RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I'm curious as to who was experiencing this deluge. As far as I can tell, 99.9% of the messages now ending up in the error folder are ones that SmarterMail (previous to Declude 4.2.20) would have deleted, and both the user and the system administrator (me) would never have seen them, let alone known that they had even existed. So the only deluge I can see (previous to Declude 4.2.20) would have been in the bit bucket. Sandy hit it right on the nose in stating that this should have been a configurable option. Previously, the only held spam was that which the system administrator had configured as being held. Now Declude has arbitrarily turned the error folder into a new hold folder completely out of the system administrator's control. And if this is indeed a SmarterMail problem, what is Declude going to do if and when SmarterMail fixes it? Rip the bandaid off and put things back to the way they were? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 4:10 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 That is exactly what was happening prior to the fix and it created a deluge of spam ending up in SmarterMail inboxes. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Bilbee Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:49 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 How about if the message has failed in the .hdr file declude just ignores the file to let SmarterMail process it as it see fit??? Kevin Bilbee -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:26 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Not sure who you spoke to at SmarterTools but I do NOT believe this is true. Declude will not pick up a message until it is completed writing both the .hdr and .eml files, that is the reason why SmarterMail while writing the header will have the .eml file as .em_ (while writing) so that when the .hdr is complete ie. Written then and only then will Declude pick up the file to process it. Also you will see clearly, that the SM logs indicate a problem long before we receive the message. This was a new problem introduced by SmarterMail - 4.2.20 provided a fix for this. Again coming back to a previous post I made talking about the effects of the Mail server on Declude. The question always comes back to who should provide the fix, in this case we did as it was causing messages not being scanned by Declude for spam. I am trying to get a better understanding to the problem from SM and as soon as I have some answers from them I will post to the lists. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder that is going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that if some other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll never find it because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before 4.2.20, this wasn't a problem. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder. You could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting these
messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into the error folder
is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am.
Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't know who
SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get their messages
or messages they send don't reach their destination. But they know who I am,
so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and then take it back to
SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users really know how to hit a
piñada because most of them are Spanish. :)
Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put this fix in
a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these previously
deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem? As soon as all
those messages started showing up in my error directory it became pretty
obvious. Seems that this work you mention that Declude is doing with
SmarterMail to resolve this problem should have been done before the fix was
put into 4.2.20.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we
have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we
are working with them to resolve this between us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both
saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files
in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason
SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not
complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Here is SmarterTools take on the problem:
Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully
recieved via SMTP.
For
instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and
corresponding
.emls) are
normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are
noticing
them is
because of
Declude storing them in the error folder.
The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of
SmarterMail's
normail process.
Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but
shouldn't
Declude know
the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and
SmarterMail is
ready to
deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an
SMTP
retry is
occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we
are
going to get
thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error
folder
that is
going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to
mention that
if some
other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder,
we'll
never find it
because its buried under all these other superfluous messages.
Before
4.2.20, this
wasn't a problem.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr
file
they
write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage
for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error
folder.
You
could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages
in the \spool.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Gary Steiner
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
If we gave you the option to delete these messages (as SmarterMail should be
doing) rather than move them to the \error directory would that solve your
problem ?
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:41 AM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting these
messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into the error
folder is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am.
Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't know who
SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get their
messages or messages they send don't reach their destination. But they know
who I am, so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and then take
it back to SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users really know
how to hit a piñada because most of them are Spanish. :)
Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put this fix
in a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these
previously deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem? As
soon as all those messages started showing up in my error directory it
became pretty obvious. Seems that this work you mention that Declude is
doing with SmarterMail to resolve this problem should have been done before
the fix was put into 4.2.20.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance
we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have
said we are working with them to resolve this between us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a
problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both
saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files
in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason
SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are
not
complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Here is SmarterTools take on the problem:
Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully
recieved via SMTP.
For
instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission.
These(and
corresponding
.emls) are
normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are
noticing
them is
because of
Declude storing them in the error folder.
The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of
SmarterMail's
normail process.
Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but
shouldn't
Declude know
the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and
SmarterMail is
ready to
deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and
an SMTP
retry is
occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we
are
going to get
thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the
error folder
that is
going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to
mention that
if some
other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error
folder, we'll
never find it
because its buried under all these other superfluous messages.
Before
4.2.20, this
wasn't a problem.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July
2006
Gary,
This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr
file
they
write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam
leakage for declude we
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
To uninstall you can do this from the add/remove programs function inside of your control panel. If you find this hasn't removed all of your components, browse to your root:\imail directory from a command prompt and type decludeproc -u Good luck with build .20 I hope this proves to be the fix for your issue. Thanks for your patients Chris Asaro Technical Support Engineer Declude Your Email Security is our Business 978.499.2933 x 7009 office 978.764.7960 mobile 978.988.1311 efax -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Doyle Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 5:00 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 We are running Imail 8.22. I did the upgrade on Saturday, so far no problems. I backed down from 4.2 b12 to 4.09 as I was getting email without declude adding header information, and I was not able to find any record in any declude log of the message being processed. So far I have not seen a similar situation with build 20. John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 7:42 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com; Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SM ADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SM ADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SM FIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SM FIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't know. I'm still trying to understand the problem. Declude added a fix to 4.2.20 that moves files to the error directory that they say were coming through as spam leakage. SmarterTools says these files are normally deleted by SmarterMail, and and the only reason I see them in the error directory is that Declude puts them there before SmarterMail has a chance to delete them. Now these two statements contradict each other. Either SmarterMail was deleting these files or it was not. Since I never saw them before 4.23.20, I have to assume that SmarterMail was deleting them. So if SmarterMail was deleting the files, then why did Declude decide to intercept them in 4.2.20 and prevent SmarterMail from deleting them? Hopefully, since as you say Declude is working with SmarterTools to resolve this between us we will see a new fix soon that will make this issue moot. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 7:48 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, If we gave you the option to delete these messages (as SmarterMail should be doing) rather than move them to the \error directory would that solve your problem ? David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:41 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting these messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into the error folder is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am. Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't know who SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get their messages or messages they send don't reach their destination. But they know who I am, so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and then take it back to SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users really know how to hit a piñada because most of them are Spanish. :) Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put this fix in a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these previously deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem? As soon as all those messages started showing up in my error directory it became pretty obvious. Seems that this work you mention that Declude is doing with SmarterMail to resolve this problem should have been done before the fix was put into 4.2.20. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we are working with them to resolve this between us. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem. But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both saying it's the other guy's fault. Original Message From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete. John T eServices For You Seek, and ye shall find! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Whatever the previous setup was seemed to be working fine for us. I guess SmarterMail was deleting these automatically? We have well over 10,000 email accounts and never saw any spam leakage as discussed here. Now I have an error directory that grows 1+ GBs each day. If SmarterMail isn't deleting these correctly then I hope this information has been passed to them so this can be fixed. SmarterMail has been pretty responsive to our requests. It seems odd that Declude would have to hack together a fix for something that is apparently a SmarterMail issue. I just don't want to have to deal with thousands of messages in the error directory and have to search through them daily to ensure they should all be there. Mark Strother Pacific Online Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222 Fax: 604-638-6020 Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870 http://www.pacificonline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 4:33 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, If we gave you the option to delete these messages (as SmarterMail should be doing) rather than move them to the \error directory would that solve your problem ? David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:41 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting these messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into the error folder is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am. Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't know who SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get their messages or messages they send don't reach their destination. But they know who I am, so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and then take it back to SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users really know how to hit a piñada because most of them are Spanish. :) Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put this fix in a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these previously deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem? As soon as all those messages started showing up in my error directory it became pretty obvious. Seems that this work you mention that Declude is doing with SmarterMail to resolve this problem should have been done before the fix was put into 4.2.20. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we are working with them to resolve this between us. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem. But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both saying it's the other guy's fault. Original Message From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete. John T eServices For You Seek, and ye shall find! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
So SmarterMail says they were deleting them. My question is when? Files
related to an incomplete e-mail session should be deleted right away at the
close of the session, not left lying around for another program to pick them
up.
