Re: [Emc-users] Jogger wheel + switches

[John Thornton]

Ok, I don't have stacks of old 5 1/4 floppy drives laying around... 

When it comes to electronics I need all the help I can get.  So the MPG puts 
out 4 
pairs of signals and the LM399 converts that to 4 outputs? Lots of googling 
going 
on... and EMC needs? I'm just looking at a MPG spec sheet and they only have 6 
connections so I assume one is ground, one is power in and the other 4 are the 
signal coming out. Now I'm really confused. The LM399 has 8 inputs and 4 
outputs.

Can you explain just a bit more for me please.

Thanks
John

On 25 Mar 2008 at 11:43, Gene Heskett wrote:

> On Tuesday 25 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
> >Why not just use a MPG their only $69?
> 
> cuz we've already got stacks of the old floppy drives?  And either
> will need an interface to shrink it down to a quadrature pair.  An
> lm-339 makes that very easy.  Needs ground, 5 volts, outputs the
> quadrature pair, 4 wires total in the cable.
> 
> -- 
> Cheers, Gene
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> AWAKE! FEAR! FIRE! FOES! AWAKE!
>  FEAR! FIRE! FOES!
>   AWAKE! AWAKE!
>   -- J. R. R. Tolkien
> 
> --
> --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges.
> Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[John Thornton]

Hey Gary,

Glad I could help. I found that the information I needed to learn Python was so 
scattered out that it took some time to bring it together. New Mexico Tech has 
about 
the best tutorial you can download that I found on Tkinter...

John

On 25 Mar 2008 at 19:03, Gary Fixler wrote:

> 
> On this page you can find the thing you seek.
> 
> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_EMC_G-Code_Gene
> rators
> 
> 
> Wow! I've been learning Python lately for my job, which will entail
> creating UIs, and such, and I'd been planning to build some things
> like this. I have a notion about how to tie all of this kind of stuff
> together into a fairly powerful toolset, but it will take me some time
> to get proficient enough at all of this, and I recognize that my crazy
> notions may be just that: crazy :)
> 
> Still, not only are these tools very helpful, but reading through
> their source will be very informative, both in using Tkinter for UIs,
> and in having my UIs communicate a bit with EMC.
> 
> Thanks, John! This is great stuff.
> -g
> 



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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[John Thornton]

That must be a mighty small mill or very dull cutter... What SFM and chip load 
are 
you running at? I don't have my charts here but from memory 6061 needs to be 
cut 
at 300-500SFM. I normally use a two flute end mill for aluminum. For a 1/4" 2 
flute 
end mill I cut at 2500 rpm and 10 IPM again from memory. 

.001"?? Double Ouch..

On 25 Mar 2008 at 22:47, Gene Heskett wrote:

> >Back on topic, I could definitely have used some cooling. I can only
> >dig through aluminum in 0.001" vertical increments, without stressing
> >things, or tearing apart my clamping assemblies, so it takes forever.
> 
> .001"?  Ouch.



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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[John Thornton]

How thick is the oxide layer? Doesn't it self seal the surface as fast as the 
oxide 
layer is formed? I guess that's why deeper cuts work better than skim cuts on 
aluminum?

A while back I was peck drilling 6061 and came across an article on drilling 
aluminum. Now I drill up to 4*d at 11 IPM. The only ones I can't drill that 
fast is 
smaller holes because I can't go faster than 3000 RPM. Now my chips come out as 
chips instead of long strings and I drill the holes in a second or two instead 
of 
minutes...

Aluminum is some funny stuff. 

John

On 25 Mar 2008 at 22:47, Gene Heskett wrote:

> The oil not only keeps it from piling up on the 
> bit, it helps to seal the alu against atmospheric oxygen, so alu oxide
> doesn't form near as fast and bits stay sharp many times longer if
> they don't have to cut that oxide film everytime a flute comes by. 
> Alu oxide is the second hardest substance, second only to diamond. 
> Without that oil, the oxide film re-forms less than .001 seconds
> behind the edge of the bits exposing it, alu is a VERY reactive metal.
>  With the oil wetting everything, the reaction is slowed quite a bit,
> not stopped, but slowed.



