Re: overvaccination
Yes ... she is a talented woman, very conscious. On Jun 21, 2007, at 8:46 PM, MaryChristine wrote: incidentally, this is written by christie keith, one of the people from www.petconnection.com who've been on top of the pet-food recall from the beginning, and the person who did the chat on homemade cat food that i posted about awhile back; she does a weekly holistic pet chat at www.doghobbyist.com; writes a weekly column for the SFGate called "Your Whole Pet," and is one of the people who hired and trained me as a chat host over seven years ago. On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:http://www.caberfeidh.com/Revax.htm This is a very thoughtful and well reasoned article about the over vaccination problem. It is written by a dog 'person', but her research includes felines, and the issues are the same. Jane > __ _ > ___ -- Spay & Neuter Your Neighbors! Maybe That'll Make The Difference MaryChristine AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 289856892
Re: overvaccination
incidentally, this is written by christie keith, one of the people from www.petconnection.com who've been on top of the pet-food recall from the beginning, and the person who did the chat on homemade cat food that i posted about awhile back; she does a weekly holistic pet chat at www.doghobbyist.com; writes a weekly column for the SFGate called "Your Whole Pet," and is one of the people who hired and trained me as a chat host over seven years ago. On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: http://www.caberfeidh.com/Revax.htm This is a very thoughtful and well reasoned article about the over vaccination problem. It is written by a dog 'person', but her research includes felines, and the issues are the same. Jane > ___ > ___ -- Spay & Neuter Your Neighbors! Maybe That'll Make The Difference MaryChristine AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 289856892
Re: overvaccination
On Jun 21, 2007, at 4:32 PM, Marylyn wrote: What you didn't mention is that Drs Dodds & Schultz need funding for this research. I am contributing thru a group I belong to and, unfortunately, don't have the link any more. Perhaps someone else can provide the link on the research and funding??? http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/ Thanks Marylyn ..this is the website for the rabies research project. The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies Challenge" research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is sufficient for the lifetime of an animal. I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to say it is prudent to research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many practices that now inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, the paw can be amputated and the animals life saved. Jane On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing vaccinations every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think I'll approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go outside. She doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her getting FeLV from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just would rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going all the time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. Melissa -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my vet agrees, so that's what my rescue does, even though it adds to our cost. It is a personal decision though, like everything else. I'm certainly not trying to tell other folks what to do. I did see that the latest AAFP vaccination guidelines recommend going to once every 3 years against distemper... On 6/21/07, Melissa Lind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I agree that the majority of the people here mix, but I never would. This is probably because I'm a newbie to this and a doubting-Thomas of sorts, but I just can't bring myself to expose my youngest (less than one year) since she would be most susceptible, and I've opted not to vaccinate her against FeLV because of the risk associated with vaccination and sarcomas. I don't have any FeLV cats now, but when I did, I kept him in one room until I was able to find him a home. It was a lonely life for the poor guy, but I spent a lot of time with him. If I had to do it long-term, I'd set up an area for several FeLV cats so they could have companionship. That's my plan for the future. But, I'll have to say that most people here know a lot more about this than I do-but that's just my own personal choice so far. Melissa From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of catatonya Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 2:57 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? I was just there yesterday! I live in Woodstock, but we have a place on Lake Buckhorn. I would say the majority of the people on this list mix their positive and negative cats as long as they are adults and have been vaccinated. I have done this over 10 years with no problems. I can't tell you dosages, because I don't give DD anything special except 'good' food. (Whatever that may be these days) Royal Canin. tonya Laura Mostello <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi, Jane suggested that I ask the list for food recommendations for Duncan. What would you all suggest? She also mentioned some supplements, like lysine and maitake. I know that these are readily available at health food stores, but I'd like to know about the dosage amount and frequency. Right now Duncan's appetite is excellent, and I'd like to keep it that way. He isn't my only cat, by the way. There are 8 others! All were saved from the euthanasia list at work. Duncan lives separately, in my tortoise room. This is probably a really stupid question, but I'll ask it anyway. I understand that FeLV is primarily transmitted through saliva, and that very casual contact between cats is probably
Re: overvaccination
What you didn't mention is that Drs Dodds & Schultz need funding for this research. I am contributing thru a group I belong to and, unfortunately, don't have the link any more. Perhaps someone else can provide the link on the research and funding??? If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: "Jane Lyons" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 11:03 AM Subject: overvaccination The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies Challenge" research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is sufficient for the lifetime of an animal. I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to say it is prudent to research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many practices that now inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, the paw can be amputated and the animals life saved. Jane On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing vaccinations every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think I'll approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go outside. She doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her getting FeLV from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just would rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going all the time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. Melissa -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my vet agrees, so that's what my rescue does, even though it adds to our cost. It is a personal decision though, like everything else. I'm certainly not trying to tell other folks what to do. I did see that the latest AAFP vaccination guidelines recommend going to once every 3 years against distemper... On 6/21/07, Melissa Lind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I agree that the majority of the people here mix, but I never would. This is probably because I'm a newbie to this and a doubting-Thomas of sorts, but I just can't bring myself to expose my youngest (less than one year) since she would be most susceptible, and I've opted not to vaccinate her against FeLV because of the risk associated with vaccination and sarcomas. I don't have any FeLV cats now, but when I did, I kept him in one room until I was able to find him a home. It was a lonely life for the poor guy, but I spent a lot of time with him. If I had to do it long-term, I'd set up an area for several FeLV cats so they could have companionship. That's my plan for the future. But, I'll have to say that most people here know a lot more about this than I do-but that's just my own personal choice so far. Melissa From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of catatonya Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 2:57 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? I was just there yesterday! I live in Woodstock, but we have a place on Lake Buckhorn. I would say the majority of the people on this list mix their positive and negative cats as long as they are adults and have been vaccinated. I have done this over 10 years with no problems. I can't tell you dosages, because I don't give DD anything special except 'good' food. (Whatever that may be these days) Royal Canin. tonya Laura Mostello <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi, Jane suggested that I ask the list for food recommendations for Duncan. What would you all suggest? She also mentioned some supplements, like lysine and maitake. I know that these are readily available at health food stores, but I'd like to know about the dosage amount and frequency. Right now Duncan's appetite is excellent, and I