Could that be what is happening, SmarterMail was deleting them on a cycle or
time basis rather than properly at the close of the failed session?
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 1:04 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't know. I'm still trying to understand the problem. Declude
added a fix to
4.2.20 that moves files to the error directory that they say were coming
through as
spam leakage. SmarterTools says these files are normally deleted by
SmarterMail,
and and the only reason I see them in the error directory is that Declude
puts them
there before SmarterMail has a chance to delete them. Now these two
statements
contradict each other. Either SmarterMail was deleting these files or it
was not. Since
I never saw them before 4.23.20, I have to assume that SmarterMail was
deleting
them. So if SmarterMail was deleting the files, then why did Declude
decide to
intercept them in 4.2.20 and prevent SmarterMail from deleting them?
Hopefully, since as you say Declude is working with SmarterTools to
resolve this
between us we will see a new fix soon that will make this issue moot.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 7:48 AM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
If we gave you the option to delete these messages (as SmarterMail
should be
doing) rather than move them to the \error directory would that solve
your
problem ?
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:41 AM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting these
messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into the error
folder is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am.
Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't know
who
SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get their
messages or messages they send don't reach their destination. But they
know
who I am, so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and then
take
it back to SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users really
know
how to hit a piñada because most of them are Spanish. :)
Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put this
fix
in a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these
previously deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem?
As
soon as all those messages started showing up in my error directory it
became pretty obvious. Seems that this work you mention that Declude is
doing with SmarterMail to resolve this problem should have been done
before
the fix was put into 4.2.20.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance
we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have
said we are working with them to resolve this between us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a
problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both
saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files
in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason
SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are
not
complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
This is the answer from SmarterTools: Messages with a failed status we would recommend just deleting those. They represent messages that didnt finish coming in via SMTP for a variety of reasons one could be that the connection terminated before the message was transferred, another could be that the message violated the max message size for the server. So rather than move these messages to the Declude\Error folder in the next release we will delete these messages as suggested by SmarterTools. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 4:04 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I don't know. I'm still trying to understand the problem. Declude added a fix to 4.2.20 that moves files to the error directory that they say were coming through as spam leakage. SmarterTools says these files are normally deleted by SmarterMail, and and the only reason I see them in the error directory is that Declude puts them there before SmarterMail has a chance to delete them. Now these two statements contradict each other. Either SmarterMail was deleting these files or it was not. Since I never saw them before 4.23.20, I have to assume that SmarterMail was deleting them. So if SmarterMail was deleting the files, then why did Declude decide to intercept them in 4.2.20 and prevent SmarterMail from deleting them? Hopefully, since as you say Declude is working with SmarterTools to resolve this between us we will see a new fix soon that will make this issue moot. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 7:48 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, If we gave you the option to delete these messages (as SmarterMail should be doing) rather than move them to the \error directory would that solve your problem ? David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:41 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting these messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into the error folder is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am. Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't know who SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get their messages or messages they send don't reach their destination. But they know who I am, so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and then take it back to SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users really know how to hit a piñada because most of them are Spanish. :) Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put this fix in a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these previously deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem? As soon as all those messages started showing up in my error directory it became pretty obvious. Seems that this work you mention that Declude is doing with SmarterMail to resolve this problem should have been done before the fix was put into 4.2.20. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we are working with them to resolve this between us. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem. But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both saying it's the other guy's fault. Original Message From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete. John T eServices For You Seek, and ye
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
SmarterMail was not deleting these files and were handing them to Declude.
That is what was causing the problem. Yes you are correct they should not
have been handing these messages to Declude in the first place.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John T
(Lists)
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 5:36 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
So SmarterMail says they were deleting them. My question is when? Files
related to an incomplete e-mail session should be deleted right away at the
close of the session, not left lying around for another program to pick them
up.
