroyable works on the cooker devlopment Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . thanks a lot ?))
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
No mozilla is NOT better. You don't want mozilla on a public release as it is a DEVELOPMENT platform for Netscape. Go to the mozilla website. They try to dissuade the average user from downloading it. I do use Mozilla- it's fast, but is it bug free- no way. Mozilla is development code. As such should only be included as an option for more experienced users, NOT as the sole available browser. It will lock up ocasionally, it will not work on all sites (I found a valid bug in the implementation of Java2 scripts) and it will frustrate an average user. If you want to develop Mandrake for techies, make Mozilla the only browser. If you want Mandrake useable by the public, put in the final release of Netscape. You're in charge of marketing- which has more brand recognition as included package on the side of your box- Mozilla, Netscape or Konqueror. I think the answers obvious. Original Message On 11/10/00, 6:42:40 AM, Chmouel Boudjnah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote regarding Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker: Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . isn't that better to switch to mozilla instead ? fcrozat ? -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
You wrote: Meir Faraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Secondly , could you put the 6 version of netscape on the cooker the final release is out r8 now . isn't that better to switch to mozilla instead ? fcrozat ? Much better. Netscape is Mozilla with more bugs (because they use a two- month old version of Mozilla to build). Netscape does have things like Java, etc., so it would be nice to have it if you go to shitty websites that use this garbage, but Mozilla is better for most purposes - you can build your own Mandrakesoft version, fewer bugs, free (as in speech), more features (Mozilla's ad blocking features are removed from the chrome by Netscape 6), less commercial AOL/Netcenter crap. -- Random fortune PIZZA!!
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
I mean you have both - Netscape if you need it (and if you can take closed source software), but otherwise Moz and Konqueror. -- Random fortune Win98 is called Win98 because it is 98% slower than Linux.
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Sam am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 01:59:18PM +: You're in charge of marketing- which has more brand recognition as included package on the side of your box- Mozilla, Netscape or Konqueror. I think the answers obvious. Right, it's my favourite, w3m, isn't it? :] To get real, I'd also vote against using Mozilla as the default browser in Mandrake. While Mozilla is really fine (I use it a lot), Sam's reasons against Mozilla are very true. Right now I'd suggest to include all 3 browsers: - netscape-old (4.76) - netscape (6.0) - netscape-hack (Mozilla) And all those three browsers should be in the main distribution. Netscape old should be included, because it's known to work (well, sort of anyway :]), and because users from other Unix systems (Unix, not Linux!) are probably very much more used to Netscape 4.x than to anything else as a browser. netscape 6 should be in, because it's the newest and greatest. It should also be the default browser, so that some more beta testing is done. And finally Mozilla should be in, because it can be superior (fewer bugs and all that) to netscape 6, but it shouldn't be the default, as it is unstable, just like cooker is. Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Matthew Brealey am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 02:01:50PM -: Netscape does have things like Java, etc., so it would be nice to have You can include the Java implementation for NS6 in Mozilla. Works fine, but takes ages to start up - it's even worse than the start up time for Java in NS 4.x. Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Sam am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 01:51:07PM +: 1. Where is NS8, it's not on the netscape website or any download centers. See /., it's on Netscape's ftp server - but, I don't seem to be able to get into the 6.0 dir, is someone here able to do so? Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Alexander Skwar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And all those three browsers should be in the main distribution. Netscape old should be included, because it's known to work (well, sort of anyway do you thing that a distribution of 1,2Gb is not enough ? -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
I do use Mozilla- it's fast, but is it bug free- no way. Wrong. The trunk cvs branch is frozen code with bug fixing only. Hmmm seems like a contradiction You say that statement is wrong yet you say it's frozen for bug fixing only :) The reason they freeze it is because they know that they have numerous bugs to squash and it's easier to squash them without adding new code. This is standard practice on what most companies call a final BETA release. The idea is to stomp out as many bugs before proceeding with further development. The 3 commercial packages I beta test for all do the same thing as does Mandrake with Cooker at various times. By no means are any of them considered a final release at that point. Sam
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Sam [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I do use Mozilla- it's fast, but is it bug free- no way. Wrong. The trunk cvs branch is frozen code with bug fixing only. Hmmm seems like a contradiction You say that statement is wrong yet you say it's frozen for bug fixing only :) The reason they freeze it is because they know that they have numerous bugs to squash and it's easier to squash them without adding new code. This is standard practice on what most companies call a final BETA release. The idea is to stomp out as many bugs before proceeding with further development. The 3 commercial packages I beta test for all do the same thing as does Mandrake with Cooker at various times. By no means are any of them considered a final release at that point. What I was meaning is that currently, the "trunk" cvs branch is for bug fixing only (and that's the best location to get the better code). -- -- Yoann http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~yoann/ In a world without walls or fences, what use do we have for windows or gates?
