Re: [Elecraft] K3 Options Last Time Buy Update

[wb0gaz via Elecraft]

 (last post I'd seen copied below.)

Been almost 2 months since last update (9/15/2023) - still awaiting 
notification of item I ordered (K3EXREF) in April 2021.

Doesn't look like any recent update to the K3 options on ship status page.

Is this still a live effort?

Thanks for refresh on this!

Dave

###

[Elecraft] K3 Options Last Time Buy Update

Eric Swartz Fri, 15 Sep 2023 10:12:29 -0700

Good news - We are now moving along smoothly on the majority of our K3
Option purchasing, assembly and testing. Here is the latest status as of
9/15/23.


*KPA3A 100W PA: * These should begin shipping in the next 2-3 weeks.
We have completed building and testing the main KPA3A PA modules and are
now kitting the mounting hardware and packaging everything for shipping.
We are also now contacting those of you with KPA3A deposit orders to
confirm your order and your K3/K3S serial number. (The S/N is important to
make sure the installation hardware and PA interface I/O board match your
radio revision.)

*KXV3B Xverter interface:* Out for PCB assembly followed by factory
testing. We expect to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.

*P3TXMON:* Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect to
begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.

*KAT3A ATU:* Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect
to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.

*KDVR3A*: Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect to
begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.

*P3SVGA:* Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect to
begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.

*K3EXREF:* Purchasing final parts and PCB fabs, then out to PCB assembly,
followed by factory testing. We hope to begin shipping in the next 6-8
weeks.

*KBPF3A:* Purchasing final parts and PCB fabs, then out to PCB assembly,
followed by factory testing. We hope to begin shipping in the next 6-8
weeks.

*K3/0 and P3*. These will be the last two K3 Options we build, as they are
more complex and are taking more time to source key parts, sheet metal,
displays etc. We will update the shipping status on these after we begin
shipping the other K3 options listed above.

I'll post updates as we get closer to shipping these options. (And
if some begin shipping earlier than the above schedule. :-)

73,
Eric
*elecraft.com *
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and KAT connections without a KPA500

[G4GNX]

No, it’s the multi-core cable with a 15 pin plug on each end.

Check Page 5 of the KAT500 manual.

73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700




> On 4 Nov 2023, at 21:50, Jim Cary  wrote:
> 
> The Aux i/o is the one with phono type plug on the end, correct?
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and KAT connections without a KPA500

[Jim Cary]

The Aux i/o is the one with phono type plug on the end, correct?

> On Nov 4, 2023, at 3:50 PM, Jack Brindle  wrote:
> 
> This is pretty simple, Jim. The AuxIO cable goes from the K3 to the KAT500. 
> Then one of the Antenna outputs of the K3 goes to the RF input of the KAT500.
> Of course the antennas connect to the KAT500 then (as they did before).
> That is pretty much it.
> 
> 73,
> Jack, W6FB
> 
> 
>> On Nov 4, 2023, at 3:03 PM, Jim Cary  wrote:
>> 
>> I’ve had to take my KPA500 out of service and want to operate just with the 
>> K3 and KAT.  I’ve tired different cabling configurations but can’t seem to 
>> get the k3 to communicate.  The manuals show all sorts of connections with 
>> amps, but not without an amp.
>> 
>> I know it has to be simple, but sure is beating me!
>> 
>> Jim
>> 
>> W2SM
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and KAT connections without a KPA500

[Jack Brindle via Elecraft]

This is pretty simple, Jim. The AuxIO cable goes from the K3 to the KAT500. 
Then one of the Antenna outputs of the K3 goes to the RF input of the KAT500.
Of course the antennas connect to the KAT500 then (as they did before).
That is pretty much it.

73,
Jack, W6FB


> On Nov 4, 2023, at 3:03 PM, Jim Cary  wrote:
> 
> I’ve had to take my KPA500 out of service and want to operate just with the 
> K3 and KAT.  I’ve tired different cabling configurations but can’t seem to 
> get the k3 to communicate.  The manuals show all sorts of connections with 
> amps, but not without an amp.
> 
> I know it has to be simple, but sure is beating me!
> 
> Jim
> 
> W2SM
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Randomly Changes Modes

[Michael Carter via Elecraft]

Hi Gary,

I bet you've never used that retort before now.

I don't need any servants, but I could use a
'memory' (not Memory) with same day service.

73,
Mike


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Randomly Changes Modes

[Gary Memory]

???  “If memory serves me correctly…”

I don’t even know who you are, let alone serve you….

Gary Memory, N7BRJ

😜

On Fri, Oct 27, 2023 at 10:27 Michael Carter via Elecraft <
elecraft@mailman.qth.net> wrote:

> Hi Randy,
>
> If memory serves me correctly, others have reported
> similar gremlins with seemingly random activation
> of front panel controls that were not intended.  The
> remedy was (1) check whether your radio has the
> gold pin connectors on the front panel-to-RF board
> interface, and (2) carefully clean the pins on the male header - not
> by spraying, but by using contact cleaner on a cotton
> swab.  Re-insert the front panel to the RF board.
>
> 73,
> Mike, K8CN
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Randomly Changes Modes

[Michael Carter via Elecraft]

Hi Randy,

If memory serves me correctly, others have reported
similar gremlins with seemingly random activation
of front panel controls that were not intended.  The
remedy was (1) check whether your radio has the
gold pin connectors on the front panel-to-RF board
interface, and (2) carefully clean the pins on the male header - not
by spraying, but by using contact cleaner on a cotton
swab.  Re-insert the front panel to the RF board.

73,
Mike, K8CN

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Filters

[Brian Hunt]

There was a time when one could email Elecraft support with the K3 serial 
number and they would send the factory Config file. Probably not 100% of the 
solution but it would be a start. 

73,
Brian, K0DTJ 

> On Oct 17, 2023, at 09:05, W3FPR  wrote:
> 
> Jim,
> 
> It is doubtful that will work if the K3 has been set to factory defaults by 
> EEINIT.
> 
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
> 
>> On 10/17/2023 11:59 AM, Jim McCook wrote:
>> Dave,
>> 
>> Open the K3 Utility and click on Calibration.  Scroll down to Configure 
>> Crystal Filters.  The top line shows the various bandwidths of the installed 
>> filters.  You can see the big picture there with the checked boxes.
>>  Jim W6YA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Filters

[W3FPR]

Jim,

It is doubtful that will work if the K3 has been set to factory defaults 
by EEINIT.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/17/2023 11:59 AM, Jim McCook wrote:

Dave,

Open the K3 Utility and click on Calibration.  Scroll down to 
Configure Crystal Filters.  The top line shows the various bandwidths 
of the installed filters.  You can see the big picture there with the 
checked boxes.

 Jim W6YA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Filters

[Jim McCook]

Dave,

Open the K3 Utility and click on Calibration.  Scroll down to Configure 
Crystal Filters.  The top line shows the various bandwidths of the 
installed filters.  You can see the big picture there with the checked 
boxes.

 Jim W6YA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Filters

[W3FPR]

Dave,

Remove the top cover - there should be a sticker either on the bottom of 
the top cover or on the top of the sub-RX showing the filters installed 
and the offsets if they are not the 8 pole filters.
If the sticker is not present (or is incorrect), then yes, you will have 
to remove the Sub-RX to see the filters in the main RX and remove the 
sub-RX cover to see the filters installed.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/16/2023 1:55 PM, Dave wrote:

I recently purchased another K3 that I believe was Factory Reset prior to the 
sale. Is there a way to determine which, if any, optional filters are installed 
without opening it up? It has the 2 meter xvtr and 2nd receiver installed and 
I’d prefer not to uninstall things.



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Filters

[Michael Carter via Elecraft]

Hi Dave,

Without a saved CONFIG file, I don't think there
is a way to retrieve the filter settings directly from
the K3.  Have you tried examining the filter settings
for any information that is stored in a CONFIG file?
The K3 Utility permits viewing and editing stored
crystal filter settings.

You could try to visually inspect the filter bandwidths
using an audio spectrum analysis tool, but you would
have to turn off any DSP filtering to see the actual
IF crystal filter response at audio frequencies.  With
some effort you could distinguish 5-pole from 8-pole
filters using the transition band slopes, but estimating
-6 dB bandwidths should be more straightforward from
the displayed spectrum.  While a separate wideband
noise generator would be the best source, you might
have enough local wideband noise to obtain a reasonable
spectrum depiction over the crystal filter response width.

73,
Mike, K8CN


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Volume knob failure: second time!

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

> Anyone know if this knob is still available?

E980091/E980092 are both listed at
  
$8.95 each ($19.00 for the pair)

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 9/23/2023 11:24 AM, Tom Doligalski via Elecraft wrote:

Took K3 #969 to the beach this week and was surprised to see the main volume
AF knob had failed (split in half at the point where the set-screw is). This
is the second time I've had this happen (in over a decade!).

  


Anyone know if this knob is still available?

  


The tech support form appears to be inoperative on the Elecraft web site.

  


73 Tom W4KX

  


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Powers Off On Its Own

[David Hachadorian]

On one of my K3's the Powerpole receptacle got flaky. Turn the radio on, 
and then wiggle the plug  to see if it drops out.  I resoldered where 
the receptacle pins mate with the circuit board inside, but I still had 
to use a tie-wrap to hold the plug in a certain position.  I'll fix it 
the right way one of these years.


Good luck!

Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ

On 9/15/2023 3:50 PM, Jed Petrovich wrote:

Hello all:

Earlier this week my K3 shut itself off while it was in receive mode. It
had been running for about 20 total minutes at the time it turned off. I
had just finished a 15 minute QSO. The Tx power was 10 watts.

When I tried to turn it on again, the display briefly flashed for a few
seconds and I could hear a slight buzzing sound from within the chassis and
it went off. I waited for a short time and tried again. The K3 display
flashed for a few seconds along with the buzzing, but would not stay
powered. I tried this one more time, but the display flashed very briefly,
buzzed and then off again.

This morning I could power on the K3, but I didn't let it run very long
before I powered it off. It would seem this is some sort of heat-related
issue.

It's serial number 2826, but it's had several mods over the years including
the upgrade on the receiver.

Any ideas would be appreciated.

73,

Jed
AD7KG
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Options Last Time Buy Update (9/15/23)

[Margaret Wold]

I’ll post this on our website.

mwold

On Fri, Sep 15, 2023 at 10:10 AM Eric Swartz  wrote:

> Good news - We are now moving along smoothly on the majority of our K3
> Option purchasing, assembly and testing. Here is the latest status as of
> 9/15/23.
>
> *KPA3A 100W PA: * These should begin shipping in the next 2-3 weeks.
> We have completed building and testing the main KPA3A PA modules and are
> now kitting the mounting hardware and packaging everything for shipping.
> We are also now contacting  those of you with  KPA3A deposit orders to
> confirm your order and your K3/K3S serial number. (The S/N is important to
> make sure the installation hardware and PA interface I/O board match your
> radio revision.)
>
> *KXV3B Xverter interface:*  Out for PCB assembly followed by factory
> testing. We expect to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.
>
> *P3TXMON:*  Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect
> to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.
>
> *KAT3A ATU:* Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect
> to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.
>
> *KDVR3A*:  Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect
> to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.
>
> *P3SVGA:*  Out for PCB assembly, followed by factory testing. We expect
> to begin shipping in the next 5-6 weeks.
>
> *K3EXREF:*  Purchasing final parts and PCB fabs, then out to PCB
> assembly, followed by factory testing. We hope to begin shipping in the
> next 6-8 weeks.
>
> *KBPF3A:* Purchasing final parts and PCB fabs, then out to PCB assembly,
> followed by factory testing. We hope to begin shipping in the next 6-8
> weeks.
> 
> *K3/0 and P3*. These will be the last two K3 Options we build, as they
> are more complex and are taking more time to source key parts, sheet metal,
> displays etc. We will update the shipping  status on these after we begin
> shipping the other K3 options listed above.
>
> I'll post updates as we get closer to shipping these options. (And
> if some begin shipping earlier than the above schedule. :-)
>
> 73,
> Eric
> *elecraft.com *
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Options Last Time Buy Update and other products status:

[Eric Swartz]

Following up on my last post, I'm running about a week and a half behind
getting input for the update. I will be posting it here before the end of
next week after we all get back from the holiday weekend.

Hope everyone gets some relaxation this holiday weekend!

73, EricWA6HHQ
*elecraft.com *



>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 subreceiver works on CW only

[Erik Wheeler]

Ah yes, that was it! Thank you all!


> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2023 14:38:51 -0400
> From: Erik Wheeler 
> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 subreceiver works on CW only
> Message-ID:
> <
> ca+e6vg7jhuyttyopmfkeys8swpnjmwtbqhw71gg9nxxb_qc...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Hi all,
>
> On my K3 (serial 1773) my sub-receiver only works on CW.
>
> On SSB, I just hear faint white noise.
>
> Is this just a setting problem? I've been through all the settings and
> reviewed the manual on the sub-receiver, but haven't been able to solve it.
>
> I have verified that the sub-receiver is using the main antenna.
>
> Thanks for any suggestions.
>
> Erik
> N1CFO
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2023 16:17:52 -0400
> From: Gordon LaPoint 
> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 subreceiver works on CW only
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> Erik,
>  ?? This sounds like the filter setup for the sub receiver is not correct.
> Gordon - N1MGO
>
> On 8/25/2023 2:38 PM, Erik Wheeler wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > On my K3 (serial 1773) my sub-receiver only works on CW.
> >
> > On SSB, I just hear faint white noise.
> >
> > Is this just a setting problem? I've been through all the settings and
> > reviewed the manual on the sub-receiver, but haven't been able to solve
> it.
> >
> > I have verified that the sub-receiver is using the main antenna.
> >
> > Thanks for any suggestions.
> >
> > Erik
> > N1CFO
> > __
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>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2023 20:53:24 +
> From: Michael Carter 
> To: Elecraft Reflector Reflector 
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 subreceiver works on CW only
> Message-ID:
> <
> bl3p223mb0385fb3c3817e02f5ecb04dee4...@bl3p223mb0385.namp223.prod.outlook.com
> >
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Erik,
>
> Did you check the filter selection for
> the sub-receiver to be sure you don't
> have a blank slot selected for SSB?
>
> 73,
> Mike, K8CN
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 subreceiver works on CW only

[Michael Carter]

Hi Erik,

Did you check the filter selection for
the sub-receiver to be sure you don't
have a blank slot selected for SSB?