Could that be what is happening, SmarterMail was deleting them on a cycle or
time basis rather than properly at the close of the failed session?
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 1:04 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't know. I'm still trying to understand the problem. Declude
added a fix to
4.2.20 that moves files to the error directory that they say were
coming
through as
spam leakage. SmarterTools says these files are normally deleted by
SmarterMail,
and and the only reason I see them in the error directory is that
Declude
puts them
there before SmarterMail has a chance to delete them. Now these two
statements
contradict each other. Either SmarterMail was deleting these files or
it
was not. Since
I never saw them before 4.23.20, I have to assume that SmarterMail was
deleting
them. So if SmarterMail was deleting the files, then why did Declude
decide to
intercept them in 4.2.20 and prevent SmarterMail from deleting them?
Hopefully, since as you say Declude is working with SmarterTools to
resolve this
between us we will see a new fix soon that will make this issue moot.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 7:48 AM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
If we gave you the option to delete these messages (as SmarterMail
should be
doing) rather than move them to the \error directory would that
solve
your
problem ?
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:41 AM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
As far as I'm concerned it's not a solution. SmarterMail deleting
these messages was not a problem for me, Declude dumping them into
the error folder is. I wasn't having a problem before 4.2.20, now I am.
Everyone in support has their stint as the piñada. My users don't
know
who
SmarterTools or Declude are, they just know when they don't get
their messages or messages they send don't reach their destination.
But they
know
who I am, so I have to hold their hands and hear their cries and
then
take
it back to SmarterTools and Declude. And believe me, my users
really
know
how to hit a piñada because most of them are Spanish. :)
Another interesting thing is, before the decision was made to put
this
fix
in a release version, didn't anyone foresee that dumping all these
previously deleted files into the error folder would cause a problem?
As
soon as all those messages started showing up in my error directory
it became pretty obvious. Seems that this work you mention that
Declude is doing with SmarterMail to resolve this problem should
have been done
before
the fix was put into 4.2.20.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:49 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this
instance we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM.
And as I have said we are working with them to resolve this between
us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a
problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two
vendors of interacting software products who point the finger at
each other, both saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Not sure who you spoke to at SmarterTools but I do NOT believe this is true. Declude will not pick up a message until it is completed writing both the .hdr and .eml files, that is the reason why SmarterMail while writing the header will have the .eml file as .em_ (while writing) so that when the .hdr is complete ie. Written then and only then will Declude pick up the file to process it. Also you will see clearly, that the SM logs indicate a problem long before we receive the message. This was a new problem introduced by SmarterMail - 4.2.20 provided a fix for this. Again coming back to a previous post I made talking about the effects of the Mail server on Declude. The question always comes back to who should provide the fix, in this case we did as it was causing messages not being scanned by Declude for spam. I am trying to get a better understanding to the problem from SM and as soon as I have some answers from them I will post to the lists. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder that is going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that if some other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll never find it because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before 4.2.20, this wasn't a problem. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder. You could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages in the \spool. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SM ADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SM ADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SM FIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SM FIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
How about if the message has failed in the .hdr file declude just ignores the file to let SmarterMail process it as it see fit??? Kevin Bilbee -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:26 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Not sure who you spoke to at SmarterTools but I do NOT believe this is true. Declude will not pick up a message until it is completed writing both the .hdr and .eml files, that is the reason why SmarterMail while writing the header will have the .eml file as .em_ (while writing) so that when the .hdr is complete ie. Written then and only then will Declude pick up the file to process it. Also you will see clearly, that the SM logs indicate a problem long before we receive the message. This was a new problem introduced by SmarterMail - 4.2.20 provided a fix for this. Again coming back to a previous post I made talking about the effects of the Mail server on Declude. The question always comes back to who should provide the fix, in this case we did as it was causing messages not being scanned by Declude for spam. I am trying to get a better understanding to the problem from SM and as soon as I have some answers from them I will post to the lists. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder that is going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that if some other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll never find it because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before 4.2.20, this wasn't a problem. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder. You could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages in the \spool. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SMADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SMADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SMFIX
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
That is exactly what was happening prior to the fix and it created a deluge of spam ending up in SmarterMail inboxes. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Bilbee Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:49 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 How about if the message has failed in the .hdr file declude just ignores the file to let SmarterMail process it as it see fit??? Kevin Bilbee -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:26 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Not sure who you spoke to at SmarterTools but I do NOT believe this is true. Declude will not pick up a message until it is completed writing both the .hdr and .eml files, that is the reason why SmarterMail while writing the header will have the .eml file as .em_ (while writing) so that when the .hdr is complete ie. Written then and only then will Declude pick up the file to process it. Also you will see clearly, that the SM logs indicate a problem long before we receive the message. This was a new problem introduced by SmarterMail - 4.2.20 provided a fix for this. Again coming back to a previous post I made talking about the effects of the Mail server on Declude. The question always comes back to who should provide the fix, in this case we did as it was causing messages not being scanned by Declude for spam. I am trying to get a better understanding to the problem from SM and as soon as I have some answers from them I will post to the lists. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder that is going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that if some other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll never find it because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before 4.2.20, this wasn't a problem. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder. You could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages in the \spool. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