RE: overvaccination
I am one of the few peope that doesn't have a computer at home. I use my work computer. So it is difficult for me to do alot of research. Honestly after working on a computer all day I probably wouldn't want to get on one when I got home. Cindy Reasoner --- "MacKenzie, Kerry N." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I hear you Cindy. Speaking for myself I think > technology while truly > wonderful has also resulted in us having to work > harder and longer than > ever before (I never ever want a Blackberry-type > thing; I've used my > recntly-acquired cellphone ONCE)my poor brain > finds it impossible to > retain information these days even when I do read > up. Kerry M > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of cindy reasoner > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 2:50 PM > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: overvaccination > > > All I know is what my vet told me. I guess I am the > idiot for trusting him. I will do research about > it. > I'm sorry I can't get on this site everyday to read > what people post. > > Cindy Reasoner > > --- MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE. > > > > the "new" calici virus is neither new, nor a > virus. > > > > like FIP, what has occurred, very infrequently, > and > > only in hospital and > > shelter environments a FEW times since first > > identified is a MUTATED FORM OF > > ONE OF THE COMMON CALICI VIRUSES. each outbreak > has > > been a different form, > > which means that NO VACCINE IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO > > PROTECT AGAINST THE NEXT > > FORM. > > > > why do you think there isn't an HIV vaccine > > yet?? > > > > this is a HUGE money-making scam by ft dodge. both > > phaewyrn and i have > > collected lots of data on this, and posted it to > the > > lists. please go back > > in archives and do real research. > > > > the avma DOES NOT CONSIDER THE FT DODGE VACCINE A > > CORE VACCINE. > > > > read the CURRENT vaccine protocol at the uc davis > > site, or any of the other > > vet school sites. please. > > > > i can post all the info on the calici virus when i > > have a chance--if anyone > > who still reads this list has the copy i sent out > a > > month or so ago, when ft > > dodge decided to capitalize on everyone's > > pet-food-recall panic, PLEASE post > > it AGAIN for people. > > > > MC who is, frankly, tired of repeating herself. > > > > On 6/21/07, MaryChristine > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > The new calici virus, again, I think is scare > > tactics. > > > > > > > > The vaccine is made by Fort Dodge, and Ft > Dodge > > is trying to make $ > > > > off it. They are the same ones who make the > FIP > > vaccine. I do not > > > > use Ft Dodge vaccines on my cats. Again, this > > is something my vet has > > > > never seen a case of, no one has been able to > > prove it even exists. > > > > > > > > If you want the most recent recommendations > for > > vaccines, go to the > > > > AAFP website and look. I believe they publish > > them yearly. > > > > > > > > On 6/21/07, cindy reasoner < > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > I have had my cats vaccinated every year but > I > > need to > > > > > talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want > to > > take > > > > > any chances. Have any of you heard of this > > new strain > > > > > of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out > to > > all his > > > > > clients owned by cats. You have to go for a > > booster > > > > > then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. > > The letter > > > > > said that the cat didn't have to come in > > contact with > > > > > the infected cat. We can bring it in to > them. > > It is > > > > > highly contagious and a perfectly healthy > cat > > can die > > > > > within days if exposed. My vet was even > > considering > > > > > making it mandatory that all of their feline > > clients > > > > > be vaccinated for this. He t
RE: overvaccination
I hear you Cindy. Speaking for myself I think technology while truly wonderful has also resulted in us having to work harder and longer than ever before (I never ever want a Blackberry-type thing; I've used my recntly-acquired cellphone ONCE)my poor brain finds it impossible to retain information these days even when I do read up. Kerry M -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of cindy reasoner Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 2:50 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: overvaccination All I know is what my vet told me. I guess I am the idiot for trusting him. I will do research about it. I'm sorry I can't get on this site everyday to read what people post. Cindy Reasoner --- MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE. > > the "new" calici virus is neither new, nor a virus. > > like FIP, what has occurred, very infrequently, and > only in hospital and > shelter environments a FEW times since first > identified is a MUTATED FORM OF > ONE OF THE COMMON CALICI VIRUSES. each outbreak has > been a different form, > which means that NO VACCINE IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO > PROTECT AGAINST THE NEXT > FORM. > > why do you think there isn't an HIV vaccine > yet?? > > this is a HUGE money-making scam by ft dodge. both > phaewyrn and i have > collected lots of data on this, and posted it to the > lists. please go back > in archives and do real research. > > the avma DOES NOT CONSIDER THE FT DODGE VACCINE A > CORE VACCINE. > > read the CURRENT vaccine protocol at the uc davis > site, or any of the other > vet school sites. please. > > i can post all the info on the calici virus when i > have a chance--if anyone > who still reads this list has the copy i sent out a > month or so ago, when ft > dodge decided to capitalize on everyone's > pet-food-recall panic, PLEASE post > it AGAIN for people. > > MC who is, frankly, tired of repeating herself. > > On 6/21/07, MaryChristine > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > > The new calici virus, again, I think is scare > tactics. > > > > > > The vaccine is made by Fort Dodge, and Ft Dodge > is trying to make $ > > > off it. They are the same ones who make the FIP > vaccine. I do not > > > use Ft Dodge vaccines on my cats. Again, this > is something my vet has > > > never seen a case of, no one has been able to > prove it even exists. > > > > > > If you want the most recent recommendations for > vaccines, go to the > > > AAFP website and look. I believe they publish > them yearly. > > > > > > On 6/21/07, cindy reasoner < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I > need to > > > > talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to > take > > > > any chances. Have any of you heard of this > new strain > > > > of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to > all his > > > > clients owned by cats. You have to go for a > booster > > > > then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. > The letter > > > > said that the cat didn't have to come in > contact with > > > > the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. > It is > > > > highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat > can die > > > > within days if exposed. My vet was even > considering > > > > making it mandatory that all of their feline > clients > > > > be vaccinated for this. He told me about a > vet in the > > > > northeast that had an infected cat come in and > I think > > > > he said that vet's office couldn't have any > cats in > > > > there for something like 45 days until they > > > > disinfected the office and were sure there was > no more > > > > danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I > just got > > > > through with the 2nd shot for all of them. > This > > > > disease just sounded to scary to take a > chance. All > > > > of my cats are inside cats. They never go > out. I > > > > think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that > you > > > > have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. > I am > > > > not sure though. > > > > > > > > Cindy Reasoner > > > > > > > > --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > &
Re: overvaccination