73,
Mike, K8CN
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 subreceiver works on CW only

[Gordon LaPoint]

Erik,
   This sounds like the filter setup for the sub receiver is not correct.
Gordon - N1MGO

On 8/25/2023 2:38 PM, Erik Wheeler wrote:

Hi all,

On my K3 (serial 1773) my sub-receiver only works on CW.

On SSB, I just hear faint white noise.

Is this just a setting problem? I've been through all the settings and
reviewed the manual on the sub-receiver, but haven't been able to solve it.

I have verified that the sub-receiver is using the main antenna.

Thanks for any suggestions.

Erik
N1CFO
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Headset

[John Paul Keon]

I have been using a HEIL proset with my K3S since I built it.
I have not had any problems with it.

John Paul // AB4PP

On Sun, Aug 6, 2023 at 8:11 PM Tom & Barb Valosin 
wrote:

> Eric,
>
> Ever since I got my K3 (used) about 9 years back I have been using a
> Heil Proset.
>
> Connects into front mic - jack and phones. Seems to work well. I have
> been happy with it.
>
> Tom, WB2KLD
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Options Last Time Buy Update and other products status:

[Michael Carter]

Thanks very much, Eric, for the comprehensive
update!

73,
Mike, K8CN
(especially glad to know about the KPA3A
being close to shipping)
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[M Cresap via Elecraft]

 Hi Dave, Joe, and Jim
The GMSK to AM distortion across any 50 Hz bandwidth of a K3 filter would seem 
to be minor. With an FT8 symbol rate of 6.25 symbols per second, would that not 
create some relatively weak 6.25 Hz sidebands plus a bit of mush around those 
lines due to the pseudorandom nature of the bit patterns? That could increase 
the overall bandwidth by maybe 18 Hz above the nominal FT8 signal bandwidth. 
The narrowest resolution bandwidth I have been using is 10 Hz, which is too 
wide to pick up that level of detail. 

There is an equalization tool in WSJT-X that is supposed to equalize phase and 
amplitude filter distortions inside the radio for improved decoding. I haven't 
played with that feature, but it looks like it could provide degraded results 
if it collects data at one passband tuning setting, then tries to decode 
signals after the operator changes the PBT.

Bob has reminded me that ALC related measurements should be done with a fresh 
Tx Cal using the DC voltage/voltage drop that exists today in my shack. I 
recently changed the DC power wiring to 2 feet of #10 wire between the K4 and 
the power supply, just like what I did for my K3. I plan on doing that Tx cal 
tomorrow, will rerun the K4 measurements and let you know what I see.

73, Mike, W3IP

On Sunday, July 23, 2023 at 11:59:58 AM EDT, Dave (NK7Z)  
wrote:  
 
 Hello Mike,

Thanks for sharing your data!!  Help me understand something you said...

Are you saying that at 2 bars, (for your K4), all spurious signals, are 
at least 80 dB down from carrier, while at 5 bars, all spurious signals 
are running around 50 or 60 dB down from carrier?

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 7/23/23 07:23, M Cresap via Elecraft wrote:
> For my K4, the FT8 signal is clean with no more than 2 bars of ALC.
> To be clear, the spurious responses I have seen with ALC set to 5 bars has NO 
> measurable IMD responses. There is only the one strong signal present, the 
> spurious signals being discussed here are all less than 50 or 60 dB below the 
> intended carrier level. My goal is to reduce all the spurious responses to 80 
> dB below the intended carrier level.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 channel hopping anomaly

[Kent Trimble]

Hi Fred ...

I don't think the "channel hopping" procedure described on page 40 will 
accomplish what you are wanting to do because it says (in bold type), 
"Memories to be used for channel hopping must be within the same band ..."


Furthermore, tapping M»V twice always puts the Memory content into VFO-A 
with the main tuning dial incrementing the frequency as you described, 
which is normal.


However, you CAN do what you are wanting to do by simply putting each 
KPH frequency in its own Memory bin.


Then, to recall the KPH frequencies (starting in VFO-A), tap M»V just 
once which puts you into the 00-99 Memory slots and allows the main 
tuning dial to cycle through (i.e. channel hop) the various programmed 
frequencies.


Like you, I have KPH marine frequencies stored in Memory.  During last 
week's Night of Nights I cycled through the various KPH Memory slots 
until determining which frequency had the best propagation to my 
location.  At that point you have a choice.  You can either stay in 
Memory mode (the bin number will flash) or you can hit M»V a second time 
and transfer the frequency into VFO-A.  Either will work.  If you do the 
latter, I'd recommend locking the main tuning dial.


Good luck with Enigma!  Too complicated for my tired old brain.

73,
Kent
K9ZTV



On 7/22/2023 2:00 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
I have a variety of frequencies, both in and outside the ham bands 
[e.g. KPH freqs] set up in my K3.  The KPH freqs are set up with the 
"*" in the name for channel hopping.  Worked great for 10 years.  This 
AM, getting ready for the "Big Enigma Decryption Test" I tapped M->V, 
selected memory 37 [6477.5 kHz], and then tapped M->V again.  K3 went 
to the right frequency, however when I move the Big Knob, it just 
increments the frequency ... it does not channel hop.  All looks 
normal in the K3 Memory Editor app.


99.775% of these kinds of problems end up being in my head. Hoping 
this one is too.  Any help?


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

Doppler caused "spreading" is readily identified ... the spreading is
generally in one direction (because airport "patterns" run in one
direction) and often manifests as a second signal offset by 60-80 Hz
(which can be independently decoded).  IMD is generally in both
directions and can not be decoded.

The *most disgusting* distortion is on signals in which the owner
pumps audio into a dynamic mic input and overdrives the mic preamp.
The mic gain control of most traditional rigs follows the preamp
and the preamp is often into clipping - particularly when the "speaker"
or headphone output of a sound card is run into a dynamic mic input
without an attenuator.  Electret inputs typically require a 20 dB
(10:1 voltage - 10 K series, 1K parallel resistors) attenuator while
dynamic inputs call for a 40 dB (100:1 - 47 K series, 470 Ohm parallel)
attenuator.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 7/23/2023 3:13 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

On 7/23/2023 9:49 AM, Andy Durbin wrote:
It is my belief that many of the wide FT8 signals seen on 6 m FT8 are 
caused by Doppler shifted aircraft reflections.  It's very common here 
in the Phoenix metro area and does not imply that the transmitted 
signal was in any way abnormal.


YES! It's very common anywhere around airports with much traffic. We see 
lots of it in the SF Bay area -- N5KO, W6RN, WB6RJH, and I are roughly 
20 miles from SJC (San Jose) 30 miles from SFO (San Francisco), a little 
farther from OAK (Oakland). There are other propagation-related causes 
for spreading signals.


73, Jim K9YC


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Jim Brown]

On 7/23/2023 9:49 AM, Andy Durbin wrote:

It is my belief that many of the wide FT8 signals seen on 6 m FT8 are caused by 
Doppler shifted aircraft reflections.  It's very common here in the Phoenix 
metro area and does not imply that the transmitted signal was in any way 
abnormal.


YES! It's very common anywhere around airports with much traffic. We see 
lots of it in the SF Bay area -- N5KO, W6RN, WB6RJH, and I are roughly 
20 miles from SJC (San Jose) 30 miles from SFO (San Francisco), a little 
farther from OAK (Oakland). There are other propagation-related causes 
for spreading signals.


73, Jim K9YC





















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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Dave (NK7Z)]

Hello Mike,

Thanks for sharing your data!!  Help me understand something you said...

Are you saying that at 2 bars, (for your K4), all spurious signals, are 
at least 80 dB down from carrier, while at 5 bars, all spurious signals 
are running around 50 or 60 dB down from carrier?


73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 7/23/23 07:23, M Cresap via Elecraft wrote:

For my K4, the FT8 signal is clean with no more than 2 bars of ALC.
To be clear, the spurious responses I have seen with ALC set to 5 bars has NO 
measurable IMD responses. There is only the one strong signal present, the 
spurious signals being discussed here are all less than 50 or 60 dB below the 
intended carrier level. My goal is to reduce all the spurious responses to 80 
dB below the intended carrier level.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Rick NK7I]

That the K3 and K4 are clean transmitters (for a 12V final) is awesome for 
everyone on the air.  Elecraft sets the bar again.

But the highly popular JT modes are not the only audio based digital modes used 
these days.  Others are more complex than one continuous phase shifted tone.

With that in mind, there is no reason that comes to mind, why (no matter the 
brand) operators should not set their audio input for max UP TO where ALC 
begins, so that any audio based digital mode stays clean; the transmitter is 
given precisely what it needs to produce output without hunting or ‘coming up 
to power’.

When I select 28 watts, it means I want and expect 28 watts on EVERY 
transmission, EVERY time IMMEDIATELY (to drive an amp where the differences 
become significant).

Anything else, is just sloppy operating and there is already ample numbers of 
sloppy stations.  We can each do our part to not be another (no matter the 
mode).

73,
Rick NK7I

> On Jul 23, 2023, at 7:23 AM, M Cresap via Elecraft  
> wrote:
> 
>  I have been running tests on K3s and K4s to understand the conditions 
> needed to transmit clean FT8 signals. I have previously shared some of my 
> findings with Pete N4ZR and a couple of other folks. Their feedback has been 
> very valuable.
> 
> Joe Taylor, K1JT has shown the spectral purity of the FT4 and FT8 protocols 
> (using WSJT-X version 2.1 and later) to be very clean to 80 dB below the peak 
> signal. See https://wsjt.sourceforge.io/FT4_FT8_QEX.pdf (Figure 3 and related 
> discussion on pages 9 and 10)  and 
> https://www.w2zq.com/wsjt-x-innards-explained-by-joe-taylor-k1jt/ (slide 
> entitled Spectra: RTTY, FT8, FT4). If the WSJT-X operating instructions are 
> followed (use operating mode "Fake-It" or "Split"), there is exactly one 
> clean signal to be transmitted as discussed in the exchanges in this thread 
> https://groups.io/g/Elecraft-K4/message/25371
> I have been endeavoring to ensure that ALL of the FT4 and FT8 spectra purity 
> shown by Joe Taylor can be replicated by my K3 and K4D in the Data A mode - 
> and that the recipe for a clean spectra can be shared with others. Clean FT8 
> spectra is badly needed, especially in metro areas at 10 meters and above, 
> where many poor quality FT8 signals abound and wipe out many of the weaker 
> stations that other stations are trying to receive. Yes, there are 
> suggestions that folks in the same area all transmit at the same time, and 
> many people try it, but in practice, not everyone is on-board with that 
> suggestion. But, there are also stations on the air that transmit very clean 
> FT8 signals every day, so it can be done!
> I shared with Pete that neither my K3 or K4 transmitted the cleanest possible 
> FT8 signal using either analog or USB digital inputs and the conventional 
> setup instructions that have been often repeated on this reflector (i.e. set 
> the audio level so there are 4/5 bars of ALC showing). After I beefed up my 
> DC power cable (it is now 2 feet of #10 wire between the K3 and the power 
> supply), I found that setting the Line In level to the point just before the 
> 1st ALC bar lights up (i.e. Line In = 2 in my case) results in a very clean 
> FT8 signal. As Pete reported, there is a slow increase of RF power output 
> level for 10-20 seconds as the ALC circuit compensates for the lower input 
> level, but apparently the ALC loop remains open, hence the clean signal. 
> 
> For my K4, the FT8 signal is clean with no more than 2 bars of ALC.
> To be clear, the spurious responses I have seen with ALC set to 5 bars has NO 
> measurable IMD responses. There is only the one strong signal present, the 
> spurious signals being discussed here are all less than 50 or 60 dB below the 
> intended carrier level. My goal is to reduce all the spurious responses to 80 
> dB below the intended carrier level.
> 
> The discussion that Pete, N4ZR started several days ago got many responses 
> that could be grouped into three categories:
> 
> 1. "The manufacturer says use 5 bars of ALC, end of story". I don't buy that 
> at all. I have yet to see any manufacturer's DATA on the relationship between 
> their transmit ALC levels (or any other metric) and the in-band spectral 
> purity of an FT8 like signal beyond "meets  FCC spurious signal 
> requirements". 
> 
> 2. "I must be mistaken, my equipment is overloaded, etc". In years past, that 
> would have been a fair criticism, it would have taken hundreds of thousands 
> of $$ worth of calibrated test equipment to prove whether anyone's receiver 
> was overloaded or not. With today's high end receivers (the K4 being one of 
> them), the overload point in every gain state is well known (notably 
> confirmed and publicized by NC0I, Rob Sherwood), and overloaded signals 
> trigger a visible alarm on the radio. The K4 (and I assume other high end 
> receivers with similar architecture) has a repeatable performance (amplitude 
> stability) in showing signal levels to the dB on

Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[M Cresap via Elecraft]

 I have been running tests on K3s and K4s to understand the conditions needed 
to transmit clean FT8 signals. I have previously shared some of my findings 
with Pete N4ZR and a couple of other folks. Their feedback has been very 
valuable.