GotCha. I then like the move to the error folder. Kevin Bilbee -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:54 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 That is exactly what was happening prior to the fix and it created a deluge of spam ending up in SmarterMail inboxes. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Bilbee Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:49 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 How about if the message has failed in the .hdr file declude just ignores the file to let SmarterMail process it as it see fit??? Kevin Bilbee -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:26 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Not sure who you spoke to at SmarterTools but I do NOT believe this is true. Declude will not pick up a message until it is completed writing both the .hdr and .eml files, that is the reason why SmarterMail while writing the header will have the .eml file as .em_ (while writing) so that when the .hdr is complete ie. Written then and only then will Declude pick up the file to process it. Also you will see clearly, that the SM logs indicate a problem long before we receive the message. This was a new problem introduced by SmarterMail - 4.2.20 provided a fix for this. Again coming back to a previous post I made talking about the effects of the Mail server on Declude. The question always comes back to who should provide the fix, in this case we did as it was causing messages not being scanned by Declude for spam. I am trying to get a better understanding to the problem from SM and as soon as I have some answers from them I will post to the lists. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 3:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder that is going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that if some other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll never find it because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before 4.2.20, this wasn't a problem. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder. You could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages in the \spool. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete. John T eServices For You Seek, and ye shall find! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder that is going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that if some other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll never find it because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before 4.2.20, this wasn't a problem. Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder. You could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages in the \spool. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SMADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SMADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SMFIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SMFIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both saying
it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in
Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is
allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Here is SmarterTools take on the problem:
Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully
recieved via SMTP.
For
instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and
corresponding
.emls) are
normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing
them is
because of
Declude storing them in the error folder.
The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's
normail process.
Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't
Declude know
the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is
ready to
deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP
retry is
occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are
going to get
thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error folder
that is
going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to mention that
if some
other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder, we'll
never find it
because its buried under all these other superfluous messages. Before
4.2.20, this
wasn't a problem.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr file
they
write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage for
declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error folder.
You
could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages in the
\spool.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the
error
folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be
spam,
but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to
scan
this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder?
Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good:
Failed
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
cmdspc: false
helo: ivmail1.fcc.es
What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the
headers
of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there
any
way to requeue this message?
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM
To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com
Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages
found to
have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder
EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user)
EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow
SM ADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file
the
message is moved to the \error folder
SM ADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid
domainlist.xml
SM FIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct
directory
path
SM FIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in
the
virus.cfg
David Barker
Product Manager
Your Email security is our businessT
978.499.2933 office
978.988.1311 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
---
This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To
unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type
unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at
http://www.mail
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we
have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we
are working with them to resolve this between us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both
saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files
in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason
SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not
complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Here is SmarterTools take on the problem:
Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully
recieved via SMTP.
For
instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and
corresponding
.emls) are
normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are
noticing
them is
because of
Declude storing them in the error folder.