All I know is what my vet told me. I guess I am the idiot for trusting him. I will do research about it. I'm sorry I can't get on this site everyday to read what people post. Cindy Reasoner --- MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE. > > the "new" calici virus is neither new, nor a virus. > > like FIP, what has occurred, very infrequently, and > only in hospital and > shelter environments a FEW times since first > identified is a MUTATED FORM OF > ONE OF THE COMMON CALICI VIRUSES. each outbreak has > been a different form, > which means that NO VACCINE IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO > PROTECT AGAINST THE NEXT > FORM. > > why do you think there isn't an HIV vaccine > yet?? > > this is a HUGE money-making scam by ft dodge. both > phaewyrn and i have > collected lots of data on this, and posted it to the > lists. please go back > in archives and do real research. > > the avma DOES NOT CONSIDER THE FT DODGE VACCINE A > CORE VACCINE. > > read the CURRENT vaccine protocol at the uc davis > site, or any of the other > vet school sites. please. > > i can post all the info on the calici virus when i > have a chance--if anyone > who still reads this list has the copy i sent out a > month or so ago, when ft > dodge decided to capitalize on everyone's > pet-food-recall panic, PLEASE post > it AGAIN for people. > > MC who is, frankly, tired of repeating herself. > > On 6/21/07, MaryChristine > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > > The new calici virus, again, I think is scare > tactics. > > > > > > The vaccine is made by Fort Dodge, and Ft Dodge > is trying to make $ > > > off it. They are the same ones who make the FIP > vaccine. I do not > > > use Ft Dodge vaccines on my cats. Again, this > is something my vet has > > > never seen a case of, no one has been able to > prove it even exists. > > > > > > If you want the most recent recommendations for > vaccines, go to the > > > AAFP website and look. I believe they publish > them yearly. > > > > > > On 6/21/07, cindy reasoner < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I > need to > > > > talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to > take > > > > any chances. Have any of you heard of this > new strain > > > > of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to > all his > > > > clients owned by cats. You have to go for a > booster > > > > then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. > The letter > > > > said that the cat didn't have to come in > contact with > > > > the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. > It is > > > > highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat > can die > > > > within days if exposed. My vet was even > considering > > > > making it mandatory that all of their feline > clients > > > > be vaccinated for this. He told me about a > vet in the > > > > northeast that had an infected cat come in and > I think > > > > he said that vet's office couldn't have any > cats in > > > > there for something like 45 days until they > > > > disinfected the office and were sure there was > no more > > > > danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I > just got > > > > through with the 2nd shot for all of them. > This > > > > disease just sounded to scary to take a > chance. All > > > > of my cats are inside cats. They never go > out. I > > > > think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that > you > > > > have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. > I am > > > > not sure though. > > > > > > > > Cindy Reasoner > > > > > > > > --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro > sarcoma > > > > > > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > > > > > > > > > They've changed the vaccine now, > however...there is > > > > > less risk. There is > > > > > still risk, however. > > > > > > > > > > I can tell you though that with an > aggressive fibro > > > > > sarcoma, amputating the > > > > > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save > it. > > > > > Felicity had her leg > > > > > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching > story. > > > > > The survival rate even > > > > > for humans with this type of cancer is > abysmal. > > > > > > > > > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > > > > > > > > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are > formulated > > > > > to be given every three > > > > > years. Others are formulated for every > year. Many > > > > > say you don't want to > > > > > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine > every 3 > > > > > years. There have also > > > > > been tests that indicate the three year > vaccines are > > > > > less effective. I'm > > > > > told that currently the best way to ensure > you > > > > > aren't over vaccinating is > > > > > to have blood work done for titers...but you > could > > > > > still end up paying for > > > > > that test and still have to pay for the > vacci
Re: overvaccination
http://www.caberfeidh.com/Revax.htm This is a very thoughtful and well reasoned article about the over vaccination problem. It is written by a dog 'person', but her research includes felines, and the issues are the same. Jane ___ ___
Re: overvaccination/new strain of calici
Hey Cindy, Check out this link from the FeLV talk archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/felvtalk@felineleukemia.org/msg28478.html I remembered it being brought up before, and that there was controversy surrounding it. :) Wendy --- cindy reasoner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I need > to > talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to take > any chances. Have any of you heard of this new > strain > of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to all > his > clients owned by cats. You have to go for a booster > then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. The > letter > said that the cat didn't have to come in contact > with > the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. It > is > highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat can > die > within days if exposed. My vet was even considering > making it mandatory that all of their feline clients > be vaccinated for this. He told me about a vet in > the > northeast that had an infected cat come in and I > think > he said that vet's office couldn't have any cats in > there for something like 45 days until they > disinfected the office and were sure there was no > more > danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I just got > through with the 2nd shot for all of them. This > disease just sounded to scary to take a chance. All > of my cats are inside cats. They never go out. I > think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that you > have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. I am > not sure though. > > Cindy Reasoner > > --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro > sarcoma > > > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there > is > > less risk. There is > > still risk, however. > > > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive > fibro > > sarcoma, amputating the > > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. > > Felicity had her leg > > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. > > The survival rate even > > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are > formulated > > to be given every three > > years. Others are formulated for every year. > Many > > say you don't want to > > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 > > years. There have also > > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines > are > > less effective. I'm > > told that currently the best way to ensure you > > aren't over vaccinating is > > to have blood work done for titers...but you could > > still end up paying for > > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine > too. > > > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate > immuno-compromised > > or geriatric cats. I > > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my > > experience with Felicity...and > > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It > > might make more sense to > > have them vaccinated more often if they were > outdoor > > types. I really think > > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, > I > > would have them > > vaccinated more often. > > > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a > > baby to FeVL+. Both are > > heart-wrenching. > > > > elizabeth > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > > > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not > > inconsequential. > > > Many veterinarians have altered their > vaccination > > protocols to > > > every three years because recent studies that > have > > indicated we are > > > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances > > one vaccination > > > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and > > revaccination and boosters > > > are driven by the economics of a practice and > > pharmaceutical companies. > > > > > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now > > conducting the 'Rabies > > > Challenge" > > > research, which is an effort to prove that one > > rabies vaccination is > > > sufficient for > > > the lifetime of an animal. > > > > > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination > > discussion, other than to > > > say it is prudent to > > > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. > > There are many > > > practices that now > > > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in > the > > event of a sarcoma, > > > the paw can be amputated > > > and the animals life saved. > > > > > > Jane > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind > wrote: > > > > > > > I had heard that on the radio or > > something--about not needing > > > > vaccinations > > > > every year. If I don't have to put them > through > > the stress...I think > > > > I'll > > > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I > guess > > my reasoning for not > > > > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she > > doesn't ever go > > > > outside. She > > > > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. > The > > chances of