Joe Taylor, K1JT has shown the spectral purity of the FT4 and FT8 protocols 
(using WSJT-X version 2.1 and later) to be very clean to 80 dB below the peak 
signal. See https://wsjt.sourceforge.io/FT4_FT8_QEX.pdf (Figure 3 and related 
discussion on pages 9 and 10)  and 
https://www.w2zq.com/wsjt-x-innards-explained-by-joe-taylor-k1jt/ (slide 
entitled Spectra: RTTY, FT8, FT4). If the WSJT-X operating instructions are 
followed (use operating mode "Fake-It" or "Split"), there is exactly one clean 
signal to be transmitted as discussed in the exchanges in this thread 
https://groups.io/g/Elecraft-K4/message/25371
I have been endeavoring to ensure that ALL of the FT4 and FT8 spectra purity 
shown by Joe Taylor can be replicated by my K3 and K4D in the Data A mode - and 
that the recipe for a clean spectra can be shared with others. Clean FT8 
spectra is badly needed, especially in metro areas at 10 meters and above, 
where many poor quality FT8 signals abound and wipe out many of the weaker 
stations that other stations are trying to receive. Yes, there are suggestions 
that folks in the same area all transmit at the same time, and many people try 
it, but in practice, not everyone is on-board with that suggestion. But, there 
are also stations on the air that transmit very clean FT8 signals every day, so 
it can be done!
I shared with Pete that neither my K3 or K4 transmitted the cleanest possible 
FT8 signal using either analog or USB digital inputs and the conventional setup 
instructions that have been often repeated on this reflector (i.e. set the 
audio level so there are 4/5 bars of ALC showing). After I beefed up my DC 
power cable (it is now 2 feet of #10 wire between the K3 and the power supply), 
I found that setting the Line In level to the point just before the 1st ALC bar 
lights up (i.e. Line In = 2 in my case) results in a very clean FT8 signal. As 
Pete reported, there is a slow increase of RF power output level for 10-20 
seconds as the ALC circuit compensates for the lower input level, but 
apparently the ALC loop remains open, hence the clean signal. 

For my K4, the FT8 signal is clean with no more than 2 bars of ALC.
To be clear, the spurious responses I have seen with ALC set to 5 bars has NO 
measurable IMD responses. There is only the one strong signal present, the 
spurious signals being discussed here are all less than 50 or 60 dB below the 
intended carrier level. My goal is to reduce all the spurious responses to 80 
dB below the intended carrier level.

The discussion that Pete, N4ZR started several days ago got many responses that 
could be grouped into three categories:

1. "The manufacturer says use 5 bars of ALC, end of story". I don't buy that at 
all. I have yet to see any manufacturer's DATA on the relationship between 
their transmit ALC levels (or any other metric) and the in-band spectral purity 
of an FT8 like signal beyond "meets  FCC spurious signal requirements". 

2. "I must be mistaken, my equipment is overloaded, etc". In years past, that 
would have been a fair criticism, it would have taken hundreds of thousands of 
$$ worth of calibrated test equipment to prove whether anyone's receiver was 
overloaded or not. With today's high end receivers (the K4 being one of them), 
the overload point in every gain state is well known (notably confirmed and 
publicized by NC0I, Rob Sherwood), and overloaded signals trigger a visible 
alarm on the radio. The K4 (and I assume other high end receivers with similar 
architecture) has a repeatable performance (amplitude stability) in showing 
signal levels to the dB on a panadapter. To me, external monitors and external 
display programs (like Win4K4) help to visualize and collect data better than 
trying to read the data off the radio's relatively small screen.
3. "Don't use my data, have someone near you with a high end receiver 
/panadapteror a good spectrum analyzer (and who knows how to use it) look at 
your signal". I agree, that is a very sound approach. On 6 meters, a station 
10-20 miles away, and near line of sight should provide a good signal strength 
for analysis by a high end receiver/panadapter.

It is also possible for any transmitter that more than one problems exists, 
beyond the ALC issue. Other potential problems include poor power supply 
regulation, excessive DC voltage drop on transmit, ground loops, or a defective 
phase locked loop. Those problems should be fixed before changes to the ALC 
response is attempted.

The K3 accepts both analog and digital inputs for Data In, with multiple 
generations of I/O boards. I have not tested all of these combinations! Ground 
loops in particular can be challenging to clean up.
I used a Signalhound SA-44B spectrum analyzer and a 

Re: [Elecraft] K3 channel hopping anomaly[1]

[Kent Trimble]

Hi Fred ...

I don't think using the "channel hopping" procedure as described on page 
40 will accomplish what you are wanting to do because it says (in bold 
type), "Memories to be used for channel hopping must be within the same 
band ..."


Furthermore, tapping M»V twice always puts the Memory content into VFO-A 
with the main tuning dial incrementing the frequency as you described, 
which is normal.


However, you CAN do what you are wanting to do by simply putting each 
KPH frequency in its own Memory bin.


Then, to recall the KPH frequencies (assuming you are in VFO-A), tap M»V 
just once which puts you into the 00-99 Memory slots and allows the main 
tuning dial to cycle through (same as "channel hopping") the various 
programmed frequencies.


Like you I have all the KPH marine frequencies in Memory.  During last 
week's Night of Nights I merely cycled through the various KPH Memory 
slots until I could determine which frequency had the best propagation 
to my location.  At that point you have a choice. You can either stay in 
Memory mode (the bin number will flash) or you can hit M»V a second time 
and transfer the frequency into VFO-A.  Either will work.  If you do the 
latter, I'd recommend locking the main tuning dial.


Good luck with Enigma!  Too complicated for my tired old brain.

73,
Kent
K9ZTV



On 7/22/2023 2:00 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
I have a variety of frequencies, both in and outside the ham bands 
[e.g. KPH freqs] set up in my K3.  The KPH freqs are set up with the 
"*" in the name for channel hopping.  Worked great for 10 years.  This 
AM, getting ready for the "Big Enigma Decryption Test" I tapped M->V, 
selected memory 37 [6477.5 kHz], and then tapped M->V again.  K3 went 
to the right frequency, however when I move the Big Knob, it just 
increments the frequency ... it does not channel hop.  All looks 
normal in the K3 Memory Editor app.


99.775% of these kinds of problems end up being in my head. Hoping 
this one is too.  Any help?


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

[1] anomaly [ah NOM ah lee, n.] Term used by NASA to indicate 
something not going correctly.  It can range anywhere from a burned 
out indicator to the rocket landing pointy-end first in the desert 
outside Tucson




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

Are you sure the "technically-qualified local ham" was not running his
tests in SSB instead of DATA A?  There are more than a few "technically-
qualified" individuals who insist on using SSB instead of DATA_A with
WSJTX and that makes all the difference in the ALC display.

Again, READ THE K3 OWNERS MANUAL and do what the manufacturer says.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV

On 7/20/2023 10:33 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
OK guys - rather than reply individually, let me try to pull everything 
together in one message.


In a previous effort at FT8 I followed the standard advice to set the 
power slider in WSJT-X (on the lower RIGHT side) so that my K-3 showed 4 
bars on the ALC meter, just below the threshold for ALC starting, and 
that seemed to work fine.  Then a technically-qualified local ham showed 
me spectrum analyzer images of a K-3 at 4 bars versus at no bars, and 
the difference was startling - the no bars signal was clean and narrow, 
while the 4-bars signal looked like some of those SSB sigs we hear 
during contests, wide and with many artifacts.  I am not going to 
identify my source here, but I'm fairly sure he reads this reflector, so 
maybe he'll join the discussion


Anyway, I'm kind of at sea - WSJT-X works fine with no bars - I've 
finished 12 and 17M, as well as digital DXCC in the last few weeks, 
following his advice.  But the hunting typically takes almost 20 seconds 
of transmitting - roughly 1 1/2 FT-8 cycles - to reach full power - and 
happens every time I change bands, which puts me behind the curve if I 
switch bands, see someone I need, and have to spend 1 1/2 transmit 
cycles getting up to full power before I can call him effectively.


73, Pete N4ZR




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Rick NK7I]

Pete,
I would suspect that the local ham didn’t account for you overdriving his 
receiver (or test set) which would explain why an underdriven signal appeared 
cleaner (no overload).  Had he attenuated your 4 bar signal, it would have been 
clean, I’m 100% certain.

A full audio supplied (just shy of ALC) K3  is clean.  I’ve had mine monitored 
several times with real test equipment, to make sure before I trusted it at QRO 
levels (and checked again in case there was an RFI distortion).  On some radios 
harmonics will appear, but they are internal to the radio, not really on the 
air (overdrive distortion).

It will remain as clean as the audio, up to the point the ALC begins to kick 
in; then it goes bad like any other radio.  That’s the fault of ALC, not the 
radio.

I DX, it’s about the only thing I do on ham radio.  Most of the time at legal 
limit with a high gain antenna (helps to be LOUD, get heard, make the contact, 
fight less) and over the past several years FT8 has been the mode of choice by 
DX teams (limited staff, fast, one op can work 2-3 bands at a time, efficient 
and dreadfully boring).  Had there been an issue, I would have heard about it 
by now; my station is one of several hundred potent signals on the band.

But, you have your answer why it’s hunting power and can choose to operate as 
you see fit as long as you remember that the K3 will try to ‘pull’ more audio 
in order to obtain the power setting, which may be that it pulls in sounds and 
noises (power supply, signals on other sound card or rig noises) not normally 
heard (and looks poor on the output as a result).

My suggestion:  As stated prior for the how, 4 bars of audio drive with the 5th 
barely flickering (WSJT-X at max) and leave it all alone.  Using audio drive on 
a modern rig as an RF output control is misusing the rig and clutters up the 
air.  Leave the ‘power setting’ on WSJT-X at MAX; recheck the collections of 
settings periodically (and ALWAYS after a Windows update, they often do NASTY 
things to audio and USB port settings).

The WSJT-X control is akin to reducing receive signal levels by trimming feet 
of antenna off, instead of using the RF gain control.  It has the same results 
but it’s just not the correct method.

If you do this, you’ll find that the clean output at the power you actually set 
the radio for, will allow other DXCC conclusions in very short order (because 
you’re loud and clean).

The choice is yours.

73,
Rick NK7I

> On Jul 20, 2023, at 7:33 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> OK guys - rather than reply individually, let me try to pull everything 
> together in one message.
> 
> In a previous effort at FT8 I followed the standard advice to set the power 
> slider in WSJT-X (on the lower RIGHT side) so that my K-3 showed 4 bars on 
> the ALC meter, just below the threshold for ALC starting, and that seemed to 
> work fine.  Then a technically-qualified local ham showed me spectrum 
> analyzer images of a K-3 at 4 bars versus at no bars, and the difference was 
> startling - the no bars signal was clean and narrow, while the 4-bars signal 
> looked like some of those SSB sigs we hear during contests, wide and with 
> many artifacts.  I am not going to identify my source here, but I'm fairly 
> sure he reads this reflector, so maybe he'll join the discussion
> 
> Anyway, I'm kind of at sea - WSJT-X works fine with no bars - I've finished 
> 12 and 17M, as well as digital DXCC in the last few weeks, following his 
> advice.  But the hunting typically takes almost 20 seconds of transmitting - 
> roughly 1 1/2 FT-8 cycles - to reach full power - and happens every time I 
> change bands, which puts me behind the curve if I switch bands, see someone I 
> need, and have to spend 1 1/2 transmit cycles getting up to full power before 
> I can call him effectively.
> 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[David Gilbert]

Sorry, but I would want to see live spectrum displays of my own rig with 
a known hardware setup instead of images of some other K3 with unknown 
K3 settings and unknown test setup.  Hundreds of us have been following 
the just barely flickering 5 bar rule with excellent performance.


You know that you're experiencing power hunting the way you are doing it 
... you don't know that you're generating trash the way everyone else 
does it.


73,
Dave  AB7E



On 7/20/2023 7:33 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
OK guys - rather than reply individually, let me try to pull 
everything together in one message.


In a previous effort at FT8 I followed the standard advice to set the 
power slider in WSJT-X (on the lower RIGHT side) so that my K-3 showed 
4 bars on the ALC meter, just below the threshold for ALC starting, 
and that seemed to work fine.  Then a technically-qualified local ham 
showed me spectrum analyzer images of a K-3 at 4 bars versus at no 
bars, and the difference was startling - the no bars signal was clean 
and narrow, while the 4-bars signal looked like some of those SSB sigs 
we hear during contests, wide and with many artifacts.  I am not going 
to identify my source here, but I'm fairly sure he reads this 
reflector, so maybe he'll join the discussion


Anyway, I'm kind of at sea - WSJT-X works fine with no bars - I've 
finished 12 and 17M, as well as digital DXCC in the last few weeks, 
following his advice.  But the hunting typically takes almost 20 
seconds of transmitting - roughly 1 1/2 FT-8 cycles - to reach full 
power - and happens every time I change bands, which puts me behind 
the curve if I switch bands, see someone I need, and have to spend 1 
1/2 transmit cycles getting up to full power before I can call him 
effectively.


73, Pete N4ZR


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Walter Underwood]

I recommend finding someone with a P3 or other spectrum display and trying this 
on *your* K3 rather than looking at pictures of “a K3”. Running with 
insufficient audio drive, which is what you are doing, has known problems, 
which you are experiencing.