The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of
SmarterMail's
normail process.
Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but
shouldn't
Declude know
the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and
SmarterMail is
ready to
deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an
SMTP
retry is
occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we
are
going to get
thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error
folder
that is
going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to
mention that
if some
other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder,
we'll
never find it
because its buried under all these other superfluous messages.
Before
4.2.20, this
wasn't a problem.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr
file
they
write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage
for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error
folder.
You
could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages
in the \spool.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Gary Steiner
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in
the
error
folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to
be
spam,
but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have
to
scan
this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder?
Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good:
Failed
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
cmdspc: false
helo: ivmail1.fcc.es
What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the
headers
of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is
there
any
way to requeue this message?
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM
To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com
Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages
found to
have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder
EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user)
EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow
SM ADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file
the
message is moved to the \error folder
SM ADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid
domainlist.xml
SM FIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
As long as someone is working on this. I have 20,000 messages in the
error directory from the past 48 hours. Obviously there is no way we can
sort through this volume of mail. Randomly looking at samples it appears
as though every messages has the Failed text in the .hdr file. I can
only hope that these are all messages that can be deleted.
Mark Strother
Pacific Online
Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222
Fax: 604-638-6020
Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870
http://www.pacificonline.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
David Barker
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 2:35 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance
we
have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said
we
are working with them to resolve this between us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a
problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both
saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files
in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason
SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not
complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Here is SmarterTools take on the problem:
Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully
recieved via SMTP.
For
instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and
corresponding
.emls) are
normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are
noticing
them is
because of
Declude storing them in the error folder.
The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of
SmarterMail's
normail process.
Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but
shouldn't
Declude know
the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and
SmarterMail is
ready to
deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an
SMTP
retry is
occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we
are
going to get
thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error
folder
that is
going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to
mention that
if some
other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder,
we'll
never find it
because its buried under all these other superfluous messages.
Before
4.2.20, this
wasn't a problem.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr
file
they
write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage
for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error
folder.
You
could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages
in the \spool.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Gary Steiner
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 2:52 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in
the
error
folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to
be
spam,
but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have
to
scan
this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder?
Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good:
Failed
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
cmdspc: false
helo: ivmail1.fcc.es
What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the
headers
of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is
there
any
way to requeue this message?
Original Message
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Mark, try this.
Go to Windows Search function.
Search files *.hdr
Search text in files failed
Search only the error directory.
Once you run the search, select all, cut, past into a temp directory.
You can now view the error directory to see if there is any file there that
does not have failed in it.
Again, I do not use SmarterMail so I do not know exactly how that is working
but just trying to provide some assistance.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark
Strother
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 4:34 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
As long as someone is working on this. I have 20,000 messages in the
error directory from the past 48 hours. Obviously there is no way we can
sort through this volume of mail. Randomly looking at samples it appears
as though every messages has the Failed text in the .hdr file. I can
only hope that these are all messages that can be deleted.
Mark Strother
Pacific Online
Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222
Fax: 604-638-6020
Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870
http://www.pacificonline.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
David Barker
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 2:35 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance
we
have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said
we
are working with them to resolve this between us.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary
Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a
problem.
But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of
interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both
saying it's the other guy's fault.
Original Message
From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files
in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason
SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not
complete.
John T
eServices For You
Seek, and ye shall find!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Gary Steiner
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Here is SmarterTools take on the problem:
Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully
recieved via SMTP.
For
instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and
corresponding
.emls) are
normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are
noticing
them is
because of
Declude storing them in the error folder.
The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of
SmarterMail's
normail process.
Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but
shouldn't
Declude know
the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and
SmarterMail is
ready to
deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an
SMTP
retry is
occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we
are
going to get
thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages dumped into the error
folder
that is
going to do nothing other than to take up disk space. Not to
mention that
if some
other type of error occurs that puts a message in the error folder,
we'll
never find it
because its buried under all these other superfluous messages.
Before
4.2.20, this
wasn't a problem.