Re: overvaccination
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE. the "new" calici virus is neither new, nor a virus. like FIP, what has occurred, very infrequently, and only in hospital and shelter environments a FEW times since first identified is a MUTATED FORM OF ONE OF THE COMMON CALICI VIRUSES. each outbreak has been a different form, which means that NO VACCINE IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO PROTECT AGAINST THE NEXT FORM. why do you think there isn't an HIV vaccine yet?? this is a HUGE money-making scam by ft dodge. both phaewyrn and i have collected lots of data on this, and posted it to the lists. please go back in archives and do real research. the avma DOES NOT CONSIDER THE FT DODGE VACCINE A CORE VACCINE. read the CURRENT vaccine protocol at the uc davis site, or any of the other vet school sites. please. i can post all the info on the calici virus when i have a chance--if anyone who still reads this list has the copy i sent out a month or so ago, when ft dodge decided to capitalize on everyone's pet-food-recall panic, PLEASE post it AGAIN for people. MC who is, frankly, tired of repeating herself. On 6/21/07, MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The new calici virus, again, I think is scare tactics. > > The vaccine is made by Fort Dodge, and Ft Dodge is trying to make $ > off it. They are the same ones who make the FIP vaccine. I do not > use Ft Dodge vaccines on my cats. Again, this is something my vet has > never seen a case of, no one has been able to prove it even exists. > > If you want the most recent recommendations for vaccines, go to the > AAFP website and look. I believe they publish them yearly. > > On 6/21/07, cindy reasoner < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I need to > > talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to take > > any chances. Have any of you heard of this new strain > > of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to all his > > clients owned by cats. You have to go for a booster > > then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. The letter > > said that the cat didn't have to come in contact with > > the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. It is > > highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat can die > > within days if exposed. My vet was even considering > > making it mandatory that all of their feline clients > > be vaccinated for this. He told me about a vet in the > > northeast that had an infected cat come in and I think > > he said that vet's office couldn't have any cats in > > there for something like 45 days until they > > disinfected the office and were sure there was no more > > danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I just got > > through with the 2nd shot for all of them. This > > disease just sounded to scary to take a chance. All > > of my cats are inside cats. They never go out. I > > think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that you > > have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. I am > > not sure though. > > > > Cindy Reasoner > > > > --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma > > > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > > > > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is > > > less risk. There is > > > still risk, however. > > > > > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro > > > sarcoma, amputating the > > > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. > > > Felicity had her leg > > > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. > > > The survival rate even > > > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > > > > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > > > > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated > > > to be given every three > > > years. Others are formulated for every year. Many > > > say you don't want to > > > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 > > > years. There have also > > > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are > > > less effective. I'm > > > told that currently the best way to ensure you > > > aren't over vaccinating is > > > to have blood work done for titers...but you could > > > still end up paying for > > > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. > > > > > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised > > > or geriatric cats. I > > > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my > > > experience with Felicity...and > > > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It > > > might make more sense to > > > have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor > > > types. I really think > > > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I > > > would have them > > > vaccinated more often. > > > > > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a > > > baby to FeVL+. Both are > > > heart-wrenching. > > > > > > elizabeth > > > > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > The ris
Re: overvaccination
Gloria, Please consider using Merial vaccines. They are more expensive, but much superior to Ft Dodge. The only reference I use for vaccination is the American Association of Feline Practitioners website, or Best Friends. Other web sites may or may not be accurate and may or may not have a financial agenda. http://www.aafponline.org/resources/guidelines/2006_Vaccination_Guidelines_JAVMA.pdf This is pretty good article from BF, a little dated. http://network.bestfriends.org/Blogs/Detail.aspx?b=59&g=3042316787ce4a6e8eb13f7e1c31758d On 6/21/07, Gloria Lane <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: This is pretty interesting. I've heard for quite a while about the 3 year protocol, but out rescue still promotes a yearly protocol (although I don't do that). Was wondering about a good reference for this. I checked out the newvaccinationprotocols.com below, but see a lot of data without links. But particularly interesting is the info on the adjuvant stuff - not sure what we use, I know it's from Ft Dodge (Wyeth Labs)... "Non adjuvanted vaccines cause much less inflammation, so are less likely to cause a fibrosarcoma. Although there have been a few reports of VAS from non adjuvanted vaccines, they are clearly much safer." Gloria On Jun 21, 2007, at 11:54 AM, MaryChristine wrote: just go and do a search for "avma vaccination protocols." you'll at least get PROFESSIONAL references. not that that means they are impartial, but at least they're a little better than a lot that gets passed around on the net--for example, ALL the vet schools in the country have adopted the every-three-year protocol, at least within the past year, if not longer ago. so any vet who doesn't know about it is not keeping up with their own profession. this article, which i'd never seen before, i found PARTICULARLY fascinating http://www.newvaccinationprotocols.com/Legal%20Considerations.htm On 6/21/07, elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is still risk, however. I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them vaccinated more often. I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are heart-wrenching. elizabeth On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies Challenge" research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is sufficient for the lifetime of an animal. I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to say it is prudent to research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many practices that now inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, the paw can be amputated and the animals life saved. Jane On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > vaccinations > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > I'll > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go > outside. She > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her > getting FeLV > from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just > would > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and go
Re: overvaccination