I would be glad to do it with my KX3 and PX3, but I’m on the other side of the 
US.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Jul 20, 2023, at 7:33 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> OK guys - rather than reply individually, let me try to pull everything 
> together in one message.
> 
> In a previous effort at FT8 I followed the standard advice to set the power 
> slider in WSJT-X (on the lower RIGHT side) so that my K-3 showed 4 bars on 
> the ALC meter, just below the threshold for ALC starting, and that seemed to 
> work fine.  Then a technically-qualified local ham showed me spectrum 
> analyzer images of a K-3 at 4 bars versus at no bars, and the difference was 
> startling - the no bars signal was clean and narrow, while the 4-bars signal 
> looked like some of those SSB sigs we hear during contests, wide and with 
> many artifacts.  I am not going to identify my source here, but I'm fairly 
> sure he reads this reflector, so maybe he'll join the discussion
> 
> Anyway, I'm kind of at sea - WSJT-X works fine with no bars - I've finished 
> 12 and 17M, as well as digital DXCC in the last few weeks, following his 
> advice.  But the hunting typically takes almost 20 seconds of transmitting - 
> roughly 1 1/2 FT-8 cycles - to reach full power - and happens every time I 
> change bands, which puts me behind the curve if I switch bands, see someone I 
> need, and have to spend 1 1/2 transmit cycles getting up to full power before 
> I can call him effectively.
> 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Pete Smith N4ZR]

OK guys - rather than reply individually, let me try to pull everything 
together in one message.


In a previous effort at FT8 I followed the standard advice to set the 
power slider in WSJT-X (on the lower RIGHT side) so that my K-3 showed 4 
bars on the ALC meter, just below the threshold for ALC starting, and 
that seemed to work fine.  Then a technically-qualified local ham showed 
me spectrum analyzer images of a K-3 at 4 bars versus at no bars, and 
the difference was startling - the no bars signal was clean and narrow, 
while the 4-bars signal looked like some of those SSB sigs we hear 
during contests, wide and with many artifacts.  I am not going to 
identify my source here, but I'm fairly sure he reads this reflector, so 
maybe he'll join the discussion


Anyway, I'm kind of at sea - WSJT-X works fine with no bars - I've 
finished 12 and 17M, as well as digital DXCC in the last few weeks, 
following his advice.  But the hunting typically takes almost 20 seconds 
of transmitting - roughly 1 1/2 FT-8 cycles - to reach full power - and 
happens every time I change bands, which puts me behind the curve if I 
switch bands, see someone I need, and have to spend 1 1/2 transmit 
cycles getting up to full power before I can call him effectively.


73, Pete N4ZR

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Rick NK7I]

Hi Jim,

Maybe you’d feel better knowing that with WSJT-X at max; I had always adjusted 
the OS driver level plus the rig levels, starting mid range on both.  And from 
midway, find the right blend to get the level to be proper with neither control 
at (or near) max so nobody shouts and no one strains to hear.

That method has worked well for me, for many years now.  With that added 
background, I stand by what I said.  Set it to MAX and forget it. 

Adding more display controls opens the door to added confusion with poor 
signals by those who do not know what they’re doing in the first place.  
Eliminating the “power control” would be a step in the right direction; it only 
adds confusion, misunderstanding and poor signals.  Audio level tweaking to 
adjust RF output is a poor method [on a modern radio].

Using the right controls (driver out —> rig input), as they were designed to be 
used is enough, adding more just mungs things up.

So I suspect we actually agree.

73,
Rick NK7I

> On Jul 20, 2023, at 3:42 PM, Jim Brown  wrote:
> 
> On 7/20/2023 2:47 PM, Rick NK7I wrote:
>> s said MANY times, set the WSJT-X output to MAX, then IGNORE IT.
> 
> Hi Rick,
> 
> This is the only part of your excellent advice that I disagree with. The 
> reason is that the analog stages of computer gear tend to be poor, and start 
> generating increased distortion well below clip. My advice is to run analog 
> outputs of computer gear 6 dB below clip.
> 
> 73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Jim Brown]

On 7/20/2023 2:47 PM, Rick NK7I wrote:

s said MANY times, set the WSJT-X output to MAX, then IGNORE IT.


Hi Rick,

This is the only part of your excellent advice that I disagree with. The 
reason is that the analog stages of computer gear tend to be poor, and 
start generating increased distortion well below clip. My advice is to 
run analog outputs of computer gear 6 dB below clip.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Jim Brown]

On 7/20/2023 2:16 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 users, 
have been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just short of 
or just into the first flickers of ALC.  I did this because I was 
advised that setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated junk in 
the FT8 passband.  I am running the K3 in Data A mode


I saw that post, and suspected at the time that you got bum advice. 
That's why it's power-hunting. I'd go back to what Elecraft says in 
their manual.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Dan Violette]

Yes, it hunts for a couple seconds first time on a change (freq, mode,
power, turn on).  Elecraft mentioned it has to do with it setting its power
level (it works a bit to get stabilized and not noticed normally).  After
the first TX time it will be fine.

 

Dan KI6X

 

Message: 14

Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2023 17:16:47 -0400

From: Pete Smith N4ZR mailto:pete.n...@gmail.com> >

To: Elecraft List mailto:elecraft@mailman.qth.net> >

Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

Message-ID: mailto:caff765b-c334-0990-072f-a2e7f1632...@gmail.com> >

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

 

I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 users, have
been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just short of or just
into the first flickers of ALC.? I did this because I was advised that
setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated junk in the FT8
passband.? I am running the K3 in Data A mode

 

Since I did this, I've noticed strange (to me, anyway) behavior from my K3.?
When WSJT-X starts an FT8 transmit cycle, after I have just switched to the
current band or changed the power slider in WSJT-X or the PWR control on my
K-3, the K3's power output starts essentially at zero and slowly ramps up
through 1- 1 1/2 FT8 transmit cycles.? Once it reaches the expected level,
subsequent transmissions stay at that level.

 

I've been told (not by Elecraft) that this behavior is a result of the K3's
firmware "hunting" for the right power level, but such a slow and
repetitious behavior doesn't fit with the rest of what I've come to expect
from my K3.? It doesn't happen on CW or SSB either. So what's going on?

 

-- 

73, Pete N4ZR

 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Rick NK7I]

Whomever K3 user told you to EVER use the output control other than MAX at ALL 
TIMES needs to go back to learning.  They are NOT helping you.

The WSJT-X output control is an AUDIO control, not an RF output control.
On any rig made since 1985, one wants to adjust the RF for RF and the audio for 
audio.

As said MANY times, set the WSJT-X output to MAX, then IGNORE IT.  FOREVER.  It 
is one stupid flaw in an otherwise brilliant application.  Audio drive is NOT 
the way to manage RF output on any modern radio.

Then adjust the audio during transmit (test mode) to 4 bars on the ALC, “just” 
tickling the 5th bar.  That is the place that the K3 ALC begins.  [If you 
undershoot the audio level, the K3 still attempts to reach that power output, 
but the results may not be pleasing to others on the air.]

Now when you send, the K3 will put out the power you choose and the signal will 
be clean and stable.

You set the output power with the RF output control, not a garage door opener.  
Right tool, right job.

It’s REALLY frustrating to see this reappearing EVERY year; the K3 is not a JA 
radio, it manages things differently and generally better.  One would think 
that after so many years the misinformation would fade out.

So now YOU know how to set the audio on the K3 and will be cleaner than those 
who attempted to mislead you with false information.

This method holds true on ANY audio based digital mode (like AFSK, PSK…).

73,
Rick NK7I

> On Jul 20, 2023, at 2:17 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 users, have 
> been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just short of or just 
> into the first flickers of ALC.  I did this because I was advised that 
> setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated junk in the FT8 passband. 
>  I am running the K3 in Data A mode
> 
> Since I did this, I've noticed strange (to me, anyway) behavior from my K3.  
> When WSJT-X starts an FT8 transmit cycle, after I have just switched to the 
> current band or changed the power slider in WSJT-X or the PWR control on my 
> K-3, the K3's power output starts essentially at zero and slowly ramps up 
> through 1- 1 1/2 FT8 transmit cycles.  Once it reaches the expected level, 
> subsequent transmissions stay at that level.
> 
> I've been told (not by Elecraft) that this behavior is a result of the K3's 
> firmware "hunting" for the right power level, but such a slow and repetitious 
> behavior doesn't fit with the rest of what I've come to expect from my K3.  
> It doesn't happen on CW or SSB either. So what's going on?
> 
> -- 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[W3FPR]

Pete,

Set the audio level to make the first 4 bars of the ALC meter solid with 
the 5th bar just flickering.
The K3 ALC onset is at the 5th bar, the bars below it are an aid to 
adjusting the audio properly for digital modes.


Your advice from "other K3 users" is not correct.  ALC starts at the 5th 
bar, so if they meant set it for no ALC, that may have been what they meant.


Yes, not enough audio will cause power hunting.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 7/20/2023 5:16 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 
users, have been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just 
short of or just into the first flickers of ALC.  I did this because I 
was advised that setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated 
junk in the FT8 passband.  I am running the K3 in Data A mode


Since I did this, I've noticed strange (to me, anyway) behavior from 
my K3.


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Fred Jensen]

Pete:

The first 4 bars on the K3 ALC are just an audio level indication [i.e. 
VU meter].  ALC action starts at the 5th bar, which you want to be just 
flickering.  Unless you have 4 solid bars, the K3 will keep trying to 
adjust the TX gain to achieve the selected output power and it may not 
be able to get there with such low audio input, hence the "hunting."


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

Pete Smith N4ZR wrote on 7/20/2023 2:16 PM:
I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 
users, have been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just 
short of or just into the first flickers of ALC.  I did this because I 
was advised that setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated 
junk in the FT8 passband.  I am running the K3 in Data A mode


Since I did this, I've noticed strange (to me, anyway) behavior from 
my K3.  When WSJT-X starts an FT8 transmit cycle, after I have just 
switched to the current band or changed the power slider in WSJT-X or 
the PWR control on my K-3, the K3's power output starts essentially at 
zero and slowly ramps up through 1- 1 1/2 FT8 transmit cycles.  Once 
it reaches the expected level, subsequent transmissions stay at that 
level.


I've been told (not by Elecraft) that this behavior is a result of the 
K3's firmware "hunting" for the right power level, but such a slow and 
repetitious behavior doesn't fit with the rest of what I've come to 
expect from my K3.  It doesn't happen on CW or SSB either. So what's 
going on?






--
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Walter Underwood]

By “first flickers of ALC” do you mean one bar flickering? If so, that will 
cause power hunting.

Not sure who advised against setting it at the 4th bar, but that was probably 
bad advice. That sounds like advice for non-Elecraft transmitters. I recommend 
following the setup instructions on pages 31 and 32 of the manual.

https://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/Manuals Downloads/E740107 K3 Owner's man D10.pdf 


wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Jul 20, 2023, at 2:16 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 users, have 
> been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just short of or just 
> into the first flickers of ALC.  I did this because I was advised that 
> setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated junk in the FT8 passband. 
>  I am running the K3 in Data A mode
> 
> Since I did this, I've noticed strange (to me, anyway) behavior from my K3.  
> When WSJT-X starts an FT8 transmit cycle, after I have just switched to the 
> current band or changed the power slider in WSJT-X or the PWR control on my 
> K-3, the K3's power output starts essentially at zero and slowly ramps up 
> through 1- 1 1/2 FT8 transmit cycles.  Once it reaches the expected level, 
> subsequent transmissions stay at that level.
> 
> I've been told (not by Elecraft) that this behavior is a result of the K3's 
> firmware "hunting" for the right power level, but such a slow and repetitious 
> behavior doesn't fit with the rest of what I've come to expect from my K3.  
> It doesn't happen on CW or SSB either. So what's going on?
> 
> -- 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power-hunting on FT8

[Paul Maciel]

Hi Peter,

Setting the ALC for FT8 is different than other transceivers due to the way the 
K3 adjusts power.

You should adjust the slider to give four solid bars and the fifth flickering.  
You find the outputvwull be ver stable then. 

See you on the bands!
—-Paul AK1P 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 20, 2023, at 5:18 PM, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> I've recently started operating FT8, and on advice from other K3 users, have 
> been adjusting the power slider in WSJT-X to a level just short of or just 
> into the first flickers of ALC.  I did this because I was advised that 
> setting the slider for 4 or 5 bars of ALC generated junk in the FT8 passband. 
>  I am running the K3 in Data A mode
> 
> Since I did this, I've noticed strange (to me, anyway) behavior from my K3.  
> When WSJT-X starts an FT8 transmit cycle, after I have just switched to the 
> current band or changed the power slider in WSJT-X or the PWR control on my 
> K-3, the K3's power output starts essentially at zero and slowly ramps up 
> through 1- 1 1/2 FT8 transmit cycles.  Once it reaches the expected level, 
> subsequent transmissions stay at that level.
> 
> I've been told (not by Elecraft) that this behavior is a result of the K3's 
> firmware "hunting" for the right power level, but such a slow and repetitious 
> behavior doesn't fit with the rest of what I've come to expect from my K3.  
> It doesn't happen on CW or SSB either. So what's going on?
> 
> -- 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Receive gone

[Dave New, N8SBE]

Check that you haven't turned on RX ANT by mistake?

73,
-- Dave, N8SBE

On 2023-07-03 00:02, Jim Rhodes wrote:

A few months ago K4 #1200 came to live in my shack and K3 #4083 got a
vacation on the shelf.  It was working fine up until then, in regular 
use.