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Re: [Emc-users] Jogger wheel + switches

[Anders Wallin]

> When it comes to electronics I need all the help I can get.  So the MPG puts 
> out 4 
> pairs of signals and the LM399 converts that to 4 outputs? Lots of googling 
> going 
> on... and EMC needs? I'm just looking at a MPG spec sheet and they only have 
> 6 
> connections so I assume one is ground, one is power in and the other 4 are 
> the 
> signal coming out. Now I'm really confused. The LM399 has 8 inputs and 4 
> outputs.
> Can you explain just a bit more for me please.

The cnc4pc jogwheel has A and B outputs ('single-ended' if you like). 
These plug directly into the A and B channels of a hardware encoder 
counter (m5i20, pico-systems, vital, etc.).
If you don't have a spare encoder input the jog-wheel could be read by 
two general purpose I/O pins (e.g. parallel port) since you are not 
likely to spin the jogwheel very fast.

Some jogwheels use differential signals, which means instead of just the 
A and B signals you get A+, A-, B+, and B-. If you have I/O to spare you 
could wire all four of these to EMC. If you want to condense these four 
into just two A and B signals you can do that with an IC. I did that 
with a DS3486.


AW

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Re: [Emc-users] Jogger wheel + switches

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 26 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
>Ok, I don't have stacks of old 5 1/4 floppy drives laying around...
>
>When it comes to electronics I need all the help I can get.  So the MPG puts
> out 4 pairs of signals and the LM399 converts that to 4 outputs? Lots of
I don't know about MPG.  The motor puts out 2 pairs of signals from its 
windings, but each pair can be reduced to one as a logic level by one of the 
4 comparators in an LM339? so that only 2 inputs are needed by emc per axis 
controlled.

> googling going on... and EMC needs? I'm just looking at a MPG spec sheet
> and they only have 6 connections so I assume one is ground, one is power in
> and the other 4 are the signal coming out. Now I'm really confused. The
> LM399 has 8 inputs and 4 outputs.
>
The lm399 would in this case have enough units in it to convert the 4 wires 
from 2 motors (say one was x, the other y, whatever) into the pair of 
quadrature signals emc would need per axis serviced.  That would be 8 signals 
plus power abd ground, and 4 motors and two LM399's and a handfull of 1/4 
watt resistors & small signal diodes for a complete 4 axis setup.  Not sure 
if I have 4 of those motors though, I'd have to rummage in the basement & 
check.  I have the extra parport card installed already so thats not a 
problem.

I'm not fam enough with the MPG though, and would have to assume it might 
contain a switch that could be used to tell emc which channel/axis it 
represents at the moment, otherwise I'm not sure what the other 2 wires would 
be.

>Can you explain just a bit more for me please.
>
>Thanks
>John
>
>On 25 Mar 2008 at 11:43, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> On Tuesday 25 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
>> >Why not just use a MPG their only $69?
>>
>> cuz we've already got stacks of the old floppy drives?  And either
>> will need an interface to shrink it down to a quadrature pair.  An
>> lm-339 makes that very easy.  Needs ground, 5 volts, outputs the
>> quadrature pair, 4 wires total in the cable.
>>
>> --
>> Cheers, Gene
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>> AWAKE! FEAR! FIRE! FOES! AWAKE!
>>  FEAR! FIRE! FOES!
>>   AWAKE! AWAKE!
>>   -- J. R. R. Tolkien
>>
>> --
>> --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges.
>> Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse012070mrt/direct/01/
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-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Some people carve careers, others chisel them.

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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 26 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
>That must be a mighty small mill or very dull cutter... What SFM and chip
> load are you running at? I don't have my charts here but from memory 6061
> needs to be cut at 300-500SFM. I normally use a two flute end mill for
> aluminum. For a 1/4" 2 flute end mill I cut at 2500 rpm and 10 IPM again
> from memory.

Note taken, I'll get some 2 fluters the next time I need some new ones.  I can 
cut .025" deep at 10ipm IF I can keep my x table running free.  It hung last 
night and chewed up the clamps it knocked loose pretty badly.  I'm also 
haveing doubts about motor current, supposedly 2.5 amps, but the motors 
aren't heating very much, so I need to recheck the settings of my xylotex 
board.

What I'm blaming on wear is now found to be the nut on the end of the x screw 
gradually working loose because the keyway allows the coupling to turn about 
a degree when the going gets tough & eventually I wind up with .30" of 
backlash cuz its the backlash adjustment.  I may have to re-think that design 
in favor of a split clamping to totally stop that thou of slippage everytime 
it reverses.