On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The new calici virus, again, I think is scare tactics. The vaccine is made by Fort Dodge, and Ft Dodge is trying to make $ off it. They are the same ones who make the FIP vaccine. I do not use Ft Dodge vaccines on my cats. Again, this is something my vet has never seen a case of, no one has been able to prove it even exists. If you want the most recent recommendations for vaccines, go to the AAFP website and look. I believe they publish them yearly. On 6/21/07, cindy reasoner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I need to > talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to take > any chances. Have any of you heard of this new strain > of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to all his > clients owned by cats. You have to go for a booster > then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. The letter > said that the cat didn't have to come in contact with > the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. It is > highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat can die > within days if exposed. My vet was even considering > making it mandatory that all of their feline clients > be vaccinated for this. He told me about a vet in the > northeast that had an infected cat come in and I think > he said that vet's office couldn't have any cats in > there for something like 45 days until they > disinfected the office and were sure there was no more > danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I just got > through with the 2nd shot for all of them. This > disease just sounded to scary to take a chance. All > of my cats are inside cats. They never go out. I > think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that you > have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. I am > not sure though. > > Cindy Reasoner > > --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma > > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is > > less risk. There is > > still risk, however. > > > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro > > sarcoma, amputating the > > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. > > Felicity had her leg > > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. > > The survival rate even > > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated > > to be given every three > > years. Others are formulated for every year. Many > > say you don't want to > > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 > > years. There have also > > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are > > less effective. I'm > > told that currently the best way to ensure you > > aren't over vaccinating is > > to have blood work done for titers...but you could > > still end up paying for > > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. > > > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised > > or geriatric cats. I > > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my > > experience with Felicity...and > > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It > > might make more sense to > > have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor > > types. I really think > > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I > > would have them > > vaccinated more often. > > > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a > > baby to FeVL+. Both are > > heart-wrenching. > > > > elizabeth > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > > > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not > > inconsequential. > > > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination > > protocols to > > > every three years because recent studies that have > > indicated we are > > > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances > > one vaccination > > > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and > > revaccination and boosters > > > are driven by the economics of a practice and > > pharmaceutical companies. > > > > > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now > > conducting the 'Rabies > > > Challenge" > > > research, which is an effort to prove that one > > rabies vaccination is > > > sufficient for > > > the lifetime of an animal. > > > > > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination > > discussion, other than to > > > say it is prudent to > > > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. > > There are many > > > practices that now > > > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the > > event of a sarcoma, > > > the paw can be amputated > > > and the animals life saved. > > > > > > Jane > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > > > > > I had heard that on the radio or > > something--about not needing > > > > vaccinations > > > > every year. If I don't have to put them through > > the stress...I think > > > > I'll > > > > approach my new vet
Re: overvaccination
The new calici virus, again, I think is scare tactics. The vaccine is made by Fort Dodge, and Ft Dodge is trying to make $ off it. They are the same ones who make the FIP vaccine. I do not use Ft Dodge vaccines on my cats. Again, this is something my vet has never seen a case of, no one has been able to prove it even exists. If you want the most recent recommendations for vaccines, go to the AAFP website and look. I believe they publish them yearly. On 6/21/07, cindy reasoner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I need to talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to take any chances. Have any of you heard of this new strain of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to all his clients owned by cats. You have to go for a booster then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. The letter said that the cat didn't have to come in contact with the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. It is highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat can die within days if exposed. My vet was even considering making it mandatory that all of their feline clients be vaccinated for this. He told me about a vet in the northeast that had an infected cat come in and I think he said that vet's office couldn't have any cats in there for something like 45 days until they disinfected the office and were sure there was no more danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I just got through with the 2nd shot for all of them. This disease just sounded to scary to take a chance. All of my cats are inside cats. They never go out. I think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that you have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. I am not sure though. Cindy Reasoner --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is > less risk. There is > still risk, however. > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro > sarcoma, amputating the > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. > Felicity had her leg > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. > The survival rate even > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated > to be given every three > years. Others are formulated for every year. Many > say you don't want to > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 > years. There have also > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are > less effective. I'm > told that currently the best way to ensure you > aren't over vaccinating is > to have blood work done for titers...but you could > still end up paying for > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised > or geriatric cats. I > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my > experience with Felicity...and > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It > might make more sense to > have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor > types. I really think > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I > would have them > vaccinated more often. > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a > baby to FeVL+. Both are > heart-wrenching. > > elizabeth > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not > inconsequential. > > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination > protocols to > > every three years because recent studies that have > indicated we are > > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances > one vaccination > > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and > revaccination and boosters > > are driven by the economics of a practice and > pharmaceutical companies. > > > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now > conducting the 'Rabies > > Challenge" > > research, which is an effort to prove that one > rabies vaccination is > > sufficient for > > the lifetime of an animal. > > > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination > discussion, other than to > > say it is prudent to > > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. > There are many > > practices that now > > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the > event of a sarcoma, > > the paw can be amputated > > and the animals life saved. > > > > Jane > > > > > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > > > I had heard that on the radio or > something--about not needing > > > vaccinations > > > every year. If I don't have to put them through > the stress...I think > > > I'll > > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess > my reasoning for not > > > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she > doesn't ever go > > > outside. She > > > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The > chances of her > > > getting FeLV > > > from contact through the screen patio door are > so slim, that I
Re: overvaccination