When I pulled it down in preparation for Field Day it no longer had any
receive on any band.  Full output on every band except 10 meters where 
it
only did 70 watts.  Plugging my XG2 into any port on the ATU even on 
the 50

uV setting shows no S meter deflection and no tone in receiver (a small
amount of quieting on 20).  Can anyone give me any hints to try before 
I

contact the mothership?

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Receive gone

[George Fremin III]

I had a k3 go deaf - and it was not any of the RX antenna switching or other 
issues.  In my case it sounded dead but with a really strong signal I could 
hear something.  I think it took the highest setting on the XG3 to get signal.  

I think I posted an update to that in this channel. 

It was a pin diode on the bottom of the radio and I got some from Mouser and 
replaced it and it has been working fine since.  

If you can not find the post in the archives - let me know and I can try to dig 
up the info. 

George Fremin III

> On Jul 3, 2023, at 5:36 AM, Michael Carter  wrote:
> 
> Hi Jim,
> 
> Does your K3 have the KXV3 interface
> or KRX3 subreceiver options installed?
> If so, I would check the menu settings
> to be sure that the rig doesn't have
> the RX antenna port selected as its
> antenna source and that the subreceiver
> isn't the primary receiver.
> 
> If it's not a menu setting issue, I would
> remove the ATU and re-install the original
> KANT3 antenna board, then test again with
> actual antenna or your signal generator.
> 
> You mentioned that the K3 sat on a shelf
> for several months - was it connected to
> anything or were all cables disconnected?
> 
> Was it stored in an environment where
> corrosion on internal connectors/circuit
> board headers might have occurred during
> its 'vacation' from active use?
> 
> 73,
> Mike, K8CN
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Receive gone

[Michael Carter]

Hi Jim,

Does your K3 have the KXV3 interface
or KRX3 subreceiver options installed?
If so, I would check the menu settings
to be sure that the rig doesn't have
the RX antenna port selected as its
antenna source and that the subreceiver
isn't the primary receiver.

If it's not a menu setting issue, I would
remove the ATU and re-install the original
KANT3 antenna board, then test again with
actual antenna or your signal generator.

You mentioned that the K3 sat on a shelf
for several months - was it connected to
anything or were all cables disconnected?

Was it stored in an environment where
corrosion on internal connectors/circuit
board headers might have occurred during
its 'vacation' from active use?

73,
Mike, K8CN

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

[evert]

Hi Gary,

Thanks for the info!

Removing the LED board is not funny so I didn't.

How I did it :
   - remove the 2 encoders speed/mic and cmp/pwr (N5NA tells you how to)
   - remove the 4 screws (2 on top of the LED board and 2 on the back side of 
the front panel PCB) and pulled the 2  4.8 mm studs away underneath the LED 
board
   - gently push the LED board towards the front panel PCB. (This gives a lot 
more space to clip the pins and remove of the two remaining encoders).
   - clean up all the holes
   - slide the LED PCB and the 2 studs back into its original position (BEFORE 
soldering the new encoders !!)
   - put the encoders in place one by one with abt 1.4 mm distance to the front 
PCB (nylon washer, I used a piece of ty-rap) and solder them.

Thanks all for the on-list and off list help and suggestions.

73, Evert PA2KW 


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  On 
Behalf Of Gary Hembree
Sent: Tuesday, 23 May 2023 00:48
To: Elecraft List Server 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

N5NA has written an excellent account of replacing the small push-button 
encoders.

https://www.n5na.net/s9y/index.php?/archives/26-Replacing-Elecraft-K3-Push-Button-Encoders.html

I have replaced all of these encoders in several K3 radios over the past
5 years.  It is not a job for the faint-hearted. However, if you take your time 
and cut the mounting pins of the encoders before you unsolder them, then you 
will succeed.  Do not attempt to remove the LED board. Make sure you wick out 
the mounting holes thoroughly or you will have difficulty installing the new 
encoders.

Good luck

73
Gary, N7IR
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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Russ Edelen]

My thinking was to restore from an earlier workspace then reinstall the 
IC-7300 but I will take a look at the controls first. I don't remember 
making any recent changes to to the control configuration.



Russ, KG7VQ



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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Victor Rosenthal]

Why take out the 2nd radio? The problem is in the configuration of the
software on the computer.

Victor 4X6GP

On Sat, Jun 17, 2023, 06:26 Russ Edelen  wrote:

> Thanks Victor, you called it. Started the K3 and it started with the
> correct mic controls. Booted the computer and started DXLab modules and
> the mic gain reverted to 1. Now I know where to look. Will start by
> removing the second radio, which installed when I sent the K3 back to
> Elecraft, and go over the configuration again.
>
>
> Thanks for the suggestion.
>
>
> 73
>
> Russ KG7VQ
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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Russ Edelen]

Thanks Victor, you called it. Started the K3 and it started with the 
correct mic controls. Booted the computer and started DXLab modules and 
the mic gain reverted to 1. Now I know where to look. Will start by 
removing the second radio, which installed when I sent the K3 back to 
Elecraft, and go over the configuration again.



Thanks for the suggestion.


73

Russ KG7VQ
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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP]

Try this: shut down the computer, and turn the gain (etc.) to their 
correct settings. Then turn the K3 off and on again. Do the settings 
reset? If so, the problem is in the K3. If not, it has something to do 
with the computer and the program.


73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
Formerly K2VCO
CWops no. 5
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/

On 16/06/2023 20:54, Russ Edelen wrote:
Some further info. Logging and control is via DXlab suite set up per the 
wiki through a serial port. The controls respond in both directions and 
the radio functions as expected during nets and general operation after 
the mic settings are adjusted. The problem only occurs at startup. The 
k3 and computer are shut down when not in use and the k3 is routed to a 
dummy load. The computer is powered on first.


As I mentioned it's not every time but seems to be more often then not.

Thanks for any advice.

Russ, KG7VQ
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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Russ Edelen]

Some further info. Logging and control is via DXlab suite set up per the 
wiki through a serial port. The controls respond in both directions and 
the radio functions as expected during nets and general operation after 
the mic settings are adjusted. The problem only occurs at startup. The 
k3 and computer are shut down when not in use and the k3 is routed to a 
dummy load. The computer is powered on first.


As I mentioned it's not every time but seems to be more often then not.

Thanks for any advice.

Russ, KG7VQ
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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP]

I forgot to add --
It's also possible (probable?) that your computer program is doing it. 
Plug in a key or mic and try transmitting without the computer connected.


73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
Formerly K2VCO
CWops no. 5
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/

On 16/06/2023 16:46, Russ Edelen wrote:
After returning from Elecraft for repair and updating my K3 (1087) will 
reset it's Mic gain to 1 and Compression to zero.


I backed up the radio's configuration when I get it back and reloading 
it does not solve the problem, which occurs at boot up more times then not.


This is a barefoot setup with computer logging/control feeding a 178 
foot extended zepp with 450 ohm twin lead.


Is this a symptom of RFI to the radio? Anyone have any suggestions?

KG7VQ
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Re: [Elecraft] k3 Mic gain self resetting to 1

[Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP]

You can determine if it's caused by RFI very easily. Try transmitting 
into a dummy load.


73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
Formerly K2VCO
CWops no. 5
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/

On 16/06/2023 16:46, Russ Edelen wrote:
After returning from Elecraft for repair and updating my K3 (1087) will 
reset it's Mic gain to 1 and Compression to zero.


I backed up the radio's configuration when I get it back and reloading 
it does not solve the problem, which occurs at boot up more times then not.


This is a barefoot setup with computer logging/control feeding a 178 
foot extended zepp with 450 ohm twin lead.


Is this a symptom of RFI to the radio? Anyone have any suggestions?

KG7VQ
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - ERR DSE DD0VS

[Keith Trinity WE6R]

Hi Harald;
Always post your serial #, it really helps narrow down problems.
If older, the 28pin and 5 pin headers on the RF board going to the front 
panel were tin and get oxidized.

Change them to gold.
To confirm this is the problem;
remove the two bottom bolts for the FP, pry gently in the two slots to 
move the FP out on the pins a small bit then shove the FP back on.

That will temporarily clear poor connections.
Also search at the groups.io page https://groups.io/g/Elecraft-K3/topics
Keith WE6R Elecraft K3/K4 Tech

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 LINE IN

[Jim Brown]

On 5/22/2023 3:14 PM, Jorge Diez - CX6VM wrote:

seems is
something else


Another thing that Windoze has done more than once on an upgrade is to 
change sampling rate. It SHOULD be 48 kHz Stereo. Check both recording 
and playback.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

[Gary Hembree]

N5NA has written an excellent account of replacing the small push-button 
encoders.


https://www.n5na.net/s9y/index.php?/archives/26-Replacing-Elecraft-K3-Push-Button-Encoders.html

I have replaced all of these encoders in several K3 radios over the past 
5 years.  It is not a job for the faint-hearted. However, if you take 
your time and cut the mounting pins of the encoders before you unsolder 
them, then you will succeed.  Do not attempt to remove the LED board.  
Make sure you wick out the mounting holes thoroughly or you will have 
difficulty installing the new encoders.


Good luck

73
Gary, N7IR
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 LINE IN

[Jorge Diez - CX6VM]

hello Jim

thanks for the help

I verify and both Windows and WSJT are using USB audio CODEC, so seems is
something else

thanks!

73,
Jorge

El lun, 22 may 2023 a las 16:20, Jim Brown ()
escribió:

> On 5/22/2023 9:18 AM, Jorge Diez - CX6VM wrote:
> > Any idea what is wrong?
>
> Jorge,
>
> One thing with symptoms like this that has happened to me several times
> is that when things are shifted around, Windows will choose the mic
> built into my laptop to feed WSJT-X or JTDX. If that's the problem, the
> fix is to go into the Windows sound setup and change it back to your
> Tascam.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
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-- 
73,
Jorge
CX6VM/CW5W
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 LINE IN

[Jim Brown]

On 5/22/2023 9:18 AM, Jorge Diez - CX6VM wrote:

Any idea what is wrong?


Jorge,

One thing with symptoms like this that has happened to me several times 
is that when things are shifted around, Windows will choose the mic 
built into my laptop to feed WSJT-X or JTDX. If that's the problem, the 
fix is to go into the Windows sound setup and change it back to your Tascam.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

[evert]

Hello Kimo and others,

 

Thank you all for your the answers.

I think Ramon (wd4x) came up with the right ones.

 

I checked the size and they are the same.

Found them at Mouser for € 1,71 (abt $ 1,70) each, ordered them and they will 
be delivered Tuesday. So that’s fast.

I will replace them all as they are in a nasty place (most probably have to 
remove the LED board but will have to look into it carefully).

 

73, Evert PA2KW

 

From: Kimo Chun  
Sent: Sunday, 21 May 2023 18:48
To: David Pratt ; ev...@pa2kw.com
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

 

I am no expert on this radio. However, I notice that the part Evert is 
referring to is not the same or type of encoder/part that David mentioned. I am 
only going by the visual representation in the manual.

The E850239 is one of two identical rotary encoders used for VFO A and B. I 
purchased a spare of that particular part. There is no part number listed in 
the Assembly Manual for the HI / WIDTH control first mentioned. It appears that 
part is one of several that are preinstalled on the E850242 Front Panel PCB 
Assembly and is not normally available or installed as a separate kit part.

 

However, contacting the factory is advised if not already done.

 

1. They would be able to say whether it is advisable for that part to be 
replaced in the field (granted, many people have the expertise and equipment to 
do so).

 

2. They have been open to me and others with offering any parts (for sale) that 
can be and/or in lieu of that, giving the OEM part they sourced themselves. 
Those, in my case, were from Digi-key for which they provided their part number 
purchased. Though not likely applicable in this case, one thing you might have 
to investigate is whether the part Elecraft sourced is correct for small 
quantity purchase and packaging format (not on a reel of SMD intended for 
automated feeding and insertion). I"m injecting this though I don't know if 
Elecraft does this. I think their contracted board assembly builders may.

 

The point is...ask the source. If you want me to phone them on your behalf I'd 
be glad to do so (so no international phone call).

 

Good luck.

73, Kimo Chun KH7U

 

 

 

On Sun, May 21, 2023 at 12:07 AM David Pratt mailto:da...@g4dmp.co.uk> > wrote:

Several years ago I had a problem with one of my K3 encoders and 
obtained a replacement E850239 from Elecraft under warranty. However, I 
noticed that the two halves of the encoder had started to separate. They 
were held together by small aluminium rivets. By carefully removing the 
rivets, one by one, and replacing them with small screws of a suitable 
size the encoder could be repaired.  If your problem is with the encoder 
halves separating, Evert, that might be worth a try.

73 de David G4DMP

On 21/05/2023 10:46, ev...@pa2kw.com <mailto:ev...@pa2kw.com>  wrote:
> I think I have a defect rotary encoder on a K3.
> It is the one used for setting the bandwidth (Hi/Width).
> Anyone out here who knows the manufacturer / type number of this rotary 
> encoder?
> 
> 73. Evert PA2KW

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

[Geert Jan de Groot]

On 21/05/2023 18:23, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote:

I think I have a defect rotary encoder on a K3.
It is the one used for setting the bandwidth (Hi/Width).
Anyone out here who knows the manufacturer / type number of this rotary encoder?


Google finds https://n5na.net/wp/replacing-elecraft-k3-push-button-encoders/
Also 
https://groups.io/g/Elecraft-K3/topic/k3_rotary_encoder_replacement/74198899


You probably want to order enough to replace all four encoders at once.

