[l10n-dev] Re: [ja-translate] Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Hi JC, Thanks very much for your time. If the number of fuzzy is small, we can work on Pootle directly, can't we ? If the update volume is high, such as in HC, we can use [TM] mark to be inserted to the leverage from TMX, right ? Is there any way to do the opposite, taht is, mark new translation ? If there's any mark put on the new translation, we can search that segment with that mark. Even if there's no such a way, your workaround will be a big help. Thank you again for your help! Regards, -Reiko Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: On 18 févr. 08, at 18:48, Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: Let me confirm. I understand the new/fuzzy is identified on OmegaT, but once the translator did the translation and put the translated string to the untranslated segment, how the reviewer can recognize which one is the strings to review ? Reiko, PO is not exactly the strong point of OmegaT :) I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Reiko, I have just tried OmegaT with Localization.po from javainstaller2. The file is translated at 97% and contains only 2 fuzzies to check. The conclusion is that OmegaT is useless for files that mostly contain translated and fuzzy strings. Ideally, a source file should not contain such strings and all the reference should be stored in a TMX. The fuzzies should be left empty for normal translation. If you work with a file that is mostly untranslated and where the reference parts are clearly separated from the source, it is trivial to set OmegaT to insert the TM reference with a prefix to distinguish it from the Translator's input. Just set OmegaT to automatically insert 100% matches with a [TM] prefix, or anything you want. The translator will still be in control of the process and will be able to do modifications to the input if necessary. When the reviewer checks the file, only the parts that are not marked with [TM] will have to be checked. I understand that this is not an ideal workflow though... Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Reiko Saito Japanese Language Lead Translation Language and Information Services (TLIS) Globalization Services Sun Microsystems, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Phone: +81 3 5962 4912 Blog: http://blogs.sun.com/reiko - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[l10n-dev] Re: [ja-translate] Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Reiko, If the number of fuzzy is small, we can work on Pootle directly, can't we ? That is what I would suggest. If the update volume is high, such as in HC, we can use [TM] mark to be inserted to the leverage from TMX, right ? Is there any way to do the opposite, taht is, mark new translation ? It is possible to insert it manually. But what I propose is an automatic insertion when OmegaT recognizes a 100% match. If there's any mark put on the new translation, we can search that segment with that mark. I understand. It would be indeed very convenient :) Especially since searches in OmegaT cover both source and target without distinction ... The ideal is that we get only the segments to translate or update, not the whole package. That is a waste of resources and requires useless roundtrip manipulations... I suggest we extract all the non translated segments before starting the translations. That would make all the manipulations above irrelevant. JC Even if there's no such a way, your workaround will be a big help. Thank you again for your help! Regards, -Reiko Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: On 18 févr. 08, at 18:48, Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: Let me confirm. I understand the new/fuzzy is identified on OmegaT, but once the translator did the translation and put the translated string to the untranslated segment, how the reviewer can recognize which one is the strings to review ? Reiko, PO is not exactly the strong point of OmegaT :) I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Reiko, I have just tried OmegaT with Localization.po from javainstaller2. The file is translated at 97% and contains only 2 fuzzies to check. The conclusion is that OmegaT is useless for files that mostly contain translated and fuzzy strings. Ideally, a source file should not contain such strings and all the reference should be stored in a TMX. The fuzzies should be left empty for normal translation. If you work with a file that is mostly untranslated and where the reference parts are clearly separated from the source, it is trivial to set OmegaT to insert the TM reference with a prefix to distinguish it from the Translator's input. Just set OmegaT to automatically insert 100% matches with a [TM] prefix, or anything you want. The translator will still be in control of the process and will be able to do modifications to the input if necessary. When the reviewer checks the file, only the parts that are not marked with [TM] will have to be checked. I understand that this is not an ideal workflow though... Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Reiko Saito Japanese Language Lead Translation Language and Information Services (TLIS) Globalization Services Sun Microsystems, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Phone: +81 3 5962 4912 Blog: http://blogs.sun.com/reiko - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