This is pretty interesting. I've heard for quite a while about the 3 year protocol, but out rescue still promotes a yearly protocol (although I don't do that). Was wondering about a good reference for this. I checked out the newvaccinationprotocols.com below, but see a lot of data without links. But particularly interesting is the info on the adjuvant stuff - not sure what we use, I know it's from Ft Dodge (Wyeth Labs)... "Non adjuvanted vaccines cause much less inflammation, so are less likely to cause a fibrosarcoma. Although there have been a few reports of VAS from non adjuvanted vaccines, they are clearly much safer." Gloria On Jun 21, 2007, at 11:54 AM, MaryChristine wrote: just go and do a search for "avma vaccination protocols." you'll at least get PROFESSIONAL references. not that that means they are impartial, but at least they're a little better than a lot that gets passed around on the net--for example, ALL the vet schools in the country have adopted the every-three-year protocol, at least within the past year, if not longer ago. so any vet who doesn't know about it is not keeping up with their own profession. this article, which i'd never seen before, i found PARTICULARLY fascinating http://www.newvaccinationprotocols.com/Legal%20Considerations.htm On 6/21/07, elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is still risk, however. I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them vaccinated more often. I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are heart-wrenching. elizabeth On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies Challenge" research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is sufficient for the lifetime of an animal. I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to say it is prudent to research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many practices that now inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, the paw can be amputated and the animals life saved. Jane On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > vaccinations > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > I'll > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go > outside. She > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her > getting FeLV > from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just > would > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going > all the > time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. > > Melissa > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley > Saveika > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? > > I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be > inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be > vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my
Re: overvaccination
I have had my cats vaccinated every year but I need to talk to my vet about it. I sure don't want to take any chances. Have any of you heard of this new strain of calici virus? My vet sent a letter out to all his clients owned by cats. You have to go for a booster then go back in 3 weeks for the last shot. The letter said that the cat didn't have to come in contact with the infected cat. We can bring it in to them. It is highly contagious and a perfectly healthy cat can die within days if exposed. My vet was even considering making it mandatory that all of their feline clients be vaccinated for this. He told me about a vet in the northeast that had an infected cat come in and I think he said that vet's office couldn't have any cats in there for something like 45 days until they disinfected the office and were sure there was no more danger from exposure. I have 8 cats and I just got through with the 2nd shot for all of them. This disease just sounded to scary to take a chance. All of my cats are inside cats. They never go out. I think where I live (Tennessee)it is a law that you have to have your pets vaccinated for rabies. I am not sure though. Cindy Reasoner --- elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is > less risk. There is > still risk, however. > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro > sarcoma, amputating the > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. > Felicity had her leg > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. > The survival rate even > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated > to be given every three > years. Others are formulated for every year. Many > say you don't want to > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 > years. There have also > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are > less effective. I'm > told that currently the best way to ensure you > aren't over vaccinating is > to have blood work done for titers...but you could > still end up paying for > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised > or geriatric cats. I > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my > experience with Felicity...and > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It > might make more sense to > have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor > types. I really think > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I > would have them > vaccinated more often. > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a > baby to FeVL+. Both are > heart-wrenching. > > elizabeth > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not > inconsequential. > > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination > protocols to > > every three years because recent studies that have > indicated we are > > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances > one vaccination > > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and > revaccination and boosters > > are driven by the economics of a practice and > pharmaceutical companies. > > > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now > conducting the 'Rabies > > Challenge" > > research, which is an effort to prove that one > rabies vaccination is > > sufficient for > > the lifetime of an animal. > > > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination > discussion, other than to > > say it is prudent to > > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. > There are many > > practices that now > > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the > event of a sarcoma, > > the paw can be amputated > > and the animals life saved. > > > > Jane > > > > > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > > > I had heard that on the radio or > something--about not needing > > > vaccinations > > > every year. If I don't have to put them through > the stress...I think > > > I'll > > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess > my reasoning for not > > > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she > doesn't ever go > > > outside. She > > > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The > chances of her > > > getting FeLV > > > from contact through the screen patio door are > so slim, that I just > > > would > > > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had > cats coming and going > > > all the > > > time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk > involved. > > > > > > Melissa > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Kelley > > > Saveika > > > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM > > > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > > Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? > > > > > > I think that the risk of vaccination
Re: overvaccination
Ok, here is his answer about VAS. I was freaking out because there is so much out of date, scary stuff on the Internet. "The term Vaccine Associated Sarcomas has fallen out of favor and now termed Injection Site Sarcoma because they now believe that it is not the vaccine, but the actual injection of a foreign substance. I use the Purevax for distemper vaccine. Sarcomas are difficult to completely remove if found in the scruff because of the different layers of tissue and extensions that the tumor extends between the layers. First time surgery (extremely invasive) is the best chance if sarcoma is diagnosed. We vaccinate in the leg so that if a sarcoma is diagnosed, then amputation may be performed if needed.I have not seen a fibrosarcoma that I thought was associated with a vaccine. But it is a possibility with any injection." On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: OH yes, my vet does offer the 3 year rabies vaccine, but state law says if the owner brings the cat in a day late, he's not allowed to give it. So if I have a cat due 4/1 and I bring the cat in 4/2 the cat can't ahve the vaccine, he has to have the one year one. On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > "Inconsequential" was probably a bad word to use, and I am sorry. I > am sorry for those of you who have lost cats to this disease (or to > anything else). > > I have a kitty with a heart murmur and I do not vaccinate her against > anything. That's not because of the risk of cancer, though, it is > because of the risk of heart attack. > > The chances of a cat contracting FELV are, in my opinion, a lot higher > than contracting cancer from the vaccine. My vet has never seen a > case, and there is now debate over whether the cancer is from the > ingredients of the vaccine or from the injection itself. I'll dig up > the email