NOTE, the VFO-A and VFO-B encoder, as well as the RIT encoder, are 
*different types*.


If you qualify for minimum order size, then ordering directly at mouser 
or digikey is simplest, at least for us behind the EU customs wall.


Be sure to include diodes to protect your KLPA when you put in an order.

Geert Jan


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

[Kimo Chun]

I am no expert on this radio. However, I notice that the part Evert is
referring to is not the same or type of encoder/part that David mentioned.
I am only going by the visual representation in the manual.
The E850239 is one of two identical rotary encoders used for VFO A and B. I
purchased a spare of that particular part. There is no part number listed
in the Assembly Manual for the HI / WIDTH control first mentioned. It
appears that part is one of several that are preinstalled on the E850242
Front Panel PCB Assembly and is not normally available or installed as a
separate kit part.

However, contacting the factory is advised if not already done.

1. They would be able to say whether it is advisable for that part to be
replaced in the field (granted, many people have the expertise and
equipment to do so).

2. They have been open to me and others with offering any parts (for sale)
that can be and/or in lieu of that, giving the OEM part they sourced
themselves. Those, in my case, were from Digi-key for which they provided
their part number purchased. Though not likely applicable in this case, one
thing you might have to investigate is whether the part Elecraft sourced is
correct for small quantity purchase and packaging format (not on a reel of
SMD intended for automated feeding and insertion). I"m injecting this
though I don't know if Elecraft does this. I think their contracted board
assembly builders may.

The point is...ask the source. If you want me to phone them on your behalf
I'd be glad to do so (so no international phone call).

Good luck.
73, Kimo Chun KH7U



On Sun, May 21, 2023 at 12:07 AM David Pratt  wrote:

> Several years ago I had a problem with one of my K3 encoders and
> obtained a replacement E850239 from Elecraft under warranty. However, I
> noticed that the two halves of the encoder had started to separate. They
> were held together by small aluminium rivets. By carefully removing the
> rivets, one by one, and replacing them with small screws of a suitable
> size the encoder could be repaired.  If your problem is with the encoder
> halves separating, Evert, that might be worth a try.
>
> 73 de David G4DMP
>
> On 21/05/2023 10:46, ev...@pa2kw.com wrote:
> > I think I have a defect rotary encoder on a K3.
> > It is the one used for setting the bandwidth (Hi/Width).
> > Anyone out here who knows the manufacturer / type number of this rotary
> encoder?
> >
> > 73. Evert PA2KW
>
> --
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Rotary encoder

[David Pratt]

Several years ago I had a problem with one of my K3 encoders and 
obtained a replacement E850239 from Elecraft under warranty. However, I 
noticed that the two halves of the encoder had started to separate. They 
were held together by small aluminium rivets. By carefully removing the 
rivets, one by one, and replacing them with small screws of a suitable 
size the encoder could be repaired.  If your problem is with the encoder 
halves separating, Evert, that might be worth a try.


73 de David G4DMP

On 21/05/2023 10:46, ev...@pa2kw.com wrote:

I think I have a defect rotary encoder on a K3.
It is the one used for setting the bandwidth (Hi/Width).
Anyone out here who knows the manufacturer / type number of this rotary encoder?

73. Evert PA2KW


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+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 RX Issue?

[Lee Hiers]

Thanks Mike - it was an ID-10T error:  I had the RX antenna selected with
nothing on the RX antenna port.

73 de Lee, AA4GA


On Thu, May 11, 2023 at 9:47 PM Michael Carter  wrote:

> Hi Lee,
>
> Do you also have a reduced RX signal level
> on 30 meters as well as 20 meters, at least
> by comparison with your KX3?
>
> Since the TX output is OK, I will hazard a
> guess that one of the relays in the
> 20/30M bandpass filter is not making
> good contact or has developed a weak
> solder joint on the RF board.  While that
> should also reduce the TX output, the
> TX Power control loop may compensate
> enough to make the added loss through
> the relay less noticeable.
>
> I would carefully inspect all solder joints
> in the 20/30M bandpass filter circuit,
> maybe do the same for the lowpass
> filter.  I would try gently pressing on the
> relay casings while listening to a good
> strong signal on 20 meters and 30 meters
> to see if there is an audible change in RX signal
> level.
>
> 73,
> Mike, K8CN
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 RX Issue?

[Michael Carter]

Hi Lee,

Do you also have a reduced RX signal level
on 30 meters as well as 20 meters, at least
by comparison with your KX3?

Since the TX output is OK, I will hazard a
guess that one of the relays in the
20/30M bandpass filter is not making
good contact or has developed a weak
solder joint on the RF board.  While that
should also reduce the TX output, the
TX Power control loop may compensate
enough to make the added loss through
the relay less noticeable.

I would carefully inspect all solder joints
in the 20/30M bandpass filter circuit,
maybe do the same for the lowpass
filter.  I would try gently pressing on the
relay casings while listening to a good
strong signal on 20 meters and 30 meters
to see if there is an audible change in RX signal
level.

73,
Mike, K8CN
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 RX Issue?

[Gary K9GS]

Glad you got it sorted out Lee73,Gary K9GS
 Original message From: Lee Hiers  Date: 
5/11/23  5:21 PM  (GMT-06:00) To: Elecraft Mailing List 
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 RX Issue? I thought about 
quoting Jack Nicholson from A Few Good Men when he said"well don't I feel like 
a" but thought better of it.100% operator error.  As diagnosed by N7GP and 
W0GHZ, I had my RX antennabutton pushed.  I don't have an RX antenna, so I 
never push it...onpurpose.I'm glad it wasn't a problem like K9GS had...although 
I had suspectedsomething like that.All looks well now - thanks everyone for the 
help.73 de Lee, AA4GAOn Thu, May 11, 2023 at 11:38 AM Lee Hiers 
 wrote:> Hi All,>> Recently I've noticed that signal 
levels have been down on 20m on my> K3/10.  At first, I thought it was just 
band condx and didn't pay much> attention to it, but over the weekend I 
switched to the KX3 and signals> were much better - S-meter, P(X)3, and my 
ears...like maybe 30dB or so.  40> meters seems fine on the K3.  I think I'm OK 
on 15m and up as well, but I'm> not 100% sure I listened there.>> Output is 
normal on 20m.>> I've checked the preamp and attenuator on/off and those don't 
seem to be> the issue.>> Obviously, I need to do some more digging on this 
before I contact> Elecraft service, but I was wondering if anyone had any 
ideas?>> 73 de Lee, 
AA4GA>>>>__Elecraft 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 RX Issue?

[Lee Hiers]

I thought about quoting Jack Nicholson from A Few Good Men when he said
"well don't I feel like a" but thought better of it.

100% operator error.  As diagnosed by N7GP and W0GHZ, I had my RX antenna
button pushed.  I don't have an RX antenna, so I never push it...on
purpose.

I'm glad it wasn't a problem like K9GS had...although I had suspected
something like that.

All looks well now - thanks everyone for the help.

73 de Lee, AA4GA



On Thu, May 11, 2023 at 11:38 AM Lee Hiers  wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Recently I've noticed that signal levels have been down on 20m on my
> K3/10.  At first, I thought it was just band condx and didn't pay much
> attention to it, but over the weekend I switched to the KX3 and signals
> were much better - S-meter, P(X)3, and my ears...like maybe 30dB or so.  40
> meters seems fine on the K3.  I think I'm OK on 15m and up as well, but I'm
> not 100% sure I listened there.
>
> Output is normal on 20m.
>
> I've checked the preamp and attenuator on/off and those don't seem to be
> the issue.
>
> Obviously, I need to do some more digging on this before I contact
> Elecraft service, but I was wondering if anyone had any ideas?
>
> 73 de Lee, AA4GA
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Fuse Blowing on Power Supply

[W3FPR]

Bill,

The K3 will draw between 17 and 22 amps during transmit.  That 15 amp 
fuse is too small,  increase it to 25 amps.  Hopefully your power supply 
is capable of 25 amps or more.
Use a power supply that has 14.3 volts output if you can.  Not only will 
your TX be cleaner (lower IMD), but the current draw will be less.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 5/6/2023 2:30 PM, Bill Gillenwater wrote:

Current setup.
K3 with P3 early serial. Back to factory for complete update. Gold 
Pins etc.

Today K3 shut down.
Found blown 15 amp fuse in ground side of power supply cable
Power supply is MFJ 4035MW.
Have had no previous problems with this setup.
Occasionally there was a message on the K3 saying LOW VOLTAGE.


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Fuse Blowing on Power Supply

[David Olean]

There is an over voltage protection diode inside. Maybe it was tripped? 
Easy to replace.. I think it is right rear when looking from the top and 
front of the radio. Just a short HV spike can trigger that diode. You 
can find it on the K3 schematic.


Dave K1WHS

On 5/6/2023 2:30 PM, Bill Gillenwater wrote:

Current setup.
K3 with P3 early serial. Back to factory for complete update. Gold 
Pins etc.

Today K3 shut down.
Found blown 15 amp fuse in ground side of power supply cable
Power supply is MFJ 4035MW.
Have had no previous problems with this setup.
Occasionally there was a message on the K3 saying LOW VOLTAGE.

Thanks for ideas and assistance.

73 Bill K3SV

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/0 Mini

[Gerry Hull]

The K3/0 Mini is sold.  Thanks for your interest.

73

Gerry W1VE

On Sat, Apr 29, 2023, 11:58 AM Gerry Hull  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I have a spare K3/0 mini I which is surplus to my needs.  It is
> the original K3/0 Mini, serial number 8152.
>
> I will also include an Elecraft octopus cable which may need some TLC.
> The K3/0 mini is in perfect condition (photo upon request.)
>
> First $450 to Venmo or Zelle takes it.
> Free USPS Priority shipping in the US.
>
> 73,
>
> Gerry W1VE
> Hancock, NH
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Nate Bargmann]

* On 2023 15 Apr 12:14 -0500, Steve Zabarnick wrote:
> Now that I have installed the recently received KSYN3A upgrade in my K3, I
> am wondering what improvements to expect? I have seen test data on this
> list showing improved transmit performance and anecdotal reports on
> improved receive performance. In an initial quick listening session on cw
> and FT8, I don't hear any dramatic changes in receive performance.
> 
> The KSYN3A upgrade is a significant investment (over $400 when including
> shipping and tax) and will likely increase the resale value of the radio
> somewhat, but as a casual operator should I expect to experience any
> noticeable performance improvements?

For me my Morse copy speed increased.  It had nothing to do with my gray
matter either!  I think the new synth just made the CW audio a bit
smoother to my ears.  A couple of years later when I bought the
subreceiver I didn't have to also order the main synth.

73, Nate, N0NB

-- 
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
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Web: https://www.n0nb.us
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Dave (NK7Z)]

Hi Steve,

See:

https://www.nk7z.net/k3/

for some actual test data, with plots of new vs. old synths...  You will 
need to decide if you are happy with your purchase.


73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 4/15/23 10:13, Steve Zabarnick wrote:

Now that I have installed the recently received KSYN3A upgrade in my K3, I
am wondering what improvements to expect? I have seen test data on this
list showing improved transmit performance and anecdotal reports on
improved receive performance. In an initial quick listening session on cw
and FT8, I don't hear any dramatic changes in receive performance.

The KSYN3A upgrade is a significant investment (over $400 when including
shipping and tax) and will likely increase the resale value of the radio
somewhat, but as a casual operator should I expect to experience any
noticeable performance improvements?

Steve N9SZ


On Fri, Apr 14, 2023 at 10:34 AM Steve Zabarnick 
wrote:


After just about two years from my original order, I finally received the
upgraded K3 synthesis board (KSYN3AUPGD). Installation will take place this
weekend and I'm hoping for the best.

Steve N9SZ


On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 9:47 AM Steve Zabarnick 
wrote:


It has been over 8 weeks since Eric announced that most of the long
delayed K3 options would be available in 6 to 8 weeks, and "should ship
close to these dates ranges if there are no new
parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays."

I have been patiently waiting for the upgraded synthesizer for my K3 and
made a 50% payment two years ago.

Any update on this? It would be nice to have some info on whether these
upgrades are being delayed once again or about to ship as promised.

Steve N9SZ




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Ted Edwards W3TB]

I had to buy two of the newer synthesizers when I added the dual receiver
after they had stopped making the older synthesizer boards.

I can’t believe that my K3 is now 10 years old and how much I still love
it. 😍. De W3TB

On Sat, Apr 15, 2023 at 20:44 David Gilbert  wrote:

>
>
> Although some will no doubt disagree, I think the short answer for you
> as a casual op is "no" ... depending, of course, on just how "casual"
> you consider yourself to be.
>
> The new synths do indeed give considerably better performance, though
> ... you just might not notice them if you are a casual operator.  The
> new synths have much better performance for multiple closely-spaced CW
> signals within the audio passband (which avoids the mush created by the
> old synths), and if you have two receivers the local oscillator signals
> remain sync'd as you tune.   The phase noise is better with the new synths.
>
> Here is a better report:
>
> https://www.ok2kkw.com/xyz/om3w/qst_ksyn3a_revised.pdf
>
> Personally, I think it was a safe bet to switch to the new synths if you
> ever plan to sell the rig.
>
> 73,
> Dave   AB7E
>
>
> On 4/15/2023 10:13 AM, Steve Zabarnick wrote:
> > Now that I have installed the recently received KSYN3A upgrade in my K3,
> I
> > am wondering what improvements to expect? I have seen test data on this
> > list showing improved transmit performance and anecdotal reports on
> > improved receive performance. In an initial quick listening session on cw
> > and FT8, I don't hear any dramatic changes in receive performance.
> >
> > The KSYN3A upgrade is a significant investment (over $400 when including
> > shipping and tax) and will likely increase the resale value of the radio
> > somewhat, but as a casual operator should I expect to experience any
> > noticeable performance improvements?
> >
> > Steve N9SZ
> >
> >
>
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-- 
73 de Ted Edwards, W3TB and GØPWW

and thinking about operating CW:
"Do today what others won't,
so you can do tomorrow what others can't."
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[David Gilbert]

Although some will no doubt disagree, I think the short answer for you 
as a casual op is "no" ... depending, of course, on just how "casual" 
you consider yourself to be.