Question?  Using STP as way oil, does that stuff stiffen up after a few hours?  
The usual Vactrex? is only available in 5 gallon pails at $90 around these 
parts.

>.001"?? Double Ouch..
>
>On 25 Mar 2008 at 22:47, Gene Heskett wrote:

No, I didn't write this, I was replying to the person who wrote it, John.

>> >Back on topic, I could definitely have used some cooling. I can only
>> >dig through aluminum in 0.001" vertical increments, without stressing
>> >things, or tearing apart my clamping assemblies, so it takes forever.
>>
>> .001"?  Ouch.
>
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-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
You will have good luck and overcome many hardships.

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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 26 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
>How thick is the oxide layer? Doesn't it self seal the surface as fast as
> the oxide layer is formed? I guess that's why deeper cuts work better than
> skim cuts on aluminum?

Yes.  Thickness depends on time & oxygen availability.  Bare, about .0001" in 
the first millisecond, maybe .001" in a year.  Its self protecting in that 
regard.

 >A while back I was peck drilling 6061 and came across an article on drilling
>aluminum. Now I drill up to 4*d at 11 IPM. The only ones I can't drill that
> fast is smaller holes because I can't go faster than 3000 RPM. Now my chips
> come out as chips instead of long strings and I drill the holes in a second
> or two instead of minutes...

Interesting.  Do you still have the URL? When I try to go that fast I wind up 
with heavier strings for a short time and a blown spindle fuse.  Needs more 
horses in the spindle drive...  I find that bits sharpened by a drill doctor 
are many times sharper than out of the factory pack, and stay that way 
longer.  Even cheap bits from a $29 kit can cut pretty hard steel if they are 
sharp.

>Aluminum is some funny stuff.

And the subject of more miss-pronunciations than almost any other english 
word. :-)  My stepfather, rest his soul, could never rememeber how 
many 'nums' there were on the end if it.  I think he did it on purpose for 
effects most of the time though.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
A sect or party is an elegant incognito devised to save a man from
the vexation of thinking.
-- Ralph Waldo Emerson, Journals, 1831

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Re: [Emc-users] Jogger wheel + switches

[Dave Engvall]

On Mar 26, 2008, at 6:06 AM, Anders Wallin wrote:

>> 
> Some jogwheels use differential signals, which means instead of  
> just the
> A and B signals you get A+, A-, B+, and B-. If you have I/O to  
> spare you
> could wire all four of these to EMC. If you want to condense these  
> four
> into just two A and B signals you can do that with an IC. I did that
> with a DS3486.
>
LM339's are really fast and therefore not too noise immume.
RS-485/RS422 chips like the one Anders used are a good solution.
They might even work if used single ended.

for another chips see:

http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/2273

HTH

Dave

>
> AW
>
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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[Dave Engvall]

Hi Gene,
Two fluters work well for slotting or anyplace you have trouble  
getting rid of the chips.
The harder the Al the easier it makes good chips. 6061-T6,  7050- 
T651, 7075-T651 are good choices.
Recutting of chips that don't get out of the way generates lots of  
heat and more mess as well as screwing up
the finish. Not that I know much about cutting aluminum but 3X speeds  
for mild steel seems to be a good place to start. That brings up the  
rpm and ipm but leaves the chip load the same. I try to use a shop  
vac to remove chips
when slotting. It makes enough turbulence to clean out the groove. I  
get a better finish if I climb cut.

I won't even touch softer aluminum if I have a choice. I've made a  
mess out of too many projects and end mills.
On the softer stuff I use coolant but I don't like it; again a real  
mess and the surface tension tends to hold the chips
together rather than helping get them out of the way.  High pressure  
coolant and a fully enclosed workspace would help. ;-)