he sent me and post it. > > On 6/21/07, elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma > > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is > > still risk, however. > > > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the > > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg > > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even > > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three > > years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to > > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also > > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm > > told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is > > to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for > > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. > > > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I > > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and > > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to > > have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think > > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them > > vaccinated more often. > > > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are > > heart-wrenching. > > > > elizabeth > > > > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. > > > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to > > > every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are > > > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination > > > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters > > > are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. > > > > > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies > > > Challenge" > > > research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is > > > sufficient for > > > the lifetime of an animal. > > > > > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to > > > say it is prudent to > > > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many > > > practices that now > > > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, > > > the paw can be amputated > > > and the animals life saved. > > > > > > Jane > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > > > > > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > > > > vaccinations > > > > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > > > > I'll > > > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning f
Re: overvaccination
OH yes, my vet does offer the 3 year rabies vaccine, but state law says if the owner brings the cat in a day late, he's not allowed to give it. So if I have a cat due 4/1 and I bring the cat in 4/2 the cat can't ahve the vaccine, he has to have the one year one. On 6/21/07, Kelley Saveika <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: "Inconsequential" was probably a bad word to use, and I am sorry. I am sorry for those of you who have lost cats to this disease (or to anything else). I have a kitty with a heart murmur and I do not vaccinate her against anything. That's not because of the risk of cancer, though, it is because of the risk of heart attack. The chances of a cat contracting FELV are, in my opinion, a lot higher than contracting cancer from the vaccine. My vet has never seen a case, and there is now debate over whether the cancer is from the ingredients of the vaccine or from the injection itself. I'll dig up the email he sent me and post it. On 6/21/07, elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma > http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html > > They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is > still risk, however. > > I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the > paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg > amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even > for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. > > I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. > > It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three > years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to > give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also > been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm > told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is > to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for > that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. > > My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I > confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and > I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to > have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think > that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them > vaccinated more often. > > I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are > heart-wrenching. > > elizabeth > > > On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. > > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to > > every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are > > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination > > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters > > are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. > > > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies > > Challenge" > > research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is > > sufficient for > > the lifetime of an animal. > > > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to > > say it is prudent to > > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many > > practices that now > > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, > > the paw can be amputated > > and the animals life saved. > > > > Jane > > > > > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > > > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > > > vaccinations > > > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > > > I'll > > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not > > > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go > > > outside. She > > > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her > > > getting FeLV > > > from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just > > > would > > > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going > > > all the > > > time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. > > > > > > Melissa > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf > Of Kelley > > > Saveika > > > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM > > > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > > Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? > > > > > > I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be > > > inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be > > > vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my vet agrees, so > > > that's what my rescue does, even though it adds to our cost. > > > > > > It is a personal decision though, like everything else. I'
Re: overvaccination
"Inconsequential" was probably a bad word to use, and I am sorry. I am sorry for those of you who have lost cats to this disease (or to anything else). I have a kitty with a heart murmur and I do not vaccinate her against anything. That's not because of the risk of cancer, though, it is because of the risk of heart attack. The chances of a cat contracting FELV are, in my opinion, a lot higher than contracting cancer from the vaccine. My vet has never seen a case, and there is now debate over whether the cancer is from the ingredients of the vaccine or from the injection itself. I'll dig up the email he sent me and post it. On 6/21/07, elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is still risk, however. I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them vaccinated more often. I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are heart-wrenching. elizabeth On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to > every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters > are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies > Challenge" > research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is > sufficient for > the lifetime of an animal. > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to > say it is prudent to > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many > practices that now > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, > the paw can be amputated > and the animals life saved. > > Jane > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > > vaccinations > > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > > I'll > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not > > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go > > outside. She > > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her > > getting FeLV > > from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just > > would > > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going > > all the > > time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. > > > > Melissa > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley > > Saveika > > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM > > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? > > > > I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be > > inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be > > vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my vet agrees, so > > that's what my rescue does, even though it adds to our cost. > > > > It is a personal decision though, like everything else. I'm certainly > > not trying to tell other folks what to do. > > > > I did see that the latest AAFP vaccination guidelines recommend going > > to once every 3 years against distemper... > > > > On 6/21/07, Melissa Lind < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> I agree that the majority of the people here mix, but I never would. > >> This > > is > >> probably because I'm a newbie to this and a doubting-Thomas of sorts, > >> but > > I > >> just can't bring myself to expose my youngest (less