The new synths do indeed give considerably better performance, though 
... you just might not notice them if you are a casual operator.  The 
new synths have much better performance for multiple closely-spaced CW 
signals within the audio passband (which avoids the mush created by the 
old synths), and if you have two receivers the local oscillator signals 
remain sync'd as you tune.   The phase noise is better with the new synths.


Here is a better report:

https://www.ok2kkw.com/xyz/om3w/qst_ksyn3a_revised.pdf

Personally, I think it was a safe bet to switch to the new synths if you 
ever plan to sell the rig.


73,
Dave   AB7E


On 4/15/2023 10:13 AM, Steve Zabarnick wrote:

Now that I have installed the recently received KSYN3A upgrade in my K3, I
am wondering what improvements to expect? I have seen test data on this
list showing improved transmit performance and anecdotal reports on
improved receive performance. In an initial quick listening session on cw
and FT8, I don't hear any dramatic changes in receive performance.

The KSYN3A upgrade is a significant investment (over $400 when including
shipping and tax) and will likely increase the resale value of the radio
somewhat, but as a casual operator should I expect to experience any
noticeable performance improvements?

Steve N9SZ




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Steve Zabarnick]

Now that I have installed the recently received KSYN3A upgrade in my K3, I
am wondering what improvements to expect? I have seen test data on this
list showing improved transmit performance and anecdotal reports on
improved receive performance. In an initial quick listening session on cw
and FT8, I don't hear any dramatic changes in receive performance.

The KSYN3A upgrade is a significant investment (over $400 when including
shipping and tax) and will likely increase the resale value of the radio
somewhat, but as a casual operator should I expect to experience any
noticeable performance improvements?

Steve N9SZ


On Fri, Apr 14, 2023 at 10:34 AM Steve Zabarnick 
wrote:

> After just about two years from my original order, I finally received the
> upgraded K3 synthesis board (KSYN3AUPGD). Installation will take place this
> weekend and I'm hoping for the best.
>
> Steve N9SZ
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 9:47 AM Steve Zabarnick 
> wrote:
>
>> It has been over 8 weeks since Eric announced that most of the long
>> delayed K3 options would be available in 6 to 8 weeks, and "should ship
>> close to these dates ranges if there are no new
>> parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays."
>>
>> I have been patiently waiting for the upgraded synthesizer for my K3 and
>> made a 50% payment two years ago.
>>
>> Any update on this? It would be nice to have some info on whether these
>> upgrades are being delayed once again or about to ship as promised.
>>
>> Steve N9SZ
>>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3, using AM Mode RX with 250 Hz filter

[David Hachadorian]

Hi Keith,

Thanks for the reply.  I tried a bunch of different width/mode 
assignments just now, but got a strange rumbling noise with those 
configurations.  Thanks for suggesting taking a picture of the original 
config, because my experimental settings got pretty wild!


73

Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ

On 4/14/2023 1:06 PM, Keith Trinity WE6R wrote:
Try using the K3 Utility to re-label the .250 to a different value, 
like 6K, make sure it has a checkmark for AM.
Or try disabling the other slots by maybe just unchecking any that 
have AM checkboxes.
Experiment with that, you should be able to have it stay on the .250 
and still be able to use WIDTH.

(Take a picture of your original setup first for restoration)
Keith WE6R Elecraft K3/K4 Tech

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Re: [Elecraft] K3, using AM Mode RX with 250 Hz filter

[Keith Trinity WE6R]

Try using the K3 Utility to re-label the .250 to a different value, like 
6K, make sure it has a checkmark for AM.
Or try disabling the other slots by maybe just unchecking any that have 
AM checkboxes.
Experiment with that, you should be able to have it stay on the .250 and 
still be able to use WIDTH.

(Take a picture of your original setup first for restoration)
Keith WE6R Elecraft K3/K4 Tech
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Clark Macaulay]

I received the KIO3BUPKT_KIO3B, too.

I vacillated on ordering this upgrade at first as the original KIO3B was
working fine with my hardware RS-232 interface in the shack computer.  The
embedded sound card wasn't of much interest as digital modes are not of
much interest either.  I may keep the upgrade in the box until (and if) my
original card fails.

On Fri, Apr 14, 2023 at 10:35 AM Steve Zabarnick 
wrote:

> After just about two years from my original order, I finally received the
> upgraded K3 synthesis board (KSYN3AUPGD). Installation will take place this
> weekend and I'm hoping for the best.
>
> Steve N9SZ
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 9:47 AM Steve Zabarnick 
> wrote:
>
> > It has been over 8 weeks since Eric announced that most of the long
> > delayed K3 options would be available in 6 to 8 weeks, and "should ship
> > close to these dates ranges if there are no new
> > parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays."
> >
> > I have been patiently waiting for the upgraded synthesizer for my K3 and
> > made a 50% payment two years ago.
> >
> > Any update on this? It would be nice to have some info on whether these
> > upgrades are being delayed once again or about to ship as promised.
> >
> > Steve N9SZ
> >
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-- 
73,

Clark, WU4B
Little Pistol With Wires + HexBeam
Elecraft K2 & K3
QRPARCI #10815
SKCC #3892
NAQCC #5055
CWOPS #1869
Collins Collectors #AC90-12432
Southeastern DX Club 
North Georgia QRP Club 


*"It is vain to do with more what can be done with less."*
*Attributed to *William of Occam (1288 AD - 1348 AD)
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Richard Hill]

I also received my KSYNAUPGD_KSYN3A board kit and my KIO3BUPKT_KIO3B board
kit.
I still have a KXV3 upgrade kit on order.

Rich
NU6T

On Fri, Apr 14, 2023 at 7:35 AM Steve Zabarnick  wrote:

> After just about two years from my original order, I finally received the
> upgraded K3 synthesis board (KSYN3AUPGD). Installation will take place this
> weekend and I'm hoping for the best.
>
> Steve N9SZ
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 9:47 AM Steve Zabarnick 
> wrote:
>
> > It has been over 8 weeks since Eric announced that most of the long
> > delayed K3 options would be available in 6 to 8 weeks, and "should ship
> > close to these dates ranges if there are no new
> > parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays."
> >
> > I have been patiently waiting for the upgraded synthesizer for my K3 and
> > made a 50% payment two years ago.
> >
> > Any update on this? It would be nice to have some info on whether these
> > upgrades are being delayed once again or about to ship as promised.
> >
> > Steve N9SZ
> >
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-- 
Richard Hill
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Steve Zabarnick]

After just about two years from my original order, I finally received the
upgraded K3 synthesis board (KSYN3AUPGD). Installation will take place this
weekend and I'm hoping for the best.

Steve N9SZ


On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 9:47 AM Steve Zabarnick  wrote:

> It has been over 8 weeks since Eric announced that most of the long
> delayed K3 options would be available in 6 to 8 weeks, and "should ship
> close to these dates ranges if there are no new
> parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays."
>
> I have been patiently waiting for the upgraded synthesizer for my K3 and
> made a 50% payment two years ago.
>
> Any update on this? It would be nice to have some info on whether these
> upgrades are being delayed once again or about to ship as promised.
>
> Steve N9SZ
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Won't Turn On all of a sudden!

[Michael Carter]

Hi Rick,

I've not experienced the problem you described,
but I've also not used my K3 as a remote front panel
for another K3.

Have you checked pin 8 of the ACC connector to
be sure that it is not held 'high' by some chance
(not likely since you pulled all the cables)?

If there isn't a problem with that ACC pin and
accompanying circuit in the KIO3 digital interface,
I would investigate Q2, the 2N7002K MOSFET
on the front panel board.

Once the POWER switch is depressed, that pulls
up the gate voltage of Q3, thus pulling down
the /PWRON signal, which is required to be
held low to keep the series-connected P-MOSFET
in the 12 VDC input line conducting for the switched
power supplied to the rest of the radio.  That /PWRON
line is held low if Q2 receives the POWERHOLDON
signal from the front panel MCU even after the
front panel POWER switch is released.

The LCD display backlight is powered from
the 8V regulator when a signal VLCDBKLT
from the MCU is asserted.  The LCD segment drives come
from a separate controller chip rather than
the MCU directly.  I'll hazard a guess that your
MCU is operating properly, but something in the
POWERHOLDON path is not allowing Q2's gate to
be held high, thus turning off the K3 when the
POWER switch is released.

Mike, K8CN
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 KPA100 not putting out in high power

[Dave New, N8SBE]

I had the same issue with my K3 a few years ago.  If yours is an early 
serial number, it may not have gold-plated pins on the KPA100 connector 
to the main board. Elecraft will supply the updated connectors for you, 
if you feel you can tackle the upgrade yourself.  The tin-plate 
connectors after a while present a higher resistance connection.


I updated my K3 and never had that issue after that.

73,

-- Dave, N8SBE

On 2023-03-16 13:59, Jim Cary wrote:

My K3 has stopped working in high power.  It works fine until output
hits 12 watts.  I hear the relay kicking in at that point to switch
the K3 PA bypass relay to the  KPA100 module, but power goes to 0 and
swr fluctuates all over the place.  The amp breaker does not appear to
have been tripped.

Does anyone have a suggestion?

Jim
W2SM



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 KPA100 not putting out in high power

[Michael Carter]

Hi Jim,

Since the bypass relay actuates, can you check the
KPA3 (or KPA3A, depending on which generation
of K3 you have) input side of the relay to verify
that the relay is doing its job, i.e. that RF is making
it onto the KPA3 input?  A scope is best,
but a simple RF probe and DMM would also suffice.
The principal difficulty is accessing the KPAIO3
board on which the bypass relay is mounted.

If the relay is switching the TX drive into the KPA3,
but you're not seeing any output power from the
KPA3, there are several places where the KPA3
module can fail and produce that effect.  Keith,
WE6R, the Elecraft K3/K4 tech par excellence,
may advise how best to test the KPA3 module
since the component side is not accessible when
it's mounted in the K3.

73,
Mike, K8CN
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/0-mini and FT8/Q65 / Remoterig

[Scott Townley]

I didn't find a simple way.

Assuming you have the remoterig set up for SSB/voice, what I did was to 
route the soundcard TX audio to the mic input on the radio RR.  To do 
that I used an old Rigblaster, which allowed me to easily switch the AF 
input to the RR between mic and soundcard. There are many ways to do 
this cheaper but I had the Rigblaster gathering dust.


As to RX audio, I used the SPKR output on the side of the K3/0-mini.  
That means switching between soundcard RX audio and a speaker/headset 
for human RX.  Or you could come up with a similar switching arrangement 
as with TX audio.



--

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2023 13:30:26 +0100
From: Viggo Magnus Nilsen 
To: Elecraft 
Subject: [Elecraft] K3/0-mini and FT8/Q65 / Remoterig
Message-ID: <055b7e7113d46d1f90c87a11c3dc6...@online.no>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

Hello K3 owners.

My Remote setup is K3 connected to the Remoterig box at the QTH site, at
home operating it with K3/0-mini.,

I prefer CW, but from time to time  want to try some Digimodes.

WHAT TO I HAVE TO DO FOR THAT MODE WITH K3/0-MINI / REMOTERIG.?

Com port 1 and 2 at the Radio RRC is connected to the K3 ,and KPA500.

At the QTH K3 working very well with the connections Line in/Line out to
the PC in Q65 mode on EME.

73' Viggo LA9NEA

--
Scott NX7U

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/ KPA500 ,AUX cable.

[Viggo Magnus Nilsen]

> Hello K3 owners. 
> 
> When I connect the K3 and the KPA500 ,the freq on KPA500 dont change during 
> RX mode, when I change  
> 
> freq. on K3. 
> 
> On TX the freq on KPA500 change when apply RF. 
> 
> The AUX cable (db15) is connected between the K3 and KPA500. 
> 
> Any settings  ion the config meny  here ??  :-)) 
> 
> 73 Viggo  LA9NEA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Chris Cox, N0UK]

I still haven’t received contact yet about the items I had ordered in April 
2020 other than the original purchase confirmation.

I had ordered both a new synthesizer upgrade and a general coverage bandpass 
filter.

Could the delay in hearing anything be waiting on both kits to become available 
or should I have heard about the KSYN3A already?
 
Chris Cox, N0UK
chr...@chris.org
https://www.credly.com/go/IR77aRbH2rFDdOiymuxu2w



> On Feb 28, 2023, at 14:53, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> Well, for what it's worth, I'm one of those waiting 2+years for an update 
> kit, and a week ago I got an e-mail from Elecraft telling me that it would be 
> shipping in 5-7 days.  I don't know if some are ready but not others.  I 
> reported this on this reflector at the time.
> 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
> 
> On 2/28/2023 3:11 PM, Lee Hiers wrote:
>> On Thu, Feb 16, 2023 at 12:48 PM Wayne Burdick  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> Eric may want to elaborate.
>>> 
>> Apparently not.
>> 
>> Consider we're 12 weeks into a "6-8 weeks" window on some of these items.
>> That's 4 to 6 weeks past due with no notice and almost two weeks after
>> Wayne addressed it at all - in response to queries about why nothing has
>> been said.
>> 
>> Not to mention the ~2 year wait already endured.  I know...Covid, supply
>> chain, blah, blah.  That does not absolve Elecraft of communicating with
>> its customers.
>> 
>> Lee, AA4GA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 ERR DSE / E 000202 DD0VS

[Keith Trinity WE6R]

Harald;
What is the serial # of the K3?
If older, did you change the P30 and P35 front panel pins (to RF board) 
to gold?.
If you have a sub receiver, make sure it is enabled and then check FW 
revisions, if the AUX DSP board has mismatched FW, you can get ERR DSE.