HTH

Dave
On Mar 26, 2008, at 7:56 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> On Wednesday 26 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
>> That must be a mighty small mill or very dull cutter... What SFM  
>> and chip
>> load are you running at? I don't have my charts here but from  
>> memory 6061
>> needs to be cut at 300-500SFM. I normally use a two flute end mill  
>> for
>> aluminum. For a 1/4" 2 flute end mill I cut at 2500 rpm and 10 IPM  
>> again
>> from memory.
>
> Note taken, I'll get some 2 fluters the next time I need some new  
> ones.  I can
> cut .025" deep at 10ipm IF I can keep my x table running free.  It  
> hung last
> night and chewed up the clamps it knocked loose pretty badly.  I'm  
> also
> haveing doubts about motor current, supposedly 2.5 amps, but the  
> motors
> aren't heating very much, so I need to recheck the settings of my  
> xylotex
> board.
>
> What I'm blaming on wear is now found to be the nut on the end of  
> the x screw
> gradually working loose because the keyway allows the coupling to  
> turn about
> a degree when the going gets tough & eventually I wind up with .30" of
> backlash cuz its the backlash adjustment.  I may have to re-think  
> that design
> in favor of a split clamping to totally stop that thou of slippage  
> everytime
> it reverses.
>
> Question?  Using STP as way oil, does that stuff stiffen up after a  
> few hours?
> The usual Vactrex? is only available in 5 gallon pails at $90  
> around these
> parts.
>
>> .001"?? Double Ouch..
>>
>> On 25 Mar 2008 at 22:47, Gene Heskett wrote:
>
> No, I didn't write this, I was replying to the person who wrote it,  
> John.
>
 Back on topic, I could definitely have used some cooling. I can  
 only
 dig through aluminum in 0.001" vertical increments, without  
 stressing
 things, or tearing apart my clamping assemblies, so it takes  
 forever.
>>>
>>> .001"?  Ouch.
>>
>> - 
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>
>
> -- 
> Cheers, Gene
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> You will have good luck and overcome many hardships.
>
> -- 
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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[Jon Elson]

Gary Fixler wrote:
> One of the reasons I often drill a useless hole someplace at the
> start of the
> project, and write my code with that as the 0,0,0 point.  That makes
> getting
> back to within a couple thou a bit easier.
> 
> 
> That's a great idea. I would love an absolute positioning system - 
> something that was always the same for the mill, at least between full 
> strip-downs, and rebuilds.
> 
Well, it depends on how your homing system works.  I have index 
pulses on my encoders, and home to those pulses.  I get quite 
repeatable homing that way.  In theory, I could shut down one 
day, fire it up the next day, home the axes, and be right on the 
same alignment to the vise jaw or whatever.

Jon

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[Emc-users] hal show configuration

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
I would like to be able to save a watch configuration. This would
allow me to restart the machine and recover the watch configuration
quickly and easily.
thanks
Stuart

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Re: [Emc-users] hal show configuration

[Stephen Wille Padnos]

Hi Stuart

May I refer you to  - this is a wiki which 
documents various web-based tck/Tk tutorials :)
It shouldn't be too hard to add a save/restore function - tcl uses 
strings for every variable and has pretty reasonable I/O functions for 
those strings.  A bigger question is where the config should go.  
Halscope drops a .scope_cfg in any directory from which it was run (I'm 
not quite sure what it does when you run it from AXIS or what the 
"current directory" is when you run EMC from an icon/menu.)  I don't 
know if you'd want halshow to do the same thing.

Another option would be to make a pyvcp panel and a hal file to load it 
and make the necessary connections.  I don't think there's much that can 
be seen by halshow that can't be seen by pyvcp.  Doing a vcp panel would 
also allow you to group things as you like, for instance encoder counts 
and limit switch inputs can be placed in a box for each axis/joint.

- Steve

Stuart Stevenson wrote:

>Gentlemen,
>I would like to be able to save a watch configuration. This would
>allow me to restart the machine and recover the watch configuration
>quickly and easily.
>thanks
>Stuart
>  
>


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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[John Thornton]

It was on practical machinest. I can't find it at the moment, I think I have a 
link at my 
machine shop...

Also there is a really good chart here

http://www.precisiontwistdrill.com/techhelp/help_pages/jobber_length_amg.asp

John

On 26 Mar 2008 at 11:10, Gene Heskett wrote:

> Interesting.  Do you still have the URL? When I try to go that fast I
> wind up with heavier strings for a short time and a blown spindle
> fuse.  Needs more horses in the spindle drive...  I find that bits
> sharpened by a drill doctor are many times sharper than out of the
> factory pack, and stay that way longer.  Even cheap bits from a $29
> kit can cut pretty hard steel if they are sharp.
> 



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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[John Thornton]

Gene,

I use threaded shaft collars a lot with good success. From McMaster Carr look 
up 
6438K18 to get the page number. They come in metric and inch and don't move 
once you set them...