Original Message
From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:24 PM
To: declude.junkmail@declude.com
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Gary,
This is a SmarterMail issue. When they fail to complete the .hdr
file
they
write Failed in the .hdr as this was causing major spam leakage
for declude we decided to move incomplete messages to the \error
folder.
You
could try changing the Failed to Written and drop the messages
in the \spool.
David B
www.declude.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Gary Steiner
Sent
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Okay. I can confirm that all 20,000 messages have failed in the header file. My problem now seems to be that this directory is pretty large in size. A lot of these messages are larger than our maximum allowed size. I'm guessing that when SmarterMail receives an email larger than the maximum allowed size it writes failed in the header. Previously these were automatically deleted by SmarterMail and we never saw them. Now they're building up in the error directory. The maximum size we allow for an email is 25MBs but in this directory I see a lot of emails that are 25 MBs. I think I'm going to have to create a script that will clear this directory every day or so. Mark Strother Pacific Online Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222 Fax: 604-638-6020 Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870 http://www.pacificonline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John T (Lists) Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 6:33 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Mark, try this. Go to Windows Search function. Search files *.hdr Search text in files failed Search only the error directory. Once you run the search, select all, cut, past into a temp directory. You can now view the error directory to see if there is any file there that does not have failed in it. Again, I do not use SmarterMail so I do not know exactly how that is working but just trying to provide some assistance. John T eServices For You Seek, and ye shall find! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Strother Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 4:34 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 As long as someone is working on this. I have 20,000 messages in the error directory from the past 48 hours. Obviously there is no way we can sort through this volume of mail. Randomly looking at samples it appears as though every messages has the Failed text in the .hdr file. I can only hope that these are all messages that can be deleted. Mark Strother Pacific Online Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222 Fax: 604-638-6020 Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870 http://www.pacificonline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 2:35 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we are working with them to resolve this between us. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem. But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both saying it's the other guy's fault. Original Message From: John T \(Lists\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete. John T eServices For You Seek, and ye shall find! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just deleted by SmarterMail. The only reason you are noticing them is because of Declude storing them in the error folder. The implication is that Declude is interrupting part of SmarterMail's normail process. Now I know this is essentially what Declude does anyway, but shouldn't Declude know the difference between a message that has finished SMTP and SmarterMail is ready to deliver, and a message that is incomplete in the SMTP process and an SMTP retry is occurring so this failed message should be ignored? Otherwise we are going to get thousands of unneccessary incomplete messages
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Mark et al., SmarterMail shouldn't be leaving this trash around, and it shouldn't be passing this trash to Declude. While having a work-around in Declude is nice in lieu of a fix from SmarterMail, this really should be fixed in SmarterMail if I am understanding the issues properly. Matt Mark Strother wrote: Okay. I can confirm that all 20,000 messages have failed in the header file. My problem now seems to be that this directory is pretty large in size. A lot of these messages are larger than our maximum allowed size. I'm guessing that when SmarterMail receives an email larger than the maximum allowed size it writes failed in the header. Previously these were automatically deleted by SmarterMail and we never saw them. Now they're building up in the error directory. The maximum size we allow for an email is 25MBs but in this directory I see a lot of emails that are 25 MBs. I think I'm going to have to create a script that will clear this directory every day or so. Mark Strother Pacific Online Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222 Fax: 604-638-6020 Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870 http://www.pacificonline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of John T (Lists) Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 6:33 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Mark, try this. Go to Windows Search function. Search files *.hdr Search text in files failed Search only the error directory. Once you run the search, select all, cut, past into a temp directory. You can now view the error directory to see if there is any file there that does not have failed in it. Again, I do not use SmarterMail so I do not know exactly how that is working but just trying to provide some assistance. John T eServices For You "Seek, and ye shall find!" -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Mark Strother Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 4:34 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 As long as someone is working on this. I have 20,000 messages in the error directory from the past 48 hours. Obviously there is no way we can sort through this volume of mail. Randomly looking at samples it appears as though every messages has the Failed text in the .hdr file. I can only hope that these are all messages that can be deleted. Mark Strother Pacific Online Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222 Fax: 604-638-6020 Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870 http://www.pacificonline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 2:35 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Gary, From time to time I feel like the Declude pinyada but in this instance we have provided a solution for what is happening in SM. And as I have said we are working with them to resolve this between us. David B www.declude.