Re: overvaccination
just go and do a search for "avma vaccination protocols." you'll at least get PROFESSIONAL references. not that that means they are impartial, but at least they're a little better than a lot that gets passed around on the net--for example, ALL the vet schools in the country have adopted the every-three-year protocol, at least within the past year, if not longer ago. so any vet who doesn't know about it is not keeping up with their own profession. this article, which i'd never seen before, i found PARTICULARLY fascinating http://www.newvaccinationprotocols.com/Legal%20Considerations.htm On 6/21/07, elizabeth trent <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is still risk, however. I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them vaccinated more often. I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are heart-wrenching. elizabeth On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. > Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to > every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are > over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination > can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters > are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. > > Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies > Challenge" > research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is > sufficient for > the lifetime of an animal. > > I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to > say it is prudent to > research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many > practices that now > inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, > the paw can be amputated > and the animals life saved. > > Jane > > > > On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > > > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > > vaccinations > > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > > I'll > > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not > > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go > > outside. She > > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her > > getting FeLV > > from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just > > would > > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going > > all the > > time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. > > > > Melissa > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley > > Saveika > > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM > > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? > > > > I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be > > inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be > > vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my vet agrees, so > > that's what my rescue does, even though it adds to our cost. > > > > It is a personal decision though, like everything else. I'm certainly > > > not trying to tell other folks what to do. > > > > I did see that the latest AAFP vaccination guidelines recommend going > > to once every 3 years against distemper... > > > > On 6/21/07, Melissa Lind < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> I agree that the majority of the people here mix, but I never would. > >> This > > is > >> probably because I'm a newbie to this and a doubting-Thomas of sorts, > > >> but > > I > >> just can't bring myself to expose my youngest (less than one year) > >> since > >
Re: overvaccination
I lost my Felicity to vaccine-related fibro sarcoma http://www.trentdesigns.com/elizabeth/felicity.html They've changed the vaccine now, however...there is less risk. There is still risk, however. I can tell you though that with an aggressive fibro sarcoma, amputating the paw can prolong the life but it cannot save it. Felicity had her leg amputated. A very sad and heart-wrenching story. The survival rate even for humans with this type of cancer is abysmal. I'm glad to hear there is on-going research. It's a difficult call. Some vaccines are formulated to be given every three years. Others are formulated for every year. Many say you don't want to give a vaccine yearly formulated vaccine every 3 years. There have also been tests that indicate the three year vaccines are less effective. I'm told that currently the best way to ensure you aren't over vaccinating is to have blood work done for titers...but you could still end up paying for that test and still have to pay for the vaccine too. My vet doesn't like to vaccinate immuno-compromised or geriatric cats. I confess that I am very shell-shocked from my experience with Felicity...and I do not have my cats vaccinated every year. It might make more sense to have them vaccinated more often if they were outdoor types. I really think that if we still had FeVL+ babies living with us, I would have them vaccinated more often. I've lost babies to the vaccine - and I've lost a baby to FeVL+. Both are heart-wrenching. elizabeth On 6/21/07, Jane Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The risk of vaccination and sarcoma is not inconsequential. Many veterinarians have altered their vaccination protocols to every three years because recent studies that have indicated we are over vaccinating our animals. In many instances one vaccination can protect an animal for its lifetime, and revaccination and boosters are driven by the economics of a practice and pharmaceutical companies. Dr Jean Dodds DVM and Ronald Schultz DVM are now conducting the 'Rabies Challenge" research, which is an effort to prove that one rabies vaccination is sufficient for the lifetime of an animal. I did not intend to get into a vaccination discussion, other than to say it is prudent to research the type and frequency of vaccinations. There are many practices that now inoculate cats just above the paw, so that in the event of a sarcoma, the paw can be amputated and the animals life saved. Jane On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Melissa Lind wrote: > I had heard that on the radio or something--about not needing > vaccinations > every year. If I don't have to put them through the stress...I think > I'll > approach my new vet about the distemper. I guess my reasoning for not > vaccinating the youngest is simply because she doesn't ever go > outside. She > doesn't even sneak out, or try to sneak out. The chances of her > getting FeLV > from contact through the screen patio door are so slim, that I just > would > rather not. But, if I ran a rescue where I had cats coming and going > all the > time, I definitely would vaccinate--more risk involved. > > Melissa > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley > Saveika > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:32 AM > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: The best food for Duncan?? > > I think that the risk of vaccination and sarcomas is so low as to be > inconsequential. I think it is really important that all cats be > vaccinated against FELV in the first year, and my vet agrees, so > that's what my rescue does, even though it adds to our cost. > > It is a personal decision though, like everything else. I'm certainly > not trying to tell other folks what to do. > > I did see that the latest AAFP vaccination guidelines recommend going > to once every 3 years against distemper... > > On 6/21/07, Melissa Lind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >> >> I agree that the majority of the people here mix, but I never would. >> This > is >> probably because I'm a newbie to this and a doubting-Thomas of sorts, >> but > I >> just can't bring myself to expose my youngest (less than one year) >> since > she >> would be most susceptible, and I've opted not to vaccinate her against > FeLV >> because of the risk associated with vaccination and sarcomas. I don't >> have >> any FeLV cats now, but when I did, I kept him in one room until I was >> able >> to find him a home. It was a lonely life for the poor guy, but I >> spent a > lot >> of time with him. If I had to do it long-term, I'd set up an area for >> several FeLV cats so they could have companionship. That's my plan >> for the >> future. >> >> >> >> But, I'll have to say that most people here know a lot more about this > than >> I do-but that's just my own personal choice so far. >> >> >> >> Melissa >> >> >> >> >> >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of >> catatonya >> Sent: Thursda