John


On 26 Mar 2008 at 10:56, Gene Heskett wrote:

> What I'm blaming on wear is now found to be the nut on the end of the
> x screw gradually working loose because the keyway allows the coupling
> to turn about a degree when the going gets tough & eventually I wind
> up with .30" of backlash cuz its the backlash adjustment.  I may have
> to re-think that design in favor of a split clamping to totally stop
> that thou of slippage everytime it reverses.



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Re: [Emc-users] How to set certain AXIS settings to defaults?

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 26 March 2008, John Thornton wrote:
>6438K18

Which leads me to the 2305K13, for 6mm threads.  Very good idea except its 
buried inside my coupling and in-accessable, either to tighten it on the 
shaft, or to tighten the lock screw.  However, I am considering slitting the 
existing coupling but in fresh softer steel, and double bolting it, with one 
of the slits straddling that mini key to grip it better.  The existing steel 
would knock the teeth off any power hacksaw blade made or I'd try to dup that 
with what I have, I wrecked every carbide tool that touched it while making 
them.

Poking around, they have some nice ideas I could use, but they are all in 
larger inch sizes, and the OD of the area of the screw shank that I need to 
grab is 8mm. They only have one that I would have to bore for fit, and thats 
part of my problem now.  When I was boring these, I had to cut heavy or the 
carbide bar just slid even if it was freshly honed with a diamond disk in a 
dremel, so the last trip with the bar made it several thou too big.  I think 
I'll just get me some more 1.5" rod, 1045 or so, and remake those pieces in 
one piece split clamp style, with at least one 6mm socket head screw to clamp 
it tight, screw the keyway, just get a death grip on it, but still adjust the 
lash using the existing 6mm nylock nut with the clamping screw loose, but a 
fresh locknut if I can find them.

Decisions...  Keeps the old farts brain semi-engaged.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
But soft you, the fair Ophelia:
Ope not thy ponderous and marble jaws,
But get thee to a nunnery -- go!
-- Mark "The Bard" Twain


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[Emc-users] cnc data

[Andrew McCallum]

I am involved in the CNC Industry. I have done the Basic Fanuc and Siemens
controls programming systems. I am trying to find out what package Linux
have,and what is the easiest one to use. The procedure i want to do is to
scan in the shape of the part to be machined and have the programme work out
the G codes and Tooling path Automatically. If you can post me literature or
CD'S on the above it will be greatly appreciated. It would be used for CNC
Lathes and Milling Machines.

 Yours Sincerely

Andrew McCallum
4 Shaw Place
Redland Bay
4165
Brisbane
Australia
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Re: [Emc-users] Jogger wheel + switches

[amtb]

Hi
I have provlem with www.CNC4PC.
ehere is those company?
Are they in USA or where?
Every US company has a phone to call and ask questions CNC4PS doesn't.
i send e-mail with same question and he send me phone 772-6215525 number
but nobody answer those phone.
Does any one purchased any think from cnc4pc?
thanks
Aram




>> When it comes to electronics I need all the help I can get.  So the MPG
>> puts out 4
>> pairs of signals and the LM399 converts that to 4 outputs? Lots of
>> googling going
>> on... and EMC needs? I'm just looking at a MPG spec sheet and they only
>> have 6
>> connections so I assume one is ground, one is power in and the other 4
>> are the
>> signal coming out. Now I'm really confused. The LM399 has 8 inputs and 4
>> outputs.
>> Can you explain just a bit more for me please.
>
> The cnc4pc jogwheel has A and B outputs ('single-ended' if you like).
> These plug directly into the A and B channels of a hardware encoder
> counter (m5i20, pico-systems, vital, etc.).
> If you don't have a spare encoder input the jog-wheel could be read by
> two general purpose I/O pins (e.g. parallel port) since you are not
> likely to spin the jogwheel very fast.
>
> Some jogwheels use differential signals, which means instead of just the
> A and B signals you get A+, A-, B+, and B-. If you have I/O to spare you
> could wire all four of these to EMC. If you want to condense these four
> into just two A and B signals you can do that with an IC. I did that
> with a DS3486.
>
>
> AW
>
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