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:31 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I don't have an answer to this question. I just know that it is a problem. But what I find amusing is, here is another instance of two vendors of interacting software products who point the finger at each other, both saying "it's the other guy's fault." Original Message From: "John T \(Lists\)" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 5:21 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Although I do not use SmarterMail, my take is these are like T files in Imail where it is not a complete message, but for some reason SmarterMail is allowing Declude to have them even though they are not complete. John T eServices For You "Seek, and ye shall find!" -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 12:13 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Here is SmarterTools take on the problem: Failed is written to the .hdr if the message was not succesfully recieved via SMTP. For instance, if the connection is closed mid transmission. These(and corresponding .emls) are normally just del
re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SMADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SMADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SMFIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SMFIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I am getting a lot of these too, some of which show a 421 timeout in the SmarterMail SMTP logs. Example: data transfer failed. 421 Command timeout. closing transmission channel. Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 11:52 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SMADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SMADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SMFIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SMFIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
I have 9,000 messages from the past 48 hours or so in the error directory. We're also using SmarterMail. It look as though all of these have the word FAILED in the .hdr file. David said in a previous message, When they fail to complete the .hdr file they write Failed in the .hdr Can you clarify this a bit. Why is SmarterMAil failing to complete the .hdr file? The majority of these messages appear to be completely empty. It it safe to delete all of these? Before deleting these I'd like to understand exactly what is going on. Why the .hdr files are incomplete. What happens to these message if you are not running Declude? Mark Strother Pacific Online Phone: 604-638-6010 ext. 222 Fax: 604-638-6020 Toll Free: 1-877-503-9870 http://www.pacificonline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Jaworski Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 12:28 PM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 I am getting a lot of these too, some of which show a 421 timeout in the SmarterMail SMTP logs. Example: data transfer failed. 421 Command timeout. closing transmission channel. Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gary Steiner Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 11:52 AM To: declude.junkmail@declude.com Subject: re: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 Now that I've installed 4.2.20, I'm getting a lot of messages in the error folder (I'm running SmarterMail 3.3.2369). Most of them seem to be spam, but there are some good messages in there. Am I now going to have to scan this folder for false positives just like the held spam folder? Here is an example of the .hdr file for a message that was good: Failed [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] cmdspc: false helo: ivmail1.fcc.es What does Failed mean? Is there something I can look for in the headers of the message (in the .eml file) that would indicate this? Is there any way to requeue this message? Original Message From: David Barker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 11:01 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com, Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SMADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SMADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SMFIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SMFIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
We are running Imail 8.22. I did the upgrade on Saturday, so far no problems. I backed down from 4.2 b12 to 4.09 as I was getting email without declude adding header information, and I was not able to find any record in any declude log of the message being processed. So far I have not seen a similar situation with build 20. John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 7:42 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com; Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SM ADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SM ADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SM FIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SM FIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006
David, What is the status on fixing the broken image spam problem? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Barker Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 9:42 AM To: Declude.Virus@declude.com; Declude.JunkMail@declude.com Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] 4.2 build 20 Released 6 July 2006 EVA ADD New NONSTANDARDHDR vulnerability test. Messages found to have broken headers are moved to the \virus folder EVA FIX ALLOWVULNERABILITIESFROM (for user) EVA FIX BANEXT buffer overflow SMADD When an error is found in the envelope (.hdr) file the message is moved to the \error folder SMADD Decludeproc will not start without a valid domainlist.xml SMFIX QUEUEFILE_SAVEFILE the log is showing the correct directory path SMFIX Allows admin to set VIRDIR to any directory path in the virus.cfg David Barker Product Manager Your Email security is our businessT 978.499.2933 office 978.988.1311 fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