On 18 févr. 08, at 18:48, Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: Let me confirm. I understand the new/fuzzy is identified on OmegaT, but once the translator did the translation and put the translated string to the untranslated segment, how the reviewer can recognize which one is the strings to review ? Reiko, PO is not exactly the strong point of OmegaT :) I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Reiko, I have just tried OmegaT with Localization.po from javainstaller2. The file is translated at 97% and contains only 2 fuzzies to check. The conclusion is that OmegaT is useless for files that mostly contain translated and fuzzy strings. Ideally, a source file should not contain such strings and all the reference should be stored in a TMX. The fuzzies should be left empty for normal translation. If you work with a file that is mostly untranslated and where the reference parts are clearly separated from the source, it is trivial to set OmegaT to insert the TM reference with a prefix to distinguish it from the Translator's input. Just set OmegaT to automatically insert 100% matches with a [TM] prefix, or anything you want. The translator will still be in control of the process and will be able to do modifications to the input if necessary. When the reviewer checks the file, only the parts that are not marked with [TM] will have to be checked. I understand that this is not an ideal workflow though... Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Hi Jean-Christophe, Reiko, nice to talk to you again ;-), Thank you Jean-Christophe for giving such a good overview. To answer your first question, I can only talk about the review I performed on the UI which I did directly online into Pootle. I could not sort segments but since the UI objective wasn't that long (about 5500 words), I reviewed all strings. Sophie and I proceed the same way as usual for review, as we did before using Pootle: I review the files, make my comments in a separate file but do not implement corrections apart from punctuation issues, and send this file to Sophie; Sophie validates my comments and implements them, I guess, directly into Pootle. Sophie? In a nutshell, we're still learning how to work best with Pootle ;-) And as Jean-Christophe says, we'll have to get us organized differently for the next batch. Hope this helps! Kind regards, Elsa Jean-Christophe Helary schrieb: On 19 févr. 08, at 11:38, Reiko Saito wrote: Hi JC, I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Thanks! That will be great. Sorry, I was busy last night... I'll do that later today. I am curious how French community is reviewing the translation ? Sophie and Elsa will be able to reply, I am only a translator :) How are you identifying the segments for review ? I don't think you are reading all of the segments, but focus on the newly tranlsated ones, right ? I understand Pootle shows Suggested translation, but if there are many segments, you are working off-line and upload them to Pootle, I assume. What we have done so far is that I translated the UI in Pootle because there were few segments and since I had forgotten (I am not used yet to the tool) that one could set the suggested flag instead of committing the translation Sophie had indeed to check all the UI strings... We agreed to work with Suggested in a next batch. If you are reviewing them only on Pootle, are you accepting the new translation one by one ? It seems to take time. For the Help files, I think Sophie translated everything offline and I don't know how she managed the review (yet). We still are in the process of adapting ourselves to the new tool. As far as I see it, if one is used to OmegaT, shifting to Pootle is not that convenient. File assignment management can be made otherwise etc. The next big batch of untranslated files will be, I guess, fully handled offline, review included. But we still have to discuss that. Sophie, Elsa, any comment ? Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Hi all, Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: On 19 févr. 08, at 11:38, Reiko Saito wrote: Hi JC, I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Thanks! That will be great. Sorry, I was busy last night... I'll do that later today. I am curious how French community is reviewing the translation ? Sophie and Elsa will be able to reply, I am only a translator :) How are you identifying the segments for review ? I don't think you are reading all of the segments, but focus on the newly tranlsated ones, right ? I understand Pootle shows Suggested translation, but if there are many segments, you are working off-line and upload them to Pootle, I assume. What we have done so far is that I translated the UI in Pootle because there were few segments and since I had forgotten (I am not used yet to the tool) that one could set the suggested flag instead of committing the translation Sophie had indeed to check all the UI strings... Yes, in fact, the difficulty is to identify how suggestions are understanded by Pootle if they are made with another tool. I don't know yet how it works. We agreed to work with Suggested in a next batch. Yes, if you work on line it could be a solution, but off line, I'm not sure If you are reviewing them only on Pootle, are you accepting the new translation one by one ? It seems to take time. For the Help files, I think Sophie translated everything offline and I don't know how she managed the review (yet). I've added my name (sophie) in the comments, so once the files uploaded, my name could still be used as a pointer on line and off line, but I don't think it's a good solution, just a work around. We still are in the process of adapting ourselves to the new tool. +1 :) As far as I see it, if one is used to OmegaT, shifting to Pootle is not that convenient. File assignment management can be made otherwise etc. The next big batch of untranslated files will be, I guess, fully handled offline, review included. But we still have to discuss that. Yes, for our community, where we are not very numerous to contribute to the workflow, it's easier to handle the file off line. Sophie, Elsa, any comment ? Done ;) Kind regards Sophie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Hi, Let me ask you about how to review with Pootle. I've read and even translated Pootle User Guide # Thanks Aijin for great documentation! and now get a picture of how to manage the translation with Pootle ... I know it's very late :-( Only the way I do not understand is how to review. Suppose the translator downloads the file, translate, and upload them as suggested to Pootle, 1. Is there any way to accept all suggested sgements in a single step on Pootle? 