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Sam [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The reason they freeze it is because they know that they have numerous bugs to squash and it's easier to squash them without adding new code. This is standard practice on what most companies call a final BETA release. The idea is to stomp out as many bugs before proceeding with thanks for your enlight on what is it a BETA release :-( -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
I know you understand what a beta release is, but this was meant for people that think when they freeze mozilla it's the same as a final release. It just isn't true. Typically the freeze is used so they can do bug fixes and then port that code over to netscape- once netscape's out of beta is where the real final release of the base code will be found. Mozilla continues so it can be developed further for the next release of NS- mabe 6.1? Sorry if I'm preaching to the choir, but it seems I'm always running into misconceptions about mozilla. BTW it's interesting that AOL's set top box (made by Dell) uses Linux and a browser based on gecko. Original Message On 11/10/00, 8:19:11 AM, Chmouel Boudjnah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote regarding Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker: Sam [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The reason they freeze it is because they know that they have numerous bugs to squash and it's easier to squash them without adding new code. This is standard practice on what most companies call a final BETA release. The idea is to stomp out as many bugs before proceeding with thanks for your enlight on what is it a BETA release :-( -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Sam am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 01:59:18PM +: You're in charge of marketing- which has more brand recognition as included package on the side of your box- Mozilla, Netscape or Konqueror. I think the answers obvious. Right, it's my favourite, w3m, isn't it? :] To get real, I'd also vote against using Mozilla as the default browser in Mandrake. While Mozilla is really fine (I use it a lot), Sam's reasons against Mozilla are very true. Right now I'd suggest to include all 3 browsers: - netscape-old (4.76) - netscape (6.0) - netscape-hack (Mozilla) And all those three browsers should be in the main distribution. Netscape old should be included, because it's known to work (well, sort of anyway :]), and because users from other Unix systems (Unix, not Linux!) are probably very much more used to Netscape 4.x than to anything else as a browser. netscape 6 should be in, because it's the newest and greatest. It should also be the default browser, so that some more beta testing is done. And finally Mozilla should be in, because it can be superior (fewer bugs and all that) to netscape 6, but it shouldn't be the default, as it is unstable, just like cooker is. Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ: 7328191 Why is netscape up to 4.76. Security-problem ???
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Chmouel Boudjnah am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 06:56:46AM -0800: do you thing that a distribution of 1,2Gb is not enough ? Yeah, they're somewhat big, granted. But what do you want to leave out? The 4.x series of Netscape? Or Mozilla? IMHO none should be left out. Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach andre am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 11:28:36PM +0100: Why is netscape up to 4.76. Security-problem ??? IIRC they did some updates to the included programs, don't know for sure though. Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx GnuPG ID: 4E35467E FP: 93367E5B4AB777B42065533F456FF17C4E35467E ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (andre) writes: Why is netscape up to 4.76. Security-problem ??? up but only FreeBSD has discover the problem. -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
So sprach Chmouel Boudjnah am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 06:56:46AM -0800: do you thing that a distribution of 1,2Gb is not enough ? Well, if you include powertools, redhat is at almost 2 Gig. So why not? Although slackware is only 1.5 CD's in size, they have a contributions iso image as the smaller one. Food for thought?
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
Sam [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So sprach Chmouel Boudjnah am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 06:56:46AM -0800: do you thing that a distribution of 1,2Gb is not enough ? Well, if you include powertools, redhat is at almost 2 Gig. So why not? Although slackware is only 1.5 CD's in size, they have a contributions iso image as the smaller one. Food for thought? let see : (chmou@kenobi)[dis/cooker]-% du -sh contrib/RPMS cooker 502Mcontrib/RPMS 1.3Gcooker you count also source i count only the binary, with source we have : (chmou@kenobi)[dis/cooker]-% du -sh contrib/RPMS cooker/ SRPMS/ contrib/SRPMS/ 502Mcontrib/RPMS 1.3Gcooker 1.2GSRPMS 518Mcontrib/SRPMS for me it's too much -- MandrakeSoft Inc http://www.chmouel.org --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] About to include netscape6 in the cooker
On Friday 10 November 2000 17:28, Alexander Skwar wrote: | So sprach Sam am Fri, Nov 10, 2000 at 01:59:18PM +: |You're in charge of marketing- which has more brand recognition as |included package on the side of your box- Mozilla, Netscape or |Konqueror. I think the answers obvious. | | To get real, I'd also vote against using Mozilla as the default browser | in Mandrake. While Mozilla is really fine (I use it a lot), Sam's reasons | against Mozilla are very true. Right now I'd suggest to include all 3 | browsers: | 1) Konqueror 2.1 and, may be, if there is so strong demand from -wide masses_, 2) - netscape-old (4.76) 3) - netscape (6.0) 4) - netscape-hack (Mozilla) | | And all those three browsers should be in the main distribution. | Netscape old should be included, because it's known to work (well, sort of | anyway Konqueror, as the fastest one at a moment. | | :]), and because users from other Unix systems (Unix, not Linux!) are | Konqueror, as *BSD users already got used to it :-) | probably very much more used to Netscape 4.x than to anything else as a | browser. netscape 6 should be in, because it's the newest and greatest. cut | Alexander Skwar I believe that Mandrake can also include on Commercial CD (like Guillaume wrote about NVidia binary drivers) for LM 8.0 - Microsoft IE for Linux. If we speak about freedom of choice, this option should also be considered. Look at work which Mainsoft does for MS (www.mainsoft.com). Win32 API is ported to UNIX, they are cleaning up some particular platform compatibility. Estimated time of this wonder to arrive - Q1'2000. So let's say realisticaly speaking April or May 2000. Key priority for MS now - Media Player (as part of MS IE6) on all platforms. It will answer somebody's request on this list - how to listen/view Windows Media on Linux... /and I don't mind this effort from MS side - RealAudio/Video is also closed standard... may be this move will awake Real and they will open-source their standards...And Apple's QuickTime is pretty closed as well./ Don't be offended by quoting this info here, I think it's better to know what MS is preparing... -- Vadim Plessky http://kde2.newmail.ru (English) http://kde2.newmail.ru/index_rus.html (Russian) Do you have Arial font installed? Just test it! http://kde2.newmail.ru/font_test_arial.html