Keith WE6R Elecraft K3/K4 Tech

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 ERR DSE / E 000202

[Harald Fritzsche]

Dear All,

 

the issue seems to be intermittent, simple disassembly/assembly of DSP-board
did not help, but switch on/off sometimes "awakes" DSP.

 

Seems to be no real defect but weak contact or cold solder joint.

 

Any idea where to search more in detail?

 

Vy73

Harald 

DD0VS

 

 

 

Von: Harald Fritzsche  
Gesendet: Sonntag, 19. Februar 2023 14:27
An: 'elecraft@mailman.qth.net' 
Betreff: K3 ERR DSE / E 000202

 

Dear All,

 

My K3 is prompting now with ERR DSE, during CQ WPX RTTY it was ok, next
switch on this week end it prompts this error.

 

Reloading DSP-firmware wasn't successful.

 

Would be open for further suggestions, my time is limited to some hours on
week end, so if you send me suggestion, please understand that I can react
only with delay.

 

TNX

 

Vy73

Harald

DD0VS

 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Pete Smith N4ZR]

Well, for what it's worth, I'm one of those waiting 2+years for an 
update kit, and a week ago I got an e-mail from Elecraft telling me that 
it would be shipping in 5-7 days.  I don't know if some are ready but 
not others.  I reported this on this reflector at the time.


73, Pete N4ZR

On 2/28/2023 3:11 PM, Lee Hiers wrote:

On Thu, Feb 16, 2023 at 12:48 PM Wayne Burdick  wrote:



Eric may want to elaborate.


Apparently not.

Consider we're 12 weeks into a "6-8 weeks" window on some of these items.
That's 4 to 6 weeks past due with no notice and almost two weeks after
Wayne addressed it at all - in response to queries about why nothing has
been said.

Not to mention the ~2 year wait already endured.  I know...Covid, supply
chain, blah, blah.  That does not absolve Elecraft of communicating with
its customers.

Lee, AA4GA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Lee Hiers]

On Thu, Feb 16, 2023 at 12:48 PM Wayne Burdick  wrote:


> Eric may want to elaborate.
>

Apparently not.

Consider we're 12 weeks into a "6-8 weeks" window on some of these items.
That's 4 to 6 weeks past due with no notice and almost two weeks after
Wayne addressed it at all - in response to queries about why nothing has
been said.

Not to mention the ~2 year wait already endured.  I know...Covid, supply
chain, blah, blah.  That does not absolve Elecraft of communicating with
its customers.

Lee, AA4GA
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 sale

[Edward Mccann]

I hope the sale is pending, not the radio !!
😎

> On Feb 26, 2023, at 1:13 PM, bht...@juno.com wrote:
> 
> Thanks to everyone who was interested in my sale
> of the K3 #5024. The radio is pending.
> 
> 73,
> Brian K1DIH
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Andy Durbin]

It doesn't matter how many "sound cards" are in the system.  What does matter 
is that the one assigned to digital modes is not also assigned as the system 
"default" device.  It is easy to get this wrong even when two or more "sound 
cards" are available.

I think you guys may be assuming different meanings for "internal".   I have 
one "sound card" in the PC and a PCM2903B USB audio CODEC in my Kenwood 
TS-590S.  Each is "internal" to its host device.

Isn't it true that a K3 can be fitted with an optional USB interface that 
provides an "internal" (internal to K3) "sound card"?  That internal sound card 
would be well suited for use on digital modes.

Andy, k3wyc



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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Mike Flowers]

I have a second sound card in my desktop PC dedicated to the digital modes.   I 
thought the risk of inadvertent audio driving my rig was too high to do 
otherwise.  

I’ve heard some weird things on the digital frequencies!

-- 73 de Mike Flowers, K6MKF, NCDXC - "It's about DX!" 

> On Feb 24, 2023, at 3:26 PM, Rick NK7I  wrote:
> 
> I politely and firmly, disagree.  It's too prone to operator error and 
> sending cruft that doesn't belong on the air.
> 
> A SECOND internal card for radio, fine.  The only one; bad plan.
> 
> Rick nk7i
> 
> 
>> On 2/24/2023 3:22 PM, Wes wrote:
>> There is nothing wrong with using the internal sound card for digital modes.
>> 
>> Wes  N7WS
>> 
>>> On 2/24/2023 1:58 PM, Rick NK7I wrote:
>>> 
>>> And ranks right up there with folks using the OS sound card, instead of a 
>>> second card for radio use for obnoxious behavior.
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Rick NK7I]

I politely and firmly, disagree.  It's too prone to operator error and 
sending cruft that doesn't belong on the air.


A SECOND internal card for radio, fine.  The only one; bad plan.

Rick nk7i


On 2/24/2023 3:22 PM, Wes wrote:
There is nothing wrong with using the internal sound card for digital 
modes.


Wes  N7WS

On 2/24/2023 1:58 PM, Rick NK7I wrote:


And ranks right up there with folks using the OS sound card, instead 
of a second card for radio use for obnoxious behavior.


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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Wes]

There is nothing wrong with using the internal sound card for digital modes.

Wes  N7WS

On 2/24/2023 1:58 PM, Rick NK7I wrote:


And ranks right up there with folks using the OS sound card, instead of a 
second card for radio use for obnoxious behavior.


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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Rick NK7I]

On 2/24/2023 12:46 PM, Andy Durbin wrote:

If you cannot, or will not, use CAT with real or fake split please do not transmit with 
DF less than 1,500 Hz.   I have far too many FT8 harmonics examples in my "horror 
signals" library.

Andy, k3wyc



And ranks right up there with folks using the OS sound card, instead of 
a second card for radio use for obnoxious behavior.


One can hear voice, music, ambient audio (all illegal) along with the 
tones (ALL of which diminishes the signal you WANT to send/hear).


And lack of RFI management (or other flaws) can produce a SPECTRUM of 
cruft sent, which helps no one.


If you're just starting out (and on occasion) ASK a neighbor to look at 
your signal to make sure it's as you need it to be.


73,
Rick nk7i

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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Rich]

Which Elecraft cable are you using a USB to serial adapter (K3) or a USB 
cable (K3S or updated K3)?


Rich

On 2/23/2023 15:20 PM, Don Putnick wrote:

I've been using WSJT-X FT8 for years using VOX. I have a MacBook Pro and an
Elecraft K3. I've been encouraged to try using Rig Control. I've tried all
sorts of Rig Control parameter settings, but all give one sort or another
HamLib Error. Any suggestions on where to look or what to do? And yes I'm
using Elecraft's cable.
73 Don NA6Z
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Looking for WSJT-X Rig Control advice

[Jim Brown]

On 2/23/2023 12:20 PM, Don Putnick wrote:

I've been using WSJT-X FT8 for years using VOX. I have a MacBook Pro and an
Elecraft K3. I've been encouraged to try using Rig Control.


Hi Don,

VOX enables transmit, Rig Control moves the VFO in TX mode to prevent 
harmonic distortion if audio is overdriven. If you can't get rig control 
working, simply be careful with setting the level that the computer 
sends to the Line Input (I'd try to make it work at 60%), and also in 
setting the Line Input control for ALC at 4 bars flashing 5. Reducing 
drive from the computer may require increasing VOX gain.


I can't help with Mac stuff.

73, Jim K9YC


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[Wayne Burdick]

Gary,

Our assembly house got overloaded, delaying our modules. But I understand that 
some of them may have just been delivered (finally!). We would need to then do 
full testing. 

Eric may want to elaborate.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


> On Feb 15, 2023, at 1:45 PM, n6...@outlook.com wrote:
> 
> Eric,
> 
> It has been almost 11 weeks since your last K3 & K3S Options Update (shown 
> below). I have several option kits on order but I haven't heard anything 
> about them in the past 11 weeks so would you please update us?
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Gary R.
> 
> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  on 
> behalf of Eric Swartz 
> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 4:16 PM
> To: Elecraft list 
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)
> 
> I apologize for the delay getting this info out to everyone. (See my final
> comments below after the status section for more info on what has caused
> much of the delay.)
> 
> First - The current K3 & K3S option status. The following boards are now in
> process, and should ship close to these dates ranges if there are no new
> parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays.
> 
> P3TXMON  6-8 weeks
> K3EXREF  8 weeks
> KAT3A:  8 weeks
> KDVR3  8 weeks
> KPA3A6-8 weeks
> KIO3B8-9 weeks
> KSYN3A8 weeks
> KBPF3A8 weeks
> KXV3B   6-8 weeks
> 
> K144XV and K144RFLK   7-10 days
> We've completed building an additional batch of K144XV 2M options and
> we're  finishing up the matching K144RFLK lock boards, which lock the
> K144XV's frequency to the K3's reference oscillator.
> We'll be contacting the remaining customers for these two items in order to
> confirm shipping information (and collect the other half of the funds due
> for shipping and those who made a half deposit.)
> 
> ---
> 
> Remaining 3 Last time Buy items:
> 
> P3: Still seeing long parts delays from Analog devices and Microchip.
> 
> P3SVGA: Still seeing long parts delays from Intel (FPGA) and Microchip (uC).
> 
> K3/0 Mini: Microchip (uC) delays plus qualifying second sources on several
> other parts. We are also evaluating our demo stock of  K3/0 Minis to see if
> that can help with regular orders or our wait-list orders.
> 
> We will update everyone on these last three items as we get new information.
> 
> 
> General comments:
> We've been navigating a wide range of parts and manufacturing issues these
> past months. The K3 Options suffered in focus as we first had to keep our
> primary product lines rolling out the door to you. (K4s, KX-Line, Amps
> (100, 500 and 1500W) etc.) We've been successful sourcing parts for these
> primary products and keeping them shipping :-) , but its taken way more
> focus and effort that anyone expected..
> 
> We've also had to contend with one of our key circuit board assembly
> subcontractors becoming unavailable after being sold to another company.
> (All of our boards are built in the U.S.) That resulted in our other
> assembly subcontractors becoming overloaded. Fortunately we have now
> qualified and brought on-line several new U.S. circuit board assembly
> companies with excellent results. In addition to smoothing our regular
> production, this has made it possible to get our focus back on the K3
> Options.
> 
> We will be posting updates for these products as they each get closer to
> shipping.
> 
> Thank you again for your patience.
> 
> 73,
> 
> 
> Eric   WA6HHQ
> *elecraft.com *
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

[n6...@outlook.com]

Eric,

It has been almost 11 weeks since your last K3 & K3S Options Update (shown 
below). I have several option kits on order but I haven't heard anything about 
them in the past 11 weeks so would you please update us?

Thank you,

Gary R.

From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  on 
behalf of Eric Swartz 
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 4:16 PM
To: Elecraft list 
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 & K3S Options Last Time Buy Update (12/02/2022)

I apologize for the delay getting this info out to everyone. (See my final
comments below after the status section for more info on what has caused
much of the delay.)

First - The current K3 & K3S option status. The following boards are now in
process, and should ship close to these dates ranges if there are no new
parts issues or surprise manufacturing delays.

P3TXMON  6-8 weeks
K3EXREF  8 weeks
KAT3A:  8 weeks
KDVR3  8 weeks
KPA3A6-8 weeks
KIO3B8-9 weeks
KSYN3A8 weeks
KBPF3A8 weeks
KXV3B   6-8 weeks

K144XV and K144RFLK   7-10 days
We've completed building an additional batch of K144XV 2M options and
we're  finishing up the matching K144RFLK lock boards, which lock the
K144XV's frequency to the K3's reference oscillator.
We'll be contacting the remaining customers for these two items in order to
confirm shipping information (and collect the other half of the funds due
for shipping and those who made a half deposit.)

---

Remaining 3 Last time Buy items:

P3: Still seeing long parts delays from Analog devices and Microchip.

P3SVGA: Still seeing long parts delays from Intel (FPGA) and Microchip (uC).

K3/0 Mini: Microchip (uC) delays plus qualifying second sources on several
other parts. We are also evaluating our demo stock of  K3/0 Minis to see if
that can help with regular orders or our wait-list orders.

We will update everyone on these last three items as we get new information.


General comments:
We've been navigating a wide range of parts and manufacturing issues these
past months. The K3 Options suffered in focus as we first had to keep our
primary product lines rolling out the door to you. (K4s, KX-Line, Amps
(100, 500 and 1500W) etc.) We've been successful sourcing parts for these
primary products and keeping them shipping :-) , but its taken way more
focus and effort that anyone expected..

We've also had to contend with one of our key circuit board assembly
subcontractors becoming unavailable after being sold to another company.
(All of our boards are built in the U.S.) That resulted in our other
assembly subcontractors becoming overloaded. Fortunately we have now
qualified and brought on-line several new U.S. circuit board assembly
companies with excellent results. In addition to smoothing our regular
production, this has made it possible to get our focus back on the K3
Options.

We will be posting updates for these products as they each get closer to
shipping.

Thank you again for your patience.

73,


Eric   WA6HHQ
*elecraft.com *
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