2. If we review the files off-line, how can we identify the new translation on OmegaT ? Thanks in advance! Regards, -Reiko -- Reiko Saito Japanese Language Lead Translation Language and Information Services (TLIS) Globalization Services Sun Microsystems, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Phone: +81 3 5962 4912 Blog: http://blogs.sun.com/reiko - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Suppose the translator downloads the file, translate, and upload them as suggested to Pootle, 1. Is there any way to accept all suggested sgements in a single step on Pootle? Reiko, 2. If we review the files off-line, how can we identify the new translation on OmegaT ? It is not trivial. The best way to work with OmegaT is to have untranslated files (without fuzzies, those are handled separately by the TM matching process), to translate them and to review them within OmegaT, or in a plain text|PO editor. Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Let me resend this since it has not come in my mail box yet... -Reiko Original Message Subject: How can we review with Pootle ? Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:04:31 +0900 From: Reiko Saito [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: dev@l10n.openoffice.org Hi, Let me ask you about how to review with Pootle. I've read and even translated Pootle User Guide # Thanks Aijin for great documentation! and now get a picture of how to manage the translation with Pootle ... I know it's very late :-( Only the way I do not understand is how to review. Suppose the translator downloads the file, translate, and upload them as suggested to Pootle, 1. Is there any way to accept all suggested sgements in a single step on Pootle? 2. If we review the files off-line, how can we identify the new translation on OmegaT ? Thanks in advance! Regards, -Reiko -- Reiko Saito Japanese Language Lead Translation Language and Information Services (TLIS) Globalization Services Sun Microsystems, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Phone: +81 3 5962 4912 Blog: http://blogs.sun.com/reiko -- Reiko Saito Japanese Language Lead Translation Language and Information Services (TLIS) Globalization Services Sun Microsystems, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Phone: +81 3 5962 4912 Blog: http://blogs.sun.com/reiko - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Let me confirm. I understand the new/fuzzy is identified on OmegaT, but once the translator did the translation and put the translated string to the untranslated segment, how the reviewer can recognize which one is the strings to review ? Reiko, PO is not exactly the strong point of OmegaT :) I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? JC - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Hi JC, It is not trivial. The best way to work with OmegaT is to have untranslated files (without fuzzies, those are handled separately by the TM matching process), to translate them and to review them within OmegaT, or in a plain text|PO editor. Let me confirm. I understand the new/fuzzy is identified on OmegaT, but once the translator did the translation and put the translated string to the untranslated segment, how the reviewer can recognize which one is the strings to review ? Regards, -Reiko - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
Hi JC, I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Thanks! That will be great. I am curious how French community is reviewing the translation ? How are you identifying the segments for review ? I don't think you are reading all of the segments, but focus on the newly tranlsated ones, right ? I understand Pootle shows Suggested translation, but if there are many segments, you are working off-line and upload them to Pootle, I assume. If you are reviewing them only on Pootle, are you accepting the new translation one by one ? It seems to take time. Regards, -Reiko - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [l10n-dev] How can we review with Pootle ?
On 19 févr. 08, at 11:38, Reiko Saito wrote: Hi JC, I'll check tonight with a PO from Pootle and will get back to you later. Maybe on the ja list ? Thanks! That will be great. Sorry, I was busy last night... I'll do that later today. I am curious how French community is reviewing the translation ? Sophie and Elsa will be able to reply, I am only a translator :) How are you identifying the segments for review ? I don't think you are reading all of the segments, but focus on the newly tranlsated ones, right ? I understand Pootle shows Suggested translation, but if there are many segments, you are working off-line and upload them to Pootle, I assume. What we have done so far is that I translated the UI in Pootle because there were few segments and since I had forgotten (I am not used yet to the tool) that one could set the suggested flag instead of committing the translation Sophie had indeed to check all the UI strings... We agreed to work with Suggested in a next batch. If you are reviewing them only on Pootle, are you accepting the new translation one by one ? It seems to take time. For the Help files, I think Sophie translated everything offline and I don't know how she managed the review (yet). We still are in the process of adapting ourselves to the new tool. As far as I see it, if one is used to OmegaT, shifting to Pootle is not that convenient. File assignment management can be made otherwise etc. The next big batch of untranslated files will be, I guess, fully handled offline, review included. But we still have to discuss that. Sophie, Elsa, any comment ? Jean-Christophe Helary http://mac4translators.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
